2024-2025 College Basketball / NBA Draft - Volume III

[Iverson Armband]

I really just don’t see Morey as a guy who values defense over offensive upside. He drafted Maxey and McCain who both weren’t highly regarded defensive prospects. He also had a love affair with Harden who was an atrocious defender.

[sodmoraes]

Last one . VJ shot 4.3 free throws per game, with his outlier athletic abilities( and a better team), while Tre shot 4.2 fts, so i dont think Tre will be that bad going to the rim. Imagine all the free lanes he will have in the NBA, with the atention Maxey, PG and Embiid command from the other teams defense. I think he will be just fine in this area.

In the end, i think VJ has more potential than Tre, if he can improve his handle ( developing his off the dribble shooting) and improving his 3 ball, but i think Tre has a bigger chance to reach his ceiling, really hard pick to make. In his best case scenario VJ can be a lesser version of Wade or similar to Mitchell, but it will be harder to him to get there, while i dont think is that hard to Tre to became an allstar.

[Iverson Armband]

Last one . VJ shot 4.3 free throws per game, with his outlier athletic abilities( and a better team), while Tre shot 4.2 fts, so i dont think Tre will be that bad going to the rim. Imagine all the free lanes he will have in the NBA, with the atention Maxey, PG and Embiid command from the other teams defense. I think he will be just fine in this area.

In the end, i think VJ has more potential than Tre, if he can improve his handle ( developing his off the dribble shooting) and improving his 3 ball, but i think Tre has a bigger chance to reach his ceiling, really hard pick to make. In his best case scenario VJ can be a lesser version of Wade or similar to Mitchell, but it will be harder to him to get there, while i dont think is that hard to Tre to became an allstar.

In all honesty, if you take away the “wow” factor dunks in transition, Grimes is more like a young DWade or Mitchell in playstyle than VJ is currently IMO

[stormi]

Last one . VJ shot 4.3 free throws per game, with his outlier athletic abilities( and a better team), while Tre shot 4.2 fts, so i dont think Tre will be that bad going to the rim. Imagine all the free lanes he will have in the NBA, with the atention Maxey, PG and Embiid command from the other teams defense. I think he will be just fine in this area.

In the end, i think VJ has more potential than Tre, if he can improve his handle ( developing his off the dribble shooting) and improving his 3 ball, but i think Tre has a bigger chance to reach his ceiling, really hard pick to make. In his best case scenario VJ can be a lesser version of Wade or similar to Mitchell, but it will be harder to him to get there, while i dont think is that hard to Tre to became an allstar.

Poor analysis.

VJ had a .373 free throw rate compared to Tre's .265. That's significantly more for VJ and a rather lacklustre number for Tre, especially in relation to how much usage he got. He's a pure shot creator with middling slashing ability, sub-optimal finishing, foul generation and passing.

Tre only got to the rim 97 times this past season, finished &59%. VJ got to the rim 126 times, finished &60%.

Tre's still a tad bit overrated on this board because of iso hesi's, but my main opposition is Ace, so I'm not focused on y'all right now.

[Iverson Armband]

Last one . VJ shot 4.3 free throws per game, with his outlier athletic abilities( and a better team), while Tre shot 4.2 fts, so i dont think Tre will be that bad going to the rim. Imagine all the free lanes he will have in the NBA, with the atention Maxey, PG and Embiid command from the other teams defense. I think he will be just fine in this area.

In the end, i think VJ has more potential than Tre, if he can improve his handle ( developing his off the dribble shooting) and improving his 3 ball, but i think Tre has a bigger chance to reach his ceiling, really hard pick to make. In his best case scenario VJ can be a lesser version of Wade or similar to Mitchell, but it will be harder to him to get there, while i dont think is that hard to Tre to became an allstar.

Poor analysis.

VJ had a .373 free throw rate compared to Tre's .265. That's significantly more for VJ and a rather lacklustre number for Tre, especially in relation to how much usage he got. He's a pure shot creator with middling slashing ability, sub-optimal finishing, foul generation and passing.

Tre only got to the rim 97 times this past season, finished &59%. VJ got to the rim 126 times, finished &60%.

Tre's still a tad bit overrated on this board because of iso hesi's, but my main opposition is Ace, so I'm not focused on y'all right now.

You’re not wrong, but the counter to that is when you can shoot like Tre, only getting to the rim 30 less times is not that much.

[eyeatoma]

Johnson has the potential to be a 30 pt scorer in the NBA. I think he reaches that more than VJ becomes an all-star. But if VJ becomes an All star he might be better than Tre.

[Jailblazers7]

My problem with Tre is that I think he absolutely has to reach his full offensive potential to be an impact guy in the playoffs. He will always be a below average defender at best so he needs to be a truly elite offensive player to stay on the court. And there are enough lingering questions about his offense - lackluster rim pressure & finishing mostly - that I’d steer clear at 3. I think he’s the trade down candidate if that’s how things play out.

At least for a player like Harden, he was always a strong athlete with good hands so he can hold his own in certain defensive schemes or situations.

[stormi]

Last one . VJ shot 4.3 free throws per game, with his outlier athletic abilities( and a better team), while Tre shot 4.2 fts, so i dont think Tre will be that bad going to the rim. Imagine all the free lanes he will have in the NBA, with the atention Maxey, PG and Embiid command from the other teams defense. I think he will be just fine in this area.

In the end, i think VJ has more potential than Tre, if he can improve his handle ( developing his off the dribble shooting) and improving his 3 ball, but i think Tre has a bigger chance to reach his ceiling, really hard pick to make. In his best case scenario VJ can be a lesser version of Wade or similar to Mitchell, but it will be harder to him to get there, while i dont think is that hard to Tre to became an allstar.

Poor analysis.

VJ had a .373 free throw rate compared to Tre's .265. That's significantly more for VJ and a rather lacklustre number for Tre, especially in relation to how much usage he got. He's a pure shot creator with middling slashing ability, sub-optimal finishing, foul generation and passing.

Tre only got to the rim 97 times this past season, finished &59%. VJ got to the rim 126 times, finished &60%.

Tre's still a tad bit overrated on this board because of iso hesi's, but my main opposition is Ace, so I'm not focused on y'all right now.

You’re not wrong, but the counter to that is when you can shoot like Tre, only getting to the rim 30 less times is not that much.

It's true, but there was a bit of undermining of how great of a slasher VJ was this past season.

It's hard to find exact numbers, but MVP Shai posted a .404 free throw rate which is marginally better than raw athlete VJ at Baylor. Being able to draw free throws is an essential skill to protecting high level scoring numbers in all situations. All of the very best in the league march to the line en command. Thinking about Embiid, Shai, Giannis, Butler, Lebron etc.

Someone like Tobias averages a .224 free throw rate for his career, so worse than Tre, but not by much. A major glaring issue about Tobias come playoff time was how perimeter oriented his game was. Couldn't get to the line when it mattered and it only amplified due to how gunshy he was from 3.

Now of course Tre is a much better and more willing shooter than Tobias, but it's one of the hesitations I have with his profile. He's loosely being discussed like he's Harden (.509 career free throw rate) when he's a lot closer to a superstar version of Alec Burks.

[sodmoraes]

If we draft VJ we commit to Maxey being the PG, which i think its suboptimal, because he isnt that good of a passer( although he improved a little) and he´s more efficient as an off guard. While if we draft Harper and Tre they will, atleast after the first season, be lead guards while Maxey will be our SG.

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I can see Morey picking Tre because he sees a little Harden on him. You can see that Tre is already a better passer than Tyrese, so i think it makes sense that he will be the lead guard if we get him. If Maxey could get 6 APG i dont see why Tre cant get atleast 7, since his vision is already way more advanced than Maxey´s.

[eyeatoma]

My problem with Tre is that I think he absolutely has to reach his full offensive potential to be an impact guy in the playoffs. He will always be a below average defender at best so he needs to be a truly elite offensive player to stay on the court. And there are enough lingering questions about his offense - lackluster rim pressure & finishing mostly - that I’d steer clear at 3. I think he’s the trade down candidate if that’s how things play out.

At least for a player like Harden, he was always a strong athlete with good hands so he can hold his own in certain defensive schemes or situations.

Tre's comp is Ray Allen/Michael Redd. Now obviously Allen is one of the GOAT shooters. Redd was very good. I'd be happy with either but I do think he's going to be really good. Looks like he has a great head on his shoulders.

[stormi]

If we draft VJ we commit to Maxey being the PG, which i think its suboptimal, because he isnt that good of a passer( although he improved a little) and he´s more efficient as an off guard. While if we draft Harper and Tre they will, atleast after the first season, be lead guards while Maxey will be our SG.

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I can see Morey picking Tre because he sees a little Harden on him. You can see that Tre is already a better passer than Tyrese, so i think it makes sense that he will be the lead guard if we get him. If Maxey could get 6 APG i dont see why Tre cant get atleast 7, since his vision is already way more advanced than Maxey´s.

He's clearly a very talented and very raw offensive player. Provides rare on and off the ball shooting from day 1.

He blew up the combine and has impressive size for a guard so he's a ball of clay for whoever selects him. You'd have to really hope the defensive effort and rebounding issues are things that can be beaten into him, especially with him training against grown men & getting stronger.

His offensive game might even hit a new peak with the introduction of NBA spacing.

[M2J]

After watching what's going on with Kuminga, who has won playoff games for the Warriors this season... Then not played. Not crazy to want to have some clearance. But, he's/this pick is far more important to Philly than Kuminga is to GS. Steph still trying to win rings with veterans.... Philly needs a contingency for their veterans

Reed Sheppard was the third overall pick just last year and saw essentially zero burn on a stacked Rockets squad. Same thing with Rob Dillingham on the Wolves.

I don't blame a youngster for not wanting to get buried on a playoff roster, but at the same time as a wing and with his alleged profile, I'd be licking my chops looking at the 76ers depth chart. There's a golden pathway for him to walk right into that starting SF/PF spot from day one. Even more-so now with Yabusele halfway out the door.

It's his career though, and it's his right to choose where he feels lends the very best track to maximize his resources.

I have been watching that Kuminga situation very close. Kerr is so married to system he pretty much benched him because hes not a perfect fit. Super talented u would think kerr would make it work. Kuminga gets hurt the trade for jimmy happens they start winning kerr says in multiple interviews kuminga is out of the rotation. The warriors roster is horrible lacks length and athleticism which he brings

I live in Oakland. Everybody here knows that the team is trying and was trying to suppress Kumingas value...For financial reasons. The guy is a proper sized 4, who can score and defend multiple positions and even in his suppressed role... Has helped win playoff games. They use the premise that he isn't a great shooter, but don't give him consistent reps to a 22 yo good guy.

The teams are playing these games, and players know it now as this was extremely public

[zaz102]

My problem with Tre is that I think he absolutely has to reach his full offensive potential to be an impact guy in the playoffs. He will always be a below average defender at best so he needs to be a truly elite offensive player to stay on the court. And there are enough lingering questions about his offense - lackluster rim pressure & finishing mostly - that I’d steer clear at 3. I think he’s the trade down candidate if that’s how things play out.

At least for a player like Harden, he was always a strong athlete with good hands so he can hold his own in certain defensive schemes or situations.

I don't know. Tre has the measurables and athleticism to be a good defender. He might not ever be an average defender, but I wouldn't say it's out of the question.

[Iverson Armband]

Poor analysis.

VJ had a .373 free throw rate compared to Tre's .265. That's significantly more for VJ and a rather lacklustre number for Tre, especially in relation to how much usage he got. He's a pure shot creator with middling slashing ability, sub-optimal finishing, foul generation and passing.

Tre only got to the rim 97 times this past season, finished &59%. VJ got to the rim 126 times, finished &60%.

Tre's still a tad bit overrated on this board because of iso hesi's, but my main opposition is Ace, so I'm not focused on y'all right now.

You’re not wrong, but the counter to that is when you can shoot like Tre, only getting to the rim 30 less times is not that much.

It's true, but there was a bit of undermining of how great of a slasher VJ was this past season.

It's hard to find exact numbers, but MVP Shai posted a .404 free throw rate which is marginally better than raw athlete VJ at Baylor. Being able to draw free throws is an essential skill to protecting high level scoring numbers in all situations. All of the very best in the league march to the line en command. Thinking about Embiid, Shai, Giannis, Butler, Lebron etc.

Someone like Tobias averages a .224 free throw rate for his career, so worse than Tre, but not by much. A major glaring issue about Tobias come playoff time was how perimeter oriented his game was. Couldn't get to the line when it mattered and it only amplified due to how gunshy from 3.

Now of course Tre is a much better and more willing shooter than Tobias, but it's one of the hesitations I have with his profile. He's loosely being discussed like he's Harden (.509 career free throw rate) when he's a lot closer to a superstar version of Alec Burks.

Good post. I don’t have the time to look it up, but curious as to the free throw rate of Booker or Ray Allen. I think Tre compares to those two more than Harden.

[ExplosionsInDaSky]

If you take Edgecombe, you're not necessarily worried about positional fit just yet. You figure that out later, but eventually, ideally he becomes a lead guard or close to it. There's no reason to suggest that he can't improve his handle and passing. For now, you take him, put him out there and just let him make plays.

[stormi]

You’re not wrong, but the counter to that is when you can shoot like Tre, only getting to the rim 30 less times is not that much.

It's true, but there was a bit of undermining of how great of a slasher VJ was this past season.

It's hard to find exact numbers, but MVP Shai posted a .404 free throw rate which is marginally better than raw athlete VJ at Baylor. Being able to draw free throws is an essential skill to protecting high level scoring numbers in all situations. All of the very best in the league march to the line en command. Thinking about Embiid, Shai, Giannis, Butler, Lebron etc.

Someone like Tobias averages a .224 free throw rate for his career, so worse than Tre, but not by much. A major glaring issue about Tobias come playoff time was how perimeter oriented his game was. Couldn't get to the line when it mattered and it only amplified due to how gunshy from 3.

Now of course Tre is a much better and more willing shooter than Tobias, but it's one of the hesitations I have with his profile. He's loosely being discussed like he's Harden (.509 career free throw rate) when he's a lot closer to a superstar version of Alec Burks.

Good post. I don’t have the time to look it up, but curious as to the free throw rate of Booker or Ray Allen. I think Tre compares to those two more than Harden.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bookede01.html

If you scroll down to the "Advanced" category, you can find the FTr column.

Booker's at ~32% for his career.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/devin-booker-2.html

~22% at Kentucky (although he was a bench warmer and his role was quite subdued)

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/a/allenra02.html

26% for Ray Allen for his career, so pretty much 1:1 with Tre at Texas. Really interesting comp, btw.

[Stanford]

stormi thinks Booker went to Duke. DISQUALIFIED

[Iverson Armband]

stormi thinks Booker went to Duke. DISQUALIFIED

He thinks all blue people look the same

[stormi]

stormi thinks Booker went to Duke. DISQUALIFIED

My brain is absolutely fried. I've been looking at splits, attacking Ace Bailey, studying the psychological make-up of prospects, attacking Ace Bailey, dissecting film, attacking Ace Bailey, reading tweets and attacking Ace Bailey for weeks at this point.

There's real life steam emitting from the top of my scalp, like a truck broken down on the side of road.

I'm logging off until draft night unless something major breaks.

Peace.

[Stanford]

bye stormi