Markelle Fultz Discussion III: For Fultz and going forward (see 2017 draft thread for trade discussion)

[PLO]

Interesting. I've never heard of wingspan being useful for shooting over a defender. I'm not sure that I understand the correlation. Based on what I've seen of him I'm not sure his wingspan gives him the advantage that you believe, based on how many shots he seems to get blocked.

He gets shots blocked when trying to finish at the rim, which was particularly common for him when he had his "scapular imbalance", ie couldn't shoot from distance at all and hence was trying to makeup for his lack of scoring by driving. In college he was routinely good shooting over defenders with his array of "hesi pull-up jimbos" etc - very quick and fluid to get his shot off from distance. That was a strength of his in college and it routinely translates well to the NBA if the player has a high release point, which Fultz did.

That's one worry I have about Trae Young, his release point isn't that high and he doesn't have the length of a Fultz anyway. Its a pretty minor quibble with Young though, he makes up for it in so many other ways with his incredible craft and awesome finishing from almost anywhere on the floor.

Having a high release point on a jumper has nothing to do with wingspan.

TBH I’m not really seeing your point.

[Bum Adebayo]

Russell has similar size and wingspan and his release is fairly low, it depends on how much you jump and your mechanics too, but having a higher standing reach certainly helps, wingspan isn't always the best indicator because some players shoulders sit lower.

[PLO]

Russell has similar size and wingspan and his release is fairly low, it depends on how much you jump and your mechanics too, but having a higher standing reach certainly helps, wingspan isn't always the best indicator because some players shoulders sit lower.

Being longer does actually help you have a higher release; my point is being longer helps you to shoot over traffic and over closeouts but yes I guess technically even a midget could have a high release point, in practice though this release point wouldn't be all that high. Possibly a big reason Peter Dinklage never graded out to be NBA level talent.

[LloydFree]

He gets shots blocked when trying to finish at the rim, which was particularly common for him when he had his "scapular imbalance", ie couldn't shoot from distance at all and hence was trying to makeup for his lack of scoring by driving. In college he was routinely good shooting over defenders with his array of "hesi pull-up jimbos" etc - very quick and fluid to get his shot off from distance. That was a strength of his in college and it routinely translates well to the NBA if the player has a high release point, which Fultz did.

That's one worry I have about Trae Young, his release point isn't that high and he doesn't have the length of a Fultz anyway. Its a pretty minor quibble with Young though, he makes up for it in so many other ways with his incredible craft and awesome finishing from almost anywhere on the floor.

Having a high release point on a jumper has nothing to do with wingspan.

TBH I’m not really seeing your point.

The point is, you said Fultz having a 6'10 wingspan helps him get shots up over defenders. Wingspan doesn't do that. And even if you meant to say that it helps you get 3 pointers or perimeter shots up over defenses, there is no evidence of that. A quick release and lift on your jump helps you get shots up. If anything, longer arms would make you take longer to get the shot up. Wingspan helps players defend switches, block shots and get deflections in passing lanes. I've never heard of wingspan helping a player get perimeter shots up over defenders.

[GWPhilly34]

Not sure if anyone posted this but for the first time in a long time he posted a pic on Snapchat of laced up basketball sneakers on the actual basketball court. Hoping that means he’s back to basketball activities but not gonna hold my breath.

[PLO]

Having a high release point on a jumper has nothing to do with wingspan.

TBH I’m not really seeing your point.

The point is, you said Fultz having a 6'10 wingspan helps him get shots up over defenders. Wingspan doesn't do that. And even if you meant to say that it helps you get 3 pointers or perimeter shots up over defenses, there is no evidence of that. A quick release and lift on your jump helps you get shots up. If anything, longer arms would make you take longer to get the shot up. Wingspan helps players defend switches, block shots and get deflections in passing lanes. I've never heard of wingspan helping a player get perimeter shots up over defenders.

?? so you're saying the length of his arms have nothing to do with where he releases the ball in his shot? So technically we could amputate DSJ's arms, put them on Fultz after removing his and its going to have no effect on how high his release point is on his shot?

[sixers hoops]

Not sure if anyone posted this but for the first time in a long time he posted a pic on Snapchat of laced up basketball sneakers on the actual basketball court. Hoping that means he’s back to basketball activities but not gonna hold my breath.

Definitely don’t. In all honesty, there is a great chance that he will start the next stage of his rehab and we’ll get another eval in three weeks.

[LloydFree]

TBH I’m not really seeing your point.

The point is, you said Fultz having a 6'10 wingspan helps him get shots up over defenders. Wingspan doesn't do that. And even if you meant to say that it helps you get 3 pointers or perimeter shots up over defenses, there is no evidence of that. A quick release and lift on your jump helps you get shots up. If anything, longer arms would make you take longer to get the shot up. Wingspan helps players defend switches, block shots and get deflections in passing lanes. I've never heard of wingspan helping a player get perimeter shots up over defenders.

?? so you're saying the length of his arms have nothing to do with where he releases the ball in his shot? So technically we could amputate DSJ's arms, put them on Fultz after removing his and its going to have no effect on how high his release point is on his shot?

I'm saying your original statement that "his wingspan helps him get shots up over defenders" or 'helps him get his jumper off', is incorrect. Wingspan has nothing to do with it, and your theory is wrong.

[PLO]

The point is, you said Fultz having a 6'10 wingspan helps him get shots up over defenders. Wingspan doesn't do that. And even if you meant to say that it helps you get 3 pointers or perimeter shots up over defenses, there is no evidence of that. A quick release and lift on your jump helps you get shots up. If anything, longer arms would make you take longer to get the shot up. Wingspan helps players defend switches, block shots and get deflections in passing lanes. I've never heard of wingspan helping a player get perimeter shots up over defenders.

?? so you're saying the length of his arms have nothing to do with where he releases the ball in his shot? So technically we could amputate DSJ's arms, put them on Fultz after removing his and its going to have no effect on how high his release point is on his shot?

I'm saying your original statement that "his wingspan helps him get shots up over defenders" or 'helps him get his jumper off', is incorrect. Wingspan has nothing to do with it, and your theory is wrong.

Well, you're welcome to your opinion. As is Kyrie for thinking the Earth is flat.

[LloydFree]

JJ Redick is 6'5 with a 6'3 wingspan... if he had a 6'10 wingspan, he'd have 100% 3pt percentage. LOL.

[Kolkmania]

The point is, you said Fultz having a 6'10 wingspan helps him get shots up over defenders. Wingspan doesn't do that. And even if you meant to say that it helps you get 3 pointers or perimeter shots up over defenses, there is no evidence of that. A quick release and lift on your jump helps you get shots up. If anything, longer arms would make you take longer to get the shot up. Wingspan helps players defend switches, block shots and get deflections in passing lanes. I've never heard of wingspan helping a player get perimeter shots up over defenders.

?? so you're saying the length of his arms have nothing to do with where he releases the ball in his shot? So technically we could amputate DSJ's arms, put them on Fultz after removing his and its going to have no effect on how high his release point is on his shot?

I'm saying your original statement that "his wingspan helps him get shots up over defenders" or 'helps him get his jumper off', is incorrect. Wingspan has nothing to do with it, and your theory is wrong.

Actually your theory is factually incorrect. Wingspan isn't the main factor because the shooting mechanics are more important regarding the release point.
However if you have two players with identical shooting mechanics and one of them has a longer wingspan than his release point is per definition higher since the shooting arm has an angle with the floor.

Basically height release point = cos^-1(angle shooting arm with floor) * length arm.

[sixers hoops]

?? so you're saying the length of his arms have nothing to do with where he releases the ball in his shot? So technically we could amputate DSJ's arms, put them on Fultz after removing his and its going to have no effect on how high his release point is on his shot?

I'm saying your original statement that "his wingspan helps him get shots up over defenders" or 'helps him get his jumper off', is incorrect. Wingspan has nothing to do with it, and your theory is wrong.

Actually your theory is factually incorrect. Wingspan isn't the main factor because the shooting mechanics are more important regarding the release point.
However if you have two players with identical shooting mechanics and one of them has a longer wingspan than his release point is per definition higher since the shooting arm has an angle with the floor.

Basically height release point = cos^-1(angle shooting arm with floor) * length arm.

Durant appears to have really long arms and a high release point. I never thought about it too much though.

[BullyKing]

JJ Redick is 6'5 with a 6'3 wingspan... if he had a 6'10 wingspan, he'd have 100% 3pt percentage. LOL.

You don't need to mock opinions you disagree with. The other poster said nothing about having that kind of difference. His opinion was only that since you both agree that a high release point helps get up shots over close out defenders, it is reasonable to think that someone with a long wing span will have an even higher release point. In response, you made the good point that this overlooks that a long wing span might lead to a longer motion, thus outweighing or negating the higher release point. It should have been left at that.

[JojoSlimbiid]

Probably a few more weeks based on a Pompey Instagram comment. His writing sucks but he seems more than anyone to be the mouth piece of the team. We'll see though the comment did seem more opinion based but who knows.

[ankle420breaker]

Probably a few more weeks based on a Pompey Instagram comment. His writing sucks but he seems more than anyone to be the mouth piece of the team. We'll see though the comment did seem more opinion based but who knows.

If that's the case then the organization needs to do some explaining... you know, considering he's 100% healthy and feels no pain...

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

[James40]

Not sure if anyone posted this but for the first time in a long time he posted a pic on Snapchat of laced up basketball sneakers on the actual basketball court. Hoping that means he’s back to basketball activities but not gonna hold my breath.

Definitely don’t. In all honesty, there is a great chance that he will start the next stage of his rehab and we’ll get another eval in three weeks.

If they do another three weeks, do you think they’ll shut him down for the year? It seems with rookies that may be available by late January, the Sixers usually shut them down for the year.

[LloydFree]

I hope they let this guy play, so they can get a good look at him. If he sits on ice all year, then that may influence how they use the draft picks for next year. I don't want them passing on guards in the draft based on not wanting two rookie guards on the roster.

[XDevilBoiX]

I am thinking they have been working with him to change his shot all this time behind closed doors. No other reason to hold him out of practice for 3 weeks when he is no longer in pain. They didn’t want him to go back to how he was shooting in college and since he was starting to change it on his own, might as well use this time to completely change it.

With the next update, he will begin practicing with the team to get back into game shape. Might be a few weeks before he gets into game actions.

[JojoSlimbiid]

I am thinking they have been working with him to change his shot all this time behind closed doors. No other reason to hold him out of practice for 3 weeks when he is no longer in pain. They didn’t want him to go back to how he was shooting in college and since he was starting to change it on his own, might as well use this time to completely change it.

This is not a good thing. I don't really trust our player development at all.

[ankle420breaker]

Apparently Fultz is doing some shooting training with Mahmoud Rauf.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk