RealGM

Discuss.

(Maybe I will add a poll)

Moving this stuff here:

Unbreakable99 wrote:

NYSixersFan wrote:It was thrilling and sad at the same time....thrilling to see Embiid and what the potential is....sad to see the fans be so desperate to see him succeed...Embiid is like seeing a river in the desert after wandering around for 3 yrs.

Having said that, if Embiid and Simmons stay healthy, the Sixers will win a title within 5 yrs

Lol. You didn't like Hinkie and wanted him home but it was Hinkie's very forward thinking that we got Embiid and Simmons. Without Hinkie we don't get either. So you're now giving Hinkie props for getting them? Lol.

BullyKing wrote:Putting aside the reply I kind of find it interesting that someone that was merciless with criticism of Hinkie is now saying they will win a title within 5 years because of what he did. I'm sort of interested in whether the Hinkie-haters that see the fruits of his efforts now acknowledge a change in opinion or will instead credit Colangelo somehow.

Was a god, still a god.

Didn't we do this soon after he left and the results were overwhelmingly positive? He has only been more vindicated since then, so I would expect the same results.

My position has always been that Hinkie did EVERYTHING right other than the not signing of Ish before last year, and some poor messaging.

Getting us out of the asset deficit, clearing the dead wood from the team, hiring Brown, revamping the training staff, and getting two potential franchise players in just over 3 years is a virtually unprecedented accomplishment.

Last night was his night, and it must have been a great moment for him wherever he was watching. Plus, since he left with his dignity when the owners were about to humiliate him by putting him under a used car salesman, his legend will only grow in time.

From my perspective, I will enjoy sitting back and watching the world catch up to him and understand what he was able to do.

I'm not sure if drafting injured and stashed players (Noel, Embiid, Saric) was done on purpose to stay bad for a while or they were just BPA in Hinkie's mind. Our team was bad, really bad, for a long time. It was painful to watch at times, but we all knew it had to be done to acquire superstar potential.
So far Hinkie had some decent deals acquiring 2nd rounders, finding talent in 2nd round (Grant, Holmes, KJ) and picked up some nice undrafted players like Covington and TJ. Even better deals were trading Elfrid Payton and Jrue Holiday.

BUT. The best has yet to come, the MCW trade will hopefully end up in a great talent from this draft, the Sacramento pick swaps are extra lottery balls and the Kings '19 pick has enormous potential. We can develop our current roster and still acquire draft talent or trade these picks to complement the current roster. Compare this situation with the post Bynum situation.

Sam Hinkie .

Kolkmania wrote:I'm not sure if drafting injured and stashed players (Noel, Embiid, Saric) was done on purpose to stay bad for a while or they were just BPA in Hinkie's mind.

This is character assassination pure and simple, and it is frustrating that ANYONE would think that a GM would deliberately draft players to make us worse. Hinkie took the player that he thought was the best at every slot that we had. He said that he did that, and he actually did that. You are basically saying that you aren't sure if he was a fool and a liar.

It makes no sense on its face. Why would you tank to get the highest picks, and then sandbag the picks that you get?

Ericb5 wrote:

Kolkmania wrote:I'm not sure if drafting injured and stashed players (Noel, Embiid, Saric) was done on purpose to stay bad for a while or they were just BPA in Hinkie's mind.

This is character assassination pure and simple, and it is frustrating that ANYONE would think that a GM would deliberately draft players to make us worse. Hinkie took the player that he thought was the best at every slot that we had. He said that he did that, and he actually did that. You are basically saying that you aren't sure if he was a fool and a liar.

It makes no sense on its face. Why would you tank to get the highest picks, and then sandbag the picks that you get?

It's like no one in the media understood taking a long view of things. People don't seem to realize that draft picks become players and that, by and large, injured players magically become uninjured eventually. If you aren't constrained by the shackles of immediacy and instant gratification you can really leach value from teams that are and that's just what Hinkie did. If we had Aaron Gordon, Peyton, and like Ben Mclemore there would be no optimism surrounding this team and there wouldn't have been any for the last few years.

Ericb5 wrote:

Kolkmania wrote:I'm not sure if drafting injured and stashed players (Noel, Embiid, Saric) was done on purpose to stay bad for a while or they were just BPA in Hinkie's mind.

This is character assassination pure and simple, and it is frustrating that ANYONE would think that a GM would deliberately draft players to make us worse. Hinkie took the player that he thought was the best at every slot that we had. He said that he did that, and he actually did that. You are basically saying that you aren't sure if he was a fool and a liar.

It makes no sense on its face. Why would you tank to get the highest picks, and then sandbag the picks that you get?

bc it was a ponzi scheme, per certain people.

That was seriously a take during this whole thing. Because people have no patience and also have an agenda (slander this guys name bc he didn't make himself available to the media thus giving them easy spoonfed stories to write).

BullyKing wrote:

HartfordWhalers wrote:

mksp wrote:
Honestly, you shouldn't be allowed to enjoy this. Go away.

Lets not go down either of these avenues of discussion. Thanks both of you.

Putting aside the reply I kind of find it interesting that someone that was merciless with criticism of Hinkie is now saying they will win a title within 5 years because of what he did. I'm sort of interested in whether the Hinkie-haters that see the fruits of his efforts now acknowledge a change in opinion or will instead credit Colangelo somehow.

I would not say we're winning the title within 5 yrs if he was still here.....I'm also skeptical that Embiid will actually stay healthy...but let's hope...

Ericb5 wrote:

Kolkmania wrote:I'm not sure if drafting injured and stashed players (Noel, Embiid, Saric) was done on purpose to stay bad for a while or they were just BPA in Hinkie's mind.

This is character assassination pure and simple, and it is frustrating that ANYONE would think that a GM would deliberately draft players to make us worse. Hinkie took the player that he thought was the best at every slot that we had. He said that he did that, and he actually did that. You are basically saying that you aren't sure if he was a fool and a liar.

It makes no sense on its face. Why would you tank to get the highest picks, and then sandbag the picks that you get?

Well, personally I believe he always drafted BPA. But If two prospects were rated as equal, perhaps the ability of stashing the prospect made the difference to pick that player, nobody knows aside from Hinkie himself. So it's not the case of "sandbagging" the picks, but a possibility that would have made the difference between two prospects. Stating that I'm accusing Hinkie of being a fool or a liar comes closer to character assassination than what I did.

Wanted to make the point that irregardless of that aspect he was a gift from heaven.

Delete.

There is more to being a GM than just tanking and drafting....the way he handled the Okafor Boston fight was a disgrace...being able to deal with the media and agents are a big part of being a GM....he was a massive failure...it would continue to undermine "the process".

NYSixersFan wrote:There is more to being a GM than just tanking and drafting....the way he handled the Okafor Boston fight was a disgrace...being able to deal with the media and agents are a big part of being a GM....he was a massive failure...it would continue to undermine "the process".

You're cognitive dissonance between your thoughts on the Sixers now (i.e., Simmons and Embiid winning a championship) and what Hinkie did to get them is simply stunning. I'm pre-emptively laughing at your posts in five years about how you were "right" that we never would have won with Hinkie when players that Hinkie acquired leads us to the promise land.

jbent87 wrote:

Ericb5 wrote:

Kolkmania wrote:I'm not sure if drafting injured and stashed players (Noel, Embiid, Saric) was done on purpose to stay bad for a while or they were just BPA in Hinkie's mind.

This is character assassination pure and simple, and it is frustrating that ANYONE would think that a GM would deliberately draft players to make us worse. Hinkie took the player that he thought was the best at every slot that we had. He said that he did that, and he actually did that. You are basically saying that you aren't sure if he was a fool and a liar.

It makes no sense on its face. Why would you tank to get the highest picks, and then sandbag the picks that you get?

bc it was a ponzi scheme, per certain people.

That was seriously a take during this whole thing. Because people have no patience and also have an agenda (slander this guys name bc he didn't make himself available to the media thus giving them easy spoonfed stories to write).

It was mostly just old dudes who have no patience for a multi-year plan.

Hinkie > Einstein, Darwin, Galileo etc.

Hinkie ain't nuttin to f wit!

NYSixersFan wrote:

BullyKing wrote:

HartfordWhalers wrote:
Lets not go down either of these avenues of discussion. Thanks both of you.

Putting aside the reply I kind of find it interesting that someone that was merciless with criticism of Hinkie is now saying they will win a title within 5 years because of what he did. I'm sort of interested in whether the Hinkie-haters that see the fruits of his efforts now acknowledge a change in opinion or will instead credit Colangelo somehow.

I would not say we're winning the title within 5 yrs if he was still here.....I'm also skeptical that Embiid will actually stay healthy...but let's hope...

Lol. You just don't get it. If Hinkie is never GM then we don't have either or Embiid or Simmons. Some other GM would have most likely stayed the course and we would have kept Jrue and drafted an average player in 2013. We would have been competitive enough in 2013-2014 to finish outside the top 9 and gotten another decent but not potentially great player. Then in the 2015-2016 season we wouldn't have been bad enough to pick in the top 5 because we more than likely have Jrue and the 2013 average player and 2014 average player and maybe still Evan Turner on the team and we could be picking at 7 or 8. You never get it. Hinkie got us Simmons and Embiid and picks. He wasn't going to just tank forever. He would have added pieces and we would have gotten better.

Unbreakable99 wrote:

NYSixersFan wrote:

BullyKing wrote:
Putting aside the reply I kind of find it interesting that someone that was merciless with criticism of Hinkie is now saying they will win a title within 5 years because of what he did. I'm sort of interested in whether the Hinkie-haters that see the fruits of his efforts now acknowledge a change in opinion or will instead credit Colangelo somehow.

I would not say we're winning the title within 5 yrs if he was still here.....I'm also skeptical that Embiid will actually stay healthy...but let's hope...

Lol. You just don't get it. If Hinkie is never GM then we don't have either or Embiid or Simmons. Some other GM would have most likely stayed the course and we would have kept Jrue and drafted an average player in 2013. We would have been competitive enough in 2013-2014 to finish outside the top 9 and gotten another decent but not potentially great player. Then in the 2015-2016 season we wouldn't have been bad enough to pick in the top 5 because we more than likely have Jrue and the 2013 average player and 2014 average player and maybe still Evan Turner on the team and we could be picking at 7 or 8. You never get it. Hinkie got us Simmons and Embiid and picks. He wasn't going to just tank forever. He would have added pieces and we would have gotten better.

But Hinkie can't do what he did if he was not permitted by the ownership right ?

Hinkie did what every GM in this league dreams to do.
Keep being bad and keep tanking until you got enough high lottery talents while don't have to worry about your poor records would cost your job.
Genarally He did a great job making some trades to put this team into a better position.
He did fine in draft by strictly following the strategy of picking BPA.
I just think if you believe Hinkie lead the team into the right way then you should also give the ownership credits too since ultimately they are the one who give Hinkie permition to do what he want. And thats a kind of rare permition for a GM to get from your boss in this league.

phifans wrote:Hinkie did what every GM in this league dreams to do.
Keep being bad and keep tanking until you got enough high lottery talents while don't have to worry about your poor records would cost your job.
Genarally He did a great job making some trades to put this team into a better position.
He did fine in draft by strictly following the strategy of picking BPA.
I just think if you believe Hinkie lead the team into the right way then you should also give the ownership credits too since ultimately they are the one who give Hinkie permition to do what he want. And thats a kind of rare permition for a GM to get from your boss in this league.

They gave him permission to do all of that and then pulled the rug out from under him in the 11th hour due to peer pressure from Twitter and local media.

jbent87 wrote:

phifans wrote:Hinkie did what every GM in this league dreams to do.
Keep being bad and keep tanking until you got enough high lottery talents while don't have to worry about your poor records would cost your job.
Genarally He did a great job making some trades to put this team into a better position.
He did fine in draft by strictly following the strategy of picking BPA.
I just think if you believe Hinkie lead the team into the right way then you should also give the ownership credits too since ultimately they are the one who give Hinkie permition to do what he want. And thats a kind of rare permition for a GM to get from your boss in this league.

They gave him permission to do all of that and then pulled the rug out from under him in the 11th hour due to peer pressure from Twitter and local media.

They didn't do it because of pressure from outside. They did it because they believe Hinkie has done what they asked him to do two and half years ago and they think some others may be the better candidate for the rest of work. The point is they know what they want from the very begining and they find a right guy to excecute the part one of this plan.