2017 Draft: Fultz trade and other 17 draft discussion

[Wilfried]

Just can't imagine all this talk about him not being able to shoot.

This is the video from SL:

Watch on YouTube

Maybe the mechanics aren't the most beautifull, but he was able to shoot it from NBA 3-point range, didn't he????

What went wrong with his shoulder and why he changed his shot, I don't know. But I really can't imagine all the talk here like the player he is now, was the player we saw in college and SL.

[kriss73]

For what we know, his shot and range are like Lonzo's.
So, why the kid isn't playing? This is the real mystery to me.

[76ciology]

For what we know, his shot and range are like Lonzo's.
So, why the kid isn't playing? This is the real mystery to me.

1.) were doing well without him
2.) sitting him out is better for long run and can be said that it likely can get him better ASAP (short run) with focusing on his problem

[kriss73]

For what we know, his shot and range are like Lonzo's.
So, why the kid isn't playing? This is the real mystery to me.

1.) were doing well without him
2.) sitting him out is better for long run and can be said that it likely can get him better ASAP (short run) with focusing on his problem

1.) Fine, but I can't see how Fultz could hurt the team. Make it better? Probably not, but worse...come on.
2.) This is debatable. Sometime you need to redshirt in order to improve, sometimes learning on the job is better.

I hope to see him come back this year, even if his shot is garbage.

[Sixerscan]

again I love that some people are so smug that they are now acting like they totally saw this coming.

Because many did.

viewtopic.php?f=26&t=1628264#start_here

That was the most interesting thing about the draft threads leading up to last June. 90% of the guys who consistently posted in those threads while watching the games, didn't have Fultz as either #1 or #2. But after the fact, you have guys who didn't even watch the games trying to tell everybody who did watch, what they saw. It is hilarious, really.

How did this become a conversation about your YouTube scouting again? The "this" Mik is referring to, that link Knobble provided and the reason not playing in games right now is that he can't shoot a basketball further than a foot from the basket. Not because his athleticism is underwhelming or something.

[LloydFree]

Because many did.

viewtopic.php?f=26&t=1628264#start_here

That was the most interesting thing about the draft threads leading up to last June. 90% of the guys who consistently posted in those threads while watching the games, didn't have Fultz as either #1 or #2. But after the fact, you have guys who didn't even watch the games trying to tell everybody who did watch, what they saw. It is hilarious, really.

How did this become a conversation about your YouTube scouting again? The "this" Mik is referring to, that link Knobble provided and the reason not playing in games right now is that he can't shoot a basketball further than a foot from the basket. Not because his athleticism is underwhelming or something.

OK. I give. He's terrible because he can't shoot, not because of anything else. That's a loss for me. I've learned my lesson.

[76ciology]

For what we know, his shot and range are like Lonzo's.
So, why the kid isn't playing? This is the real mystery to me.

1.) were doing well without him
2.) sitting him out is better for long run and can be said that it likely can get him better ASAP (short run) with focusing on his problem

1.) Fine, but I can't see how Fultz could hurt the team. Make it better? Probably not, but worse...come on.
2.) This is debatable. Sometime you need to redshirt in order to improve, sometimes learning on the job is better.

I hope to see him come back this year, even if his shot is garbage.

2.) have u seen how realistic virtual reality is nowadays?

[OFWGKTA]

1.) were doing well without him
2.) sitting him out is better for long run and can be said that it likely can get him better ASAP (short run) with focusing on his problem

1.) Fine, but I can't see how Fultz could hurt the team. Make it better? Probably not, but worse...come on.
2.) This is debatable. Sometime you need to redshirt in order to improve, sometimes learning on the job is better.

I hope to see him come back this year, even if his shot is garbage.

2.) have u seen how realistic virtual reality is nowadays?

I wonder if they set him up on a VR court in the middle of a warzone, so when he gets in front a crowd it'll feel easy

[Sixerscan]

That was the most interesting thing about the draft threads leading up to last June. 90% of the guys who consistently posted in those threads while watching the games, didn't have Fultz as either #1 or #2. But after the fact, you have guys who didn't even watch the games trying to tell everybody who did watch, what they saw. It is hilarious, really.

How did this become a conversation about your YouTube scouting again? The "this" Mik is referring to, that link Knobble provided and the reason not playing in games right now is that he can't shoot a basketball further than a foot from the basket. Not because his athleticism is underwhelming or something.

OK. I give. He's terrible because he can't shoot, not because of anything else. That's a loss for me. I've learned my lesson. Validation of the pick.

"Loss for you" wtf? I don't care about your wannabe scouting rep lol. If you're right or wrong about individual guys it doesn't change the fact that you make ridiculously dogmatic conclusions based on watching a guy play on TV a few times. If anything, this situation that's happening with Fultz should make you realize that there's a lot more that goes into projecting 19 year olds than that. Instead you're taking him not playing because of this incredibly weird situation with his shot as if you have been validated and predicted this all along. As someone who never had a strong opinion on the guy in the first place I find it exceedingly annoying how you have done nothing but talk about this over and over for the last year, melding ridiculous development after ridiculous development with this kid to fit the conclusions from the 4 PAC12 games you watched.

[76ciology]

1.) Fine, but I can't see how Fultz could hurt the team. Make it better? Probably not, but worse...come on.
2.) This is debatable. Sometime you need to redshirt in order to improve, sometimes learning on the job is better.

I hope to see him come back this year, even if his shot is garbage.

2.) have u seen how realistic virtual reality is nowadays?

I wonder if they set him up on a VR court in the middle of a warzone, so when he gets in front a crowd it'll feel easy

Maybe in a warzone where he’s a granade thrower

[Eyeamok]

Damn Fultz is gonna divide the fanbase more than a 10 win season, Embiid missing two season and missing out on Kristaps Porziņģis.

[LloydFree]

How did this become a conversation about your YouTube scouting again? The "this" Mik is referring to, that link Knobble provided and the reason not playing in games right now is that he can't shoot a basketball further than a foot from the basket. Not because his athleticism is underwhelming or something.

OK. I give. He's terrible because he can't shoot, not because of anything else. That's a loss for me. I've learned my lesson. Validation of the pick.

"Loss for you" wtf? I don't care about your wannabe scouting rep lol. If you're right or wrong about individual guys it doesn't change the fact that you make ridiculously dogmatic conclusions based on watching a guy play on TV a few times. If anything, this situation that's happening with Fultz should make you realize that there's a lot more that goes into projecting 19 year olds than that. Instead you're taking him not playing because of this incredibly weird situation with his shot as if you have been validated and predicted this all along. As someone who never had a strong opinion on the guy in the first place I find it exceedingly annoying how you have done nothing but talk about this over and over for the last year, melding ridiculous development after ridiculous development with this kid to fit the conclusions from the 4 PAC12 games you watched.

Ad hom attacks and insults from you doesn't make me change my opinion on the subject. I don't need validation from you. You and Mik are stuck on "This guy thinks he's so smart...He doesn't get to boast that he's right on this...". I'm not on that. I haven't boasted that I was right, ONE TIME. I've said he wasn't close to being the best player in this draft and they wouldn't be in this situation (weird fluke or not) if Colangelo had done his homework and resisted doing that ridiculous trade. That is all to it.

[Eyeamok]

Danny Ainge before the draft: "Any Sucker GMs out there looking to give me 2 #1s for Fultz?" Bryan Colangelo raises his hand "Over here Danny, over here!" SMH

You know it could always be worse. When Embiid was not picked #1, Ainge was trying to move up and was offering picks so he could draft Embiid. Can you imagine if BC was our GM at the time. Oh my cod.

[Sixerscan]

OK. I give. He's terrible because he can't shoot, not because of anything else. That's a loss for me. I've learned my lesson. Validation of the pick.

"Loss for you" wtf? I don't care about your wannabe scouting rep lol. If you're right or wrong about individual guys it doesn't change the fact that you make ridiculously dogmatic conclusions based on watching a guy play on TV a few times. If anything, this situation that's happening with Fultz should make you realize that there's a lot more that goes into projecting 19 year olds than that. Instead you're taking him not playing because of this incredibly weird situation with his shot as if you have been validated and predicted this all along. As someone who never had a strong opinion on the guy in the first place I find it exceedingly annoying how you have done nothing but talk about this over and over for the last year, melding ridiculous development after ridiculous development with this kid to fit the conclusions from the 4 PAC12 games you watched.

Ad hom attacks and insults from you doesn't make me change my opinion on the subject. I don't need validation from you. You and Mik are stuck on "This guy thinks he's so smart...He doesn't get to boast that he's right on this...". I'm not on that. I haven't boasted that I was right, ONE TIME. I've said he wasn't close to being the best player in this draft and they wouldn't be in this situation (weird fluke or not) if Colangelo had done his homework and resisted doing that ridiculous trade. That is all to it.

What homework? Watch 4 pac12 games on tv the way you did? Do you honestly think they didn't do that? They have a full scouting department and came to a different conclusion than you. I'm sure if you were less obsessed with protecting your imagined rep you could think of times a team disagreed with you about a prospect you felt strongly about and they were right.

Either way this is small potatoes relative to the fact that the guy completely forgot how to shoot. I hope we can get to the point where we are worried about whether he can create separation against elite length or whatever it was you actually didn't like about the guy.

[gdog2004]

It's not often that guys overcome these things (the Yips)
https://www.si.com/extra-mustard/2016/01/11/10-athletes-who-got-yips-and-how-their-careers-worked-out
But there are some so we can hold out hope. When you research the biggest busts in NBA history and look at their numbers relative to their draft position you could make an argument that if Fultz never regains his shot, like at all, he will go down as the biggest bust in NBA history. And the trade to get him (assuming the Celtics get a top player next year like Bagley or someone) will go down as the worst trade in NBA history. Imagine that, you traded Jason Tatum and Marvin Bagley for a guy who can't play. Yikes.
Because of this, BC will be fired. So he probably knows this, and therefore may be a little testy when it comes to meeting with the press about Fultz.
It's really not his fault, because Fultz was considered THE pick to play with Simmons by a LOT of knowledgeable people(myself included) , but this is how these things go. Someone has to take the fall.

[ExplosionsInDaSky]

The question was never if Fultz could play at this level, because he showed all the abilities even after we drafted him during Summer League. Physically he easily looked the part of a lead guard. Whatever weird stuff happened between the end of SL and the start of Preseason is where the problem lies. So basically it is going to come down to whether or not he finds his shot again, because everything else screams NBA player to me. From his defense, handles, ability to create space, awareness, etc.

[gdog2004]

The question was never if Fultz could play at this level, because he showed all the abilities even after we drafted him during Summer League. Physically he easily looked the part of a lead guard. Whatever weird stuff happened between the end of SL and the start of Preseason is where the problem lies. So basically it is going to come down to whether or not he finds his shot again, because everything else screams NBA player to me. From his defense, handles, ability to create space, awareness, etc.

Agree, but none of those things matter if he can't shoot at all. He is not SO good at any of those things that he can exist without a shot. Everything was predicated on him being able to get and make his shot.
Why is what I am saying true ? Because if any of those things were at such a high level he would be playing over scrubs like Bayless, and he's not.

[Bum Adebayo]

The question was never if Fultz could play at this level, because he showed all the abilities even after we drafted him during Summer League. Physically he easily looked the part of a lead guard. Whatever weird stuff happened between the end of SL and the start of Preseason is where the problem lies. So basically it is going to come down to whether or not he finds his shot again, because everything else screams NBA player to me. From his defense, handles, ability to create space, awareness, etc.

Agree, but none of those things matter if he can't shoot at all. He is not SO good at any of those things that he can exist without a shot. Everything was predicated on him being able to get and make his shot.
Why is what I am saying true ? Because if any of those things were at such a high level he would be playing over scrubs like Bayless, and he's not.

Without a shot he is better than Bayless, I can guarantee you that, so he would have a place in our rotation even with no shot. We just need to follow our tradition of sitting 1st pick.

[gdog2004]

The question was never if Fultz could play at this level, because he showed all the abilities even after we drafted him during Summer League. Physically he easily looked the part of a lead guard. Whatever weird stuff happened between the end of SL and the start of Preseason is where the problem lies. So basically it is going to come down to whether or not he finds his shot again, because everything else screams NBA player to me. From his defense, handles, ability to create space, awareness, etc.

Agree, but none of those things matter if he can't shoot at all. He is not SO good at any of those things that he can exist without a shot. Everything was predicated on him being able to get and make his shot.
Why is what I am saying true ? Because if any of those things were at such a high level he would be playing over scrubs like Bayless, and he's not.

Without a shot he is better than Bayless, I can guarantee you that, so he would have a place in our rotation even with no shot. We just need to follow our tradition of sitting 1st pick.

Got it, so your take is he's not playing because he's better than Bayless. Makes sense.

[BullyKing]

Agree, but none of those things matter if he can't shoot at all. He is not SO good at any of those things that he can exist without a shot. Everything was predicated on him being able to get and make his shot.
Why is what I am saying true ? Because if any of those things were at such a high level he would be playing over scrubs like Bayless, and he's not.

Without a shot he is better than Bayless, I can guarantee you that, so he would have a place in our rotation even with no shot. We just need to follow our tradition of sitting 1st pick.

Got it, so your take is he's not playing because he's better than Bayless. Makes sense.

Or, more likely, unlike Bayless they actually care about his long term future and don't think its best to send him out there until he is more confident.