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Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs)

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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#541 » by Sixerscan » Sun Jun 16, 2019 3:39 pm

Negrodamus wrote:
LloydFree wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:Lakers should be the most hated in the league now. This situation with Rich Paul making the league bend to his will is absurd.

I don't get the Rich Paul hate. Before him the same six, old money, agents ran the league and filled their pockets unchecked, but suddenly because a new guy gets a little power, he's a villain? SMH.


Maybe it's because Rich Paul is in the spotlight more than the other agents, but an agent and LeBron essentially running the Lakers is not in the best interest of the league in terms of competitiveness.

Honestly, the Lakers have made miserable moves since Kobe started declining and is wiping the slate clean and rewarded a top 3 player. Ball has played 99 games in two season, Ingram has a career threatening injury, and Josh Hart is a bench player. Ball and Ingram are both the second picks in their drafts and have played far below that level. And, yes, they are giving up their draft picks: the 4th pick is likely as valuable as the 10th pick in this draft, and the rest of the trade is hoping the wheel fall off of LeBron or Anthony Davis (and whoever they sign).

The Lakers will likely fill out the rest of their team with solid ring chasing vets who will play for nothing and their "rebuild" was basically getting LeBron and strong arming the league to take their failed prospects.

That said, if Lonzo can play a full season, he and Zion will be fun to watch.


I just think it's a classic disruptor thing. The traditional agents have their deep connections already. Paul has to make these big splashy moves to get his slice.

I don't begrudge him personally for it. At the same time, I just want to watch and follow basketball, and am really not interested in all of the TMZ and outside interests stuff that his methods bring.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#542 » by Negrodamus » Sun Jun 16, 2019 3:52 pm

Sixerscan wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:
LloydFree wrote:I don't get the Rich Paul hate. Before him the same six, old money, agents ran the league and filled their pockets unchecked, but suddenly because a new guy gets a little power, he's a villain? SMH.


Maybe it's because Rich Paul is in the spotlight more than the other agents, but an agent and LeBron essentially running the Lakers is not in the best interest of the league in terms of competitiveness.

Honestly, the Lakers have made miserable moves since Kobe started declining and is wiping the slate clean and rewarded a top 3 player. Ball has played 99 games in two season, Ingram has a career threatening injury, and Josh Hart is a bench player. Ball and Ingram are both the second picks in their drafts and have played far below that level. And, yes, they are giving up their draft picks: the 4th pick is likely as valuable as the 10th pick in this draft, and the rest of the trade is hoping the wheel fall off of LeBron or Anthony Davis (and whoever they sign).

The Lakers will likely fill out the rest of their team with solid ring chasing vets who will play for nothing and their "rebuild" was basically getting LeBron and strong arming the league to take their failed prospects.

That said, if Lonzo can play a full season, he and Zion will be fun to watch.


I just think it's a classic disruptor thing. The traditional agents have their deep connections already. Paul has to make these big splashy moves to get his slice.

I don't begrudge him personally for it. At the same time, I just want to watch and follow basketball, and am really not interested in all of the TMZ and outside interests stuff that his methods bring.


Well, to be clear, I never said I hated Rich Paul. He's gaming the system in a way that's apparently allowed in the NBA, so props to him. I just think if you look take a look at the Lakers and Sixers timeline from the end of the Bynum trade to today, this situation feels so much worse due to the NBA intervening with our team. If I'm a small market team, I'd be irate.

Say what you want about the Warriors, they won one with players they drafted. And signing Durant was way more legitimate than this trade. Oh well.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#543 » by Negrodamus » Sun Jun 16, 2019 4:08 pm

Also, let me add that I don't think this new Lakers team could beat this past year's Sixers team in a 7 game series.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#544 » by Wilfried » Sun Jun 16, 2019 4:30 pm

Negrodamus wrote:Also, let me add that I don't think this new Lakers team could beat this past year's Sixers team in a 7 game series.


4-1 Sixers :wink:
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#545 » by LloydFree » Sun Jun 16, 2019 5:19 pm

Negrodamus wrote:
Sixerscan wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:
Maybe it's because Rich Paul is in the spotlight more than the other agents, but an agent and LeBron essentially running the Lakers is not in the best interest of the league in terms of competitiveness.

Honestly, the Lakers have made miserable moves since Kobe started declining and is wiping the slate clean and rewarded a top 3 player. Ball has played 99 games in two season, Ingram has a career threatening injury, and Josh Hart is a bench player. Ball and Ingram are both the second picks in their drafts and have played far below that level. And, yes, they are giving up their draft picks: the 4th pick is likely as valuable as the 10th pick in this draft, and the rest of the trade is hoping the wheel fall off of LeBron or Anthony Davis (and whoever they sign).

The Lakers will likely fill out the rest of their team with solid ring chasing vets who will play for nothing and their "rebuild" was basically getting LeBron and strong arming the league to take their failed prospects.

That said, if Lonzo can play a full season, he and Zion will be fun to watch.


I just think it's a classic disruptor thing. The traditional agents have their deep connections already. Paul has to make these big splashy moves to get his slice.

I don't begrudge him personally for it. At the same time, I just want to watch and follow basketball, and am really not interested in all of the TMZ and outside interests stuff that his methods bring.


Well, to be clear, I never said I hated Rich Paul. He's gaming the system in a way that's apparently allowed in the NBA, so props to him. I just think if you look take a look at the Lakers and Sixers timeline from the end of the Bynum trade to today, this situation feels so much worse due to the NBA intervening with our team. If I'm a small market team, I'd be irate.

Say what you want about the Warriors, they won one with players they drafted. And signing Durant was way more legitimate than this trade. Oh well.

Oh stop. Kareem forced his way to the Lakers. Kobe forced his way to the Lakers. And Shaq forced his way to the Lakers. In each of those cases the team's got absolutely robbed. The Pelicans got a great deal out of this. Rich Paul isn't hurting small market teams anymore than the good ol' boys have been the last 40 years. He's doing the same thing theve done, only in an age where more information is available to the public. Rich Paul isn't hurting anything.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#546 » by Negrodamus » Sun Jun 16, 2019 5:39 pm

LloydFree wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:
Sixerscan wrote:
I just think it's a classic disruptor thing. The traditional agents have their deep connections already. Paul has to make these big splashy moves to get his slice.

I don't begrudge him personally for it. At the same time, I just want to watch and follow basketball, and am really not interested in all of the TMZ and outside interests stuff that his methods bring.


Well, to be clear, I never said I hated Rich Paul. He's gaming the system in a way that's apparently allowed in the NBA, so props to him. I just think if you look take a look at the Lakers and Sixers timeline from the end of the Bynum trade to today, this situation feels so much worse due to the NBA intervening with our team. If I'm a small market team, I'd be irate.

Say what you want about the Warriors, they won one with players they drafted. And signing Durant was way more legitimate than this trade. Oh well.

Oh stop. Kareem forced his way to the Lakers. Kobe forced his way to the Lakers. And Shaq forced his way to the Lakers. In each of those cases the team's got absolutely robbed. The Pelicans got a great deal out of this. Rich Paul isn't hurting small market teams anymore than the good ol' boys have been the last 40 years. He's doing the same thing theve done, only in an age where more information is available to the public. Rich Paul isn't hurting anything.


Gotcha, Lakers have been **** to the rest of the league forever, so act accordingly and just shrug.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#547 » by hookshot199 » Sun Jun 16, 2019 5:53 pm

Sixerscan wrote:
Read on Twitter


Uhh this changes things alot. They're not gonna have the space to get a 3rd guy unless it's Russell or one of the 30% guys takes a discount.


People on the Lakers board, including their mods, are disputing Woj's report. There seems to be
some question about why the rush to July 6 rather than wait 30 days. Something about a "moratorium".
If they were to wait 30 days, according to my paraphrase, their cap number could go up to $32 mil,
thus giving them a better shot a quality free agent.

Does this make any sense to you? It impacts us because Jimmy, theoretically, could accept a slightly
lower offer (not that he will), thus be in play for the Lakers. Ditto I suppose for Kemba Walker, Kyrie
and Kawhi.

Thanks.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#548 » by Sixerscan » Sun Jun 16, 2019 5:59 pm

hookshot199 wrote:
Sixerscan wrote:
Read on Twitter


Uhh this changes things alot. They're not gonna have the space to get a 3rd guy unless it's Russell or one of the 30% guys takes a discount.


People on the Lakers board, including their mods, are disputing Woj's report. There seems to be
some question about why the rush to July 6 rather than wait 30 days. Something about a "moratorium".
If they were to wait 30 days, according to my paraphrase, their cap number could go up to $32 mil,
thus giving them a better shot a quality free agent.

Does this make any sense to you? It impacts us because Jimmy, theoretically, could accept a slightly
lower offer (not that he will), thus be in play for the Lakers. Ditto I suppose for Kemba Walker, Kyrie
and Kawhi.

Thanks.


Yeah if they can wait until the 30 days they’re fine, which is what everyone assumed was happening when this first came out, and why that woj report was surprising.

There’s no rush from the Lakers standpoint, but the Pelicans have reasons to want to get it done ASAP. They get a larger trade exception, if they want to trade #4 then the team trading for it might not like having to delay a month getting that guy in house.

If they really agreed to that timing (or the Pelicans thought they had) then I imagine the Lakers would have to give some more compensation for waiting. Either way it seems pretty sloppy by the Lakers to not make this clear before it was leaked.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#549 » by LloydFree » Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:28 pm

Negrodamus wrote:
LloydFree wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:
Well, to be clear, I never said I hated Rich Paul. He's gaming the system in a way that's apparently allowed in the NBA, so props to him. I just think if you look take a look at the Lakers and Sixers timeline from the end of the Bynum trade to today, this situation feels so much worse due to the NBA intervening with our team. If I'm a small market team, I'd be irate.

Say what you want about the Warriors, they won one with players they drafted. And signing Durant was way more legitimate than this trade. Oh well.

Oh stop. Kareem forced his way to the Lakers. Kobe forced his way to the Lakers. And Shaq forced his way to the Lakers. In each of those cases the team's got absolutely robbed. The Pelicans got a great deal out of this. Rich Paul isn't hurting small market teams anymore than the good ol' boys have been the last 40 years. He's doing the same thing theve done, only in an age where more information is available to the public. Rich Paul isn't hurting anything.


Gotcha, Lakers have been **** to the rest of the league forever, so act accordingly and just shrug.

I'm not saying anyone shouldn't be mad. That's everyone's right. But it has nothing to do with Rich Paul. It's the players, who have wanted to play for the Lakers instead of their poorly run organizations. Be mad at the players if anything. Rich Paul didn't create this.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#550 » by hookshot199 » Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:37 pm

Sixerscan wrote:
hookshot199 wrote:
Sixerscan wrote:
Read on Twitter


Uhh this changes things alot. They're not gonna have the space to get a 3rd guy unless it's Russell or one of the 30% guys takes a discount.


People on the Lakers board, including their mods, are disputing Woj's report. There seems to be
some question about why the rush to July 6 rather than wait 30 days. Something about a "moratorium".
If they were to wait 30 days, according to my paraphrase, their cap number could go up to $32 mil,
thus giving them a better shot a quality free agent.

Does this make any sense to you? It impacts us because Jimmy, theoretically, could accept a slightly
lower offer (not that he will), thus be in play for the Lakers. Ditto I suppose for Kemba Walker, Kyrie
and Kawhi.

Thanks.


Yeah if they can wait until the 30 days they’re fine, which is what everyone assumed was happening when this first came out, and why that woj report was surprising.

There’s no rush from the Lakers standpoint, but the Pelicans have reasons to want to get it done ASAP. They get a larger trade exception, if they want to trade #4 then the team trading for it might not like having to delay a month getting that guy in house.

If they really agreed to that timing (or the Pelicans thought they had) then I imagine the Lakers would have to give some more compensation for waiting. Either way it seems pretty sloppy by the Lakers to not make this clear before it was leaked.



The other thing somebody mentioned is that summer league will have begun, thus the Pelicans may wish
to have 4 play in summer league (I wouldn't given our history). If I were to bet, I wouldn't bet against Griffin
having slipped up. He's made these deals before. But this one clearly would give the Lakers a competitive
advantage in the West by letting them possibly add a third max or close-to-max player.

It will be interesting to see if Griffin or Pelinka slipped up.

One other thing with those pick swaps. Anthony Davis, although only 26 and arguably one of the top five
players in the game, hasn't been particularly successful from the standpoint of leading his team to the
playoffs or win-loss records. Dating back to his rookie year: 27 wins, 34 wins, 45 wins, 30 wins, 34 wins,
48 wins (his only playoff) and 33 wins.

If LeBron starts to falter or Davis goes down with an injury, the Pels basically own the Lakers' '22, '23 and
'24 unprotected firsts. It's not likely to be a repeat of the Brooklyn-Celtics situation, but the potential is
there, which is why this July 6 issue is big IMO. If the Lakers can't add a third star now, it will make it more
difficult to do so in the future.

Anyway, thanks.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#551 » by Arsenal » Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:58 pm

Why would the Lakers be dumb enough to agree to the deal going through on July 6th?

Are they that incredibly stupid? This would absolutely keep them from signing another star player.

Totally incompetent front office. The ONLY reason they have any kind of success is their location.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#552 » by Arsenal » Sun Jun 16, 2019 7:00 pm

In terms of star trades, the Pelicans haul is the best I can remember. Even better than the Nuggets got for MElo.

For the Lakers to give up so much and then not INSIST on the deal going through after 30 days to preserve a MAX cap slot is 100% total INCOMPETENCE.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#553 » by hookshot199 » Sun Jun 16, 2019 7:28 pm

Arsenal wrote:In terms of star trades, the Pelicans haul is the best I can remember. Even better than the Nuggets got for MElo.

For the Lakers to give up so much and then not INSIST on the deal going through after 30 days to preserve a MAX cap slot is 100% total INCOMPETENCE.


Agree, if the reports are true. Moreover, if I'm the Pelicans and don't want to create a super team in the division,
I move the pick to someone in the conference, if possible of course, who doesn't want to face a lineup of LeBron,
Davis and, take your choice, Butler, Kemba or Kyrie. If they want to sign several solid rotation players to complete
the roster - they did The Dream Team this past season - make them commit to two- or three-year deals with the
second-tier free agents.

It would appear we're moving toward a reverse "collusion" if/when Griffin trades the pick. But again, the devil's
in the detail.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#554 » by phiphan » Sun Jun 16, 2019 7:49 pm

Would be hilarious if holder of the 4th pick makes the Lakers give up Kuzma to postpone the trade execution.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#555 » by hookshot199 » Sun Jun 16, 2019 8:48 pm

phiphan wrote:Would be hilarious if holder of the 4th pick makes the Lakers give up Kuzma to postpone the trade execution.


Or if the holder of the pick tells the Tamperer-in-Chief, LeBron James, to stuff it.

This is interesting because it has the smell of DeAndre Jordan and the Mavs, but
unlike DeAndre Jordan the player wants to go to his new team. If Pelinka pulls out
of the deal - no one is saying he will - that carries more officialdom with it.

He will have damaged Griffin's ability to trade to find another team. That's why
it's important to know what went down regarding the 4 pick and the July 6 closing
date. Just my opinion.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#556 » by Negrodamus » Sun Jun 16, 2019 10:59 pm

LloydFree wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:
LloydFree wrote:Oh stop. Kareem forced his way to the Lakers. Kobe forced his way to the Lakers. And Shaq forced his way to the Lakers. In each of those cases the team's got absolutely robbed. The Pelicans got a great deal out of this. Rich Paul isn't hurting small market teams anymore than the good ol' boys have been the last 40 years. He's doing the same thing theve done, only in an age where more information is available to the public. Rich Paul isn't hurting anything.


Gotcha, Lakers have been **** to the rest of the league forever, so act accordingly and just shrug.

I'm not saying anyone shouldn't be mad. That's everyone's right. But it has nothing to do with Rich Paul. It's the players, who have wanted to play for the Lakers instead of their poorly run organizations. Be mad at the players if anything. Rich Paul didn't create this.


I still don’t think my original sentiment is incorrect though. The way this team will be constructed is a much more hateable situation than any team I can remember. Blame Rich Paul, blame LeBron and AD, blame the nature of the Lakers getting their way. It doesn’t matter, it’s stupid.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#557 » by mjkvol » Mon Jun 17, 2019 8:17 am

LloydFree wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:Lakers should be the most hated in the league now. This situation with Rich Paul making the league bend to his will is absurd.

I don't get the Rich Paul hate. Before him the same six, old money, agents ran the league and filled their pockets unchecked, but suddenly because a new guy gets a little power, he's a villain? SMH.


It's the LeJerk factor, plain and simple.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#558 » by Tomjas » Mon Jun 17, 2019 8:56 am

As an Australian, I am an outsider

LA is a **** hole and I have no idea why anyone would live there

NYC is amazing

Miami is great

Parts of Texas are brilliant

LA would be seriously low on my list if I could earn hundreds of millions wherever and particularly when I only need to spend 6 months per year elsewhere
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#559 » by Kobe System » Mon Jun 17, 2019 9:18 am

Read on Twitter


Just for the sake of discussion, here is the correct information regarding the picks traded.

2019 4th overall pick.
2021 pick if it falls from 1-8. If not, 2022 unprotected pick.
2023 rights to swap.
2024 unprotected pick. Rights to defer to 2025.
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Re: Around the League Discussion - 2018-2019 (Playoffs) 

Post#560 » by LloydFree » Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:38 am

mjkvol wrote:
LloydFree wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:Lakers should be the most hated in the league now. This situation with Rich Paul making the league bend to his will is absurd.

I don't get the Rich Paul hate. Before him the same six, old money, agents ran the league and filled their pockets unchecked, but suddenly because a new guy gets a little power, he's a villain? SMH.


It's the LeJerk factor, plain and simple.

I don't see how LeBron James has done a thing to be labeled a jerk. He was the best HS player of the last 25 years. He sent his HS friends to school and helped them become successful, instead of giving his money to strangers like other athletes. He worked to be the best on the planet at his profession, and he's decided where he wants it play, instead of letting GMs control his career. Not one jerky thing in that list.
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