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2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1

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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#861 » by skulky » Sat Sep 5, 2020 6:47 pm

Tre jones is a nice role player and if you can get him in the second round. I think 12-14 ppg for him in the nba is pretty unrealistic. He is older and has questionable shot. He is a solid team and man on man defender, but still older than maxey and significantly less athletic and strong. I see the tj comparison, with potential for better jumper, but that’s hardly a lock. I think he’s a smart player and will definitely have a place/role in the league. I question his athleticism and size and the impact he will have in the nba, especially if he can’t solidify that jumper.

Maxey his shooting numbers were a bit up and down but has a nice and consistent form and his misses are usually front rim. He can work on it with some minor adjustments. I think he’s an equally smart player as tre jones, I agree to start he’s going to be a high energy bench player. His physical tools and age just give him way more upside to me. And Kentucky guards have a nice precedent of outperforming their draft slot.
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#862 » by Kobblehead » Sat Sep 5, 2020 8:06 pm

skulky wrote:Tre jones is a nice role player and if you can get him in the second round. I think 12-14 ppg for him in the nba is pretty unrealistic. He is older and has questionable shot. He is a solid team and man on man defender, but still older than maxey and significantly less athletic and strong. I see the tj comparison, with potential for better jumper, but that’s hardly a lock. I think he’s a smart player and will definitely have a place/role in the league. I question his athleticism and size and the impact he will have in the nba, especially if he can’t solidify that jumper.

Maxey his shooting numbers were a bit up and down but has a nice and consistent form and his misses are usually front rim. He can work on it with some minor adjustments. I think he’s an equally smart player as tre jones, I agree to start he’s going to be a high energy bench player. His physical tools and age just give him way more upside to me. And Kentucky guards have a nice precedent of outperforming their draft slot.

Tre Jones isn't that much older. They'll both be 20 at the same time for a couple of months this winter. And Jones is far more well-rounded a basketball player. Ultimately, that appears to matter way more than athleticism these days.

Maxey is dynamic off the dribble and might have an okay jumper (however, it's easy to see how inconsistent his shot is going to be), but he's a deficient passer for the position he'll play at the next level and he's an outright defensive zero.

I can't fathom trading up in the draft for such a limited, one-dimensional player like Maxey. I would have a hard time even taking him outright at #21.
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#863 » by skulky » Sat Sep 5, 2020 8:42 pm

Interesting take on Maxey considering your feelings for rj Hampton. Have to agree to disagree on this one, we’re pretty far apart on our views of Maxey and tre jones.
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#864 » by Kobblehead » Sat Sep 5, 2020 8:55 pm

I identify Hampton as someone who's going to score off the dribble and defend. Maxey is just not a guy I'm expecting to provide any defensive value.

Our roster is devoid of shotcreation, but also devoid of perimeter defenders outside of Simmons/Thybulle.

So if we're going to address our shotcreation woes, I think we need to make sure we're landing creators that can hold up defensively. Especially if we're trading up to get someone.

If we were in a different position where we had plenty of perimeter defenders and just needed to add the finishing touches by adding a dynamic scorer off the bench, I'd be more open to targeting a one-dimensional guy. I don't think we have anywhere near that kind of depth or talent, though. We're still building this thing up, despite what our capsheet says.
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#865 » by Negrodamus » Sun Sep 6, 2020 3:46 am

Kobblehead wrote:Wouldn't be surprised if all three panned out to varying degrees.

I got them ranked...

Defensively:
1. Jones
2. Dotson
3. Flynn

Off the dribble:
1. Dotson
2. Flynn
3. Jones

Passing
1. Jones
2. Flynn
3. Dotson

Jumpshot:
1. Flynn
2. Jones
3. Dotson

Personally, I like Jones the best. I think he's the strongest defender of the three with the best head on his shoulders. Really smart, mature, composed kid.

As an aside, I'm still surprised that the Kira Lewis crowd isn't a Devon Dotson crowd. Devon is a way better defender and finisher than Kira and an even more aggressive attacker.


I think athletic upside needs to be added to the equation. Dotson looks the part of stocky with excellent athleticism NBA PGs that have stuck around 10+ years in the league. It’s one of the reasons why I think the other two could fall flat once they get to the league.
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#866 » by Negrodamus » Sun Sep 6, 2020 4:59 pm

Read on Twitter


Interesting thread dissecting Elleby. I actually feel like he's more refined as a defensive player the more I look at his stuff. The upside is that he's extremely confident in himself as a scorer (even if his shooting numbers are a bit average) and he has pretty good handles as a SG. Also love his jab step and ability to get looks, despite forcing many shots.

He feels like a steal in this draft since he won't be asked to score 20 ppg any time soon. Then again, the dude is only 20 years old.
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#867 » by Kobblehead » Sun Sep 6, 2020 5:28 pm

I'm lukewarm on Elleby.

Offensively, he reminds me of a shorter Tatum with a worse jumper.
Defensively, he reminds of Josh Richardson (good team defender that might be compromised defending ball handlers).

I can't fall in love with him on either end. Might just be a streaky player on both ends that looks awesome at times and overexposed at others.
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#868 » by Negrodamus » Sun Sep 6, 2020 5:44 pm

Right, but he just turned 20 and was asked to play a role that he's clearly not going to play in the NBA. He also has a larger frame than Josh Richardson, so I feel he'll be able to deal with the physicality better. I just watched a portion of WSU vs Wash and he does little things that many guys aren't willing to do on the current roster: attack on the switch in PnR with great recovery, box out his defender, make the effort to contest jumpers, etc. His rebounding effort really does it for me. Was also often the screener on offense.

Either way, getting shorter Tatum with worse jumper/Josh Richardson in the second round is phenomenal value. That's a great role player.
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#869 » by Kobblehead » Sun Sep 6, 2020 6:04 pm

Guys that use screens and pull up in the mid-range are putting up crazy scoring production right now since nobody in the league is guarding that area of the floor. Elleby fits right in with that en vogue trend. It's beneficial that he'll project to be a good team defender, too.

I see the value. Just not in love with him. I agree that he'll definitely outproduce his draft slot.
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#870 » by Aussiepiston1 » Tue Sep 8, 2020 12:06 pm

Kira Lewis jr has daaron fox in him no?
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#871 » by skulky » Tue Sep 8, 2020 1:51 pm

Kira Lewis is interesting. There’s plenty of talent available, I think one concern is picking right after Miami.
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#872 » by Sea2003 » Tue Sep 8, 2020 10:56 pm

The sixers would have been a dynasty if Negrodamus was the 76ers GM. They could have had a lineup of SGA--Mitchell-Tatum-Simmons-Embild. :lol:
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#873 » by stormi » Tue Sep 8, 2020 10:58 pm

Kinda wanna see old threads to see the takes. I think when i first started lurking on here y'all were infatuated with Chandler Hutchison

2017 i was ecstatic with Fultz. Liked Fox a lot, didn't want Tatum, DSJ or Monk.

2018 i think i was into Knox (yikes) and Walker at 10. I was out on Miles and was content with Mikal. But then during the draft I was screaming for MPJ, like i couldn't believe he fell to us.

Last year I wanted Cam Johnson, expected Thybulle.
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#874 » by Kobblehead » Tue Sep 8, 2020 11:01 pm

Aussiepiston1 wrote:Kira Lewis jr has daaron fox in him no?

I'd say no, given the huge discrepancy between the two players, defensively.

Lewis is closer to Brandon Knight, IMO.
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#875 » by stormi » Tue Sep 8, 2020 11:03 pm

Kira Lewis also has much more range and is a natural jump shooter than Fox was.
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#876 » by Sea2003 » Tue Sep 8, 2020 11:05 pm

From HotelVitale:

I wanted to shout out my man Negrodamus from the Sixers draft threads. Lived up to his name a bunch of time by coming out hard for players that, in retrospect, we all should've seen coming. His signature is 'these picks would be perfect for us, but we'll inevitably end up taking whichever overrated schlub the draft websites have higher than them.' Those threads are all locked because they're dated to those particular drafts, but here are a couple examples. (If he were only our GM those years, sigh.)

In 2017 he spent weeks pitching Donovan Mitchell as a top pick, with posts like this:
"I mean, if you objectively look at it, he's a better at almost everything than Ball except for passing and three point shooting (however I like Mitchell's potential as a shooter in the NBA much more since he's got a form shooting coaches can work with). He's a more versatile offensive player than Monk, by a lot. He is on the same tier defensively (some might argue Mitchell is better) than Fox and he can also get his shot wherever he wants on the court, and, you know, actually make it. He's infinity times better at defense than Fultz and Smith. On top of that, he's in the same echelon of athlete as all of them, vertically and laterally. So, when we're talking about potential and swinging for the fences, I'm not sure where an explosive, two way scoring sophomore guard falls in that category."

The year after he beat the drum for the Sixers taking SGA at #10 for months and months:
"I've really been struggling to keep SGA (low). His tourney season (SEC/NCAA) might be the best during that stretch of any guard. 6 games: 20ppg (52% FG, 54% 2FG, 42% 3FG), 8 FTA per game (84% FT), 6 apg, 6 rpg, 2 spg, 2.5 topg. Efficient with volume. The funny thing is, if you do the last 10 games, it's arguably more efficient in the scoring department. He was just dominating people."
"Not to be the SGA propaganda machine, but he's the reason this team made a complete turn around...Along with him being determined to be great and having the stats + ideal height/length makes him pretty can't miss to me"

In '17 there were a couple of us who were very vocal about how Fultz was overrated, but he was the only one who kept repeating that Tatum was the real star:
"I'm still a bit confused as to how Tatum isn't even in the discussion for #1 or even #2. I don't think I've wavered off him as the best player since midway through conference play. 2 way player with size, agility to defend multiple positions, and a foul drawing scorer with textbook jumper."
"His size and skill makes me think he's the best prospect in the draft. He's been great off ball and in ISO situations ever since Duke has been honed in. The idea that he's just a ball dominant scorer is really a fallacy now. He's actually very much playing within their system and thriving. I think people see the "ISO KILLER" headline for that DX video and assume he's a ball hog."
"BTW, Tatum is the best player in this draft. He's scoring at will right now. Carry on."
"Mock drafts have Celtics taking Tatum. They're going to end up with possibly the best player in the draft and he fits their system. Good for them, I guess."
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#877 » by Kobblehead » Tue Sep 8, 2020 11:06 pm

stormi wrote:Kira Lewis also has much more range and is a natural jump shooter than Fox was.

Yeah, Lewis is a bomber right away. Wouldn't be surprised if he shot 5+ threes a game as a rookie.
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#878 » by Arsenal » Tue Sep 8, 2020 11:12 pm

Trade for CP3.
Draft T. Terry.

Profit.
#ThankYouSam | #TrustTheProcess
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#879 » by Negrodamus » Tue Sep 8, 2020 11:21 pm

Sea2003 wrote:From HotelVitale:

I wanted to shout out my man Negrodamus from the Sixers draft threads. Lived up to his name a bunch of time by coming out hard for players that, in retrospect, we all should've seen coming. His signature is 'these picks would be perfect for us, but we'll inevitably end up taking whichever overrated schlub the draft websites have higher than them.' Those threads are all locked because they're dated to those particular drafts, but here are a couple examples. (If he were only our GM those years, sigh.)

In 2017 he spent weeks pitching Donovan Mitchell as a top pick, with posts like this:
"I mean, if you objectively look at it, he's a better at almost everything than Ball except for passing and three point shooting (however I like Mitchell's potential as a shooter in the NBA much more since he's got a form shooting coaches can work with). He's a more versatile offensive player than Monk, by a lot. He is on the same tier defensively (some might argue Mitchell is better) than Fox and he can also get his shot wherever he wants on the court, and, you know, actually make it. He's infinity times better at defense than Fultz and Smith. On top of that, he's in the same echelon of athlete as all of them, vertically and laterally. So, when we're talking about potential and swinging for the fences, I'm not sure where an explosive, two way scoring sophomore guard falls in that category."

The year after he beat the drum for the Sixers taking SGA at #10 for months and months:
"I've really been struggling to keep SGA (low). His tourney season (SEC/NCAA) might be the best during that stretch of any guard. 6 games: 20ppg (52% FG, 54% 2FG, 42% 3FG), 8 FTA per game (84% FT), 6 apg, 6 rpg, 2 spg, 2.5 topg. Efficient with volume. The funny thing is, if you do the last 10 games, it's arguably more efficient in the scoring department. He was just dominating people."
"Not to be the SGA propaganda machine, but he's the reason this team made a complete turn around...Along with him being determined to be great and having the stats + ideal height/length makes him pretty can't miss to me"

In '17 there were a couple of us who were very vocal about how Fultz was overrated, but he was the only one who kept repeating that Tatum was the real star:
"I'm still a bit confused as to how Tatum isn't even in the discussion for #1 or even #2. I don't think I've wavered off him as the best player since midway through conference play. 2 way player with size, agility to defend multiple positions, and a foul drawing scorer with textbook jumper."
"His size and skill makes me think he's the best prospect in the draft. He's been great off ball and in ISO situations ever since Duke has been honed in. The idea that he's just a ball dominant scorer is really a fallacy now. He's actually very much playing within their system and thriving. I think people see the "ISO KILLER" headline for that DX video and assume he's a ball hog."
"BTW, Tatum is the best player in this draft. He's scoring at will right now. Carry on."
"Mock drafts have Celtics taking Tatum. They're going to end up with possibly the best player in the draft and he fits their system. Good for them, I guess."


Lol, I'm flattered, but I have some pretty good misses too.

While I hit pretty hard on those two drafts, I don't think I hit on prospects any more than Kobble does.
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Re: 2019-2020 College BBall/2020 NBA Draft Vol 1 

Post#880 » by Negrodamus » Tue Sep 8, 2020 11:22 pm

stormi wrote:Kinda wanna see old threads to see the takes. I think when i first started lurking on here y'all were infatuated with Chandler Hutchinson



.... I still am.

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