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Welcome Al Horford(?!?)

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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#341 » by VDT » Thu Aug 20, 2020 1:15 pm

Horford was declining already in Boston. He is not gonna score a lot of points. He is a smart player that can (could?) help defensively and has some playmaking and 3 point shooting. The Boston teams are built with entirely different philosophy and is the reason that he looked better there. It is hard to look good defensively when the perimeter defenders are two essentially rookies, Korkmaz, Harris and Burks. He is also not going to look good offensively when he is asked to create and the spacing he can provide from the 3 is not really utilized as the team doesnt have any perimeter player that can drive or create from the perimeter.

He worked for Boston because he was younger and their style fit him better.
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#342 » by ankle420breaker » Thu Aug 20, 2020 1:21 pm

VDT wrote:Horford was declining already in Boston. He is not gonna score a lot of points. He is a smart player that can (could?) help defensively and has some playmaking and 3 point shooting. The Boston teams are built with entirely different philosophy and is the reason that he looked better there. It is hard to look good defensively when the perimeter defenders are two essentially rookies, Korkmaz, Harris and Burks. He is also not going to look good offensively when he is asked to create and the spacing he can provide from the 3 is not really utilized as the team doesnt have any perimeter player that can drive or create from the perimeter.

He worked for Boston because he was younger and their style fit him better.
Exactly my point, that's the difference between us and Boston. They build their roster based off a philosophy and play style. We spit on square pegs and try to ram them through round holes.

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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#343 » by Arsenal » Thu Aug 20, 2020 2:23 pm

ankle420breaker wrote:Anyone see Al recently? Did anyone in the organization explain to him that he doesn't play for Boston anymore?

Just imagine how productive he'd be out there if he were donning a C's jersey in Brad's system. We shelled out so much on a longterm deal without giving an ounce of thought as to how we'd utilize him.

The intent was that he'd be our carpet that ties our "built for the playoffs" room together yet he's hardly been involved through 2 games, let alone had any kind of impact.

Colossal miss. Blatant incompetence on full display from our front office and coaching staff.

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Signing Al Horford was a fireable offense right from the jump. It's been comical to see homers and paid shills try to justify it, but it should be obvious to anyone with two functioning eyes at this point what a disaster that signing was.
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#344 » by Negrodamus » Thu Aug 20, 2020 3:22 pm

Well, to be fair, Horford was signed to an extremely bloated contract so that he will not be on the Celtics to shut down Embiid and to be our Giannis stopper! Unfortunately we'll never make it to the Bucks matchup this year.
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#345 » by Bum Adebayo » Thu Aug 20, 2020 3:27 pm

But this only speaks worse about Embiid. I mean, if we took that albatross Horford contract just so Embiid doesn't struggle against Celtics, but still can't take over on offense and plays matador defense, then just wow, what are we even doing here?
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#346 » by VDT » Thu Aug 20, 2020 3:32 pm

If that was their thought, then it was an idiotic thought. The Celtics were not even the team to beat in the conference. The Bucks and the Raptors were the teams to beat at the time.

I think the thought process is that you get a back up 5 that can play the 4 because he can space the floor, can help against Giannis and weakens Boston. Unfortunately nothing of this was true other than him being a back up 5.
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#347 » by ankle420breaker » Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:25 am

Seriously questioning whether Horford is still playing for Boston and we're just footing the bill.

HEADS NEED TO ROLL.

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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#348 » by Fencer reregistered » Sat Aug 22, 2020 5:47 am

Horford was special for Boston because he was a competent, unspectacular big man who further had three sets of perimeter skills. First, he could actually defend perimeter players. Second, he could drive-and-kick. Third, he could shoot threes.

The first was somewhat slower than a classical perimeter defender, but that was OK because his size made up for it. The second was a lot slower than a classical perimeter offensive player, but that was OK because the bigs who guarded him were a lot slower than typical perimeter defenders too. And if you put a defender on him that was too small, he could of course abuse the guy in some way or other.

The perimeter defense, however, he was already losing with age. The drive-and-kick only worked in a five-out offensive scheme. I don't really know what happened to the threes, but I conjecture that the age-related slower healing of routine minor injuries probably had a little to do with it.
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#349 » by stormi » Sat Aug 22, 2020 5:53 am

the first page of this thread LOL
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#350 » by Arsenal » Sat Aug 22, 2020 10:10 pm

ankle420breaker wrote:
VDT wrote:Horford was declining already in Boston. He is not gonna score a lot of points. He is a smart player that can (could?) help defensively and has some playmaking and 3 point shooting. The Boston teams are built with entirely different philosophy and is the reason that he looked better there. It is hard to look good defensively when the perimeter defenders are two essentially rookies, Korkmaz, Harris and Burks. He is also not going to look good offensively when he is asked to create and the spacing he can provide from the 3 is not really utilized as the team doesnt have any perimeter player that can drive or create from the perimeter.

He worked for Boston because he was younger and their style fit him better.
Exactly my point, that's the difference between us and Boston. They build their roster based off a philosophy and play style. We spit on square pegs and try to ram them through round holes.

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They also have an intelligent general manager who is not stupid enough to pay a 34 year old declining fringe all-star at the most devalued position in the game a $110M contract, when it's pretty obvious he also does not fit with your two stars.

Of course, you don't have to be intelligent to understand how dumb a move that would be. Even a moron could figure out that's a bad move...
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#351 » by sixers4real » Fri Sep 4, 2020 3:19 am

I remember when we singed Al Horford people were saying it's a smart move because we need him as Embiid insurance. I was shocked and I still am. What exactly is insurance? This Philly team can only win title IF Embiid is able to play 35-38 minutes during playoffs. Maybe 40 minutes in pivotal games. If Embiid is injured and cannot play in the playoffs, there is 0 chance we win title.
We all know that Embiid will miss a 20-25 games during his career in regular season, but I can't believe that Horford was payed to play some minutes alongside Embiid, 10 12 minutes of the bench while Embiid sits and 20 games in RS while Embiid is out. For 97 million. They could've spend that 97 million dollars WAY better for something that really matters during playoffs.

So EB, you better get creative and find a way to trade Al during this offseason. Buddy Hield, CJ or CP3 should be our target for Al + picks + some.

There can much cheaper options for Embiid back up. Even Simmons can play some C in this small ball league.
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#352 » by sixers hoops » Fri Sep 4, 2020 3:32 am

sixers4real wrote:I remember when we singed Al Horford people were saying it's a smart move because we need him as Embiid insurance. I was shocked and I still am. What exactly is insurance? This Philly team can only win title IF Embiid is able to play 35-38 minutes during playoffs. Maybe 40 minutes in pivotal games. If Embiid is injured and cannot play in the playoffs, there is 0 chance we win title.
We all know that Embiid will miss a 20-25 games during his career in regular season, but I can't believe that Horford was payed to play some minutes alongside Embiid, 10 12 minutes of the bench while Embiid sits and 20 games in RS while Embiid is out. For 97 million. They could've spend that 97 million dollars WAY better for something that really matters during playoffs.

So EB, you better get creative and find a way to trade Al during this offseason. Buddy Hield, CJ or CP3 should be our target for Al + picks + some.

There can much cheaper options for Embiid back up. Even Simmons can play some C in this small ball league.


Most people at the time were just trying to understand the signing and look at why we might be doing it. Scrolling back through the thread, not too many people saying it was a great move. Mostly just trying to look at it and make some sense of it.

I recall most people most questioning the signing.
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#353 » by sixers4real » Fri Sep 4, 2020 3:37 am

sixers hoops wrote:
sixers4real wrote:I remember when we singed Al Horford people were saying it's a smart move because we need him as Embiid insurance. I was shocked and I still am. What exactly is insurance? This Philly team can only win title IF Embiid is able to play 35-38 minutes during playoffs. Maybe 40 minutes in pivotal games. If Embiid is injured and cannot play in the playoffs, there is 0 chance we win title.
We all know that Embiid will miss a 20-25 games during his career in regular season, but I can't believe that Horford was payed to play some minutes alongside Embiid, 10 12 minutes of the bench while Embiid sits and 20 games in RS while Embiid is out. For 97 million. They could've spend that 97 million dollars WAY better for something that really matters during playoffs.

So EB, you better get creative and find a way to trade Al during this offseason. Buddy Hield, CJ or CP3 should be our target for Al + picks + some.

There can much cheaper options for Embiid back up. Even Simmons can play some C in this small ball league.


Most people at the time were just trying to understand the signing and look at why we might be doing it. Scrolling back through the thread, not too many people saying it was a great move. Mostly just trying to look at it and make some sense of it.

I recall most people most questioning the signing.

Got it. Maybe you remember it better than I did. One thing I remember for sure, my anger lol.
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#354 » by ExplosionsInDaSky » Fri Sep 4, 2020 3:40 am

The signing made no sense. I thought ya know...Dwayne Dedmon would be the guy. We inked Horford and our fate was sealed. No DLo, no Butler, game over.
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#355 » by phillynative » Fri Sep 4, 2020 4:22 am

Bum Adebayo wrote:But this only speaks worse about Embiid. I mean, if we took that albatross Horford contract just so Embiid doesn't struggle against Celtics, but still can't take over on offense and plays matador defense, then just wow, what are we even doing here?


Exactly thats pathetic
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#356 » by Dave Meltzer » Fri Sep 4, 2020 10:28 am

sixers4real wrote:I remember when we singed Al Horford people were saying it's a smart move because we need him as Embiid insurance. I was shocked and I still am. What exactly is insurance? This Philly team can only win title IF Embiid is able to play 35-38 minutes during playoffs. Maybe 40 minutes in pivotal games. If Embiid is injured and cannot play in the playoffs, there is 0 chance we win title.

Well remember people here were willing to give Noel 20 million a year to be the back up center. So they were more accustomed to bad ideas when it comes to having an overpaid back up center.
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#357 » by stormi » Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:04 pm

Is he underrated? Strong underlying numbers, one of the best passers at his position, and a solid defensive pillar at the 5 who also suffered all year long having to get out of the way of others and force 3's to help his teams spacing. And BB never maximized his strengths aka passing out of the low post / defending bigs, not chasing forwards around the perimeter.

He's not a good fit in Philadelphia, but I think on a team like Dallas, Sacramento, LAC etc he'd hold a lot of value.
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#358 » by 76ciology » Fri Sep 18, 2020 5:11 am

stormi wrote:Is he underrated? Strong underlying numbers, one of the best passers at his position, and a solid defensive pillar at the 5 who also suffered all year long having to get out of the way of others and force 3's to help his teams spacing. And BB never maximized his strengths aka passing out of the low post / defending bigs, not chasing forwards around the perimeter.

He's not a good fit in Philadelphia, but I think on a team like Dallas, Sacramento, LAC etc he'd hold a lot of value.


He’s in the same category with guys like Theis and Bam.
The PF in the 2010 is the center of 2020.

A team that is not starved off with scoring like the Rockets or the Celtics would be perfect for Al.

Guys like him has value because you can start him at C to play small or slide him to PF like how Celts used to pair him with Baynes.

He actually played well with Biid during the bubble. It’s just you need a Michael Jordan than an Al Horford with our team during the play-offs with how starved we our on our talent at the perimeter.

Thinking about it, we may have the worst perimeter talent at the bubble. Maybe the worst at the guard positions.

An example of when you need to insert Al with Biid and Ben is when your shooters are not making their 3s, you insert Al to get more boards and to hunt more high % 2s, like how we played in game 3. But the difference is Ben may have helped us there in getting easy baskets in transition or even some 2s in halfcourt. Another is when the opposing team plays really big like how Raps, Bucks and Lakers can, you also have to play the same unit to counter the size advantage.

But when your shooters are making their shots, or are just playing small or normal sized while the offense is really good, you just have to play Tobi-Ben-Biid at the 3-4-5 positions. Then play like Celtics or Heat defense with some zone to prevent teams to attack your weaker guard defenders.
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#359 » by stormi » Fri Sep 18, 2020 5:25 am

76ciology wrote:
stormi wrote:Is he underrated? Strong underlying numbers, one of the best passers at his position, and a solid defensive pillar at the 5 who also suffered all year long having to get out of the way of others and force 3's to help his teams spacing. And BB never maximized his strengths aka passing out of the low post / defending bigs, not chasing forwards around the perimeter.

He's not a good fit in Philadelphia, but I think on a team like Dallas, Sacramento, LAC etc he'd hold a lot of value.


He’s in the same category with guys like Theis and Bam.
The PF in the 2010 is the center of 2020.

A team that is not starved off with scoring like the Rockets or the Celtics would be perfect for Al.

Guys like him has value because you can start him at C to play small or slide him to PF like how Celts used to pair him with Baynes.

He actually played well with Biid during the bubble. It’s just you need a Michael Jordan than an Al Horford with our team during the play-offs with how starved we our on our talent at the perimeter.

Thinking about it, we may have the worst perimeter talent at the bubble. Maybe the worst at the guard positions.


Lets not forget Al was an allstar the year before he came to Philly as a player who's game is not predicated around athleticism. Being used in pick and pop and being able to playmake out of the lowpost is his expertise. We had him here trying to be Cam Johnson.

I think Dallas is a sleeper great fit for him to go. He's a hard screen setter, great playmaker and he can sit down low cause and protect the areas Porzingis is allergic too. Luka would create a lot of looks for him, and he himself would create looks for the Mavs' shooters passing from the post.

The fit of him, Simmons and Embiid was just abhorrent. I thought he could have been like a better defending Dario when we signed him but i must have underrated how fluid Dario was with and without the ball.
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Re: Welcome Al Horford(?!?) 

Post#360 » by 76ciology » Fri Sep 18, 2020 5:31 am

stormi wrote:
76ciology wrote:
stormi wrote:Is he underrated? Strong underlying numbers, one of the best passers at his position, and a solid defensive pillar at the 5 who also suffered all year long having to get out of the way of others and force 3's to help his teams spacing. And BB never maximized his strengths aka passing out of the low post / defending bigs, not chasing forwards around the perimeter.

He's not a good fit in Philadelphia, but I think on a team like Dallas, Sacramento, LAC etc he'd hold a lot of value.


He’s in the same category with guys like Theis and Bam.
The PF in the 2010 is the center of 2020.

A team that is not starved off with scoring like the Rockets or the Celtics would be perfect for Al.

Guys like him has value because you can start him at C to play small or slide him to PF like how Celts used to pair him with Baynes.

He actually played well with Biid during the bubble. It’s just you need a Michael Jordan than an Al Horford with our team during the play-offs with how starved we our on our talent at the perimeter.

Thinking about it, we may have the worst perimeter talent at the bubble. Maybe the worst at the guard positions.


Lets not forget Al was an allstar the year before he came to Philly as a player who's game is not predicated around athleticism. Being used in pick and pop and being able to playmake out of the lowpost is his expertise. We had him here trying to be Cam Johnson.

I think Dallas is a sleeper great fit for him to go. He's a hard screen setter, great player maker and he can sit down low cause and protect the areas Porzingis is allergic too. Luka would create a lot of looks for him, and he himself would create looks for the Mavs' shooters passing from the post.

The fit of him, Simmons and Embiid was just abhorrent. I thought he could have been like a better defending Dario when we signed him but i must have underrated how fluid Dario was with and without the ball.


Dario is not playable in the playoffs. He has 0 rim protection, slower feet than Al and can’t attack anyone at 1v1. You can afford to put a wing at him like Jaylen Brown. Then you can expect Kemba, Tatum or Jaylen hunting Dario’s defense. We’ve seen this movie before.

Roco is only playable with the Rockets because he plays alot of team defense at the C position while he is not asked a lot on offense. His shooting is very erratic to be relied upon on offense while defensively he is not that good of an individual defender compared to guys like Iguodala or even Ben.

Al is playable in all teams, including ours.

The problem with Al is his contract. There is just no justification for that amount, on an individual level.
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