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Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III

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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#101 » by Kobblehead » Thu Feb 6, 2020 5:58 pm

HartfordWhalers wrote:You are not concerned about the high profile injury he suffered, and the fact that for several years now he hasn't been a volume or efficient scorer like he was before then, all while getting feasted on while on defense?

I feel like it is not a stretch to say that the IT now does not resemble the one that put up those numbers you are using to justify loving him.


Obviously Thomas isn't the player he once was, but he's still pretty damn dynamic on a per-minute basis (19 ppg per-36). That type of per minute scoring punch from a ball handler of his proven pedigree coming off our bench in a 20 minute role would elevate our offense significantly. He's also shooting at elite level so he provides the spacing many are clamoring for.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#102 » by eagereyez » Thu Feb 6, 2020 5:59 pm

It doesn't matter if the Sixers have a million round picks. Using them on players who A) won't turn this season around and B) will be gone at the end of the season is equivalent to selling the picks for cash. Trading for rentals only makes sense if you're at or near the top of the league, not a 6th seed who can't win on the road.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#103 » by Negrodamus » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:01 pm

BullyKing wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:
Phila Tough wrote:
We have enough young talent. And we haven't really hit on any 2nd round picks outside of Richuan Holmes these past few years. I rather cash them in for impact players right now. How many 2nd round picks do we have left?


Right, but we're not committed to Pelle, Burke (who might be gone anyway), O'Quinn, or Neto beyond this year. Jonah Bolden is clearly a lost cause. James Ennis and Zhaire are moveable assets. This roster is not static. Young players come and go.

I'm not going to present the same tired argument about the Raptors, but there's a reason they are still relevant post Kawhi. It's because they kept trying to find overlooked players with star upside.


I think this is a different argument though. I am the first person to agree with the general statement that the way Colangelo and Brand have literally thrown away seconds is the height of stupidity. But acting like we should be using four second picks a year is way too far to the opposite extreme. We should definitely be taking swings in the second like the Raptors but the three remaining second round picks we have this year seems sufficient for that no?


I'm not really arguing the current trade, I'm mostly arguing the value of 2nd round picks. The idea that they are these worthless assets that are meant to be blown is crazy to me.

As far as this trade, I understand why it was done and think Brand made a good trade. I do also recognize that GSW is process level bad and might have inflated the value of these players. I think for the price, it's worth the risk. I also believe it was Brand's last ditch effort at surrounding the team with more talent because I don't think ownership trusts him to make any move of substance out of fear of losing his job. He constructed this roster, if it's a dud, then the next guy will be the one that moves Horford, J-Rich, Tobias, Thybulle, etc.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#104 » by BullyKing » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:08 pm

eagereyez wrote:It doesn't matter if the Sixers have a million second round picks. Using them on players who A) won't turn this season around and B) will be gone at the end of the season is equivalent to selling the picks for cash. Trading for rentals only makes sense if you're at or near the top of the league, not a 6th seed who can't win on the road.


Since no one has any idea what impact these players will have or what will happen in the future, your position is the intellectual equivalent of saying second round picks should only be used on future superstars.
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the plan is to get as good as quickly as possible....I fully believe we could have been a borderline playoff team last year by adding young veterans....using or draft picks and cap space.....can I specifically tell you who? no.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#105 » by BullyKing » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:22 pm

Negrodamus wrote:
BullyKing wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:
Right, but we're not committed to Pelle, Burke (who might be gone anyway), O'Quinn, or Neto beyond this year. Jonah Bolden is clearly a lost cause. James Ennis and Zhaire are moveable assets. This roster is not static. Young players come and go.

I'm not going to present the same tired argument about the Raptors, but there's a reason they are still relevant post Kawhi. It's because they kept trying to find overlooked players with star upside.


I think this is a different argument though. I am the first person to agree with the general statement that the way Colangelo and Brand have literally thrown away seconds is the height of stupidity. But acting like we should be using four second picks a year is way too far to the opposite extreme. We should definitely be taking swings in the second like the Raptors but the three remaining second round picks we have this year seems sufficient for that no?


I'm not really arguing the current trade, I'm mostly arguing the value of 2nd round picks. The idea that they are these worthless assets that are meant to be blown is crazy to me.

As far as this trade, I understand why it was done and think Brand made a good trade. I do also recognize that GSW is process level bad and might have inflated the value of these players. I think for the price, it's worth the risk. I also believe it was Brand's last ditch effort at surrounding the team with more talent because I don't think ownership trusts him to make any move of substance out of fear of losing his job. He constructed this roster, if it's a dud, then the next guy will be the one that moves Horford, J-Rich, Tobias, Thybulle, etc.


I don't think anyone is taking the position that they're actually worthless. Just that late second picks, like role players on expiring contracts, are worth very little.
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the plan is to get as good as quickly as possible....I fully believe we could have been a borderline playoff team last year by adding young veterans....using or draft picks and cap space.....can I specifically tell you who? no.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#106 » by eagereyez » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:25 pm

BullyKing wrote:
eagereyez wrote:It doesn't matter if the Sixers have a million second round picks. Using them on players who A) won't turn this season around and B) will be gone at the end of the season is equivalent to selling the picks for cash. Trading for rentals only makes sense if you're at or near the top of the league, not a 6th seed who can't win on the road.


Since no one has any idea what impact these players will have or what will happen in the future, your position is the intellectual equivalent of saying second round picks should only be used on future superstars.

Lol what a silly thing to say. Of course people have an idea of what impact these players will have. They played 50 games this season and have a combined 700 NBA games under their belt. Their total worth is a bundle of second round picks, because they suck. They aren't the saviors.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#107 » by Arsenal » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:25 pm

Kobblehead wrote:Golden State played us so hard.

They signed a pair of guys to vet minimums this summer. Then pumped the hell out of their stats on a tanking squad and then moved them at the deadline for 3 second rounders.

We're absolutely the suckers in this scenario.


What's new about that? We've been the suckers since April 2016 when we lost our lord and savior...
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#108 » by Arsenal » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:27 pm

HartfordWhalers wrote:Robinson is an upgrade to Ennis. That shouldn't be debatable. Bemoaning the loss of picks around 50 seems absurd.


I'm ok with this move because the cost was so low, but I'm not convinced that Robinson is better than Ennis overall. I suppose since he's a better shooter that he's a better fit though.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#109 » by Arsenal » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:30 pm

Phila Tough wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:
Phila Tough wrote:Alec Burks could be an absolute steal. I really don't see how anyone can complain about this deal. Complaining about 2nd round picks? Really? Maybe in 2015...


While I agree that Burks was a solid acquisition, I do recognize that second round picks are important for this teams future. We need to hit on some of them for depth, or even guys like Shake who have been incredible for us as a second rounder.


We have enough young talent. And we haven't really hit on any 2nd round picks outside of Richuan Holmes these past few years. I rather cash them in for impact players right now. How many 2nd round picks do we have left?


Disagree. We hit on Jerami Grant, Richaun Holmes, and Shake Milton. 2nd rounders should not be totally discounted.

With that said I'm fine with this deal.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#110 » by MambaJuice » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:30 pm

Let's see how Robinson and Burks play before we start praising or bemoaning the move. We got shooting NOW, and not years from now when a late 2nd may or may not develop into something. We basically got them for nothing. Maybe the price of a lottery ticket, a ticket with a low percentage of hitting a jackpot but a high percentage of returning nothing more than a late rotation guy at best or a non-NBA player at worst.

It's remarkably easy to acquire 2nd round picks, especially late 2nd rounders. I am losing zero sleep. These picks can be recouped at any time. Besides, they were either going to be wasted, sold or stashed or would take years of development and we don't have those minutes.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#111 » by BullyKing » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:31 pm

eagereyez wrote:
BullyKing wrote:
eagereyez wrote:It doesn't matter if the Sixers have a million second round picks. Using them on players who A) won't turn this season around and B) will be gone at the end of the season is equivalent to selling the picks for cash. Trading for rentals only makes sense if you're at or near the top of the league, not a 6th seed who can't win on the road.


Since no one has any idea what impact these players will have or what will happen in the future, your position is the intellectual equivalent of saying second round picks should only be used on future superstars.

Lol what a silly thing to say. Of course people have an idea of what impact these players will have. They played 50 games this season and have a combined 700 NBA games under their belt. Their total worth is a bundle of second round picks, because they suck. They aren't the saviors.


Only because you continue to avoid the absurdity of your position. If Burks gets hot and wins us a single game, he will have provided more value than the expected combined value of all of those picks. You continue to think the trade was three future long term contributors for guys who will leave at the end of the season.
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the plan is to get as good as quickly as possible....I fully believe we could have been a borderline playoff team last year by adding young veterans....using or draft picks and cap space.....can I specifically tell you who? no.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#112 » by NoDopeOnSundays » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:31 pm

Ideally, shouldn't one of these two guys be in the starting lineup instead of Horford?
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#113 » by eagereyez » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:33 pm

BullyKing wrote:
eagereyez wrote:
BullyKing wrote:
Since no one has any idea what impact these players will have or what will happen in the future, your position is the intellectual equivalent of saying second round picks should only be used on future superstars.

Lol what a silly thing to say. Of course people have an idea of what impact these players will have. They played 50 games this season and have a combined 700 NBA games under their belt. Their total worth is a bundle of second round picks, because they suck. They aren't the saviors.


Only because you continue to avoid the absurdity of your position. If Burks gets hot and wins us a single game, he will have provided more value than the expected combined value of all of those picks. You continue to think the trade was three future long term contributors for guys who will leave at the end of the season.

Point out where I said that. I'll wait.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#114 » by BullyKing » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:33 pm

Arsenal wrote:
Phila Tough wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:
While I agree that Burks was a solid acquisition, I do recognize that second round picks are important for this teams future. We need to hit on some of them for depth, or even guys like Shake who have been incredible for us as a second rounder.


We have enough young talent. And we haven't really hit on any 2nd round picks outside of Richuan Holmes these past few years. I rather cash them in for impact players right now. How many 2nd round picks do we have left?


Disagree. We hit on Jerami Grant, Richaun Holmes, and Shake Milton. 2nd rounders should not be totally discounted.

With that said I'm fine with this deal.


Richaun and Jerami were early 2nd rounders though. And we couldn't wait for them to develop into useful players even when we were rebuilding. Not ready to call Shake Milton anything yet.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#115 » by Arsenal » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:36 pm

NoDopeOnSundays wrote:Ideally, shouldn't one of these two guys be in the starting lineup instead of Horford?


Absolutely either one of them or Korkmaz. I think Burks should be our bench scorer, so I'd go with Robinson or Korkmaz.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#116 » by eagereyez » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:37 pm

Arsenal wrote:
NoDopeOnSundays wrote:Ideally, shouldn't one of these two guys be in the starting lineup instead of Horford?


Absolutely either one of them or Korkmaz. I think Burks should be our bench scorer, so I'd go with Robinson or Korkmaz.

This only happens if the Sixers are willing to bench Horford. I hope it happens, but I'm not terribly optimistic.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#117 » by BullyKing » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:38 pm

eagereyez wrote:
BullyKing wrote:
eagereyez wrote:Lol what a silly thing to say. Of course people have an idea of what impact these players will have. They played 50 games this season and have a combined 700 NBA games under their belt. Their total worth is a bundle of second round picks, because they suck. They aren't the saviors.


Only because you continue to avoid the absurdity of your position. If Burks gets hot and wins us a single game, he will have provided more value than the expected combined value of all of those picks. You continue to think the trade was three future long term contributors for guys who will leave at the end of the season.

Point out where I said that. I'll wait.


Then what is your point? That trading 3 3% chances of landing a rotation player is something to be distraught about?
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the plan is to get as good as quickly as possible....I fully believe we could have been a borderline playoff team last year by adding young veterans....using or draft picks and cap space.....can I specifically tell you who? no.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#118 » by mithrandir17 » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:42 pm

Let's say DAL, DEN, TOR's regular season records stay the same for the next few years, the picks that we've traded away are 50th pick (DAL), 55th pick (DEN) and 58th pick (TOR). I dont think we should be worried abour losing these picks. We dont have roster spots for these picks, they will be just two way contracts, stashed players that we will never hear again or just plainly sold for cash.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#119 » by AI_Efficiency » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:44 pm

eagereyez wrote:
Arsenal wrote:
NoDopeOnSundays wrote:Ideally, shouldn't one of these two guys be in the starting lineup instead of Horford?


Absolutely either one of them or Korkmaz. I think Burks should be our bench scorer, so I'd go with Robinson or Korkmaz.

This only happens if the Sixers are willing to bench Horford. I hope it happens, but I'm not terribly optimistic.

Yea, I don't think he'll get benched this season, but I foresee his minutes going down in the playoffs. Brett will hopefully do what he has to with his job on the line.
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Re: Welcome Alec Burks and Glenn Robinson III 

Post#120 » by Arsenal » Thu Feb 6, 2020 6:46 pm

AI_Efficiency wrote:
eagereyez wrote:
Arsenal wrote:
Absolutely either one of them or Korkmaz. I think Burks should be our bench scorer, so I'd go with Robinson or Korkmaz.

This only happens if the Sixers are willing to bench Horford. I hope it happens, but I'm not terribly optimistic.

Yea, I don't think he'll get benched this season, but I foresee his minutes going down in the playoffs. Brett will hopefully do what he has to with his job on the line.


Don't understand the hesitation. Horford can STILL get 30 mpg during the regular season while never playing a single minute with both Embiid and Simmons at the same time. His numbers may improve because he'll get to handle the ball in the low/high post when he's on the floor, instead of standing at the 3 point line as a miscast spacer.

Only ego and cowardice would prevent this obvious move.
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