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Game 60: Sixers vs Knicks - 7pm

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Re: Game 60: Sixers vs Knicks - 7pm 

Post#121 » by kio80 » Sat Feb 29, 2020 6:58 am

All the pro arguments regarding Harris’ fit in the team is that he played well, he scores his load etc.
However, the ways he scores and everything about him just doesn’t fit with the play style of our 2 young stars. We need pieces to compliment them, catch and shoot wings, stretch bigs who doesn’t need to put the ball down for post ups and dribble out the shot clock.



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Re: Game 60: Sixers vs Knicks - 7pm 

Post#122 » by mjkvol » Sat Feb 29, 2020 1:31 pm

kio80 wrote:All the pro arguments regarding Harris’ fit in the team is that he played well, he scores his load etc.
However, the ways he scores and everything about him just doesn’t fit with the play style of our 2 young stars. We need pieces to compliment them, catch and shoot wings, stretch bigs who doesn’t need to put the ball down for post ups and dribble out the shot clock.


Exactly. I'm astounded how hard this simple concept seems to be for some to grasp. Stats are great, but all too often are deceiving and don't show the entire picture, and this is a classic example.

Just watching this team play at full strength when the game slows down shows in pretty stark terms how awkward these pieces fit what is needed around Jo and Ben. There's a reason why Brand was so desperate to bring in a certain kind of player at the trade deadline and the buyout market.
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Re: Game 60: Sixers vs Knicks - 7pm 

Post#123 » by agiaco » Sat Feb 29, 2020 8:43 pm

kio80 wrote:All the pro arguments regarding Harris’ fit in the team is that he played well, he scores his load etc.
However, the ways he scores and everything about him just doesn’t fit with the play style of our 2 young stars. We need pieces to compliment them, catch and shoot wings, stretch bigs who doesn’t need to put the ball down for post ups and dribble out the shot clock.

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Rip on the way the team was constructed instead of the player then. Because you're constantly saying Harris sucks, ironically in games where he's the only one doing anything worthwhile.
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Re: Game 60: Sixers vs Knicks - 7pm 

Post#124 » by mjkvol » Sat Feb 29, 2020 11:01 pm

agiaco wrote:
kio80 wrote:All the pro arguments regarding Harris’ fit in the team is that he played well, he scores his load etc.
However, the ways he scores and everything about him just doesn’t fit with the play style of our 2 young stars. We need pieces to compliment them, catch and shoot wings, stretch bigs who doesn’t need to put the ball down for post ups and dribble out the shot clock.

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Rip on the way the team was constructed instead of the player then. Because you're constantly saying Harris sucks, ironically in games where he's the only one doing anything worthwhile.


Does it really matter? Point is that regardless how good he is, with this group his skill set just isn't a good fit, and that's not likely to change.
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Game 60: Sixers vs Knicks - 7pm 

Post#125 » by kio80 » Sun Mar 1, 2020 3:06 am

agiaco wrote:
kio80 wrote:All the pro arguments regarding Harris’ fit in the team is that he played well, he scores his load etc.
However, the ways he scores and everything about him just doesn’t fit with the play style of our 2 young stars. We need pieces to compliment them, catch and shoot wings, stretch bigs who doesn’t need to put the ball down for post ups and dribble out the shot clock.

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Rip on the way the team was constructed instead of the player then. Because you're constantly saying Harris sucks, ironically in games where he's the only one doing anything worthwhile.


I admit I ripped on Tobias multiple times.
He’s a decent guy and probably a boarder line all star in a slow paced, non playoff team with him as the number 1 or 2 option, but watching him in this team is like having someone play an organ in a classical orchestra, it is hard for me to listen/watch. Even as bad as Horford, at least he tries to adjust to the team but Harris never really change his play style even the slightest.


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Re: Game 60: Sixers vs Knicks - 7pm 

Post#126 » by Negrodamus » Sun Mar 1, 2020 4:32 am

We should have bought low on Trier. He's a natural scorer with flaws but provides something we don't have, iso offense.
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Re: Game 60: Sixers vs Knicks - 7pm 

Post#127 » by agiaco » Sun Mar 1, 2020 4:47 am

kio80 wrote:
agiaco wrote:
kio80 wrote:All the pro arguments regarding Harris’ fit in the team is that he played well, he scores his load etc.
However, the ways he scores and everything about him just doesn’t fit with the play style of our 2 young stars. We need pieces to compliment them, catch and shoot wings, stretch bigs who doesn’t need to put the ball down for post ups and dribble out the shot clock.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Rip on the way the team was constructed instead of the player then. Because you're constantly saying Harris sucks, ironically in games where he's the only one doing anything worthwhile.


I admit I ripped on Tobias multiple times.
He’s a decent guy and probably a boarder line all star in a slow paced, non playoff team with him as the number 1 or 2 option, but watching him in this team is like having someone play an organ in a classical orchestra, it is hard for me to listen/watch. Even as bad as Horford, at least he tries to adjust to the team but Harris never really change his play style even the slightest.


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I respect that. Let's say hypothetically the team were to replace Josh with a lights out shooter and Horford with a better stretch four, do you see Harris fitting in better at the 3? Or even Tobias at the 4 and Josh and a shooting wing at the 2/3.
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Re: Game 60: Sixers vs Knicks - 7pm 

Post#128 » by Mik317 » Sun Mar 1, 2020 6:28 am

Tobias is a rhythm based player who needs touches and dribbles to get into said rhythm.

this makes him a terrible fit next to Embiid who also requires touches...and lots of them. Thus he often plays like **** with Joel...it was the same last year too.

He is also a mediocre fit next to Ben because he's not comfortable just spotting up and shooting. And doesn't move well off ball.

JJ was great fit with Embiid because he didn't require many touches or dribbles to get hot. Ben has great chemistry with Furkan because he does move well off ball and is able to catch and fire.

Now this does not mean you just fill the team with a bunch of JJs and Furkans either. Defensively that has shown to be tough (See JJ and Marco). And it still does not solve the shot creation issues. Which means Ben needs to **** shoot and Embiid needs to **** pass the ball better. But Tobias is a bad fit regardless. He was supposed to be able to fix the shot creation part but we need him to do it further out and not in the same space Joel and Ben like to stand in.

so long story short...another guy placed in a terrible spot.
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Re: Game 60: Sixers vs Knicks - 7pm 

Post#129 » by 76ciology » Sun Mar 1, 2020 6:31 am

Tobias isn’t Kawhi or LeBron. But he plays good on both ends, he can score without the ball to compliment Ben and Jojo, he can space the floor. And he has the second highest on vs off NetRtg.

Once Jojo and Ben gets into 100%, physically and spiritually (yup), tobi will be perfect as third option.
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Re: Game 60: Sixers vs Knicks - 7pm 

Post#130 » by brannigan73 » Sun Mar 1, 2020 6:59 am

76ciology wrote:Tobias isn’t Kawhi or LeBron. But he plays good on both ends, he can score without the ball to compliment Ben and Jojo, he can space the floor. And he has the second highest on vs off NetRtg.

Once Jojo and Ben gets into 100%, physically and spiritually (yup), tobi will be perfect as third option.



The Sixers are a wretched offensive team thats the main reason why Harris looks so important on offense. Here are some stats for you. Harris is has .9 BPM, he has a 1.64 PIPM which is the exact PIPM of Bojan Bogdanovich who makes half his money and worse then Gallinari who also makes half his money. His RPM is .58 which is not particularly good at all. Tobias Harris is not an impact player. He makes too much money. You dont build a championship contender paying a guy 35 million per year who is at most a 20 million dollar player by impact stats and maybe a little less then that. The guy is not a difference maker. By all means though feel good about the big game he put up against the wretched Knicks. Lets see what he does on this road trip. There main goals after this season should be to get rid of Harris and Horford. As long as they are over-paying those two by so much there is no hope for anything more then a quasi contender.
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Re: Game 60: Sixers vs Knicks - 7pm 

Post#131 » by mjkvol » Sun Mar 1, 2020 4:08 pm

Mik317 wrote:Tobias is a rhythm based player who needs touches and dribbles to get into said rhythm.

this makes him a terrible fit next to Embiid who also requires touches...and lots of them. Thus he often plays like **** with Joel...it was the same last year too.

He is also a mediocre fit next to Ben because he's not comfortable just spotting up and shooting. And doesn't move well off ball.

JJ was great fit with Embiid because he didn't require many touches or dribbles to get hot. Ben has great chemistry with Furkan because he does move well off ball and is able to catch and fire.

Now this does not mean you just fill the team with a bunch of JJs and Furkans either. Defensively that has shown to be tough (See JJ and Marco). And it still does not solve the shot creation issues. Which means Ben needs to **** shoot and Embiid needs to **** pass the ball better. But Tobias is a bad fit regardless. He was supposed to be able to fix the shot creation part but we need him to do it further out and not in the same space Joel and Ben like to stand in.

so long story short...another guy placed in a terrible spot.


This about sums it up.
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Re: Game 60: Sixers vs Knicks - 7pm 

Post#132 » by mjkvol » Sun Mar 1, 2020 4:12 pm

brannigan73 wrote:
76ciology wrote:Tobias isn’t Kawhi or LeBron. But he plays good on both ends, he can score without the ball to compliment Ben and Jojo, he can space the floor. And he has the second highest on vs off NetRtg.

Once Jojo and Ben gets into 100%, physically and spiritually (yup), tobi will be perfect as third option.



The Sixers are a wretched offensive team thats the main reason why Harris looks so important on offense. Here are some stats for you. Harris is has .9 BPM, he has a 1.64 PIPM which is the exact PIPM of Bojan Bogdanovich who makes half his money and worse then Gallinari who also makes half his money. His RPM is .58 which is not particularly good at all. Tobias Harris is not an impact player. He makes too much money. You dont build a championship contender paying a guy 35 million per year who is at most a 20 million dollar player by impact stats and maybe a little less then that. The guy is not a difference maker. By all means though feel good about the big game he put up against the wretched Knicks. Lets see what he does on this road trip. There main goals after this season should be to get rid of Harris and Horford. As long as they are over-paying those two by so much there is no hope for anything more then a quasi contender.


And this sums it up as well.

No one is saying Harris isn't a good player, which seems to be the issue with some on here. He simply doesn't fit what the Sixers need at that spot, and he eats up far too much of the cap for what he brings to the table. Why is this so complicated?
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