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Championship hopes

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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#61 » by 76ciology » Sun Jun 7, 2020 4:28 am

VDT wrote:
76ciology wrote:
VDT wrote:Yea it is very hard to win like that. Hunting mismatches can help, but you generally need a player that is a mismatch by himself to win the title.


If you watch how top teams play even Rockets or Warriors hunts mismatches.

NBA playoffs has become a heavy ISO game because teams are now advanced in their ability to switch and pre-switch the screen plays. A good example is how hard it is for our sets to work in the playoffs compared in the regular season.

So by inserting Al and sliding Ben, Biid and Tobi. They are “mismatch by himself”. Guards are too small to guard Tobi or Ben while PFs are not big enough to defend Biid.

The key is, our guys have to be able to defend guys lower their position. Which if you notice, is something we’re doing. Biid was on Siakam and Giannis most times when we faced them. Tobi improved his footspeed on defense while Ben has been defending point guards.

The problem with our team, IMO. Was we focused too much on that type of style that we moved away from the Jj-Biid DHO which kills most teams in the regular season (and doesnt work that well in the playoffs). So we were looking for furkan, Milton, Burks and maybe GRob to generate it for us.


Rockets just have Harden and Westbrook and have built their entire team to accommodate them, to the point that they have no center.
They even traded the guy that Harden run pick and roll with because he couldnt shoot 3s.They dont hunt any matchups, they just give the ball to their best players and let them create.

Warriors had Durant who can score on anybody.

Also i am not sure why you want Embiid (or any other player) to defend a position down. The reason he did against the Bucks and the Raptors was that the PFs couldnt shoot 3s while the opposing centers camped the three point line. The whole idea was for him to stay in the paint. Most of the teams have Fs that can shoot so the situation is not the same.

Offensively, you cant force the other team to defend Embiid with their PF unless you can force a switch, in which case playing Horford is irrelevant if not detrimental.


First off, because top teams are trending towards having a stretch 5 and a big PF who loves attacking the paint. If you put Embiid at Brolo and Gasol he will be pulled away from the paint.

Then on offense, have to slide Biid to PF and have Al at C so you can pull the C away from the rim and Biid won’t have a hard time going against the Baynes and the Gasol type centers in the playoffs.

You can’t always force the opponents PF at Biid, but you increased that chance (i.e., there were possessions Siakam was on Biid in last year’s playoff) with a non dead ball situation and fast pace.

check first possession then another one at 2:14 minute mark.

Then if you can’t force the PF on embiid, having Al always will have a smaller guy on either Ben and Tobi.

Having Ben against a smaller defender at the post with 4 guys spacing him actually is the most optimal set-up where you have Ben as a threat on offense and as your guy to pass the ball to the open shooter.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#62 » by 76ciology » Sun Jun 7, 2020 4:43 am

Spoiler:
Kobblehead wrote:
76ciology wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:I think this is where we fundamentally disagree.

I don't think you can synthetically manufacture the impact that "a guy" typically gives a team by taking lesser players and hunting size mismatches.


This is something we learned from the Celtics when they had 2-4 guys (including morris) who can attack mismatches. Crazy how they met the perfect opportunity to show it against our squad in the 2018 playoffs. The Celts practiced heavy 1v1 on their practice.



The Celtics had a handful of guys who could legitimately create their own shot and they sicked them on bad defenders.

I don't see the parallel between that situation and the situation with us that you're describing regarding having guys who aren't apt at creating their own shot relying solely on size mismatches to gain an advantage.


It’s really how you value Ben and Tobi.

Like I know Al is criticized a lot. But in the playoffs he can drop 20+ a game when he’s in rhythm or against a mismatch. So he’s a threat that you can’t place a SG to cheat the size issue

A lot of it also needs Ben and Tobi stepping up and developing. Are both guys there yet? I also don’t know but I think they can.

We don’t really have an offensive juggernaut player like Harden or KD. So we will do the offense collectively. So don’t expect like we need Ben to drop 40-50 pts, the possessions are going to spread out among players and play types (not all possessions will be iso but the point is we can play iso ball).
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#63 » by elchengue20 » Sun Jun 7, 2020 7:58 am

Who is a reliable scorer on isolation?

We only have Embiid(and gets doubled a lot). Then nobody else. Horford scores mostly in the flow of the offense. He's not somebody you can look mismaches for and throw him the ball and expect him to carry you. Sure, he can score 20 in some games but he won't avergare 20+ for a series, much less in multiple series.

Tobias is the only player who could potentialy do it, but i'm not keeping my hopes up about that, it's not likely to happen.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#64 » by 76ciology » Sun Jun 7, 2020 8:29 am

Spoiler:
SparksFly87 wrote:
76ciology wrote:
elchengue20 wrote:

I trust Embiid a lot more than Ben. If he's in shape and plays smart he can be dominant. He still has to grow up a bit, the bad thing is he isn't showing much improvement in that regard.Plus he will get doubled a lot if others don't show up. So, a lot of IF with Embiid(conditioning, character, system fit). Maybe he can put it all together.

Ben is damn talented, if he ever improved a little he could be special. But he hasn't improved his shooting in any way( not even his damn FT's are decent). He is a total liabilty ofensively in close games.And he's even more inmature than Embiid. So no, i don't think you can rely on him a lot to make deep playoffs runs. Maybe he makes the leap we all have been waiting for, but i think its too soon for him yet. And at this point i dond't know if he ever bee. Maybe he has the Fultz curse(Somebody should be fired in our shooting and player development staff).


Personally, I prefer Ben to be our alpha on offense. He’s just a better ball handler, passer and decision maker on the court. But you have to factor scoring which Biid is way better than Ben in this regard.

That said, we can go with either one of them depending on whichever match-up that is more favorable for us.

With regards to his shooting, I don’t think he’s comfortable with it. And i personally think that the people around him doesnt want him to jack up 3s for it will lower his value (considering he should be a sub par shooter). His people would prefer his shooting to be a mystery. An extra upside of how good he can be. And his numbers without shooting has been good so they dont want to mess up with it. And just as Biid, i dont think his guys want him to shoot perimeter shots and mess up his %s and give up the alpha role to Ben on offense. That’s just my guess.

But if Ben can shoot the 3s at atleast league average with volume (which is a big leap for him), i wouldnt be surprised if he’ll take them.




Would moving Embiid for a shot creater on the wing such as Tatum or Ingram increase our chances of winning a chip with our current core Simmons, Tobias, Horford and JRich ?


I really enjoyed having this on my mind.

Star players are like owning luxury cars. They’re expensive to have and they have low resale value, unless you’re lucky.

Short term, the answer is trading Ben would be more ideal. You will take a hit if you trade Biid for Tatum. Tatum doesn’t really move the needle like Biid. But the team would be a lot better if you have Tatum or Ingram instead of Ben right now IMO.

Long term, this can go the opposite way. Like if Ben ever develops and the uncertainty in Biid’s health (physcially and emotionally).

The thing is, you just cant know the future. And that’s why we’re holding to both. And that is the best recommended move IMO, for now.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#65 » by 76ciology » Sun Jun 7, 2020 9:06 am

Spoiler:
elchengue20 wrote:Who is a reliable scorer on isolation?

We only have Embiid(and gets doubled a lot). Then nobody else. Horford scores mostly in the flow of the offense. He's not somebody you can look mismaches for and throw him the ball and expect him to carry you. Sure, he can score 20 in some games but he won't avergare 20+ for a series, much less in multiple series.

Tobias is the only player who could potentialy do it, but i'm not keeping my hopes up about that, it's not likely to happen.


Best offense is when you have multiple options, this way you can go where there is least pressure.

First off, make no mistake that im not saying that we will rely on Al scoring high volume of points. He may attack mismatches and he will create mismatches by allowing our top guys to slide down their positions

That said, you can spread out the opportunities among Ben, Biid, Tobi and Al depending on mismatches and who has the hot hand that game.Then Josh Rich and Burks can run 2man games. With Milton and Furkan playing off the ball.

Personally, I prefer Ben attacking the opponents PG, then having a 4 out offense with Ben being the playmaker and passing the ball to the open shooter.

When the offense can attack on different angles, it’s just a nightmare for the defense


Like for instance we’re facing the Bucks.

We can put Ben on Bledsoe and Biid on Giannis (Al on Brolo, Tobi on Middleton and Jrich on Matthews).

Ben can attack Bledsoe or Biid can attack Giannis on crossmatch.

If Bucks can recover on defense and get the match-ups they want on defense, we can always attack Wes Matthews via Ben or Tobias.

Ben and Tobi can also run 2 man games with Biid, where they can score or dump the ball to Biid to attack Matthews at the post if Bucks switch on defense.

Im not saying all possessions are these way. But when the sets gets neutralized during crunch time and we need to generate buckets this is the type of scenarios we can explore

Do we need these type of scenarios? Yes, try to watch the closing minutes of the g7 against the Raps series.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#66 » by VDT » Sun Jun 7, 2020 10:54 am

76ciology wrote:
First off, because top teams are trending towards having a stretch 5 and a big PF who loves attacking the paint. If you put Embiid at Brolo and Gasol he will be pulled away from the paint.



As i said, the idea is to keep Embiid in the paint it's not to have him defend PFs. The Bucks and the Raptors are two exceptions that their star player is a PF that cant shoot (or couldnt for Siakam) while having centers that camp the 3 point line. Generally speaking Embiid will defend the opposing center. And you dont need Horford for that, last year Harris was defending Gasol without any problems.

76ciology wrote:Then on offense, have to slide Biid to PF and have Al at C so you can pull the C away from the rim and Biid won’t have a hard time going against the Baynes and the Gasol type centers in the playoffs.


Horford will not be able to pull the center away because the center will be defending Embiid and there is nothing you can do about it. The other teams are not idiots, they are not going to defend Embiid with their PFs just because you decided to slide Embiid to PF (whatever that means).

76ciology wrote:You can’t always force the opponents PF at Biid, but you increased that chance (i.e., there were possessions Siakam was on Biid in last year’s playoff) with a non dead ball situation and fast pace.


The only time something like that would happen is in transition offense and that has nothing to do with Horford. Generally speaking Embiid will be defended by centers, and as i said you cant do anything about it other that try to force a switch.


76ciology wrote:Then if you can’t force the PF on embiid, having Al always will have a smaller guy on either Ben and Tobi.


Al will be defended by the PF of the other team. Even if he is a little bit smaller than Horford you dont want to base your offense on Horford's iso game.

76ciology wrote:Having Ben against a smaller defender at the post with 4 guys spacing him actually is the most optimal set-up where you have Ben as a threat on offense and as your guy to pass the ball to the open shooter.


You can do that if he is defended by a much smaller player. Generally speaking Simmons hasnt shown the ability to exploit players in the post unless he has a huge size advantage. He hasnt been very impressive against SF sized players in the post. He lacks length, moves and touch to be a consistent threat in the post against similarly sized players.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#67 » by 76ciology » Sun Jun 7, 2020 11:57 am

VDT wrote:
76ciology wrote:
First off, because top teams are trending towards having a stretch 5 and a big PF who loves attacking the paint. If you put Embiid at Brolo and Gasol he will be pulled away from the paint.



As i said, the idea is to keep Embiid in the paint it's not to have him defend PFs. The Bucks and the Raptors are two exceptions that their star player is a PF that cant shoot (or couldnt for Siakam) while having centers that camp the 3 point line. Generally speaking Embiid will defend the opposing center. And you dont need Horford for that, last year Harris was defending Gasol without any problems.

76ciology wrote:Then on offense, have to slide Biid to PF and have Al at C so you can pull the C away from the rim and Biid won’t have a hard time going against the Baynes and the Gasol type centers in the playoffs.


Horford will not be able to pull the center away because the center will be defending Embiid and there is nothing you can do about it. The other teams are not idiots, they are not going to defend Embiid with their PFs just because you decided to slide Embiid to PF (whatever that means).

76ciology wrote:You can’t always force the opponents PF at Biid, but you increased that chance (i.e., there were possessions Siakam was on Biid in last year’s playoff) with a non dead ball situation and fast pace.


The only time something like that would happen is in transition offense and that has nothing to do with Horford. Generally speaking Embiid will be defended by centers, and as i said you cant do anything about it other that try to force a switch.


76ciology wrote:Then if you can’t force the PF on embiid, having Al always will have a smaller guy on either Ben and Tobi.


Al will be defended by the PF of the other team. Even if he is a little bit smaller than Horford you dont want to base your offense on Horford's iso game.

76ciology wrote:Having Ben against a smaller defender at the post with 4 guys spacing him actually is the most optimal set-up where you have Ben as a threat on offense and as your guy to pass the ball to the open shooter.


You can do that if he is defended by a much smaller player. Generally speaking Simmons hasnt shown the ability to exploit players in the post unless he has a huge size advantage. He hasnt been very impressive against SF sized players in the post. He lacks length, moves and touch to be a consistent threat in the post against similarly sized players.


Relax my friend.

Anyway, my point is just that having Al increases your chance and possessions of having an opponent’s PF defending Biid. Sure opponents will find ways to prevent that by all means so i dont think it will happen frequently. But having Al also allows one of Ben or Tobi to have the size advantage against opponents guards.

While opponents defense always have to scramble to get their guys on defense, which makes us a lot tougher to defend on transition. Right? Either that or they have to live with the mismatches on halfcourt.

Raps and Bucks are two teams you mentioned. And surely we tried to built a team that can beat those two teams when we tried to retool this team during the 2019 offseason. You can also consider the Lakers where AD will try to hide from Embiid so expect them to play with either McGee or D12 with AD.

Regarding Tobi against opponents centers, we got outrebounded because of that and caused us the g7 of the raps series. Then offensively, we werent able to generate favorable 1v1 situations down the stretch. Raps aren’t afraid of Embiid (see the game when Biid laid an egg against then).

Ben attacking mismatches unlocked a 20+ppg scoring Ben in the month of January. We hope that he developed into a better scorer against mismatches, which can happen more frequently with Al and Biid occupying the PF&C positions. This also improved Tobi’s opportunities on ISOs, since he’ll likely be defended by smaller guys (P.S. try to check Tobi’s real height).

Again, my idea is more theoretical than actual and I think the FO and the coaching staff of this team have the same idea with what I have.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#68 » by phillybird » Sun Jun 7, 2020 5:38 pm

Anyone else worried about the fact that our team is only motivated to win games at the Wells Fargo Center and we will be playing all remaining games not there...
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#69 » by elchengue20 » Sun Jun 7, 2020 7:57 pm

76ciology wrote:
Spoiler:
SparksFly87 wrote:
76ciology wrote:
Personally, I prefer Ben to be our alpha on offense. He’s just a better ball handler, passer and decision maker on the court. But you have to factor scoring which Biid is way better than Ben in this regard.

That said, we can go with either one of them depending on whichever match-up that is more favorable for us.

With regards to his shooting, I don’t think he’s comfortable with it. And i personally think that the people around him doesnt want him to jack up 3s for it will lower his value (considering he should be a sub par shooter). His people would prefer his shooting to be a mystery. An extra upside of how good he can be. And his numbers without shooting has been good so they dont want to mess up with it. And just as Biid, i dont think his guys want him to shoot perimeter shots and mess up his %s and give up the alpha role to Ben on offense. That’s just my guess.

But if Ben can shoot the 3s at atleast league average with volume (which is a big leap for him), i wouldnt be surprised if he’ll take them.




Would moving Embiid for a shot creater on the wing such as Tatum or Ingram increase our chances of winning a chip with our current core Simmons, Tobias, Horford and JRich ?


I really enjoyed having this on my mind.

Star players are like owning luxury cars. They’re expensive to have and they have low resale value, unless you’re lucky.

Short term, the answer is trading Ben would be more ideal. You will take a hit if you trade Biid for Tatum. Tatum doesn’t really move the needle like Biid. But the team would be a lot better if you have Tatum or Ingram instead of Ben right now IMO.

Long term, this can go the opposite way. Like if Ben ever develops and the uncertainty in Biid’s health (physcially and emotionally).

The thing is, you just cant know the future. And that’s why we’re holding to both. And that is the best recommended move IMO, for now.


It all comes to, do you think Ben is going to develop at least an average jumpshot and become a Superstar?

If you thinks that's more likely than not, i understand if you want to keep him.

After watching his poor devlopment (he's barely improved in 3 years), his questionable work ethic and focus, i personaly think it's more likley than he never becomes that player. I would rather take advantage of his value and cash in some big assets/better fits to build around Embiid.

Embiid has his questions also. His health is always a concern, and his maturity stil isn't where it should be for an 1# guy on a contender. But he's already an MVP calibeer player. His window to contend also could be shorter than normal, so waiting in vain to Ben to develop( while also loosing value) could be very detrimental.

So, all things considered, i would definitely trade Simmons if the package is right, but i understand it's debatable.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#70 » by VDT » Mon Jun 8, 2020 12:14 am

76ciology wrote:
VDT wrote:
76ciology wrote:
First off, because top teams are trending towards having a stretch 5 and a big PF who loves attacking the paint. If you put Embiid at Brolo and Gasol he will be pulled away from the paint.



As i said, the idea is to keep Embiid in the paint it's not to have him defend PFs. The Bucks and the Raptors are two exceptions that their star player is a PF that cant shoot (or couldnt for Siakam) while having centers that camp the 3 point line. Generally speaking Embiid will defend the opposing center. And you dont need Horford for that, last year Harris was defending Gasol without any problems.

76ciology wrote:Then on offense, have to slide Biid to PF and have Al at C so you can pull the C away from the rim and Biid won’t have a hard time going against the Baynes and the Gasol type centers in the playoffs.


Horford will not be able to pull the center away because the center will be defending Embiid and there is nothing you can do about it. The other teams are not idiots, they are not going to defend Embiid with their PFs just because you decided to slide Embiid to PF (whatever that means).

76ciology wrote:You can’t always force the opponents PF at Biid, but you increased that chance (i.e., there were possessions Siakam was on Biid in last year’s playoff) with a non dead ball situation and fast pace.


The only time something like that would happen is in transition offense and that has nothing to do with Horford. Generally speaking Embiid will be defended by centers, and as i said you cant do anything about it other that try to force a switch.


76ciology wrote:Then if you can’t force the PF on embiid, having Al always will have a smaller guy on either Ben and Tobi.


Al will be defended by the PF of the other team. Even if he is a little bit smaller than Horford you dont want to base your offense on Horford's iso game.

76ciology wrote:Having Ben against a smaller defender at the post with 4 guys spacing him actually is the most optimal set-up where you have Ben as a threat on offense and as your guy to pass the ball to the open shooter.


You can do that if he is defended by a much smaller player. Generally speaking Simmons hasnt shown the ability to exploit players in the post unless he has a huge size advantage. He hasnt been very impressive against SF sized players in the post. He lacks length, moves and touch to be a consistent threat in the post against similarly sized players.


Relax my friend.

Anyway, my point is just that having Al increases your chance and possessions of having an opponent’s PF defending Biid. Sure opponents will find ways to prevent that by all means so i dont think it will happen frequently. But having Al also allows one of Ben or Tobi to have the size advantage against opponents guards.

While opponents defense always have to scramble to get their guys on defense, which makes us a lot tougher to defend on transition. Right? Either that or they have to live with the mismatches on halfcourt.

Raps and Bucks are two teams you mentioned. And surely we tried to built a team that can beat those two teams when we tried to retool this team during the 2019 offseason. You can also consider the Lakers where AD will try to hide from Embiid so expect them to play with either McGee or D12 with AD.

Regarding Tobi against opponents centers, we got outrebounded because of that and caused us the g7 of the raps series. Then offensively, we werent able to generate favorable 1v1 situations down the stretch. Raps aren’t afraid of Embiid (see the game when Biid laid an egg against then).

Ben attacking mismatches unlocked a 20+ppg scoring Ben in the month of January. We hope that he developed into a better scorer against mismatches, which can happen more frequently with Al and Biid occupying the PF&C positions. This also improved Tobi’s opportunities on ISOs, since he’ll likely be defended by smaller guys (P.S. try to check Tobi’s real height).

Again, my idea is more theoretical than actual and I think the FO and the coaching staff of this team have the same idea with what I have.



How does having Horford means that Embiid is more likely to be defended by PFs? It doesnt make sense in my mind.

The problem with Horford is that he is a center. If you play him with Embiid and Simmons the offense become stale and the spacing atrocious. Having someone like Shake or Korkmaz in his stead gives us much better, positional and in terms of skills, balance. Better shooting, more fluid offense, less clogged paint and in the end better chemistry.


One problem with hunting matcups is that you are not going to win with Horford's iso game against teams with legitimate superstars. It is something that you can use here and there but you cant give a lot of possessions to offensively limited players like Horford. Just like the Raptors didnt try to run their offense though Gasol when we put Harris on him. A huge matchup size-wise but there was a reason we did it, it would be terrible for them to run iso plays for Gasol. Hunting matcups become even more difficult when the other team has time to prepare, like in a playoff series.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#71 » by 76ciology » Mon Jun 8, 2020 4:54 am

Spoiler:
VDT wrote:
76ciology wrote:
VDT wrote:

As i said, the idea is to keep Embiid in the paint it's not to have him defend PFs. The Bucks and the Raptors are two exceptions that their star player is a PF that cant shoot (or couldnt for Siakam) while having centers that camp the 3 point line. Generally speaking Embiid will defend the opposing center. And you dont need Horford for that, last year Harris was defending Gasol without any problems.



Horford will not be able to pull the center away because the center will be defending Embiid and there is nothing you can do about it. The other teams are not idiots, they are not going to defend Embiid with their PFs just because you decided to slide Embiid to PF (whatever that means).



The only time something like that would happen is in transition offense and that has nothing to do with Horford. Generally speaking Embiid will be defended by centers, and as i said you cant do anything about it other that try to force a switch.




Al will be defended by the PF of the other team. Even if he is a little bit smaller than Horford you dont want to base your offense on Horford's iso game.



You can do that if he is defended by a much smaller player. Generally speaking Simmons hasnt shown the ability to exploit players in the post unless he has a huge size advantage. He hasnt been very impressive against SF sized players in the post. He lacks length, moves and touch to be a consistent threat in the post against similarly sized players.


Relax my friend.

Anyway, my point is just that having Al increases your chance and possessions of having an opponent’s PF defending Biid. Sure opponents will find ways to prevent that by all means so i dont think it will happen frequently. But having Al also allows one of Ben or Tobi to have the size advantage against opponents guards.

While opponents defense always have to scramble to get their guys on defense, which makes us a lot tougher to defend on transition. Right? Either that or they have to live with the mismatches on halfcourt.

Raps and Bucks are two teams you mentioned. And surely we tried to built a team that can beat those two teams when we tried to retool this team during the 2019 offseason. You can also consider the Lakers where AD will try to hide from Embiid so expect them to play with either McGee or D12 with AD.

Regarding Tobi against opponents centers, we got outrebounded because of that and caused us the g7 of the raps series. Then offensively, we werent able to generate favorable 1v1 situations down the stretch. Raps aren’t afraid of Embiid (see the game when Biid laid an egg against then).

Ben attacking mismatches unlocked a 20+ppg scoring Ben in the month of January. We hope that he developed into a better scorer against mismatches, which can happen more frequently with Al and Biid occupying the PF&C positions. This also improved Tobi’s opportunities on ISOs, since he’ll likely be defended by smaller guys (P.S. try to check Tobi’s real height).

Again, my idea is more theoretical than actual and I think the FO and the coaching staff of this team have the same idea with what I have.



How does having Horford means that Embiid is more likely to be defended by PFs? It doesnt make sense in my mind.

The problem with Horford is that he is a center. If you play him with Embiid and Simmons the offense become stale and the spacing atrocious. Having someone like Shake or Korkmaz in his stead gives us much better, positional and in terms of skills, balance. Better shooting, more fluid offense, less clogged paint and in the end better chemistry.


One problem with hunting matcups is that you are not going to win with Horford's iso game against teams with legitimate superstars. It is something that you can use here and there but you cant give a lot of possessions to offensively limited players like Horford. Just like the Raptors didnt try to run their offense though Gasol when we put Harris on him. A huge matchup size-wise but there was a reason we did it, it would be terrible for them to run iso plays for Gasol. Hunting matcups become even more difficult when the other team has time to prepare, like in a playoff series.


I want to know what’s on your mind.

1.) Let’s say Embiid is defending Giannis while Horford is defending Brook lopez.

Milwaukee misses.

All 5 of our guys are running down the court. Ben is bringing down the ball.

Don’t you see some possessions where Giannis will be on Embiid since he is the closest guy at him while Brook lopez is not that quick enough to run to embiid?

Sure it won’t happen all the time. But what will happen all the time is when Bucks misses their shots, they will scramble to find their guys or they have to pay the mismatch. Which.. favors your transition and halfcourt offense.

2.) This set-up doesn’t rely on Horford’s iso game. Having Horford allows us to dictate the match-ups, which we can because our top guys ability to defend smaller positions.

Ben can defend PGs
Tobi can defend SGs
Biid can defend PFs (guys im not saying he will defend stretch4s, im referring to guys like Siakam and Giannis)

Horford Vs opponents center
Biid vs opponents PF
Tobias vs opponents SF
Josh Rich vs opponents SG
Ben vs opponents PG

If you watch the clips (which I’d advise you to). There is always a match-up we can take advantage when we have this 5 man unit on the court. Sometimes Giannis is on Biid, Sometimes opponents stretch 4 is on Horford, a lot of times opponents PG is on Ben and almost all times opponents SG is on Tobias.

3.) spacing
It’s really how you define Horford and Josh Rich as 3pt shooters. For me they are threats that defense can leave so they can provide spacing/gravity.

Last season when we need a 3, defense will have all their eyes on JJ. In this roster, it could be Tobi, it could be Biid, it could be horford and it could be Josh Rich.

Then if you can pull the opponents’ goalie (think Gobert) away from the rim with him defending Biid or Horford at the perimeter, you can post Ben or Tobi. This helps a lot of spacing in the paint.

The problem actually is not spacing. The problem is ability to dribble drive.

4.) this is what I and the FO have in mind with this roster and let’s just enjoy the ride.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#72 » by 76ciology » Mon Jun 8, 2020 5:07 am

elchengue20 wrote:
76ciology wrote:
Spoiler:
SparksFly87 wrote:


Would moving Embiid for a shot creater on the wing such as Tatum or Ingram increase our chances of winning a chip with our current core Simmons, Tobias, Horford and JRich ?


I really enjoyed having this on my mind.

Star players are like owning luxury cars. They’re expensive to have and they have low resale value, unless you’re lucky.

Short term, the answer is trading Ben would be more ideal. You will take a hit if you trade Biid for Tatum. Tatum doesn’t really move the needle like Biid. But the team would be a lot better if you have Tatum or Ingram instead of Ben right now IMO.

Long term, this can go the opposite way. Like if Ben ever develops and the uncertainty in Biid’s health (physcially and emotionally).

The thing is, you just cant know the future. And that’s why we’re holding to both. And that is the best recommended move IMO, for now.


It all comes to, do you think Ben is going to develop at least an average jumpshot and become a Superstar?

If you thinks that's more likely than not, i understand if you want to keep him.

After watching his poor devlopment (he's barely improved in 3 years), his questionable work ethic and focus, i personaly think it's more likley than he never becomes that player. I would rather take advantage of his value and cash in some big assets/better fits to build around Embiid.

Embiid has his questions also. His health is always a concern, and his maturity stil isn't where it should be for an 1# guy on a contender. But he's already an MVP calibeer player. His window to contend also could be shorter than normal, so waiting in vain to Ben to develop( while also loosing value) could be very detrimental.

So, all things considered, i would definitely trade Simmons if the package is right, but i understand it's debatable.


Another thing to consider is the value of centers had a steep decline in value. You just have to look around or maybe just look at the blazers roster to see how easy it is to acquire a good center.

If I’m a GM or a coach of our opponent, i can easily find multiple ways to take embiid out of the game. Either by a stretch 5 or a big who can push him out of the paint with wings to provide help side defense.

Ben is easy to take out of the game if you consider him as a forward. But if you consider him as a pure point guard, then maybe he can be a nightmare to defend.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#73 » by VDT » Mon Jun 8, 2020 1:30 pm

76ciology wrote:



I want to know what’s on your mind.

1.) Let’s say Embiid is defending Giannis while Horford is defending Brook lopez.

Milwaukee misses.

All 5 of our guys are running down the court. Ben is bringing down the ball.

Don’t you see some possessions where Giannis will be on Embiid since he is the closest guy at him while Brook lopez is not that quick enough to run to embiid?

Sure it won’t happen all the time. But what will happen all the time is when Bucks misses their shots, they will scramble to find their guys or they have to pay the mismatch. Which.. favors your transition and halfcourt offense.


Lopez camps the 3 point line, Embiid defending Giannis is in the paint, so you do the math. Lopez will be generally closer to the other half of the court and will generally be able to pick up Embiid.

In any case it is not like Embiid is some transition player, he is usually jogging to get to his position in offense and is usually the last player to get there.

Even if what you say is true, playing Horford doesnt help with that.You can put someone else on Lopez (Simmons/Harris) and still have Embiid on Giannis.


76ciology wrote:2.) This set-up doesn’t rely on Horford’s iso game. Having Horford allows us to dictate the match-ups, which we can because our top guys ability to defend smaller positions.

Ben can defend PGs
Tobi can defend SGs
Biid can defend PFs (guys im not saying he will defend stretch4s, im referring to guys like Siakam and Giannis)

Horford Vs opponents center
Biid vs opponents PF
Tobias vs opponents SF
Josh Rich vs opponents SG
Ben vs opponents PG

If you watch the clips (which I’d advise you to). There is always a match-up we can take advantage when we have this 5 man unit on the court. Sometimes Giannis is on Biid, Sometimes opponents stretch 4 is on Horford, a lot of times opponents PG is on Ben and almost all times opponents SG is on Tobias.




What players can defend one position down? Not Harris and not Embiid. Embiid guarding Giannis or Siakam is the exception because they couldnt shoot and Embiid could stay in the paint. He was not really defending them, he was defending an area (paint). You cant put him on most other PFs because they will pull him outside and have him chasing them in the three point line. Harris defending SGs is a joke. He cant stay in front of the athletic ones and he cant chase around shooters like Reddick.

You can have a size advantage, but if the player is not able to exploit it you dont really have any advantage. Which is why we put Harris on Gasol and the Raptors couldnt do anything about it. The other team can put a smaller player on Horford but it will not be wise to give him a lot of possessions.


76ciology wrote:3.) spacing
It’s really how you define Horford and Josh Rich as 3pt shooters. For me they are threats that defense can leave so they can provide spacing/gravity.

Last season when we need a 3, defense will have all their eyes on JJ. In this roster, it could be Tobi, it could be Biid, it could be horford and it could be Josh Rich.

Then if you can pull the opponents’ goalie (think Gobert) away from the rim with him defending Biid or Horford at the perimeter, you can post Ben or Tobi. This helps a lot of spacing in the paint.

The problem actually is not spacing. The problem is ability to dribble drive.


Horford, Embiid and RIchardson are mediocre shooters. Embiid and Hordord have a very slow release which is perhaps as important of a trait as their percentage. Harris was a better shooter for a couple of year before he came here but he is not particularly stellar since he came here.

More importantly all three of Embiid, Harris and Richardson are not really willing 3 point shooters, that's not their game. This means that the starting lineup will be shooting a small amount of 3s at mediocre percentages.

You can try and put Embiid at the three point line as they tried to do, however:

1. For most of his time in the league he was not a good enough shooter to require guarding him closely. In general you would prefer having him shoot a semi contested 3 than anything else. This doesnt provide much spacing.
2. It is a gross mishandling of resources to have your best player, on max contract standing at the three point line as a center.
3. It kills chemistry. Star players dont accept such marginalization especially when they are the best player on the team.

Off the dribble creation is a of course an issue, and it shouldnt be after all these high lottery picks and millions spend on max contracts.

Which is why people want Hordord to come off the bench. The starting lineup desperately needs more 3 point shooting and creation off the dribble. Replacing Horford with a perimeter player looks like a no brainer to me.
76ciology wrote:4.) this is what I and the FO have in mind with this roster and let’s just enjoy the ride.


I dont think the FO has anything particular in mind at this point as they look clueless.

For sure they are not planning to continuing doing what you are suggesting as they made it clear that Horford will come off the bench.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#74 » by 76ciology » Mon Jun 8, 2020 4:35 pm

Spoiler:
[gfycat][/gfycat]
VDT wrote:
76ciology wrote:



I want to know what’s on your mind.

1.) Let’s say Embiid is defending Giannis while Horford is defending Brook lopez.

Milwaukee misses.

All 5 of our guys are running down the court. Ben is bringing down the ball.

Don’t you see some possessions where Giannis will be on Embiid since he is the closest guy at him while Brook lopez is not that quick enough to run to embiid?

Sure it won’t happen all the time. But what will happen all the time is when Bucks misses their shots, they will scramble to find their guys or they have to pay the mismatch. Which.. favors your transition and halfcourt offense.


Lopez camps the 3 point line, Embiid defending Giannis is in the paint, so you do the math. Lopez will be generally closer to the other half of the court and will generally be able to pick up Embiid.

In any case it is not like Embiid is some transition player, he is usually jogging to get to his position in offense and is usually the last player to get there.

Even if what you say is true, playing Horford doesnt help with that.You can put someone else on Lopez (Simmons/Harris) and still have Embiid on Giannis.


76ciology wrote:2.) This set-up doesn’t rely on Horford’s iso game. Having Horford allows us to dictate the match-ups, which we can because our top guys ability to defend smaller positions.

Ben can defend PGs
Tobi can defend SGs
Biid can defend PFs (guys im not saying he will defend stretch4s, im referring to guys like Siakam and Giannis)

Horford Vs opponents center
Biid vs opponents PF
Tobias vs opponents SF
Josh Rich vs opponents SG
Ben vs opponents PG

If you watch the clips (which I’d advise you to). There is always a match-up we can take advantage when we have this 5 man unit on the court. Sometimes Giannis is on Biid, Sometimes opponents stretch 4 is on Horford, a lot of times opponents PG is on Ben and almost all times opponents SG is on Tobias.




What players can defend one position down? Not Harris and not Embiid. Embiid guarding Giannis or Siakam is the exception because they couldnt shoot and Embiid could stay in the paint. He was not really defending them, he was defending an area (paint). You cant put him on most other PFs because they will pull him outside and have him chasing them in the three point line. Harris defending SGs is a joke. He cant stay in front of the athletic ones and he cant chase around shooters like Reddick.

You can have a size advantage, but if the player is not able to exploit it you dont really have any advantage. Which is why we put Harris on Gasol and the Raptors couldnt do anything about it. The other team can put a smaller player on Horford but it will not be wise to give him a lot of possessions.


76ciology wrote:3.) spacing
It’s really how you define Horford and Josh Rich as 3pt shooters. For me they are threats that defense can leave so they can provide spacing/gravity.

Last season when we need a 3, defense will have all their eyes on JJ. In this roster, it could be Tobi, it could be Biid, it could be horford and it could be Josh Rich.

Then if you can pull the opponents’ goalie (think Gobert) away from the rim with him defending Biid or Horford at the perimeter, you can post Ben or Tobi. This helps a lot of spacing in the paint.

The problem actually is not spacing. The problem is ability to dribble drive.


Horford, Embiid and RIchardson are mediocre shooters. Embiid and Hordord have a very slow release which is perhaps as important of a trait as their percentage. Harris was a better shooter for a couple of year before he came here but he is not particularly stellar since he came here.

More importantly all three of Embiid, Harris and Richardson are not really willing 3 point shooters, that's not their game. This means that the starting lineup will be shooting a small amount of 3s at mediocre percentages.

You can try and put Embiid at the three point line as they tried to do, however:

1. For most of his time in the league he was not a good enough shooter to require guarding him closely. In general you would prefer having him shoot a semi contested 3 than anything else. This doesnt provide much spacing.
2. It is a gross mishandling of resources to have your best player, on max contract standing at the three point line as a center.
3. It kills chemistry. Star players dont accept such marginalization especially when they are the best player on the team.

Off the dribble creation is a of course an issue, and it shouldnt be after all these high lottery picks and millions spend on max contracts.

Which is why people want Hordord to come off the bench. The starting lineup desperately needs more 3 point shooting and creation off the dribble. Replacing Horford with a perimeter player looks like a no brainer to me.
76ciology wrote:4.) this is what I and the FO have in mind with this roster and let’s just enjoy the ride.


I dont think the FO has anything particular in mind at this point as they look clueless.

For sure they are not planning to continuing doing what you are suggesting as they made it clear that Horford will come off the bench.


Watch this

Read on Twitter


Anyway, let’s see. Im open to all views
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#75 » by elchengue20 » Mon Jun 8, 2020 8:04 pm

Those are transition baskets, sure, we can defend very well and we can be good in transition. Simmons is an elite defender and transition palyer.

That's great but you won't get far if you halfcourt game is a mess. We simply don't have enough shotcreators, 1vs1 scorers and shooters. We don't even have great slashers, i think Ben is the only one. Hunting mistmaches and playing bullyball is a viable option, but you can't rely a lot on that. It' can't be your go to plan in the halfcourt.

Maybe you can lack in some of those areas and figure it out, but if your are lacking in all of them, you are in a problem.

If you want Ben at PG, as the 1# option generating matchups problems because of his size, then you are going to significatively misuse Embiid, he's going to basically become an stretch 5. The only way Ben can score is close to the basket, he needs spacing. He won't be that big of a matchup problem if the opposing defense can pack the paint.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#76 » by 76ciology » Tue Jun 9, 2020 4:43 am

Spoiler:
elchengue20 wrote:Those are transition baskets, sure, we can defend very well and we can be good in transition. Simmons is an elite defender and transition palyer.

That's great but you won't get far if you halfcourt game is a mess. We simply don't have enough shotcreators, 1vs1 scorers and shooters. We don't even have great slashers, i think Ben is the only one. Hunting mistmaches and playing bullyball is a viable option, but you can't rely a lot on that. It' can't be your go to plan in the halfcourt.

Maybe you can lack in some of those areas and figure it out, but if your are lacking in all of them, you are in a problem.

If you want Ben at PG, as the 1# option generating matchups problems because of his size, then you are going to significatively misuse Embiid, he's going to basically become an stretch 5. The only way Ben can score is close to the basket, he needs spacing. He won't be that big of a matchup problem if the opposing defense can pack the paint.


“We’re only good in transition”. Bullyball, hunting mismatch and neutralizing mismatch is made for halfcourt offense and in the playoffs. And nobody is saying we’re going to play bullyball for all possessions.


We make more 3s and shoot better 3s than the best team in the league (lakers). We’re even better 3pt shooting team than the Hawks, who have a heavy 3pt shooting offense.

Lack of 1v1 scorers? Like I said, we now have multiple options with the star caliber players who have size advantage in multiple positions. Its not like Jimmy or Jj were good 1v1 scorers, actually if you think of it we just got better a lot in this regard. And the whole premise of building this roster in the 2019 offseason was to improve a lot in this department because we lack go to guys in crunch time. ..and we’re not getting a guy like Harden in our lifetime. So we better wake up from this fantasy of “star PG”, this is as good as it gets on having 1v1 scorers.

“Significantly misuses Biid”. Personally if winning means Biid bringing down the ball and playing PG, I’ll let him do that. I’m all for the team and I don’t care about a player’s ego. I also find Biid to be a lot better when he is at the perimeter and his shots are falling (game 3 raps series and Christmas game 2019 against the Bucks). Im not saying Biid should jack up 3s like BroLo, he should still have the right balance in his offense.

Im not a fan of Ben. But I believe the best set-up on offense is Ben collapsing the defense and kicking out to the open guys. Again, I’m not saying we should have this for all possessions but just increase this frequency will do.


You may say “why does it sound so good but we were still losing”

Remember 538 had us as the favorite to win it this season? We were actually playing a high level to start the season. We looked like a contender at home. A finals favorite when we beat the Lakers without Biid and the Bucks at Christmas.

But Biid went thru the motions, our guys got injured then we added 2-3 guys in the deadline, Milton emerges and we never really had time to gel.

Instead of making snap evaluation of our team, try to look at it on detail. It’s not as bad as it looks
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#77 » by Zumramania » Wed Jun 10, 2020 6:45 pm

Considering that this years' Sixers are among the all time NBA worst teams considering their home-away win percentage differential: https://hoopshype.com/2020/03/03/philadelphia-76ers-home-away-standings-2019-20/ (interestingly there are quite a few Sixer teams on this list but they are all from the 50s), there has to be something which was off, something that goes beyond player qualities or roster fit.
This was a cause for concern for me and I doubted they could just turn the switch on in playoffs. However, since there will be no fans, they won't travel and they had time to recover, maybe they will eventually find their mojo?
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#78 » by elchengue20 » Thu Jun 11, 2020 7:13 am

That's a good question.

The impact of the neutral court is an enigma for every team, even more for us with our weird home/away record.

I don't know if it will be good for us, because we won't have to play on the road anymore, or very bad, because we won't play at home nomore.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#79 » by Mik317 » Thu Jun 11, 2020 12:42 pm

this could be a WIN/WIN or a LOSE/LOSE

either we win it all or we lose and blow up the FO

Or we go far enough to save the FO or the "different times" is a good enough excuse to save them.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#80 » by 76ciology » Thu Jun 11, 2020 5:42 pm

Post ups
12.6 possessions most in the league (Around 40% more frequent than the second highest, the Lakers)
1.00 points per possession highest in the league

In comparison Rox Isolation is 1.04 ppp, twice the volume though.

Something to think about? Post up numbers could have been higher if Embiid didnt miss games.
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