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Championship hopes

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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#81 » by 76ciology » Thu Jun 11, 2020 6:35 pm

Read on Twitter


Another reason for the Al Horford signing. Brolo may fall in the same category with Gasol and Baynes as “embiid stopper”.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#82 » by 76ciology » Thu Jun 11, 2020 6:36 pm

76ciology wrote:
Read on Twitter


Another reason for the Al Horford signing. Brolo may fall in the same category with Gasol and Baynes as “embiid stopper”.


Read on Twitter
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#83 » by youngcrev » Thu Jun 11, 2020 7:11 pm

76ciology wrote:
76ciology wrote:
Read on Twitter


Another reason for the Al Horford signing. Brolo may fall in the same category with Gasol and Baynes as “embiid stopper”.


Read on Twitter


Embiid has also scored more points on BroLo than any other player during the same span, so there's that
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#84 » by 76ciology » Thu Jun 11, 2020 7:19 pm

I just checked the clip of the latest Bucks vs Sixers game.

One thing that’s very interesting is Bucks had Wesley Matthews on Horford on defense, these neutralize the match-up edge with Al that Ive been talking about

Brolo also sags a lot off Embiid. This leads to having both Giannis and Brolo in the paint for great rim protection set-up.

So unless Biid shoots 3s above his average, it’s going to be a long night for us on offense
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#85 » by 76ciology » Thu Jun 11, 2020 7:34 pm

Spoiler:
youngcrev wrote:
76ciology wrote:
76ciology wrote:
Read on Twitter


Another reason for the Al Horford signing. Brolo may fall in the same category with Gasol and Baynes as “embiid stopper”.


Read on Twitter


Embiid has also scored more points on BroLo than any other player during the same span, so there's that


Kind of reminds me of Ben Simmons defense on Kawhi. But we’re now on the opposite end of the table defending our guy on offense.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#86 » by youngcrev » Thu Jun 11, 2020 8:28 pm

76ciology wrote:
Spoiler:
youngcrev wrote:
76ciology wrote:
Read on Twitter


Embiid has also scored more points on BroLo than any other player during the same span, so there's that


Kind of reminds me of Ben Simmons defense on Kawhi. But we’re now on the opposite end of the table defending our guy on offense.


I just think it's a bit faulty to think of Lopez as an Embiid stopper on their part when he's scoring as much as he has just because his FG% isn't great against him.

He fits the mold guys that Jo can't just physically dominate, but at the same time, it's not a matchup I'm too worried about.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#87 » by kuclas » Fri Jun 12, 2020 2:31 am

76ciology wrote:I just checked the clip of the latest Bucks vs Sixers game.

One thing that’s very interesting is Bucks had Wesley Matthews on Horford on defense, these neutralize the match-up edge with Al that Ive been talking about

Brolo also sags a lot off Embiid. This leads to having both Giannis and Brolo in the paint for great rim protection set-up.

So unless Biid shoots 3s above his average, it’s going to be a long night for us on offense


That’s the bucks defensive game plan against all nba teams. Lopez in the middle with Giannis sagging in as help defender. It’s been well documented how bucks play defense.

Doesn’t really matter. Embiid just need to stick to the game plan. Punish lopez by backing him down and causing foul trouble to Lopez. But Embiid loses interest and starts jacking up shots especially bad mid range 18 footer. Stupid shots. That’s why the shooting percentage is low. Bad shot selection.

Let’s be honest. B Lopez can’t guard Embiid without help. And bucks certainly do not want to put Giannis on Embiid without help. That’s why they signed robin Lopez as more insurance.

But Embiid is out of shape/disinterested. Honestly I’d rather Embiid go 100% at 28-30 min a game. Than huffing and puffing at the 34-36 min mark. He can hurt the team
When he’s jacking up shots to save energy.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#88 » by kuclas » Fri Jun 12, 2020 2:37 am

76ciology wrote:
elchengue20 wrote:
76ciology wrote:
Spoiler:


I really enjoyed having this on my mind.

Star players are like owning luxury cars. They’re expensive to have and they have low resale value, unless you’re lucky.

Short term, the answer is trading Ben would be more ideal. You will take a hit if you trade Biid for Tatum. Tatum doesn’t really move the needle like Biid. But the team would be a lot better if you have Tatum or Ingram instead of Ben right now IMO.

Long term, this can go the opposite way. Like if Ben ever develops and the uncertainty in Biid’s health (physcially and emotionally).

The thing is, you just cant know the future. And that’s why we’re holding to both. And that is the best recommended move IMO, for now.


It all comes to, do you think Ben is going to develop at least an average jumpshot and become a Superstar?

If you thinks that's more likely than not, i understand if you want to keep him.

After watching his poor devlopment (he's barely improved in 3 years), his questionable work ethic and focus, i personaly think it's more likley than he never becomes that player. I would rather take advantage of his value and cash in some big assets/better fits to build around Embiid.

Embiid has his questions also. His health is always a concern, and his maturity stil isn't where it should be for an 1# guy on a contender. But he's already an MVP calibeer player. His window to contend also could be shorter than normal, so waiting in vain to Ben to develop( while also loosing value) could be very detrimental.

So, all things considered, i would definitely trade Simmons if the package is right, but i understand it's debatable.


Another thing to consider is the value of centers had a steep decline in value. You just have to look around or maybe just look at the blazers roster to see how easy it is to acquire a good center.

If I’m a GM or a coach of our opponent, i can easily find multiple ways to take embiid out of the game. Either by a stretch 5 or a big who can push him out of the paint with wings to provide help side defense.

Ben is easy to take out of the game if you consider him as a forward. But if you consider him as a pure point guard, then maybe he can be a nightmare to defend.


Embiid can’t really be guarded 1:1 especially when he gets down low. Like within 5 feet of the basket. The issue like you said is the help defense. A combination of Ben not being able to shoot helps a ton for the defense. Look at how Toronto defends Embiid. Outside of 10 feet. Gasol is 1:1. Moving his arms whatever. But when Embiid starts to back down gasol. Help/cheat defenders comes. It’s effective because the help defense know 1. Embiid has tunnel vision at times. 2. The cheat help defender is usually the one guarding Ben Simmons. So it’s ok to leave Simmons and help on Embiid.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#89 » by 76ciology » Fri Jun 12, 2020 4:49 am

kuclas wrote:
76ciology wrote:
elchengue20 wrote:
It all comes to, do you think Ben is going to develop at least an average jumpshot and become a Superstar?

If you thinks that's more likely than not, i understand if you want to keep him.

After watching his poor devlopment (he's barely improved in 3 years), his questionable work ethic and focus, i personaly think it's more likley than he never becomes that player. I would rather take advantage of his value and cash in some big assets/better fits to build around Embiid.

Embiid has his questions also. His health is always a concern, and his maturity stil isn't where it should be for an 1# guy on a contender. But he's already an MVP calibeer player. His window to contend also could be shorter than normal, so waiting in vain to Ben to develop( while also loosing value) could be very detrimental.

So, all things considered, i would definitely trade Simmons if the package is right, but i understand it's debatable.


Another thing to consider is the value of centers had a steep decline in value. You just have to look around or maybe just look at the blazers roster to see how easy it is to acquire a good center.

If I’m a GM or a coach of our opponent, i can easily find multiple ways to take embiid out of the game. Either by a stretch 5 or a big who can push him out of the paint with wings to provide help side defense.

Ben is easy to take out of the game if you consider him as a forward. But if you consider him as a pure point guard, then maybe he can be a nightmare to defend.


Embiid can’t really be guarded 1:1 especially when he gets down low. Like within 5 feet of the basket. The issue like you said is the help defense. A combination of Ben not being able to shoot helps a ton for the defense. Look at how Toronto defends Embiid. Outside of 10 feet. Gasol is 1:1. Moving his arms whatever. But when Embiid starts to back down gasol. Help/cheat defenders comes. It’s effective because the help defense know 1. Embiid has tunnel vision at times. 2. The cheat help defender is usually the one guarding Ben Simmons. So it’s ok to leave Simmons and help on Embiid.


The thing is there are guys in the league that Biid can’t back down unto 5 feet from the basket while also have the length to challenge his shots, guys like Gasol and Brolo are examples. I dont think he is ever as dominant down low like a prime shaq that he can do that and we wouldnt want that for the game has changed that it’s better to be as versatile and be very mobile like Embiid.

Then you can’t not factor in the help defense because that is always there since there are always more than 1 defenders on the court and it’s more difficult when he has to play with Ben.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#90 » by Sixerscan » Sat Jun 13, 2020 4:16 am

Bucks have had the #1 defense in the NBA the last two years. Lopez isn't an "Embiid stopper" but they do a great job as a team on everyone.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#91 » by 76ciology » Sat Jun 13, 2020 5:53 am

Sixerscan wrote:Bucks have had the #1 defense in the NBA the last two years. Lopez isn't an "Embiid stopper" but they do a great job as a team on everyone.


Possibly.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#92 » by 76ciology » Sat Jun 13, 2020 5:58 am

One way to counter having both Brolo and Giannis sagging off their man is by putting both Biid and Ben on opposite sides and let them set screen for offball shooter or ball handler.

Clips used to run a similar set with Blake-DeAndre/Cp3-Billups.




You can also run a PnR on the strongside then have an offball action
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#93 » by thenbaman » Tue Jun 16, 2020 2:51 pm

The only one that can stop Embiid is Embiid....
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#94 » by 76ciology » Tue Jun 16, 2020 4:00 pm

thenbaman wrote:The only one that can stop Embiid is Embiid....


5th law of nature
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#95 » by 76ciology » Thu Jun 18, 2020 5:51 pm

Read on Twitter
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#96 » by elchengue20 » Thu Jun 18, 2020 7:12 pm

And what did they say? I won't pay to read the Athletic.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#97 » by youngcrev » Thu Jun 18, 2020 7:22 pm

They give a nuanced opinion thats not easily summarized and has no definitive answer
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#98 » by elchengue20 » Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:45 pm

In my opinion, the issue is we don't have enough spacing so, with better preparation for games in the Playoffs, he gets doubled more easily. Having an good shotcreator/playmaker in the halfcourt also could help a lot.

The other issue, is that he isn't mature enough and tends to dissapear a bit in big games. Plus, we have his conditiong issues. He runs out of gas in games when he plays a lot of minutes.

The only problem we can directly solve( and is the bigger problem imo) is the spacing/shotcreator one. The rest is all on him, i think he will figure it out sooner than later.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#99 » by ExplosionsInDaSky » Fri Jun 19, 2020 12:28 am

thenbaman wrote:The only one that can stop Embiid is Embiid....


Yes, this...He's his biggest opponent. Embiid can be an MVP multiple times in this league if he truly wants to. Injuries and the turmoils of being a mid 20s young man are his biggest obstacles.
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Re: Championship hopes 

Post#100 » by Mik317 » Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:07 pm

Joel also falls in love with fishing for fouls and in the playoffs the refs swallow their whistles a lot. This often throws off his game a lot.

Harden has similar issues and thus is often dead tired from having to actually score a ton with a lot of effort.
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