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Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason

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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1721 » by DCasey91 » Sun Apr 25, 2021 12:20 am

Wait CJ ain’t risky imo. His scoring has well translated for years now. Right age bracket, his defense is poor but we have the defense good and proper anyway.

Jalen Green (Garland but I prefer Green)
Beal
CJ

Pick one push the chips and go for it (Wasted 2020, and this year, that’s two years of Embiid’s peak wasted already).

Derozan maybe (Should we have gone for him this year?.)
Ingram is a maybe (no playoff history either).
Lavine no (zero playoff history worse than CJ/Beal).

treat the team as having two rolling centers, everyone on the court must be a dynamic/shooter/scorer/playmaker

Ben has worse Shaq range, so he’s a big man on offense because he is one.
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1722 » by DCasey91 » Sun Apr 25, 2021 12:21 am

the_process wrote:
ProcessDoctor wrote:Harris + Hill + Maxey + FRP for CJ + Covington would be interesting. Is CJ a clear #2 scoring threat in the playoffs though?


Simmons(14)/Milton(24)/Curry(10)
McCollum(34)/Curry(14)
Green(28)/Thybulle(20)
Covington(28)/Simmons(20)
Embiid(32)/Howard(16)


Just make it Thybulle and Harris for Covington and McCollum. I think that's a good deal for both sides.


Yep that’s the super obvious one (plus a late first) if Beal was not on the table.

Jalen Green is very enticing though.
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1723 » by ProcessDoctor » Sun Apr 25, 2021 2:02 pm

DCasey91 wrote:Wait CJ ain’t risky imo. His scoring has well translated for years now. Right age bracket, his defense is poor but we have the defense good and proper anyway.

Jalen Green (Garland but I prefer Green)
Beal
CJ

Pick one push the chips and go for it (Wasted 2020, and this year, that’s two years of Embiid’s peak wasted already).

Derozan maybe (Should we have gone for him this year?.)
Ingram is a maybe (no playoff history either).
Lavine no (zero playoff history worse than CJ/Beal).

treat the team as having two rolling centers, everyone on the court must be a dynamic/shooter/scorer/playmaker

Ben has worse Shaq range, so he’s a big man on offense because he is one.


I'm not sure I like swapping Thybulle for Covington because of the differences in age and contract. Tisse is just as effective of a defender and much younger and cheaper.

Ideally, if you can turn Tobias into one of Beal or LaVine you do it. What would it take to get Beal without Simmons? A 3rd team and LOTS of picks. There would only be less than a handful of teams interested in Tobias. Maybe Golden State, Dallas, and Sacramento?

LaVine is much more "gettable" IMO. Acquiring him along with Thad for Tobias would be an easy yes. LaVine would only look better here.

CHI out: LaVine, Young
CHI in: Wiggins, Maxey, 2021 GSW FRP, 2021 MIN SRP, 2023 PHI FRP, 2024 & 2026 PHI FRP swaps

GSW out: Wiggins, 2021 FRP, 2021 MIN SRP
GSW in: Harris

PHI out: Harris, Maxey, 2023 FRP, 2024 & 2026 FRP swaps
PHI in: LaVine, Young


Simmons(14)/Milton(20)/Curry(14)
LaVine(34)/Curry(10)/Thybulle(4)
Green(28)/Thybulle(20)
Young(28)/Simmons(20)
Embiid(32)/Howard(16)


Simmons/Milton/FA
LaVine/Curry/Joe
Green/Thybulle/FA
Young/1st/FA
Embiid/Howard/NYK 2nd
2020-2021 Philadelphia 76ers:

Simmons/Hill/Maxey
Curry/Milton/Korkmaz
Green/Thybulle/Joe
Harris/Scott/Tolliver
Embiid/Howard/Reed
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1724 » by DCasey91 » Sun Apr 25, 2021 2:31 pm

Thing is I’m not buying on Lavine atm (Ingram is the more enticing one if it’s for a younger player) CJ I like because of experience. I may come around to Lavine in the future.

I like Thybulle, but if it’s for CJ and Covington I’d do it. Thing I like about Covington is he bombs threes for fun and is an excellent rebounder for his size. Less offset needed with him on court on the offensive end vs Thybulle. Thybulle needs an effiency monster beside him (Durant/Roberson) Embiid isn’t near Durant lvl offense.

Embiid is the leader let’s make a core triple threat that matches super well together
Embiid/CJ/Simmons has so much balance to it.

Alternatively there’s Beal as always but in a way whatever happens in the off season I’m sure Morey would know what is needed and will do the trade anyway.

Harden was never going to happen, and Lowry costs too much/would have shot us in the foot next year for a less than 50% chance this year. Lowry is great but it’s a bigger risk that eers on the side of a no.
At 20mil would be touch and go. I think it’s the signal for the all in move in the off-season. Which is understandable just wish it began last off-season (When Lavine/Markannen/Ball/NAW/Garland were all pennies to a dime) so essentially a year behind where it should be. It goes without saying but if you like a young player get them before the inevitable breakout or worst yet they get better by just playing more time on the court lol.

Very surprised we didn’t inquire about Derozan more.
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1725 » by DCasey91 » Sun Apr 25, 2021 2:52 pm



This is a young lad I’m buying for sure. Only 16 mins a night with a logjam of 3 ahead, can’t wait to see what he’ll be two years from now.

Hunter
Goga
Simons
NAW
Bamba
Nowell

Are my breakout canditates for next year. Every year it happens, just wished we would pounce on the young undervalued stuff more often it’s a goldmine for value.
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1726 » by phillynative » Mon Apr 26, 2021 8:25 pm

DCasey91 wrote:

This is a young lad I’m buying for sure. Only 16 mins a night with a logjam of 3 ahead, can’t wait to see what he’ll be two years from now.

Hunter
Goga
Simons
NAW
Bamba
Nowell

Are my breakout canditates for next year. Every year it happens, just wished we would pounce on the young undervalued stuff more often it’s a goldmine for value.


Would you trade thybulle for one of those guys?
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1727 » by DCasey91 » Mon Apr 26, 2021 8:49 pm

phillynative wrote:
DCasey91 wrote:

This is a young lad I’m buying for sure. Only 16 mins a night with a logjam of 3 ahead, can’t wait to see what he’ll be two years from now.

Hunter
Goga
Simons
NAW
Bamba
Nowell

Are my breakout canditates for next year. Every year it happens, just wished we would pounce on the young undervalued stuff more often it’s a goldmine for value.


Would you trade thybulle for one of those guys?


I actually think Thybulle is our most valuable young piece outside of Ben. A lot of interest around trade deadline from other teams, only gotten better (more-so recognized, he’s been the best perimeter defender this year just needs a Durant/Doncic type beside him we don’t have that).

initially I would but now I’d look to have him in a bigger package. Beal/Ingram/Brown (If Celtics implode who knows :))
CJ fits the archetype player and Roco coming back
For Harris/Thybulle and a pick seems reasonable.

I’m more looking at Maxey/Milton/Curry. I just think Goga is more a need for us and the talent/skill level is a wash anyway. Can easily play starter minutes (which would happen with Embiid playing 70% reg games). I think we have to make a direct decision on those three, who do you want to keep next year? Sorta deal. It’s just too much overlap between the three and also Hill can play a similar role. That makes four.

Probably only need two plus whatever is at the end of the list.

Like Goga for Maxey or Milton I’d be okay with. We have Curry/Hill plus the youngster leftover. We are going to need to sign a big men this off-season anyway, might as well get a young talented/underutilized one.

Hoping in the off-season there’s one “big” move and one little move to sure up the list biggest needs (Backup Center is definitely on the priority list).

Salary wise overall we are pushing up literal sh*t uphill excuse my French lol.

126 mill on the books without Howard/Green/Korkmaz so that’s three depth/starter pieces gone.

Joe most likely will get moved for a future pick/trade package too which sucks because he can shoot the cover off it.

One of Ben or Harris is most likely get moved it just holds up so much flexibility.

Hill (Expiring non full guarantee and Curry’s contract) can bring in returns if moved.

A lot of championship teams have won not just from a team building front, their 2/3 wheel or sometimes in Curry/Pippen’s case was way unders.
It’s harder for Non FA teams to build chip winning roster unless it’s organically through the draft/trade (Like we did). Masai approach when the table is set is something we actually did with Butler.

The upside is you have a legit shot, the downside is they may not resign and you loose assets.
(I have a sneaky suspicion Butler wanted his own team and the management at the 76s would have been alarm bells ringing, he’s seen it before at the Bulls/Wolves, he was dead right).

Try and find the medium (2-3 years left on a great contract). Jaylen Brown fits right in that wheelhouse.
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1728 » by DCasey91 » Mon Apr 26, 2021 9:15 pm

For me Embiid would pair much better with a scoring wing and a shooting/Playmaking PG, then cover it with 2x Rocos.

So Vanvleet/Ingram or Brown is what I’m looking at for the build around. From a draft point Ingram was better for us.

We are not streamlined enough for modern NBA. Having basically two centers and a slow PF doesn’t work. PF spot is dying out (Replaced with a dynamic wing type makes sense, the 3ball has always been super threatening, even a decade ago (120 & 130 attempts in the finals 11’).

Give the Big Man acres of space with 3 ball gunners at volume and a scoring wing is a huge challenge for anyone.

Or get on the bandwagon that I’ve been on for ages and get Jalen Green and we’ll be fine lol.
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1729 » by 76ciology » Tue Apr 27, 2021 8:05 am

DCasey91 wrote:For me Embiid would pair much better with a scoring wing and a shooting/Playmaking PG, then cover it with 2x Rocos.

So Vanvleet/Ingram or Brown is what I’m looking at for the build around. From a draft point Ingram was better for us.

We are not streamlined enough for modern NBA. Having basically two centers and a slow PF doesn’t work. PF spot is dying out (Replaced with a dynamic wing type makes sense, the 3ball has always been super threatening, even a decade ago (120 & 130 attempts in the finals 11’).

Give the Big Man acres of space with 3 ball gunners at volume and a scoring wing is a huge challenge for anyone.

Or get on the bandwagon that I’ve been on for ages and get Jalen Green and we’ll be fine lol.


My ideal set-up for Biid.

3 combo guards who can score
1 3&D wing or a star wing (could be a SG like Thybulle or a star wing like Kawhi)
Biid

You’re looking at an early prototype with our current roster.

What this team lack is a good combo guard. Someone better than Seth, Shake or 35 year old George Hill.

I find that the current trend of the league is having a couple of good combo guards starting for their team. I think with Embiid’s size and what he can do, you can add another one and have the edge over any team.

You possibly can start with a couple of combo guard in your backcourt. A 3&D wing at 3 and another 3&D wing or star wing at PF. This is the more stable approach in a starting unit.

Then you end the game with 3 combo guards with a 3&D wing or a star wing at PF.

Until then, you’ll always experience this Clunky initial action then just dumping the ball to embiid to bail out every possession. With a 2-3 combo guards, your initial action on offense will be a lot better and you’d rely less on Embiid bailing you out.

Defensively, if you do it right, you may not even experience a step down on defense. Look at how good the Raps is on defense where they can use the speed of FVV and Lowry to rotate on defense.

Whats not much talked about on defense is the quality of shot from the first x seconds to the last x seconds of a possession.

If you can generate a good shot quicker than your opponent on more of the possessions, you already have a leg up.

You maybe smaller. But you double, and rotate on defense, let your opponent take that shot with the clock winding down. Then still have a Thybulle or Embiid being able to protect the rim.
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1730 » by eyeatoma » Tue Apr 27, 2021 8:08 am

76ciology wrote:

Months ago i proposed a Love+Garland for Tobi+Shake.

I’d still do this deal.

I believe Love and Garland are two great fits for Ben and Biid.

Love can play the Dario Saric archetype that Ben loves. Someone to jack up 3s with reckless abandon to bail him out whenver he drives.

Garland is the Jj/Jimmy archetype that compliments Biid well.



Definitely not giving up Tobi for Garland. Garland is good, but not that good yet. Love is also always injured. LOL like wtf, you can probably get CJ for Tobi, why would you want Garland. Yeah he's younger, but definietley not giving Shake also for that package, yuck.
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1731 » by 76ciology » Tue Apr 27, 2021 8:15 am

eyeatoma wrote:
76ciology wrote:

Months ago i proposed a Love+Garland for Tobi+Shake.

I’d still do this deal.

I believe Love and Garland are two great fits for Ben and Biid.

Love can play the Dario Saric archetype that Ben loves. Someone to jack up 3s with reckless abandon to bail him out whenver he drives.

Garland is the Jj/Jimmy archetype that compliments Biid well.



Definitely not giving up Tobi for Garland. Garland is good, but not that good yet. Love is also always injured. LOL like wtf, you can probably get CJ for Tobi, why would you want Garland. Yeah he's younger, but definietley not giving Shake also for that package, yuck.


Except you can’t.

Because having a couple of combo guards have been the foundation of the Blazers. They’re not going to sacrifice for our benefit.

Dame fits better with CJ than Tobi. The foundation on Blazers offense is CJ and Dame initiating actions on opposite sides of the court similar to CP3 and Billups back then when both played for the Clips (weakside and strongside) then they dump to Melo as pressure release valve. It doesnt make sense for them to upgrade a pressure release valve and downgrade for a foundational piece.

Can Tobi breakdown the defense like CJ? If he can, then we wouldnt be trading him for CJ.
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1732 » by eyeatoma » Tue Apr 27, 2021 9:16 am

76ciology wrote:
eyeatoma wrote:
76ciology wrote:

Months ago i proposed a Love+Garland for Tobi+Shake.

I’d still do this deal.

I believe Love and Garland are two great fits for Ben and Biid.

Love can play the Dario Saric archetype that Ben loves. Someone to jack up 3s with reckless abandon to bail him out whenver he drives.

Garland is the Jj/Jimmy archetype that compliments Biid well.



Definitely not giving up Tobi for Garland. Garland is good, but not that good yet. Love is also always injured. LOL like wtf, you can probably get CJ for Tobi, why would you want Garland. Yeah he's younger, but definietley not giving Shake also for that package, yuck.


Except you can’t.

Because having a couple of combo guards have been the foundation of the Blazers. They’re not going to sacrifice for our benefit.

Dame fits better with CJ than Tobi. The foundation on Blazers offense is CJ and Dame initiating actions on opposite sides of the court similar to CP3 and Billups back then when both played for the Clips (weakside and strongside) then they dump to Melo as pressure release valve. It doesnt make sense for them to upgrade a pressure release valve and downgrade for a foundational piece.

Can Tobi breakdown the defense like CJ? If he can, then we wouldnt be trading him for CJ.


They need a quality Powerforward, hence Tobi for CJ.
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1733 » by eyeatoma » Tue Apr 27, 2021 10:34 am

Another reason I don't want Love.

Read on Twitter
?s=19

He pulled something else with Sexton in his rookies year. Not a great leader.

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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1734 » by 76ciology » Tue Apr 27, 2021 10:35 am

eyeatoma wrote:
76ciology wrote:
eyeatoma wrote:

Definitely not giving up Tobi for Garland. Garland is good, but not that good yet. Love is also always injured. LOL like wtf, you can probably get CJ for Tobi, why would you want Garland. Yeah he's younger, but definietley not giving Shake also for that package, yuck.


Except you can’t.

Because having a couple of combo guards have been the foundation of the Blazers. They’re not going to sacrifice for our benefit.

Dame fits better with CJ than Tobi. The foundation on Blazers offense is CJ and Dame initiating actions on opposite sides of the court similar to CP3 and Billups back then when both played for the Clips (weakside and strongside) then they dump to Melo as pressure release valve. It doesnt make sense for them to upgrade a pressure release valve and downgrade for a foundational piece.

Can Tobi breakdown the defense like CJ? If he can, then we wouldnt be trading him for CJ.


They need a quality Powerforward, hence Tobi for CJ.


Roco is starting for them at PF. They already overpaid for him.

Having Tobi would clog the PF position with Tobi, Roco and Melo all playing PF.

They need CJ over Tobi. And they wont make a for them to take a step back and for us to make a step forward.
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1735 » by eyeatoma » Tue Apr 27, 2021 10:36 am

This too

Read on Twitter
?s=19

No to Kevin Love.

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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1736 » by eyeatoma » Tue Apr 27, 2021 10:38 am

76ciology wrote:
eyeatoma wrote:
76ciology wrote:
Except you can’t.

Because having a couple of combo guards have been the foundation of the Blazers. They’re not going to sacrifice for our benefit.

Dame fits better with CJ than Tobi. The foundation on Blazers offense is CJ and Dame initiating actions on opposite sides of the court similar to CP3 and Billups back then when both played for the Clips (weakside and strongside) then they dump to Melo as pressure release valve. It doesnt make sense for them to upgrade a pressure release valve and downgrade for a foundational piece.

Can Tobi breakdown the defense like CJ? If he can, then we wouldnt be trading him for CJ.


They need a quality Powerforward, hence Tobi for CJ.


Roco is starting for them at PF. They already overpaid for him.

Having Tobi would clog the PF position with Tobi, Roco and Melo all playing PF.

They need CJ over Tobi. And they wont make a for them to take a step back and for us to make a step forward.
I guarantee they are not prioritizing Melo if they are going to trade CJ. Roco can play the 3 just fine.

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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1737 » by youngcrev » Tue Apr 27, 2021 12:54 pm

76ciology wrote:
eyeatoma wrote:
76ciology wrote:

Months ago i proposed a Love+Garland for Tobi+Shake.

I’d still do this deal.

I believe Love and Garland are two great fits for Ben and Biid.

Love can play the Dario Saric archetype that Ben loves. Someone to jack up 3s with reckless abandon to bail him out whenver he drives.

Garland is the Jj/Jimmy archetype that compliments Biid well.



Definitely not giving up Tobi for Garland. Garland is good, but not that good yet. Love is also always injured. LOL like wtf, you can probably get CJ for Tobi, why would you want Garland. Yeah he's younger, but definietley not giving Shake also for that package, yuck.


Except you can’t.

Because having a couple of combo guards have been the foundation of the Blazers. They’re not going to sacrifice for our benefit.

Dame fits better with CJ than Tobi. The foundation on Blazers offense is CJ and Dame initiating actions on opposite sides of the court similar to CP3 and Billups back then when both played for the Clips (weakside and strongside) then they dump to Melo as pressure release valve. It doesnt make sense for them to upgrade a pressure release valve and downgrade for a foundational piece.

Can Tobi breakdown the defense like CJ? If he can, then we wouldnt be trading him for CJ.


CP3-Billups? I had to hit basketball reference because I didn't remember Chauncey ever playing for them. And for good reason, because it was a 42 game stretch over 2 years.

Dame-CJ has always been an a double edged sword for the Blazers. Great offensive duo, but you just give away too much defensively, to the point that they end up overpaying for defensive wings that bring nothing on the other end (Covington, Jones Jr, Aminu, Harkless, ect). They're one of the worst defensive teams in basketball this year (they were last year as well).

I'm not saying Tobias would necessarily be the answer for them or that the offer would be on the table either way, but I think a lineup of Dame-Powell-Cov-Harris-Nurk would be considerably more balanced than what they have now.
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1738 » by eyeatoma » Tue Apr 27, 2021 1:33 pm

youngcrev wrote:
76ciology wrote:
eyeatoma wrote:

Definitely not giving up Tobi for Garland. Garland is good, but not that good yet. Love is also always injured. LOL like wtf, you can probably get CJ for Tobi, why would you want Garland. Yeah he's younger, but definietley not giving Shake also for that package, yuck.


Except you can’t.

Because having a couple of combo guards have been the foundation of the Blazers. They’re not going to sacrifice for our benefit.

Dame fits better with CJ than Tobi. The foundation on Blazers offense is CJ and Dame initiating actions on opposite sides of the court similar to CP3 and Billups back then when both played for the Clips (weakside and strongside) then they dump to Melo as pressure release valve. It doesnt make sense for them to upgrade a pressure release valve and downgrade for a foundational piece.

Can Tobi breakdown the defense like CJ? If he can, then we wouldnt be trading him for CJ.


CP3-Billups? I had to hit basketball reference because I didn't remember Chauncey ever playing for them. And for good reason, because it was a 42 game stretch over 2 years.

Dame-CJ has always been an a double edged sword for the Blazers. Great offensive duo, but you just give away too much defensively, to the point that they end up overpaying for defensive wings that bring nothing on the other end (Covington, Jones Jr, Aminu, Harkless, ect). They're one of the worst defensive teams in basketball this year (they were last year as well).

I'm not saying Tobias would necessarily be the answer for them or that the offer would be on the table either way, but I think a lineup of Dame-Powell-Cov-Harris-Nurk would be considerably more balanced than what they have now.


Yup, Powell was turning into an elite SG in Toronto. They already have a new premiere SG if McCollum leaves. Not saying Powell will be as good as McCollum, but he was shooting insane numbers for close to 3-4 months, and has some talent.
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1739 » by davesilver » Tue Apr 27, 2021 2:15 pm

Absolutely see a Tobias <-> CJ trade coming this offseason
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Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason 

Post#1740 » by 76ciology » Tue Apr 27, 2021 2:19 pm

Maybe you guys are right. Im staying open minded.

But I just can’t see Blazers breaking up the CJ-Dame duo for Tobias. If Blazers can get Kawhi, maybe. But definitely not for Tobias.

CJ-Dame duo is not perfect. Yes, its a double edged sword but its been proven that it’s positives outweigh its negatives. It has been successful and a lot of teams are copying their blueprint.

Because this kind of set-up gives you optimal offense in today’s NBA where you have superior perimeter scoring, superior spacing and dual playmakers who can breakdown the defense on either the strong and weak side of the court.

This kind of set-up also allows you to play “moneyball” on other positions where you can just simply get 3&D wings and dime a dozen defensive bigs. Then you can just run 1-4 or 1-5 PnR on both sides on offense. Another team that is doing great with this set-up is the Jazz.

No, I dont see the Blazers giving up CJ for Tobi, even if we add a couple of first rounders.

Tobi is a pressure release valve scorer, like Norman Powell. Third option at best. You can’t give the ball to Norman Powell and expect him to breakdown the defense, unlike what you can see with CJ or Dame.

CJ is a secondary option scorer. Something both Sixers and Blazers need.

Again, if you think Tobi can replace CJ’s role with the Blazers, then why do we have to trade Tobi for CJ? If you think Norman Powell can replace CJ, then why not go after Norman Powell? I find bias playing its role. But then I might be wrong.
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