Neither Harris or Love can defend, so you might as well take the better shooter and better rebounder and that's Kevin.
Garland is a tiny shotcreater that we can use in the short term and, like you said, flip down the line.
Between Garland, Maxey and our eventual signing of Austin Rivers, we'd have a small handful of guys that can get buckets in the halfcourt in their sleep (albeit while being a bunch of defensive zeroes in the process, though).
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:28 pm
by the_process
76ciology wrote:Cavs: Tobias Harris Korkmaz Milton - Tobias is a younger replacement for Love - Cavs doesnt care about cap because nobody would wanf to sign there - Milton replaces Garland as a shooter to play with Sexton - Milton is no slouch. 15ppg 47FG% 40 3pt% and 85FT% in the playoffs. - Korkmaz is Lord Korkmaz. He should not be disrespected.
Reason: - love’s contract is one year shorter garland can be a valuable trade chip for rebuilding team - Love can space the floor - Love prevents PFs defending Ben, because Love can post smaller players with .94ppp on post ups. - Garland and Seth can play the JJ role
Sixers starting 5 Seth Green Ben Love Biid
^ that looks like a starting 5 analytics would love
Cavs would want all the 1sts to make that trade
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:40 pm
by Jkam31
the_process wrote:
76ciology wrote:I’d do a Hield for Tobi straight up.
The catch? They absorb Tobi’s extra millions with their cap.
I could be wrong but that cap space can be another $10m trade exemption that we can use
For the kings, this solves their log jam at the G position with bogdan and haliburton
Sign me up! But I do not see any way the Kings do that without multiple draft picks coming back to them.
We wouldn’t do it with multiple picks coming
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:07 am
by Dnt hate
76ciology wrote:Ive been doing Tobi to Bobcats. Believing that Bobcats is one of those franchise who’d gladly overpay (salary) for Tobi. They just did it with Hayward.
We should definitely keep Tobias 1 more year and see how he does with Doc, if he plays how he did with the Clippers we have a great shot at a ring
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:28 am
by 76ciology
Kobblehead wrote:I would do that deal, pretty easily.
Neither Harris or Love can defend, so you might as well take the better shooter and better rebounder and that's Kevin.
Garland is a tiny shotcreater that we can use in the short term and, like you said, flip down the line.
Between Garland, Maxey and our eventual signing of Austin Rivers, we'd have a small handful of guys that can get buckets in the halfcourt in their sleep (albeit while being a bunch of defensive zeroes in the process, though).
What I like about Love over Harris is Love can punish SFs compared to Tobi.
If opponents has to put their PFs on Love then Love can step out, you take away the PF who can help their C protect the rim.
It’s like having Al but the difference is Love is a way better shooter and much better in attacking close outs. Love can also is reliable to get you 20-30pts where as Al is living in his natural habitat of 12-15ppg.
The contracts are almost the same. But Tobi is a year younger. You see the Bobcats (Cavs on the same tier) wouldnt mind overpaying Hayward to stay relevant.
Let’s be honest, Love is only good for like 2 more seasons. And this is where Garland for Milton trade comes in to compensate for it. And we’ll never know, Milton may even end up being a better player than Garland.
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Mon Nov 23, 2020 7:51 pm
by Olabikkel
Should we trade khorkmaz and Scott for bjelica? Bjelica is a little bit better than Scott i think. Would sacramento agree? Maybe even give us 2nd rnd pick?
Bjelica and korkmaz are not yet guaranteed for this season. It would create another roster spot.
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2020 2:44 pm
by Kobblehead
With how much the league overrates shooting, I'd imagine the Kings would get a better return for Bjelica if they shopped him around. They would have to be unusually high on Korkmaz.
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2020 1:48 am
by Arsenal
Kings trade: SG Buddy Hield, F Harrison Barnes
Sixers trade: F Tobias Harris, SG Seth Curry
Kings get rid of a malcontent and get back a steady 20ppg scorer at PF, plus a replacement shooter who'll be ok coming off the bench.
Sixers move on from Tobias and get a sniper who'll hold up better as a starter, and a replacement forward.
Total money is very similar over the next several years.
Sixers lineup: PG Hield SG Green SF Simmons PF Barnes CE Embiid
Kings lineup: PG Fox SG Halliburton SF Bogi PF Harris CE Bagley
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2020 8:09 am
by 76ciology
The only Hield trade I’m going to consider is Tobi for Hield then Kings has to absorb the extra 10m difference in Tobi’s contract. I’ll maybe add Furk in there just to make it easier for them to swallow.
Cavs: Danny Green (15M expiring) 8m trade exemption Terrance Ferguson (4M expiring) Mike Scort (5m expiring) Tony Bradley (3.7M expiring) Shake Milton
Why? 35M worth of cap space to compensate for any value loss between Garland and Milton
Kings: Tobias Harris 2039 and 2041 2nd rounders
Why? Hield wants to go. ...to Sixers
Sixers: Buddy Hield Kevin Love (1 year shorter than Tobi’s contract) Darius Garland Jabari Parker (7m expiring)
Sixers Starting 5: Seth Curry (one of the top shooters in the league) Buddy Hield (19ppg) Ben Simmons (17ppg) Kevin Love (17ppg) Joel Embiid (20+ppg) ^ starting 5 that can score and shoot. Love is a great fit with Ben, it forces defenders to put the smaller forward on Ben given Love’s size.
Back-up Maxey Gardland Korkmaz Thybulle D12
Reason: Arguably a more talented team short term.
Definitely a more promising team long term. You have two promising bets for a third star between Maxey and Garland.
Short term cap relief, by Jabari’s expiring.
Then long term cap relief with Tobi’s contract shorter than Love’s. I believe we’ll have a ton of cap during the offseason when Love’s contract expires (same year with Biid’s).
*i think Garland and Sexton are interchangeable
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2020 6:10 pm
by ProcessDoctor
I’d take on Barnes if it meant offloading Harris. Harris/Scott/Ferguson for Hield/Barnes.
Ugly thing is Tobias is owed $146M the next 4 years.
Combine Hield and Barnes only owed $145M next 4 years, and only $21M to Hield in year 4 with Barnes off the books, meanwhile $39M to Tobias that same year.
I think we need to face facts that Tobias isn't going anywhere any time soon. NOBODY wants that contract. It's TURRIBLE.
Hield and Barnes for Tobias, every pick swap, use full TPE from Horford trade, 3 future 1sts from Sixers is still a good deal for Philly.
ProcessDoctor wrote:I’d take on Barnes if it meant offloading Harris. Harris/Scott/Ferguson for Hield/Barnes.
Cavs: Danny Green (15M expiring) 8m trade exemption Terrance Ferguson (4M expiring) Mike Scort (5m expiring) Tony Bradley (3.7M expiring) Shake Milton
Why? 35M worth of cap space to compensate for any value loss between Garland and Milton
Kings: Tobias Harris 2039 and 2041 2nd rounders
Why? Hield wants to go. ...to Sixers
Sixers: Buddy Hield Kevin Love (1 year shorter than Tobi’s contract) Darius Garland Jabari Parker (7m expiring)
Sixers Starting 5: Seth Curry (one of the top shooters in the league) Buddy Hield (19ppg) Ben Simmons (17ppg) Kevin Love (17ppg) Joel Embiid (20+ppg) ^ starting 5 that can score and shoot. Love is a great fit with Ben, it forces defenders to put the smaller forward on Ben given Love’s size.
Back-up Maxey Gardland Korkmaz Thybulle D12
Reason: Arguably a more talented team short term.
Definitely a more promising team long term. You have two promising bets for a third star between Maxey and Garland.
Short term cap relief, by Jabari’s expiring.
Then long term cap relief with Tobi’s contract shorter than Love’s. I believe we’ll have a ton of cap during the offseason when Love’s contract expires (same year with Biid’s).
*i think Garland and Sexton are interchangeable
I think you ventured too far into spacing and too far away from defense. That said, I think many would agree with you and I know I'm in the minority there.
I'm just trying to look at it through the lens of a playoff series: 1. Who scores in the halfcourt (Maxey, Garland) <-- the right skillsets, but a lot of youth, inexperienced 2. Who can be targeted and exploited <-- he whole team except for Simmons, Thybulle. we won't get any stops
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Thu Nov 26, 2020 6:05 am
by 76ciology
Kings: Tobias Harris
Why: Hield wants out and has no position with Haliburton’s addition. Tobi is better than Hield on ISO (1.3ppp in the playoffs; and less liable on defense)
Fox-Haliburton-Tobi-Bjelica-Whiteside is a good starting unit
Bobcats: Buddy Hield Jabari Parker (7m expiring)
Why: Solves the clog at PG. Tobi and Hayward gives them shooting and scoring, good for a mediocre team.
Parker’s expiring gives you short term cap relief while Hield’s contract value decreases.
Lamelo-Graham-Hayward-Tobi-Center - pick and roll from your guards, 18-20ppg scoring from wing, just need a cheap C who can defend
Cavs: 28M expiring (Tyler Zeller, Tony Bradley, Mike Scott and Ferguson) 8m trade exemption from Al Trade Shake Milton 2021 Sixers 1st Round Pick
Why: - Cap Relief for the Cavs (they could do what Presti has done by absorbing salaries in exchange for picks; basically im saying that the cap relief they received is equivalent to a first round pick). For instance, Cavs can absorb John Wall’s contract for a future first round pick - Milton can both play with Sexton and Okoro - worse talent short term, better for tanking. - sexton and milton sounds good. And they’re a better pairing given Milton has superior length than Garland, this allows Sexton to continue playing PG. - they got a first round pick from sixers
Sexton Milton Okoro Larry Nance Drummond
Sixers: Kevin Love (expires same year with Biid; 1 year shorter than Tobi) Terry Rozier (2 year contract) Darius Garland
Sixers Starting 5: Seth Green Ben Love Biid ^ still have this very promising starting unit
Bench: Rozier Garland Korkmaz Maxey Thybulle D12 ^ Rozier, Garland and Korkmaz can get you good scoring in short bursts then Thybulle and D12 can be good defensive impact guys on short spurts
Why: - Seth, Rozier, Maxey and Garland gives you 4 options for your “perimeter shot creator”. - Kevin love is a really good fit with Biid and Ben. Maybe better than Tobi. - cap? Green’s expiring year 1. Rozier’s expiring year 2. Love’s expiring year 3. - Better team short term, better team long term and better contract situation.
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Thu Nov 26, 2020 6:26 am
by 76ciology
Kobblehead wrote:
76ciology wrote:
Spoiler:
Cavs: Danny Green (15M expiring) 8m trade exemption Terrance Ferguson (4M expiring) Mike Scort (5m expiring) Tony Bradley (3.7M expiring) Shake Milton
Why? 35M worth of cap space to compensate for any value loss between Garland and Milton
Kings: Tobias Harris 2039 and 2041 2nd rounders
Why? Hield wants to go. ...to Sixers
Sixers: Buddy Hield Kevin Love (1 year shorter than Tobi’s contract) Darius Garland Jabari Parker (7m expiring)
Sixers Starting 5: Seth Curry (one of the top shooters in the league) Buddy Hield (19ppg) Ben Simmons (17ppg) Kevin Love (17ppg) Joel Embiid (20+ppg) ^ starting 5 that can score and shoot. Love is a great fit with Ben, it forces defenders to put the smaller forward on Ben given Love’s size.
Back-up Maxey Gardland Korkmaz Thybulle D12
Reason: Arguably a more talented team short term.
Definitely a more promising team long term. You have two promising bets for a third star between Maxey and Garland.
Short term cap relief, by Jabari’s expiring.
Then long term cap relief with Tobi’s contract shorter than Love’s. I believe we’ll have a ton of cap during the offseason when Love’s contract expires (same year with Biid’s).
*i think Garland and Sexton are interchangeable
I think you ventured too far into spacing and too far away from defense. That said, I think many would agree with you and I know I'm in the minority there.
I'm just trying to look at it through the lens of a playoff series: 1. Who scores in the halfcourt (Maxey, Garland) <-- the right skillsets, but a lot of youth, inexperienced 2. Who can be targeted and exploited <-- he whole team except for Simmons, Thybulle. we won't get any stops
Look at my latest trade proposal where I address this issue by not trading Green while adding Rozier.
You can then play Rozier or Seth, depending on the match-up. Just as some match-up works well with DHO and some don’t. When it doesnt then you can run Rozier at the PG position. Maybe he can run a PnR with Biid or Ben.
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Thu Nov 26, 2020 8:52 am
by UptownPhilly
PHL & DC - Albatross for an Albatross + Beal
PHL Out:
Tobias Green Curry Scott Ferguson Bradley
Why? Massive boost for us in talent. Beal is the reason for the deal. No idea what Wall has left, but if he has something left, he could prove to be valuable. His contract is ugly, but it’s one year less than Harris. We’d need to sign a bunch of min guys to fill out our roster.
Why? The Wizards shed somewhere in the range of 25M in cap space to get out of Wall’s deal and go into full rebuild mode.
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Thu Nov 26, 2020 8:57 am
by 76ciology
Spoiler:
76ciology wrote:Kings: Tobias Harris
Why: Hield wants out and has no position with Haliburton’s addition. Tobi is better than Hield on ISO (1.3ppp in the playoffs; and less liable on defense)
Fox-Haliburton-Tobi-Bjelica-Whiteside is a good starting unit
Bobcats: Buddy Hield Jabari Parker (7m expiring)
Why: Solves the clog at PG. Tobi and Hayward gives them shooting and scoring, good for a mediocre team.
Parker’s expiring gives you short term cap relief while Hield’s contract value decreases.
Lamelo-Graham-Hayward-Tobi-Center - pick and roll from your guards, 18-20ppg scoring from wing, just need a cheap C who can defend
Cavs: 28M expiring (Tyler Zeller, Tony Bradley, Mike Scott and Ferguson) 8m trade exemption from Al Trade Shake Milton 2021 Sixers 1st Round Pick
Why: - Cap Relief for the Cavs (they could do what Presti has done by absorbing salaries in exchange for picks; basically im saying that the cap relief they received is equivalent to a first round pick). For instance, Cavs can absorb John Wall’s contract for a future first round pick - Milton can both play with Sexton and Okoro - worse talent short term, better for tanking. - sexton and milton sounds good. And they’re a better pairing given Milton has superior length than Garland, this allows Sexton to continue playing PG. - they got a first round pick from sixers
Sexton Milton Okoro Larry Nance Drummond
Sixers: Kevin Love (expires same year with Biid; 1 year shorter than Tobi) Terry Rozier (2 year contract) Darius Garland
Sixers Starting 5: Seth Green Ben Love Biid ^ still have this very promising starting unit
Bench: Rozier Garland Korkmaz Maxey Thybulle D12 ^ Rozier, Garland and Korkmaz can get you good scoring in short bursts then Thybulle and D12 can be good defensive impact guys on short spurts
Why: - Seth, Rozier, Maxey and Garland gives you 4 options for your “perimeter shot creator”. - Kevin love is a really good fit with Biid and Ben. Maybe better than Tobi. - cap? Green’s expiring year 1. Rozier’s expiring year 2. Love’s expiring year 3. - Better team short term, better team long term and better contract situation.
Possibly..
Kings: Tobias Harris
Bobcats: Hield Jabari Parker
Sixers: Garland Love Rozier
Wizards: 28M expiring 8m trade exemption - get John wall off their salary cap
Cavs: John Wall Milton Sixers 2021 1st Round Pick Wizards 2021 1st Round Pick - john wall and love’s salary expires the same duration. - john wall sells way more ticket than love
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Thu Nov 26, 2020 9:04 am
by 76ciology
UptownPhilly wrote:PHL & DC - Albatross for an Albatross + Beal
PHL Out:
Tobias Green Curry Scott Ferguson Bradley
Why? Massive boost for us in talent. Beal is the reason for the deal. No idea what Wall has left, but if he has something left, he could prove to be valuable. His contract is ugly, but it’s one year less than Harris. We’d need to sign a bunch of min guys to fill out our roster.
Why? The Wizards shed somewhere in the range of 25M in cap space to get out of Wall’s deal and go into full rebuild mode.
You have to repackage tobi.
Kings: Tobias Harris
Bobcats: Buddy Hield and Jabari
Wizards: Rozier 30M of expiring (Green, Zeller and Tony Bradley) 8M of trade exemption - 40M cap relief in year 1 with additional 20M cap relief in year 2
Sixers: Wall Beal
*I dont see us or wizards doing the deal. But this is how you get it done
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Thu Nov 26, 2020 2:14 pm
by Kobblehead
I like Rozier's skillset a lot, but he obviously is a headcase.
I view Garland as being in the same spectrum as Maxey. Halfcourt scoring bench player that I want to eventually trade, as opposed to build with.
Re: Fantasy Trade Thread: 2020 Offseason
Posted: Thu Nov 26, 2020 2:16 pm
by Kobblehead
I'm uncomfortable with parting with any more draft capital. Especially after the Horford dump and the Curry acquisition. We lost a future first and a current 2nd rounder with those moves.