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2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft

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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#401 » by Kobblehead » Sat May 15, 2021 7:51 pm

Spencer Dinwiddie and Jordan Clarkson are better and more useful than everyone taken in the lottery that year outside of Joel Embiid and all the sudden Julian Randle.

Seems like the most consistent trait for finding useful NBA players in the draft is to identify the best creators.

Like the Coby Whites of the world.
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#402 » by DCasey91 » Sat May 15, 2021 10:51 pm

the_process wrote:Is there any kind of a feel yet for who will be available at 28?


I think it’s going to be traded most likely. If it was closer to 20 I wouldn’t and take a free swing or trade up. But 28 is such a bad spot imo. Good chance all the potential creators/scorers will be gone by then.
This draft is deep with prospects but the quality after about the top 5 (not draft position just prospects) is lacking.
A lot of mid 35-50 ranked types have had great years and planting themselves as firm 1st rounders.

Duarte might me the most realistic one and that won’t be a guarantee either. Wouldn’t surprise me that all the ones and others have listed that we like are gone before 25.

On average there’s about 10 or so NBA established players each draft. Stars/MVPs it’s a small number to hit out of 60 each time. Some drafts have a lot of depth not much high end, other drafts have high end not much depth, super drafts have both. Goes by year.

Busts get drafted too early, quality prospects get drafted late.

In the coming years it’ll get harder with high school kids coming in so they’ll be much more variance thus on the flip side way way more potential value.

This draft is okay as comparisons go.
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#403 » by LloydFree » Sat May 15, 2021 11:41 pm

Kobblehead wrote:Spencer Dinwiddie and Jordan Clarkson are better and more useful than everyone taken in the lottery that year outside of Joel Embiid and all the sudden Julian Randle.

Seems like the most consistent trait for finding useful NBA players in the draft is to identify the best creators.

Like the Coby Whites of the world.

LOL

Kobblehead wrote:Clarkson would go top 10 in a 2014 re-draft.

1. Joel Embiid
2. Nikola Jokic
3. Julius Randle
4. Zach Lavine
5. Jeremi Grant
6. Aaron Gordon
7. Clint Capella
8. Brogdan Bogdonavic
9. Jusuf Nurkic
10. Marcus Smart
11. TJ Warren
12. Joe Harris

In a re-draft Jordan Clarkson wouldn't even be picked in the top 12, and that's excluding Spencer Dinwiddie and who's hurt and Andrew Wiggins, who if contracts weren't a factor would go before him too.

And of that top 12, maybe 3 of them could fall into your gold standard archetype of "perimeter creator".
Fischella wrote:I think none of you guys that are pro-Embiid no how basketball works today.. is way easier to win it all with Omer Asik than Olajuwon.
Actually if you ask me which Center I want for my perfect championship caliber team, I will chose Asik hands down
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#404 » by Kobblehead » Sat May 15, 2021 11:51 pm

LloydFree wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:Spencer Dinwiddie and Jordan Clarkson are better and more useful than everyone taken in the lottery that year outside of Joel Embiid and all the sudden Julian Randle.

Seems like the most consistent trait for finding useful NBA players in the draft is to identify the best creators.

Like the Coby Whites of the world.

LOL

Kobblehead wrote:Clarkson would go top 10 in a 2014 re-draft.

1. Joel Embiid
2. Nikola Jokic
3. Julius Randle
4. Zach Lavine
5. Jeremi Grant
6. Aaron Gordon
7. Clint Capella
8. Brogdan Bogdonavic
9. Jusuf Nurkic
10. Marcus Smart
11. TJ Warren
12. Joe Harris

In a re-draft Jordan Clarkson wouldn't even be picked in the top 12, and that's excluding Spencer Dinwiddie and who's hurt and Andrew Wiggins, who if contracts weren't a factor would go before him too.

And of that top 12, maybe 3 of them could fall into your gold standard archetype of "perimeter creator".


Terrible list.

Aaron Gordon and Jeremi Grant are trash players that cannot defend or score off the dribble.
Marcus Smart is a doofus defensive guard with no offensive game. That's like saying Kris Dunn would still go top 10 in a re-draft of 2016.
T.J. Warren is trash.
Joe Harris...lmao you're trolling

Joel Embiid
Nikola Jokic
Zach Lavine
Julius Randle
Jordan Clarkson
Spencer Dinwiddie

Only acceptable top 6.
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#405 » by Kobblehead » Sun May 16, 2021 12:05 am

DCasey91 wrote:Good chance all the potential creators/scorers will be gone by then.

So many fans/scouts/gms still overrating skinny bigs that can't defend, athletes with no game, and shooting specialists.

Look at some of the guys with creating upside still on the board at #28 and all of round 2 last year:

- Jaden McDaniels
- Malachi Flynn
- Tyrell Terry
- Tre Jones
- Theo Maledon
- Saben Lee
- CJ Elleby
- Nico Mannion
- Skylar Mays
- Grant Riller
- Devon Dotson

No reason to sell the pick if there are no takers for a trade up. There's going to be a creator on the board.
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#406 » by LloydFree » Sun May 16, 2021 12:16 am

Kobblehead wrote:
LloydFree wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:Spencer Dinwiddie and Jordan Clarkson are better and more useful than everyone taken in the lottery that year outside of Joel Embiid and all the sudden Julian Randle.

Seems like the most consistent trait for finding useful NBA players in the draft is to identify the best creators.

Like the Coby Whites of the world.

LOL

Kobblehead wrote:Clarkson would go top 10 in a 2014 re-draft.

1. Joel Embiid
2. Nikola Jokic
3. Julius Randle
4. Zach Lavine
5. Jeremi Grant
6. Aaron Gordon
7. Clint Capella
8. Brogdan Bogdonavic
9. Jusuf Nurkic
10. Marcus Smart
11. TJ Warren
12. Joe Harris

In a re-draft Jordan Clarkson wouldn't even be picked in the top 12, and that's excluding Spencer Dinwiddie and who's hurt and Andrew Wiggins, who if contracts weren't a factor would go before him too.

And of that top 12, maybe 3 of them could fall into your gold standard archetype of "perimeter creator".


Terrible list.

Aaron Gordon and Jeremi Grant are trash players that cannot defend or score off the dribble.
Marcus Smart is a doofus defensive guard with no offensive game. That's like saying Kris Dunn would still go top 10 in a re-draft of 2016.
T.J. Warren is trash.
Joe Harris...lmao you're trolling...

Well, either you don't know what you're talking about or Jordan Clarkson has the worst agent in the history of the world. Because somehow he managed to command less money than all of them and play himself into being nothing more than a bench scorer off the bench after 6 years in the NBA.

There's not one (non-injured) player on that list that another GM would trade in order to get Jordan 'friggin' Clarkson.
Fischella wrote:I think none of you guys that are pro-Embiid no how basketball works today.. is way easier to win it all with Omer Asik than Olajuwon.
Actually if you ask me which Center I want for my perfect championship caliber team, I will chose Asik hands down
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#407 » by Kobblehead » Sun May 16, 2021 12:23 am

No way you're serious saying Joe Harris would go top 10 in a re-draft over Jordan Clarkson. Bruh.

1. Evan Mobley
2. Corey Kispert
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#408 » by DCasey91 » Sun May 16, 2021 1:03 am

Kobblehead wrote:
DCasey91 wrote:Good chance all the potential creators/scorers will be gone by then.

So many fans/scouts/gms still overrating skinny bigs that can't defend, athletes with no game, and shooting specialists.

Look at some of the guys with creating upside still on the board at #28 and all of round 2 last year:

- Jaden McDaniels
- Malachi Flynn
- Tyrell Terry
- Tre Jones
- Theo Maledon
- Saben Lee
- CJ Elleby
- Nico Mannion
- Skylar Mays
- Grant Riller
- Devon Dotson

No reason to sell the pick if there are no takers for a trade up. There's going to be a creator on the board.



Yeah I just think the pick is ending up going in a trade package. The later year picks id hold onto with younger kids entering. More boom/bust types but you get earlier looks at potential studs. Years to come I’m betting studs will come from picks later then 10 imo.
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#409 » by Kobblehead » Sun May 16, 2021 1:35 pm

I think it's important to be bringing these players into the program now and starting the clock on getting them to the magic mid-20s age when they start to figure out how to win. We lost so many years by wasting picks on non-creators and we've been in playoff limbo because of it. Maxey was a good start. Need to follow that up with another 19-20 year old creator in this draft.

A 19 year old in the 2023 draft isn't going to help Joel Embiid win a championship during our run. The 19 year old from 2020 and 2021 have a much better chance to, timeline-wise.
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#410 » by Kobblehead » Sun May 16, 2021 3:53 pm

It sucks that Davion Mitchell's stock skyrocketed. He'd be the perfect late first selection for us.
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#411 » by Foshan » Mon May 17, 2021 4:44 am

So let's say i haven't looked at the draft class much... and i'm unrealistically optimistic that our current young guys (Maxey / Shake / Joe / Reed) could actually be effective off the bench in the future... I would maybe be looking to take a flyer on a 3rd string C to learn from Dwight (who we resign to a one year deal)...

Who could we get at 28? or look later? or no one worth looking at in this draft? It seems like there is usually some big that drops that is waaaaay better than their draft position (and several bigs that are taken waaay to high)
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#412 » by Monix » Mon May 17, 2021 11:10 am

Foshan wrote:So let's say i haven't looked at the draft class much... and i'm unrealistically optimistic that our current young guys (Maxey / Shake / Joe / Reed) could actually be effective off the bench in the future... I would maybe be looking to take a flyer on a 3rd string C to learn from Dwight (who we resign to a one year deal)...

Who could we get at 28? or look later? or no one worth looking at in this draft? It seems like there is usually some big that drops that is waaaaay better than their draft position (and several bigs that are taken waaay to high)

I like Charles Bassey as a C option in the mid-second.

He was a high ranked HS prospect, missed a year with an injury - potential to be a defensive anchor, rim protector with some offensive upside (took two 3s/gm this year and decent FT shooter)
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#413 » by Monix » Mon May 17, 2021 8:42 pm

I would also have interest in Yves Pons as an UDFA on a 2-way deal - send him to Delaware and develop him as a switchy rim-defender lob guy.

His only NBA position is C but he's a freak athlete and may have the bulk to pull it off...an uber-athletic Chuck Hayes?
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#414 » by Negrodamus » Mon May 17, 2021 9:07 pm

Makur Maker is worth a look. Has a nice looking jumper and is pretty fluid for someone his size. Former 5 star recruit who has his season cut short at Howard. I know the Maker's have not quite panned out in the NBA, but I think he's an interesting second rounder.
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#415 » by Kobblehead » Mon May 17, 2021 9:49 pm

Foshan wrote:So let's say i haven't looked at the draft class much... and i'm unrealistically optimistic that our current young guys (Maxey / Shake / Joe / Reed) could actually be effective off the bench in the future... I would maybe be looking to take a flyer on a 3rd string C to learn from Dwight (who we resign to a one year deal)...

Who could we get at 28? or look later? or no one worth looking at in this draft? It seems like there is usually some big that drops that is waaaaay better than their draft position (and several bigs that are taken waaay to high)

Day'Ron Sharpe

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/dayron-sharpe-1.html

Sharpe is elite on the glass and the most switch versatile big in the class. He's equally comfortable defending in space as he is in the post. And unlike most bigs that can defend in space, he actually has legit C size (he's not a skinny SF-weighted C like many).

Offensively, there's a lot of work to be done. But he's a plug and play backup C, given his rebounding and defense.
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#416 » by Monix » Tue May 18, 2021 12:54 am

Jay Huff as a stretch-5 to open up the paint when Embiid is off the floor?

Obviously a 2nd rounder or UDFA
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#417 » by Negrodamus » Tue May 18, 2021 12:56 am

Monix wrote:Jay Huff as a stretch-5 to open up the paint when Embiid is off the floor?

Obviously a 2nd rounder or UDFA


He's a great option that will probably be in the league a long time, imo. Good call, forgot about him.
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#418 » by Negrodamus » Tue May 18, 2021 2:18 pm

Lol, Cats get Sahvir Wheeler. What a garbage pickup. Cal must have been desperate.
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#419 » by Kobblehead » Tue May 18, 2021 10:28 pm

Negrodamus wrote:Lol, Cats get Sahvir Wheeler. What a garbage pickup. Cal must have been desperate.

On a positive spin, Wheeler was arguably the top penetrating guard in the conference last year. So even though he's tiny ad can't shoot, you can have faith in him torching dudes off the dribble and taking it to the rack, fearlessly.

Don't understand why Cal didn't go all-in on Remy Martin, though. Self landed him in Kansas.
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Re: 2020-2021 College Basketball / NBA Draft 

Post#420 » by Kobblehead » Tue May 18, 2021 10:32 pm

Kentucky really needs Devin Askew to make a huge leap in year 2.

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