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The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread

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The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#1 » by TTP » Sat Oct 23, 2021 2:34 am

Seems as good a time as any to get this one going. Post your criticisms here.

I don’t think he’ll actually get fired because of his contract. However, it’s worth mentioning that he was hired before Morey, so you’ve got to wonder if you can solve two problems at once by firing Doc and making Ben happy enough to play.

The lack of the challenge was terrible. Furkan getting only 20 minutes is inexcusable, especially when Maxey got 36. Isaiah Joe needs more than 4 minutes too. Just an all around garbage job tonight.
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#2 » by the_process » Sat Oct 23, 2021 2:41 am

TTP wrote:Seems as good a time as any to get this one going. Post your criticisms here.

I don’t think he’ll actually get fired because of his contract. However, it’s worth mentioning that he was hired before Morey, so you’ve got to wonder if you can solve two problems at once by firing Doc and making Ben happy enough to play.

The lack of the challenge was terrible. Furkan getting only 20 minutes is inexcusable, especially when Maxey got 36. Isaiah Joe needs more than 4 minutes too. Just an all around garbage job tonight.


And let's not forget the dumpster fire job he did vs. the Hawks last year.

Glenn got gifted a title from a super team. And has been living off that ever since.
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#3 » by Skates » Sat Oct 23, 2021 2:41 am

He will last this year but not past this year.
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#4 » by mjkvol » Sat Oct 23, 2021 3:34 am

Unfortunately, he's not going anywhere unless this team crashes and burns this season. I thought it was a horrible hire at the time, as aside from one season with a stacked team more than a decade ago he has proven to be an underachiever that rarely gets the best out of his teams, and he has had some really good teams.

Tonight we saw the essence of Rivers - horrible game management down the stretch highlighted by the non-challenge, total lack of ability to make adjustments on the fly, stubbornly sticking with guys like Green and Thybulle and leaving Korkmaz on the bench in a spot where his shooting was desperately needed. But I think it would have to get really ugly for him to be shown the door this season.
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#5 » by NYSixersFan » Sat Oct 23, 2021 4:48 am

I'd really love to know the logic for keeping Doc or why anyone thinks he's a good coach.
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#6 » by eyeatoma » Sat Oct 23, 2021 5:02 am

Gotta agree, Doc has got to go. It is clear as day that he is in over his head in the 4th quarter. HIs game management is abysmal, and apart from Ben, he played a huge role in us losing the Hawks series.
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#7 » by Tomjas » Sat Oct 23, 2021 5:10 am

NYSixersFan wrote:I'd really love to know the logic for keeping Doc or why anyone thinks he's a good coach.


I said that he should have been fired after the Hawks loss and the only argument offered in his favour was that he’s got a 5 year contract and management wouldn’t pay him out
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#8 » by Tomjas » Sat Oct 23, 2021 5:13 am

Special Agent Simmons is doing his best to get Doc fired by sitting out

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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#9 » by Skates » Sat Oct 23, 2021 5:17 am

Tomjas wrote:
NYSixersFan wrote:I'd really love to know the logic for keeping Doc or why anyone thinks he's a good coach.


I said that he should have been fired after the Hawks loss and the only argument offered in his favour was that he’s got a 5 year contract and management wouldn’t pay him out


We all know he needs to go, but for the moment Morey can only spend so much capital on one major problem at a time. Once Doc gets a full roster one way or another, then there won't ne any more excuses. I was really hoping Brand would take the Minny job he was rumored for, then you could slide doc upstairs into a do nothing, feel good position to show off his championship ring now and then and hire his replacement without a huge amount of fanfare or controversy. Likely he would not take that spot, but at least it could be offered as an organizational restructure to save face for him.
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#10 » by 76ciology » Sat Oct 23, 2021 5:30 am

NYSixersFan wrote:I'd really love to know the logic for keeping Doc or why anyone thinks he's a good coach.


Because he is good at bringing out the best in players, which is one of the top things or even the top thing you want from a coach.
Embiid almost MVP
Ben almost DPOY
Tobias almost allstar
Thybulle all defensive or almost all defensive
Seth playing at career best years
Shake playing his best year despite the struggle last season
D12 good per 36 numbers as backup big
Maxey looking like a promising rookie

-Does not stagger Ben and Biid’s minutes (this prevents huge drop off in +/-)
- Has the balls to go against toxic star players like Ben, unlike Brett
- He doesnt have a single style and adjusts on different trend of the game from his stint with Magic, big 3 boston, heavy PnR Clips, wing duo clips to heavy post Sixers
-I believe Morey also like Doc. Because Doc runs the offense in line with Morey’s vision.

Issue with this team is Embiid’s availability and how the team plays against the trend because of our personnel that an inferior team can be as effective or more effective than us.

G7 of the Hawks and the recent game prior to this thread’s common denominator is Embiid struggling or questionable conditioning. The only way to counter that is to get a top tier star, and thats what the FO is trying to do with an all or nothing mentality chase for Harden, Lillard or Beal.
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#11 » by Skates » Sat Oct 23, 2021 5:34 am

Morey does like Doc, Morey sees those things, but he can always see the best in an asset, and the worst. Doc fits for the moment and the current stage of molding, he will be gone before a championship can be won.
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#12 » by TTP » Sat Oct 23, 2021 5:42 am

eyeatoma wrote:Gotta agree, Doc has got to go. It is clear as day that he is in over his head in the 4th quarter. HIs game management is abysmal, and apart from Ben, he played a huge role in us losing the Hawks series.


It shouldn't even be too controversial. He contributed to alienating Ben as well, so even his players coach reputation comes into question.
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#13 » by TTP » Sat Oct 23, 2021 5:54 am

Skates wrote:Morey does like Doc, Morey sees those things, but he can always see the best in an asset, and the worst. Doc fits for the moment and the current stage of molding, he will be gone before a championship can be won.


I think Morey is pretty good at giving off the impression that he likes everyone (aside from China). It would be a bad business decision to publicly show your dislike for a peer in an industry where relationships between players and other teams' management are crucial to success. He's basically a salesman when he's trying to get people to agree to favorable deals.

Who knows what his true opinion of Doc is and there's probably plenty of good coaches out there that he likes as well (MDA is available for example, someone Morey clearly values). I've seen enough evidence from Morey's track record of success over a large amount of years that I trust him to make good decisions that maintain the health of the franchise in one way or another. He'll do it again here if he needs to (or if ownership lets him).
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#14 » by TTP » Sat Oct 23, 2021 6:20 am

76ciology wrote:
Because he is good at bringing out the best in players, which is one of the top things or even the top thing you want from a coach.


He's certainly not bringing out the best in Ben right now.

Embiid almost MVP
Ben almost DPOY
Tobias almost allstar
Thybulle all defensive or almost all defensive
Seth playing at career best years
Shake playing his best year despite the struggle last season
D12 good per 36 numbers as backup big
Maxey looking like a promising rookie
-Does not stagger Ben and Biid’s minutes (this prevents huge drop off in +/-)
- Has the balls to go against toxic star players like Ben, unlike Brett
- He doesnt have a single style and adjusts on different trend of the game from his stint with Magic, big 3 boston, heavy PnR Clips, wing duo clips to heavy post Sixers
-I believe Morey also like Doc. Because Doc runs the offense in line with Morey’s vision.

Issue with this team is Embiid’s availability and how the team plays against the trend because of our personnel that an inferior team can be as effective or more effective than us.

G7 of the Hawks and the recent game prior to this thread’s common denominator is Embiid struggling or questionable conditioning. The only way to counter that is to get a top tier star, and thats what the FO is trying to do with an all or nothing mentality chase for Harden, Lillard or Beal.


I think a lot of those positives you're listing can be more attributed to good roster construction, good drafting, and general player growth. You can attribute some of it to coaching, but it's really lazy to just list a bunch of team accomplishments as your argument when there are so many factors that go into those individual successes.

As for the bolded and just to be clear, your argument is that you think the Ben situation currently under Doc's oversight where he's demanding a trade and refusing to play and making up excuses is an improvement over Brett Brown's? This is your position?

The main issue is that I saw significant blunders today that shouldn't happen with a competent NBA coach.
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#15 » by 76ciology » Sat Oct 23, 2021 6:31 am

On this team, you can’t bring out the best in Ben. Biid and Ben are polar opposites in terms of roster construction.You need to build a Bucks type roster to max out Ben, which would reduce Biid into a stretch 5. Ben confirmed that this is what he wants.

Yes, the improvements are not totally on Doc but it played a big factor and he is know most(not all) of his coaching career would speak for it.

As a headcoach, you should command respect. And if you defer on a player like Ben in this “player empowerment era” you’ll lose control of your team. Finally we have a coach who will call out on a player our team’s best player (Embiid) and ex-players like (Jimmy) have issues with.

What’s the alternative? We hire Tyrone Lue, which is Ben and Klutch sport’s bet. We’d then be a clown show just as the Lakers right now.

The struggles of this team is more on the roster than on the coaching. The PG position is the most important position in the game right now, and we probably have the least talented guard depth in the league.

If Doc is really bad. You’d probably hear players on our team or Morey speaking about it right now. If Doc is handling the Ben situation bad, then why do you see Embiid and Jimmy blatantly spoke against Ben? You rarely see a player saying something bad against his teammate, unless its a really bad situation or if a player is really that toxic.
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#16 » by 76ciology » Sat Oct 23, 2021 6:39 am

Im not saying Doc is a great coach. But I know the limitations of a coach.

Our issue really is about our roster. Whereas we need to do some tweaks with our roster and these are not tweaks u can do with a snap of your finger because you have a bad hand of cards and is jusy waiting for the opportunity to play them.

And its evident by the countless Ben Simmons or Tobias Harris trade proposal on this even prior when Ben asks for a trade. Its also evident when our FO almost traded Ben for Harden even Ben asks to be traded or we going after top tier stars who can carry the team whenever Biid shows signs of question with his conditioning (such as our most recent game).

If we have Harden or Lillard instead of Ben, do you think you’ll still have these issues with our team?

Its a roster issue. And you know it when you’re asking guys like Maxey and Korkmaz to play bigger than what they are.
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#17 » by Tomjas » Sat Oct 23, 2021 7:13 am

Dude

Joel got up in front of Wells Fargo today and appealed for help with Ben

Tobias basically did the same thing on social media

Both took real guts as Simmons has put a target on his back & far easier for them to say nothing

There’s a lot more happening behind the scenes and we will probably never know the real story but both did more today than Doc has ever done
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#18 » by Kova » Sat Oct 23, 2021 7:38 am

Can't believe he didn't challenge that call. He literally cost us the game.
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#19 » by 76ciology » Sat Oct 23, 2021 8:49 am

Tomjas wrote:Dude

Joel got up in front of Wells Fargo today and appealed for help with Ben

Tobias basically did the same thing on social media

Both took real guts as Simmons has put a target on his back & far easier for them to say nothing

There’s a lot more happening behind the scenes and we will probably never know the real story but both did more today than Doc has ever done


So Biid never called Ben out?

I dont know what’s going on with that guy?
Im not here to babysit.

Butler never called Ben out?

Some guys are here for the houses, the money and the fame.

Yes, Biid told the crowd to support Ben but its not like Biid didnt called Ben out.

Biid, Jimmy (indirectly) and Doc all called Ben out. And they know Ben more than the posters here on Realgm such as you and me. Ben is just a pain in the ass for the team.

And just imagine if Ben’s group was able to take over our FO and coaching staff with Lue being our head coach.

Imagine if we still had that Hinkie hired dumb headcoach that comes from where Ben came from, prior to Doc. We’d still probably babysitting Ben and Biid would have been the one asking for antrade.
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Re: The Official Fire Doc Rivers Thread 

Post#20 » by Tomjas » Sat Oct 23, 2021 8:53 am

76ciology wrote:
Tomjas wrote:Dude

Joel got up in front of Wells Fargo today and appealed for help with Ben

Tobias basically did the same thing on social media

Both took real guts as Simmons has put a target on his back & far easier for them to say nothing

There’s a lot more happening behind the scenes and we will probably never know the real story but both did more today than Doc has ever done


So Biid never called Ben out?

I dont know what’s going on with that guy?
Im not here to babysit.

Butler never called Ben out?

Some guys are here for the houses, the money and the fame.

Yes, Biid told the crowd to support Ben but its not like Biid didnt called Ben out.

Biid, Jimmy (indirectly) and Doc all called Ben out. And they know Ben more than the posters here on Realgm such as you and me. Ben is just a pain in the ass for the team.

And just imagine if Ben’s group was able to take over our FO and coaching staff with Lue being our head coach.

Imagine if we still had that Hinkie hired dumb headcoach that comes from where Ben came from, prior to Doc. We’d still probably babysitting Ben and Biid would have been the one asking for antrade.


None of us know half of it

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