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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1241 » by ProcessDoctor » Fri Nov 12, 2021 1:33 pm

Ben has his work cut out for him in terms of re-establishing his image. It’s gonna be an uphill battle for the foreseeable future for him.
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1242 » by kuclas » Fri Nov 12, 2021 1:35 pm

sodmoraes wrote:I may be dumb, but i´m failing to understand ben/rich paul endgame strategy, flashing the "mental health card". In my opinion, it erodes ben´s value even more, making the possibility of a trade harder. Which team will want to trade good players for a broken down player, who maybe will need some time off after the trade, to fix his "mental issues" ? Ben value around the league was already low before his mental problems. After that, he doesnt have value anymore.

We already know Morey won´t trade ben just for the sake of doing it. So now, with his mental health disease, we will get worst trade offers, so Morey will probably never trade him. He will be in philly forever, probably without getting paid( since it seems is just a scam to get paid).

So if rich paul wants ben ou ot Philly, this strategy doesnt seem good. I think they are using this so Ben gets paid. It may work in the short term, but in the long term i think it makes a trade harder to happen. Seems like a shortsighted move, but they are desperate. :lol:


Simmons/Klutch sports about to become the standard how to deal with malcontents on long term contracts.

That player empowerment strategy for disgruntled players demanding out may work with 1-2 years. It’s not gonna to work with 4 years left. Simmons will be the poster child. And klutch may end up losing millions if Simmons contract is voided and he sues klutch due to poor advice. (Simmons isn’t a smart guy we all know that) he can claim he didn’t know and only followed klutch advice.

I have sympathy for nfl players holding out and wanting more money/guarantees.

But I have no sympathy for max (super max Simmons) guarantee contracts.

The league revenues/advertising/media contracts pay Simmons and other players money.

The players association has fought long and hard for long term guarantee Contracts. If players pull this stunt they need to renegotiate number of years guarantees.

Only certain players can work on 1-2 year max deals (Lebron/KD). The rest including Embiid take the max extension.
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1243 » by BullyKing » Fri Nov 12, 2021 1:39 pm

Tomjas wrote:
BullyKing wrote:
Tomjas wrote:
Anthony Kim was regarded as the next Tiger

American/Korean and top 10

Retired out of nowhere with a massive insurance payout to fall back on (rumoured to be $50 million)

Can’t play again as that would entail repaying the money

Allegedly not a career ending injury but came with rumours of mental health issues

Nobody actually knows

Sound familiar?

Simmons has a fully guaranteed contract

It happens


I ask again, what is your point? I've already said Ben is more than welcome to retire if he feels that's the best decision for himself.

Ben's contract is not guaranteed against retirement. Hopefully he's got a nice insurance policy that covers "not being mentally prepared".


Comes down to medical opinion

Once again, people are speculating without information

Simmons is either unwell or not

Nobody knows outside inner circle


What are you talking about? That has nothing to do with the idea that Simmons' mental health issues might lead to his retirement (because apparently his mental health issues are linked to whether he is being paid).

But for the record, it is only you that is pretending to know what is going on. Everyone else, including the Sixers, are saying only let's hear from the doctor that this issue exists and what the course of treatment is. You're the one taking the position that Simmons should be paid without providing any information to the Sixers about what the doctors are saying.
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the plan is to get as good as quickly as possible....I fully believe we could have been a borderline playoff team last year by adding young veterans....using or draft picks and cap space.....can I specifically tell you who? no.
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1244 » by Tomjas » Fri Nov 12, 2021 1:46 pm

BullyKing wrote:
Tomjas wrote:
BullyKing wrote:
I ask again, what is your point? I've already said Ben is more than welcome to retire if he feels that's the best decision for himself.

Ben's contract is not guaranteed against retirement. Hopefully he's got a nice insurance policy that covers "not being mentally prepared".


Comes down to medical opinion

Once again, people are speculating without information

Simmons is either unwell or not

Nobody knows outside inner circle


What are you talking about? That has nothing to do with the idea that Simmons' mental health issues might lead to his retirement (because apparently his mental health issues are linked to whether he is being paid).

But for the record, it is only you that is pretending to know what is going on. Everyone else, including the Sixers, are saying only let's hear from the doctor that this issue exists and what the course of treatment is. You're the one taking the position that Simmons should be paid without providing any information to the Sixers about what the doctors are saying.


I have said no such thing

I don’t care whether Simmons gets paid or not as none of it is ending up in my pocket

My only position is that engaging in a war with Simmons lowers his trade value as any rational gm will realise that the situation is untenable
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1245 » by Tomjas » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:05 pm

Here’s reality

Every GM in the league knows Simmons value

Be higher to some, lower to others

Value will fluctuate a little bit depending on how their own team is performing

They know that the Sixers need to trade so will be offering lowballs until their own situation changes

Ben playing changes nothing

It’s not a personal issue so stop thinking that way
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1246 » by Da Doctor » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:06 pm

Not ever sentence needs its own line. See how easy this is?
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1247 » by kuclas » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:09 pm

Tomjas wrote:
BullyKing wrote:
Tomjas wrote:
Comes down to medical opinion

Once again, people are speculating without information

Simmons is either unwell or not

Nobody knows outside inner circle


What are you talking about? That has nothing to do with the idea that Simmons' mental health issues might lead to his retirement (because apparently his mental health issues are linked to whether he is being paid).

But for the record, it is only you that is pretending to know what is going on. Everyone else, including the Sixers, are saying only let's hear from the doctor that this issue exists and what the course of treatment is. You're the one taking the position that Simmons should be paid without providing any information to the Sixers about what the doctors are saying.


I have said no such thing

I don’t care whether Simmons gets paid or not as none of it is ending up in my pocket

My only position is that engaging in a war with Simmons lowers his trade value as any rational gm will realise that the situation is untenable


You only let players sit at home if
1. They are role players end of career (iggy with Memphis and Iggy wasn’t getting paid much )
2. Tanking teams (John wall with Houston) Al horford with okc till they find a trade partner.

Letting Simmons sit at home on 33 million dollar a year waiting out a trade when the lasting image of Simmons is him shooting 34% from free throw line and passing up a dunk.

His value isn’t getting any higher sitting at home getting paid. It’s not getting any lower than the current offers.

I think Morey understand these same offers are there by trade deadline.

As for playoffs and seeding. We found out seeding doesn’t matter much in nba these days. Health is the most important. As long as we are not playing a healthy harden/kD in first round. We can beat any team in eastern conference including Miami and bucks with our current roster (without Simmons). We could lose. But we have a good team without Simmons. We just need health.

So why trade Simmons for more role players.

Morey will survive. Sixers organization will survive. Simmons may be bankrupt in 5 years if his contract is voided the way he spends money.
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1248 » by Tomjas » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:09 pm

Da Doctor wrote:Not ever sentence needs its own line. See how easy this is?


It’s “every” grammar police :lol:
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1249 » by Declan » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:11 pm

Lol
No one with an ounce of intelligence is going to buy this Simmons/Paul crap. Once the NBA gets involved Ben will lose this big time. Morey is playing this perfectly.!
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1250 » by Tomjas » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:13 pm

kuclas wrote:
Tomjas wrote:
BullyKing wrote:
What are you talking about? That has nothing to do with the idea that Simmons' mental health issues might lead to his retirement (because apparently his mental health issues are linked to whether he is being paid).

But for the record, it is only you that is pretending to know what is going on. Everyone else, including the Sixers, are saying only let's hear from the doctor that this issue exists and what the course of treatment is. You're the one taking the position that Simmons should be paid without providing any information to the Sixers about what the doctors are saying.


I have said no such thing

I don’t care whether Simmons gets paid or not as none of it is ending up in my pocket

My only position is that engaging in a war with Simmons lowers his trade value as any rational gm will realise that the situation is untenable


You only let players sit at home if
1. They are role players end of career (iggy with Memphis and Iggy wasn’t getting paid much )
2. Tanking teams (John wall with Houston) Al horford with okc till they find a trade partner.

Letting Simmons sit at home on 33 million dollar a year waiting out a trade when the lasting image of Simmons is him shooting 34% from free throw line and passing up a dunk.

His value isn’t getting any higher sitting at home getting paid. It’s not getting any lower than the current offers.

I think Morey understand these same offers are there by trade deadline.

As for playoffs and seeding. We found out seeding doesn’t matter much in nba these days. Health is the most important. As long as we are not playing a healthy harden/kD in first round. We can beat any team in eastern conference including Miami and bucks with our current roster (without Simmons). We could lose. But we have a good team without Simmons. We just need health.

So why trade Simmons for more role players.

Morey will survive. Sixers organization will survive. Simmons may be bankrupt in 5 years if his contract is voided the way he spends money.


Voided :lol:

You have completely jumped the shark

Listen to yourself ffs
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1251 » by Wilfried » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:18 pm

Tomjas wrote:
Wilfried wrote:
Jhawk03 wrote:
I think Ben needs a sabbatical, time away from basketball, fans and the media, and most important, time to consider what he needs and where he wants to be in life.

All this getting paid or being fined nonsense is not helping Ben's mental health. I'm willing to predict that Ben may never play basketball again IF he truly has mental health issues, and that's only because if he were to quit basketball, (which may or may not be the cause, but it's certainly not helping) he'd be taking the first step towards solving his issues, and he'd have more time to focus on his mental health.


Ok for me, but only if he works on his shooting in the meantime.

Because he's still running away from what would be the answer to all this mess


Father of a friend was a leading golf professional who “retired” in his prime after getting the yips

Bought a pub and hardly played golf for 18 months

Eventually returned and won more than 30 tournaments around the world

Practice is not always the answer to mental conditions


Pretty sure that, if he had developped (read: worked) on his shooting (and maybe didn't be too stubborn to switch hands), he probably had become a better offensive player, maybe had shot more than 35% from the free throw line in the play-offs, and maybe the Sixers would have advanced to the CF and this whole situation wouldn't have happened.

The mental issue because Simmons is afraid (read: scared to death) from the whole Philly situation (coach, team and off course the crowd). And that's because finally he cannot run away from what everyone has been asking him for years: develop your offensive game. That time and the patience is over, gone, .... and he knows that too.

And instead of doing what he's paid to do, he runs away and will declare that 'he is what he is'.

Is that 'a mental issue'? And if it's so, would this mental issue have occured if he had develloped his offensive game the last years?
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1252 » by Sixerscan » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:19 pm

Tomjas wrote:
BullyKing wrote:
Tomjas wrote:
Comes down to medical opinion

Once again, people are speculating without information

Simmons is either unwell or not

Nobody knows outside inner circle


What are you talking about? That has nothing to do with the idea that Simmons' mental health issues might lead to his retirement (because apparently his mental health issues are linked to whether he is being paid).

But for the record, it is only you that is pretending to know what is going on. Everyone else, including the Sixers, are saying only let's hear from the doctor that this issue exists and what the course of treatment is. You're the one taking the position that Simmons should be paid without providing any information to the Sixers about what the doctors are saying.


I have said no such thing

I don’t care whether Simmons gets paid or not as none of it is ending up in my pocket

My only position is that engaging in a war with Simmons lowers his trade value as any rational gm will realise that the situation is untenable


The point of saying he's not being entitled to money isn't because we do or don't care about it, it's explaining that's why the SIxers aren't just rolling over and blindly paying him millions of dollars to not show up like you want them to. Do you really not get that?

Btw for all we know that's not even Morey's call it could be the guys actually writing the checks.
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1253 » by Kobblehead » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:20 pm

Ben Simmons retiring is an interesting concept. He doesn't seem like he likes basketball all that much or particularly cares about winning. It kinda does feel like he's just convincingly cosplaying being a basketball player and socialite. In his nature, he seems like a shy introvert with no charisma. It would be interesting to see him shift his career to professional gaming to see if that's where his true passion lies.
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1254 » by Tomjas » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:32 pm

Sixerscan wrote:
Tomjas wrote:
BullyKing wrote:
What are you talking about? That has nothing to do with the idea that Simmons' mental health issues might lead to his retirement (because apparently his mental health issues are linked to whether he is being paid).

But for the record, it is only you that is pretending to know what is going on. Everyone else, including the Sixers, are saying only let's hear from the doctor that this issue exists and what the course of treatment is. You're the one taking the position that Simmons should be paid without providing any information to the Sixers about what the doctors are saying.


I have said no such thing

I don’t care whether Simmons gets paid or not as none of it is ending up in my pocket

My only position is that engaging in a war with Simmons lowers his trade value as any rational gm will realise that the situation is untenable


The point of saying he's not being entitled to money isn't because we do or don't care about it, it's explaining that's why the SIxers aren't just rolling over and blindly paying him millions of dollars to not show up like you want them to. Do you really not get that?

Btw for all we know that's not even Morey's call it could be the guys actually writing the checks.


It’s not my money so I don’t care whether Simmons gets paid or not

You obviously care waaaay more about it than I do

Why does it bother you so much when you will never see a dime of it?

Just weird
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1255 » by Kobblehead » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:36 pm

Da Doctor wrote:Not ever sentence needs its own line. See how easy this is?

I like to think Tomjas is just speaking into a computer which is typing up his words for him. That's why his posts are churning out as 7 word paragraphs with no discernable format.
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1256 » by GutUNC » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:41 pm

Negrodamus wrote:The league will eventually intervene (as they always do) and force a trade. Ben not playing hurts them and the fight being so public must be driving Silver crazy.

Not sure how this is hurting the league - it’s barely hurting the Sixers. And the public drama is the stuff the league runs on during the regular season.
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1257 » by Negrodamus » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:41 pm

Tomjas wrote:
They know that the Sixers need to trade so will be offering lowballs until their own situation changes


So Morey will wait until the other team's situation changes. Why does he receive so much criticism from you for doing so?
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1258 » by Tomjas » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:48 pm

Negrodamus wrote:
Tomjas wrote:
They know that the Sixers need to trade so will be offering lowballs until their own situation changes


So Morey will wait until the other team's situation changes. Why does he receive so much criticism from you for doing so?


Read my posts

Given that Morey didn’t trade Simmons before the draft, his next timeline is December 15 to the deadline

My criticism is him slandering Simmons in the meantime

How’s that helping?
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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1259 » by Eyeamok » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:50 pm

Kobblehead wrote:Ben Simmons retiring is an interesting concept. He doesn't seem like he likes basketball all that much or particularly cares about winning. It kinda does feel like he's just convincingly cosplaying being a basketball player and socialite. In his nature, he seems like a shy introvert with no charisma. It would be interesting to see him shift his career to professional gaming to see if that's where his true passion lies.


He may not love basketball but he likes everything that professional basketball gives him, the limelight, money, the attention from the media and women and the power. He will be hard pressed to give that up (retire) to be a professional gamer. Even though gaming is more low key It will not afford him the things he seems to crave that come along with being a basketball "superstar".
Please allow me to introduce myself I'm a man of wealth and taste.

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Re: Ben Simmons Trade Thread Part 7 

Post#1260 » by Negrodamus » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:54 pm

GutUNC wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:The league will eventually intervene (as they always do) and force a trade. Ben not playing hurts them and the fight being so public must be driving Silver crazy.

Not sure how this is hurting the league - it’s barely hurting the Sixers. And the public drama is the stuff the league runs on during the regular season.


Multiple reasons:

-Distracts from the actual product
-Will be a point of contention at the next CBA
-Hurts the image of a marketable 3x All-Star and keeps him sidelined.
-Forces the NBA to confront the nebulous issue of mental health, particular how it relates to being an injury.

The drama benefits the media, doesn't really add money to the pocket of the NBA. I mean, maybe Ben's first game back will draw numbers and his first game back in Philly will be primetime TV. But Stephen A Smith screaming on First Take isn't doing anything for the NBA.

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