RealGM

Miller is not going to take us anywhere. There is little that our young guys can learn from him that they have not learned already or that they cannot learn from Iggy, ollie or the coaches. The longer we keep him the less we know about what our needs are. Obviously we need a solid big that can post up, rebound, defend and run the floor. that should be the priority. But do we need a point? Is lou our point of the future or not? If we do not trade miller that question will not be answered until next year. There is no way miller is not going to start here and the only real way to determine whether lou can handle the job is to let him start. Any reasonable offer for miller should be accepted. there are several points on the market and that may be why he is still here. Bibby, Kidd, cassell and west to name a few. at any rate I will be very disappointed if we still have miller after the deadline. Miller is a solid point but he does nothing for us in our current situation. I do not think lou is going to be that spark off of the bench for much longer. He is either going to given the opportunity to start here or somewhere else.

He may be more valuable as a 10M expiring next year than he is as a good PG this year.

Again, remeber that Kwame's 10M expiring basically landed Gasol. It is possible that we could be in similar position next winter- and if we are under the cap and our young talent and prossible lottery pick we could be even a better player on the trade market than the Lakers were when they landed Gasol.

Miller currently doesn't have a huge amount of value beyond clearing cap space for the summer- which we already have.

I personally like the trade scenario proposed by Mahorn on the Deep Sixer thread. Cleveland gets Miller and filler. Golden State gets Gooden and a 1st, and we get Pietrus and Wright.

STChaser

A) Miller is a player who makes players around him better

B) As tk said, he will have a $10MIL expiring contract next year which may be valuable next year

C) Not that I am for this but Miller probably has another 2-3 years of high quality basketball left in him. It's not as though his game has slipped (if anything I would say he's getting better) and the fact that his game isn't based on speed is a huge factor.

The Guilty Party wrote:A) Miller is a player who makes players around him better

B) As tk said, he will have a $10MIL expiring contract next year which may be valuable next year

C) Not that I am for this but Miller probably has another 2-3 years of high quality basketball left in him. It's not as though his game has slipped (if anything I would say he's getting better) and the fact that his game isn't based on speed is a huge factor.

I'm not buying into "A" too much these days. Miller takes way too many shots sometimes, some of them he has no business taking.

I understand he has very little to work with(players and head coaching) but sometimes he goes "AI" on us, and leaves his teammates looking lost.

In my opinion, there's one scenario where keeping Miller makes a lot of sense. If Ed thinks that adding a very-good PF this offseason is likely, then you can keep Andre Miller and legitimately compete right away.

Otherwise, I'm onboard with trading him to get more picks/youth/capspace if there's a deal out there that makes sense.

When there was some possibility of Amare being the player that Phoenix moved this summer... I was all for keeping Miller. Now that it looks like we're going to be adding a less impactful player... I just don't see how we can compete for anything other than the bottom seeds of the playoffs for the remainder of Miller's career.

Miller is crafty when it comes to pump fakes and getting his own shot in transition. he also has a decent semi-jump shot out to about 17 - 19 feet max. I say semi jump shot because he gets minimal elevation on his j. however, he is not a drive and kick point guard and does not create shots other than the lobs and the back door cuts. no teams fear andre miller. He is either in shoot mode he will stand out at the top of the key for the back door or the lob. he does not draw double teams and has limited range and athleticism. hes good. but if he is your top one or two players you are not going far. If you look at the better points in the league now, parker, nash, paul, harris, D williams, b davis, j kidd, ect, miller is not in that group. Miller is also not getting any younger. keeping him here holds back the development of lou or in the alternative does not allow us to properly evaluate whether lou can be our point of the future. the only way to do that is to let lou start. we are not going far this year so we may as well use this year evaluate our future. a future that frankly should not include andre miller.

lol @ Devin "sir flops alot" Harris..........

Miller is a top 10 PG he's probally at 8 or 7.

My list goes like this.

1.Nash
2.Paul
3.Kidd
4.Williams
5.A.I
6. Parker
7.Davis
8. Miller
9.Gil
10. dfghdghcg ( I lost my train of thought.)

some guys on that list may not belong (A.I. and Gil) but Miller is definatley up there on that list. The difference with all of those guys san Kidd and A.I is that Miller is older and is on a crap team....put him a good team and he'd shine.

At this point in time Miller may be a top ten point guard but we are a team building for the future. I'm also for Williams starting and us just cutting him loose on the court. There are also a lot of younger talented players that haven't reached potential yet that i'd rather have than Miller (D.Harris, R.Felton) being a couple.
The only way i'd keep Miller is if we were actually a contending team which we are not right now. In my opinion keeping Miller has kept us from landing Oden, and Durant, and will now keep us from landing Rose, Gordon, and Beasley and all have that franchise player ability which is what we are sorely lacking right now.

sweetlou23 wrote:Miller is crafty when it comes to pump fakes and getting his own shot in transition. he also has a decent semi-jump shot out to about 17 - 19 feet max. I say semi jump shot because he gets minimal elevation on his j. however, he is not a drive and kick point guard and does not create shots other than the lobs and the back door cuts.

So, you really value drive-and-kick point guards, setting up 3-pt shots ... and do not value lobs for dunks or backdoor cuts for layups ...

Interesting ...

If they can nail their pick and can sign a FA PF, Miller puts them in a nice position next season. He's a good leader for the young players now, and still is a valuable floor leader next season...as well as the expiring deal. If they get value for him this season, that is great...if they keep him next season, that is fine as well. As has been mentioned on numerous topics by many posters, his value next season may be greater than this season. On the other hand, if Thad develops further, the get a steal in the draft, and sign a PF...they may not want to give him up next season either.

miller fits this team better than any point guard the 76ers can get at this point. good pg's are not exactly a dime a dozen. sure a few great ones have come out in the draft in the last few years (Williams, Paul), but really Miller is better than a lot of guys out there and we are including years worth of drafts. if we add an offensively minded PF Miller will seem like a much better PG.

think about it. if we trade him for a pick 14-22, and get an expiring, is it really going to be better than keeping Miller in the first place?

another way to put it. (excluding Carney's play of the last fortnight) would you trade miller for the 1st round pick that lands Carney and an expiring contract??? you would have no pg and not really help the team go anywhere...

Louis Williams is a nice player, but he has shown very little in the way turning into the pg miller is now or was at any point of his career.

drewfogarty wrote:miller fits this team better than any point guard the 76ers can get at this point. good pg's are not exactly a dime a dozen. sure a few great ones have come out in the draft in the last few years (Williams, Paul), but really Miller is better than a lot of guys out there and we are including years worth of drafts. if we add an offensively minded PF Miller will seem like a much better PG.

think about it. if we trade him for a pick 14-22, and get an expiring, is it really going to be better than keeping Miller in the first place?

another way to put it. (excluding Carney's play of the last fortnight) would you trade miller for the 1st round pick that lands Carney and an expiring contract??? you would have no pg and not really help the team go anywhere...

Louis Williams is a nice player, but he has shown very little in the way turning into the pg miller is now or was at any point of his career.

Thank You

[quote="drewfogarty"]

another way to put it. (excluding Carney's play of the last fortnight) would you trade miller for the 1st round pick that lands Carney and an expiring contract??? you would have no pg and not really help the team go anywhere... quote]

What you are missing is that by trading Miller we increase our cap space from 10/12 million to 20/22 million. If you can use that additional 10 million of cap space to sign two fee agents, say a Josh smith and a Calderon, then you are trading miller for a first round pick and Calderon. Sure you can wait another year and let miler's contract expire, but in 2009, multiple teams will have cap space. My problem with Miller is that he plays below average defense. He can not play an above average point guard, and stop him from penetrating. If I were stefanski, if some one offered expirings, a first round pick, and a decent prospect, or took back a bad contract from us (Willie green), I would do the deal.

it's very simple..if we trade dre miller for expirings+first pick we WON"T sign a pf like brand because he won't come here.

IggyTheKing wrote:it's very simple..if we trade dre miller for expirings+first pick we WON"T sign a pf like brand because he won't come here.

And thank you also ...

This is from the Daily Dime on espn.com....

As time passes, Sixers general manager Ed Stefanski convinces more of his peers that he's serious about hanging onto Andre Miller. It was initially assumed that Stefanski had been making that claim publicly simply to increase Miller's value, but you hear more and more on the GM grapevine lately that Philly -- underwhelmed by its likely free-agent options this offseason -- would prefer to stagger its salary-cap flexibility so it has some this summer and some in the summer of 2009.

Miller seems like a natural candidate (at least to me) to help facilitate a three-way Jason Kidd trade scenario with Dallas because A) new Nets exec Kiki Vandeweghe signed Miller in Denver and remains a big fan of his and B) Miller's contract only has one season to run after this one, which should appeal to the Nets.

But there's been no indication yet that Philly is interested in participating in that kind of deal. Especially since there's a case to be made that Miller might be even more valuable as a trade asset next season when he's in the final year of his contract at $9,999,999.


While keeping Miller doesn't come as a big shock, I'm not sure that I like this idea of "staggering" the cap money. If the $9.8MIL number is accurate then we don't really have enough cap money to make any sort of a splash this summer unless it's in a trade and next summer the FA class isn't much better, if at all.

It seems to me that there are two two distinct views about trading andre miller. The first view is that andre miller is a good point and is helping the young guys develop and will be valuable as trade bait later. the second view is really more about lou williams than it is about miller. and its the view that i hold. i believe that lou williams is the point of the future for this team. i also believe that he needs time on the floor to grow into that position. miller averages 36 minutes per game that limits lou's time at the point to 12 minutes per game. that is simply not enough time at the point for lou. this is lous third year in the league. eventually they will have to start him or trade him. i would hate for the sixer to trade lou without him getting the chance to start. they cant keep lou in limbo for another year and a half. i really think that they need to make a move with miller now. if not now then definitely over the summer. i cannot bear another season of miller starting at point while lou comes off the bench.

IggyTheKing wrote:it's very simple..if we trade dre miller for expirings+first pick we WON"T sign a pf like brand because he won't come here.

While I don't believe this to be untrue, my feeling is that the PF will not be a UFA, rather come in a trade or be a RFA.

As for the DAL-NJN scenaio, would getting back Devin Harris+expirings+1st rounder work?