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Sixers' Iguodala has faith he can play for larger fortune

Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 2:53 pm
by THFM
Sixers' Iguodala has faith he can play for larger fortune
By PHIL JASNER
Philadelphia Daily News

jasnerp@phillynews.com

LOS ANGELES - He wants to be a franchise player. He wants to be paid accordingly.
But he walked away from a $57 million contract extension. And his team is 28-33.

And that has observers all around the NBA wondering exactly where that leaves the 76ers' Andre Iguodala as he approaches restricted free agency this summer.

In the midst of his fourth season after becoming the No. 9 overall pick in the NBA's 2004 draft, he is the Sixers' leading scorer and has been one of a handful of players in the league to maintain averages of at least 19 points, five rebounds and four assists.

He was a member of the U.S. national select team that practiced with and scrimmaged against the Olympic team last summer. Jerry Colangelo, the managing director of the Olympic team, has said he is a likely candidate for the 2012 Olympic team.

But when the Daily News asked people around the league whether the multitalented Iguodala is a franchise player, many of the responses indicated that, while he might yet develop into one, he is seen more as an excellent No. 2 guy, able to support a No. 1 guy in whatever areas might be necessary in a given game.

Those same people - certainly not a scientific poll - wonder about the wisdom of Iguodala rejecting an offer that would have provided him with his first fortune; he is playing this season for a little more than $2.8 million. Negotiations on a new deal cannot resume until July 1, when the Sixers will hold the right of first refusal.

The Sixers also might hold a trump card, because they are likely to have more space (about $10 million) under the salary cap than any other team in the league; should they choose to pay luxury tax they could conceivably use their space elsewhere, then re-sign him. Iguodala also has the option of signing a 1-year tender and becoming unrestricted after next season.

"When I heard that he had turned down the extension, the first thing I thought was, either he's crazy or he's a good businessman," said Boston Celtics coach Doc Rivers. "The way I look at it is, he has a lot of faith in himself. Given the finances of my generation, I can't compute [the current numbers], to be able to walk away from that. But a lot of players are."

Iguodala wasn't alone. The Chicago Bulls' Luol Deng and Ben Gordon reportedly walked away from offers of $50 million; the Charlotte Bobcats' Emeka Okafor turned down a reported $65 million.

"For that group, in the long run, it probably is a good business decision," Rivers said. "But it is risky."

Colangelo, the former owner of the Phoenix Suns, has seen the value of player contracts escalate and worries about where the ceiling might be.

"I think the agents have tremendous impact on what decisions these young men are making," he said. "It's a little bit of a sad commentary on the importance or emphasis on money, that it takes precedence over a lot of other things. It's gone way too far, way too far. That's my opinion."

Denver Nuggets guard Allen Iverson, Iguodala's former teammate with the Sixers, said it was a lot of money to walk away from "[but] it was a good decision if that's the decision he made. Obviously, he felt like he deserved more." Iverson added, "He's someone you can build a team around."

Golden State Warriors coach Don Nelson agreed. "He is a quality player that you can build around as your franchise player," Nelson said. "Isn't he already there? He's pretty close. He guards, he rebounds, he scores; he's not a terrible passer, though it's probably not his forte. He's multifaceted, tough to guard, does what the coaches ask and is a willing teammate. I'd put him up there."

But the payoff that Iguodala left on the table still is difficult to fathom, said former player Eddie Johnson, now a broadcaster with the Phoenix Suns.

"It's hard to ask a guy who played in the 1980s and 1990s [about the money], because we're looking at it like 'Whaaat?' " Johnson said. "But in today's game, we're dealing with a different kind of player.

"If you're telling me you're walking away from $55 million because you want $60 million and then you're playing 82 games and risking the chance of maybe having a bad year or getting hurt, something's wrong."

While some observers might disagree with what Iguodala did at the contract table, most are in pretty close agreement about his strengths and weaknesses. Hall of Famer Rick Barry suggested that Iguodala "needs to be more aggressive, to do the subtle things, like breaking a guy down, squaring up and beating a [defender] instead of always doing it off the dribble."

And a veteran scout who requested anonymity said: "To me, he's the second- or third-best player on a good team. He doesn't have any glaring weaknesses; he's a good defender, a good passer, a little fancy, a high-turnover guy. He runs the floor and is athletic. If the Sixers had a star, he'd be a great player."

The money?

"I thought he was out of his mind, quite frankly [to turn it down]," the scout said. "First of all, there's no money out here. But I think all of this is based on [the Sacramento Kings'] Kevin Martin, who got about $55 million. Martin, though, was averaging 21 [points a game for a team] in the West, and he found a team that thought that was his worth. I don't see a team paying Iguodala $57 million."

Iguodala ascended to the dual roles of leader and best player after Iverson was traded to the Nuggets in December 2006, helping drive the Sixers to 17 victories in their last 26 games.

"It would help him if he had more guys around him, which he's starting to get," Rivers said. "What they're doing right now is phenomenal; they're playing amazing ball and he's the leader, he and Andre Miller. This is his first shot; last season, in the middle of the year, shouldn't count."

Good player to great player to franchise player. That's the ladder Iguodala is attempting to climb, said Hall of Famer Bill Walton. "I think the role model for him has got to be [Wizards forward] Caron Butler, showing the ability to become one of the top 15 players in the conference, to be able to translate talent into impact, control and wins," Walton said. "Ultimately, the result of that is the imagination of the crowd that is drawn to watch you. Can you sell tickets? Can you be the driver of the engine?

"I was stunned with all the guys that turned down the money. Those are huge amounts. Are you going to be able to get significantly more by waiting longer? I'm not sure that's the case, and even as salaries continue to grow, [you're talking about] another 1 to 2 million [dollars] . . . for what?"

Iguodala has consistently said he is comfortable with his decision and that, if he and the team play well, things will take care of themselves.

"I think two things when guys turn down the money," said Orlando coach Stan Van Gundy. "Most people look and say 'How in the heck could you do that?' I always think they're taking a risk, but at the same time I say they're showing tremendous confidence in themselves and their abilities.

"If a guy is going to be a franchise player, and I think that's what Andre Iguodala wants to be, it starts obviously with talent, but the next thing is, they better have tremendous confidence. I think that's what he's showing."

And then there was this caveat from Minnesota Timberwolves broadcaster Billy McKinney: "Whenever a guy turns down that kind of money, I think back to Christian Laettner, who turned down $63 million from the Atlanta Hawks, then blew out his Achilles tendon. Sometimes, a reality check needs to happen."

That will come, one way or another, this summer. *


Right now I say Iggy should get 60 million nothing more, nothing less

Re: Sixers' Iguodala has faith he can play for larger fortun

Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 3:48 pm
by 76ciology
THFM wrote:
Right now I say Iggy should get 60 million nothing more, nothing less


60 Million is alright if its a 7 year deal.

I really don't think that he deserves the kind of figure he has in his mind. His stats is bloated, due to the fact that he is playing in a poor team and is asked to be our no.1 scorer.

He isn't a guy to build a team around. You only build a team around a superior offensive player.

Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 4:08 pm
by underpressure
I would turn it the other way around. His numbers are not that good because he is the first option on this team. In other words, the other team is paying more attention on Andre than on anybody. So he has to create his shots, which are often more difficult.

Re: Sixers' Iguodala has faith he can play for larger fortun

Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 4:12 pm
by Grenerd686
THFM wrote:
Right now I say Iggy should get 60 million nothing more, nothing less



That is a lot of money to give to a player who is at best a role player on a good team. Iggy is having a good year but he does not deserve that type of money. As soon as we bring in a star player (Brand or Arenas) the value of Iggy will go down.

Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 4:25 pm
by ITK9
60mil/6 years.that's it.nothing more! but 60/6< 57/5(that was the extension offer) so i'm not sure if iggy will take this offer.

Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 4:51 pm
by The Guilty Party
I appreciate that you post the entire column and one sentence... but seriously, is there anyway you could swap the column for a link and maybe a little more from you?

I don't want to see Iguodala get anything over $55MIL and if he's adamant that he wants $60MIL plus... well then I'd start to consider sign and trade options if there's that kind of offer for him and if we can obtain something of real value in return.

Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 5:56 pm
by Hewy29
The Guilty Party wrote:I appreciate that you post the entire column and one sentence... but seriously, is there anyway you could swap the column for a link and maybe a little more from you?

I don't want to see Iguodala get anything over $55MIL and if he's adamant that he wants $60MIL plus... well then I'd start to consider sign and trade options if there's that kind of offer for him and if we can obtain something of real value in return.


Im with you on that. That kind of money is ridiculous for a guy who is just now showing something in one full year. Do it for two or three years consistently, and then I would feel fine forking over that kind of money.

Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 6:12 pm
by Skates
Iggy is a player who can be a big part of a core you can build around, but he is not a franchise player if that term has any meaning anymore. he is a high level number 2 guy, much more than a role player, but clearly less than "the man." A lot of the guys that turned down the big extensions last year, like Deng and Gordon, have either suffered through injuries or played poorly. Iggy has done a good job for us despite the contract issues, although I could do without the whining after every non-existent foul call.

Stefanski has consistently called Iggy a "very nice player," and it's pretty obvious he does not see Iggy as a franchise level player either. Give him 10-11 million per year this summer and let him have an opt out after three years. If he develops into a franchsie guy by then you can pay him like it, if he doesn't he's getting paid a fair market salary or you can egt rid of him.

Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 6:52 pm
by Sixers24
Just let the market set itself. We don't have to give anything to Iguodala.

Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 7:11 pm
by dbodner
60 Million is alright if its a 7 year deal.


7 year deals are a thing of the past. Not allowed in current CBA IIRC.

Just let the market set itself. We don't have to give anything to Iguodala.


Amen. Iguodala has zero chance of getting that on the open market (unless we facilitate it in a sign and trade), so I don't see that the worry is.

Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 9:21 pm
by dond
The worst part of all of this is that if Igoudala does not get the $57 million he was previously offered I fear that he will feel foolish that he let that money go. That might bother him to the point that it affects his play and/or causes him to wish to be traded.

Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 10:59 pm
by Temple2k2
dond wrote:The worst part of all of this is that if Igoudala does not get the $57 million he was previously offered I fear that he will feel foolish that he let that money go. That might bother him to the point that it affects his play and/or causes him to wish to be traded.


After reading the article thats how I felt

Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 11:58 pm
by Sleep
Iggy isn't a franchise player. He's a really good complimentary player. Not someone you build a team around.

Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 12:34 am
by big123
Iggy is worth what he was previously offered and didn't take.

Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 12:37 am
by sixersinsider
Unfourtunatley Iggys value around the leauge is sky high.Will go even higher if he helps lead the sixers to the playoffs.Management will let the market set its self. Ive heard Whispers that he will be the top target in the summer of 08.I think memphis will attempt to sighn him for a 5 year contract starting at 13.5 million dollars a year. WHAT YOU GONA DO NOW EDDY.

Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 12:59 am
by SendEm
sixersinsider wrote:Unfourtunatley Iggys value around the leauge is sky high.Will go even higher if he helps lead the sixers to the playoffs.Management will let the market set its self. Ive heard Whispers that he will be the top target in the summer of 08.I think memphis will attempt to sighn him for a 5 year contract starting at 13.5 million dollars a year. WHAT YOU GONA DO NOW EDDY.


BS! :crazy:

Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 1:04 am
by sixersinsider
Hes the face and voice of a potential playoff team..SORRY.. :banghead: but He gona break the bank..

Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 1:10 am
by dbodner
sixersinsider wrote:Hes the face and voice of a potential playoff team..SORRY.. :banghead: but He gona break the bank..


For everyone who says this, I await an answer to:
- who's going to make him an offer that will force the sixers to break the bank on him?

Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 1:35 am
by sixersinsider
Mr MODERATO with all due respect you need to study what teams are capable of offering him this type of payday.Acording to the media there will be a couple of free agents that will be opting out of contracts which will free up money for Franchises(...arenas... Brand Maggetti... Artest ...Marion ...Iverson ) out of these players i believe one or two will actually bolt from their squad. Im sure gordon wont be in chicogos future which will give them money,.... Memphis will be the team to force our hand....Dalla is a projected Olympian.... 13.5 Believe that

Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 1:36 am
by Wildfire
dbodner wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



For everyone who says this, I await an answer to:
- who's going to make him an offer that will force the sixers to break the bank on him?


I have one question, can expiring contracts be trade before FA starts or do they become FA's the minute the season ends?

Because if expiring contracts can be traded on draft day then I could definitely see some teams shed salary and have as much if not more money than us.

Even if you can't, Iggy could always go the route of taking a one year contract and waiting for 09 (which would, of course, be utterly stupid considering everyone else that is available that year). But honestly, if Iggy did that, I might not want him on this team anymore. 57 million is more than enough for what he brings to the table and if he turns it down again then he just doesn't want to be here that badly.