Iggy!!!!! The Bottom Line

[CoachK]

From the looks of things on here it seems to me Andre Iguodala needs to have his own thread on here. So I decided to start one. Seems that people either like him or they don’t. They either think Iggy’s worth the money he’s asking for or they don’t. There seems to be no middle ground when it comes to Iggy.

There were 42 SF (Small Forwards) in the NBA last year that had 1500 minutes and above. 1500 minutes a game equals out to about 18.2 minutes a game. Stats listed below are from those 42 players.

To me the bottom line is this, Iggy was a top 10 SF in the league last year. Sure Iggy’s shooting percentages could be better the bottom line is he scored 1630 points last year and that was 5th in the NBA last year at the SF position. When you come down to it does it really matter how he scored the points? Yeah Iggy disappeared in the playoffs; he’s not the first player to do so, it happens, move onto this year. If his disappearance in the playoffs continues it will be something to be concerned about. You can’t base Iggy’s overall performance from a few games. (Well ok you can, but you’re not making a fair assessment of Iggy if you do so)

Let’s see here, Iggy was 18th in ORB and 6th in DRB and 9th overall in TRB at the SF position. Not to shabby for someone that can’t rebound.

Let’s delve a little deeper into some facts. At the SF position Iggy ranked 3rd in assist with 391, he ranked 1st in steals with 171 and finally he ranked 10th in (BS) blocked shots.

Quite a few on different message boards have compared Iggy to Deng and have come to a conclusion that Deng is a far better player than Iggy. Can any of you back it up with anything beside your feelings?

For those of you who have said that Luol Deng is a better shooter (player) than Iggy and that Iggy can’t get his own shot must live in an alternate universe somewhere. Some have said that Deng is a better 3PT shooter, give me a break, Deng shot 29-3PT shots in the last two years and made 9 of them for a total of 27points. That’s 31% for a two year period. Let’s just say Iggy scored 447 points from 3PT land in the same time period and leave it at that. Deng’s eFG% (Effective Field Goal Percentage) last year was 48.3% and Iggy’s was 49.5%. Can someone please tell me how this makes Deng a better shooter?

Deng is a better offensive rebounder than Iggy and gets more points off offensive rebounds than Iggy does. Deng moves better with and without the ball than Iggy does and commits fewer turnovers because of it. Other than that Iggy does everything else better than Deng.

Statistically speaking Deng is better than Iggy in FG%, FT% and offensive rebounds. Iggy is statistically better in every other category over Deng. Iggy last year had 391 Assist to Deng’s 155. Iggy had 171 steals to Deng’s 57, giving Iggy 114 more steals.


Saying that Iggy will be over compensated at the $12 million range isn’t really fair compared to what the other top 10 players at the SF position are being paid. I know some of you are going to ask is Iggy better than Butler and a few others and I would definitely have to say no way. But maybe they’re under paid, if you take into account what Deng just got in his deal I would have to say the bottom line says that the going rate right now for a player of Iggy’s caliber is around $12 million.

If you don’t like paying Iggy the $12 million name me another player of his caliber that you’re going to get to agree to come to Philly for under $12 million!

[76ersFan1]

From the looks of things on here it seems to me Andre Iguodala needs to have his own thread on here. So I decided to start one. Seems that people either like him or they don’t. They either think Iggy’s worth the money he’s asking for or they don’t. There seems to be no middle ground when it comes to Iggy.

There were 42 SF (Small Forwards) in the NBA last year that had 1500 minutes and above. 1500 minutes a game equals out to about 18.2 minutes a game. Stats listed below are from those 42 players.

To me the bottom line is this, Iggy was a top 10 SF in the league last year. Sure Iggy’s shooting percentages could be better the bottom line is he scored 1630 points last year and that was 5th in the NBA last year at the SF position. When you come down to it does it really matter how he scored the points? Yeah Iggy disappeared in the playoffs; he’s not the first player to do so, it happens, move onto this year. If his disappearance in the playoffs continues it will be something to be concerned about. You can’t base Iggy’s overall performance from a few games. (Well ok you can, but you’re not making a fair assessment of Iggy if you do so)

Let’s see here, Iggy was 18th in ORB and 6th in DRB and 9th overall in TRB at the SF position. Not to shabby for someone that can’t rebound.

Let’s delve a little deeper into some facts. At the SF position Iggy ranked 3rd in assist with 391, he ranked 1st in steals with 171 and finally he ranked 10th in (BS) blocked shots.

Quite a few on different message boards have compared Iggy to Deng and have come to a conclusion that Deng is a far better player than Iggy. Can any of you back it up with anything beside your feelings?

For those of you who have said that Luol Deng is a better shooter (player) than Iggy and that Iggy can’t get his own shot must live in an alternate universe somewhere. Some have said that Deng is a better 3PT shooter, give me a break, Deng shot 29-3PT shots in the last two years and made 9 of them for a total of 27points. That’s 31% for a two year period. Let’s just say Iggy scored 447 points from 3PT land in the same time period and leave it at that. Deng’s eFG% (Effective Field Goal Percentage) last year was 48.3% and Iggy’s was 49.5%. Can someone please tell me how this makes Deng a better shooter?

Deng is a better offensive rebounder than Iggy and gets more points off offensive rebounds than Iggy does. Deng moves better with and without the ball than Iggy does and commits fewer turnovers because of it. Other than that Iggy does everything else better than Deng.

Statistically speaking Deng is better than Iggy in FG%, FT% and offensive rebounds. Iggy is statistically better in every other category over Deng. Iggy last year had 391 Assist to Deng’s 155. Iggy had 171 steals to Deng’s 57, giving Iggy 114 more steals.


Saying that Iggy will be over compensated at the $12 million range isn’t really fair compared to what the other top 10 players at the SF position are being paid. I know some of you are going to ask is Iggy better than Butler and a few others and I would definitely have to say no way. But maybe they’re under paid, if you take into account what Deng just got in his deal I would have to say the bottom line says that the going rate right now for a player of Iggy’s caliber is around $12 million.

If you don’t like paying Iggy the $12 million name me another player of his caliber that you’re going to get to agree to come to Philly for under $12 million!

I'm assuming you used ESPN.com for these stats so i'll use that too when looking at SFs stats.

First of all you have to look at per game averages when doing this. Iguodala played all 82 games of course his amount of points is going to be higher than a lot. He is #5 in total points for SFs but #9 in PPG. So lets look at this at a per game sense. Also keep in mind Iguodala was 2nd in MPG only to LeBron James at SF.

Clearly Iguodalas PPG compared to alot of other SFs is not a fair comparison because he was the clear cut #1 option. Igoudala scored 12.3 PPG when he was the #2 option so to automatically assume he is a better scorer than someone like Paul Pierce (19.6) or Hedo Turkoglu (19.5) is wrong. He might be #9 SFin SCORING but i dont see him as a top 10 SF SCORER in the league if that makes sense.

Iguodala was 26th in ORB PER GAME (1.0 Per game). Iguodala was 10th in DRB PER GAME (4.4 Per game). Good for 11th in TRB. 11th when you are #2 in MPG is pretty shabby to me. I wouldn't consider him a good rebounder, especially with his leaping ability i'd expect him to pull down more than that.

Iguodala is #3 in APG which is pretty impressive but keep in mind not all SFs take the ball up as much as Iguodala. A lot of these SFs play on the wing and don't have the opportunity for as many assists. He was #4 in SPG for SFs, expected from apparently one of the best defenders in the league. He was #11 in BPG at 0.6 BPG, but you would expect him to be higher since he was #2 in MPG at SF.

This is not a fair comparison but Iguodala shot 33% for 3 last year compared to Dengs 36%. Deng only shot 22 but still, while no case can be made that Deng has a better 3, you certainly cant argue that Iguodala is a better three point shooter.

Let's not look at eFG%, lets look at FG%, the ACTUAL % of shots made not the adjusted one. Luol Deng %47.9. Andre Iguodala %45.6. I think this is where the case can be made that Deng is a better shooter.

Deng scores more efficiently than iguodala, dribbles better than iguodala and understands his role better than iguodala too.

Statistically speaking Deng is better than Iguodala at FG%, FT%, 3FG%, TO, ORB, TRB. All while averaging less minutes per game and assuming a smaller role.

Also keep in mind this discussion doesn't include some players who i think could be considered SFs, just like Iguodala can be considered SG/SF. Kobe, Kevin Martin, Jason Richardson, T-Mac, Vince Carter, Manu Ginobili, Ben Gordon. All these players are similar to Iguodala as SG/SF combos but are not involved in this SF statistical breakdown

[The Guilty Party]

From the looks of things on here it seems to me Andre Iguodala needs to have his own thread on here.

Excellent point. I haven't seen any other threads dedicated to talking about this "Iguodala" guy that you speak of. Oh wait.... there's 15 pages about him on this one.

[OhhBF]

Let's not look at eFG%, lets look at FG%, the ACTUAL % of shots made not the adjusted one. Luol Deng %47.9. Andre Iguodala %45.6. I think this is where the case can be made that Deng is a better shooter.

Deng scores more efficiently than iguodala, dribbles better than iguodala and understands his role better than iguodala too.

If you want to talk about efficiency, you can't leave out PPS. Iguodala scores 1.28 PPS and Deng scores 1.19 PPS. According to 82games Deng takes about 40% of his shots from inside, while Iguodala only takes around 30% of his shots from inside. Iguodala's 2point% is 49.6%, and Deng's is 48.2%. Iguodala is a better shooter than Deng. He takes more difficult shots and he was the primary offensive option on his team. Gordon was the first option on Chicago, not Deng.

An easy argument can be made that Iguodala is better 3point shooter than Deng. First of all, Iguodala takes a little less than 4 a game. Now, quantity is no indication of quality, but the fact that Deng takes so few is an admission by him that he is incapable of consistently making shots from that far from the basket. And while Iguodala is a slightly below league average 3point shooter, Deng isn't a 3point shooter at all.

It appears quite obvious that Iguodala is a better shooter, and he also scores more efficiently than Deng.

I also fail to see how one can claim that Deng dribbles better than Iguodala. Iguodala has an A/TO of 1.83 to Deng's 1.29. Iguodala is counted on to handle the ball for his team. Deng is not. Deng's Aper48 doesn't even come close to Iguodala's APG. That's a huge difference.

The only thing I see that Deng has on Iguodala statistically is rebounding.

Oh, and if you're going to compare two players with noticeable differences in mpg or gp, it would be wise to use their PER48min or PER40min avgs to balance their stats out. Obviously, a good enough sample size of the stats you're basing the comparison on will also be necessary.

[Sixerscan]

First of all you have to look at per game averages when doing this. Iguodala played all 82 games of course his amount of points is going to be higher than a lot. He is #5 in total points for SFs but #9 in PPG. So lets look at this at a per game sense. Also keep in mind Iguodala was 2nd in MPG only to LeBron James at SF.

Absolutely true. But if you're going to correct him (which absolutely needed to be done since counting stats are always a silly way to go about ranking people) i hope you dont mind if I do the same.

Statistically speaking Deng is better than Iguodala at FG%, FT%, 3FG%, TO, ORB, TRB. All while averaging less minutes per game and assuming a smaller role.

FG%, FT and 3 go into TS%-> Iggy has the higher TS%
TOs-> Iggy Has the superior A/TO ratio. And, to take your own arguement if someone has a larger role (which I disagree with BTW) shouldn't more TOs be expected?
Rebounds-> Yeah Dengs a better rebounder. Iguodala plays guard a lot more though.

As far as his role, Deng took more shots per minute he just played less. The year before he took more shots than Iggy did.

Their usage rates (If you don't know that's how often they are involved in the final outcome of a possession) are similar, with Iguodala being 1% more, 23.2 to Deng's 22.1. And remember, Andre averages about twice as many assists so much more of Deng's rate is shooting the ball. So I guess he has a larger role, but it's not a hugely larger role.

Clearly Iguodalas PPG compared to alot of other SFs is not a fair comparison because he was the clear cut #1 option. Igoudala scored 12.3 PPG when he was the #2 option so to automatically assume he is a better scorer than someone like Paul Pierce (19.6) or Hedo Turkoglu (19.5) is wrong. He might be #9 SFin SCORING but i dont see him as a top 10 SF SCORER in the league if that makes sense.

Usage rates
Pierce 23.4 (9th among SFs)
Turk- 23.2 (10th)
Iggy- 23.2 (12th- I assume only by percentage points though)

(For reference when he scored 12.3 a night his usage rate was 13.7)

I have no idea why people think Iguodala is this huge ball hog. How can he be when he plays with Green and Louis so much?

Iguodala was 26th in ORB PER GAME (1.0 Per game). Iguodala was 10th in DRB PER GAME (4.4 Per game). Good for 11th in TRB. 11th when you are #2 in MPG is pretty shabby to me. I wouldn't consider him a good rebounder, especially with his leaping ability i'd expect him to pull down more than that.

Iguodala is #3 in APG which is pretty impressive but keep in mind not all SFs take the ball up as much as Iguodala. A lot of these SFs play on the wing and don't have the opportunity for as many assists.

Kind of being unfair here don't you think? You're belittling his assists by saying he played up top a lot but you're not giving him the benefit of the doubt for the rebounds (especially offensive boards)?

He was #11 in BPG at 0.6 BPG, but you would expect him to be higher since he was #2 in MPG at SF.

Bah who cares about blocks from a wing?

Also keep in mind this discussion doesn't include some players who i think could be considered SFs, just like Iguodala can be considered SG/SF. Kobe, Kevin Martin, Jason Richardson, T-Mac, Vince Carter, Manu Ginobili, Ben Gordon. All these players are similar to Iguodala as SG/SF combos but are not involved in this SF statistical breakdown

Agreed. Plus I think we should put him moreso against other people's 2s since thats where hes playing next year.

[CoachK]

From the looks of things on here it seems to me Andre Iguodala needs to have his own thread on here.

Excellent point. I haven't seen any other threads dedicated to talking about this "Iguodala" guy that you speak of. Oh wait.... there's 15 pages about him on this one.

Thanks for pointing that out for me. You're my hero.