2014

[cgf]

Gotze is overrated on most days. Anyone still think he's better than Neymar? cgf?

I'm not sure he's better than Harry Kane tbh

He's a darn good player but people were pretending he's got Messi, Ronaldo, Best in the World potential. He's not that kind of player. He's David Silva.

I always compared him to Iniesta and he absolutely has that talent. He's stagnated a bit as pep is so obsessed with turning him into Messi rather than excepting that he's Iniesta, while Neymar has proven he can do work against actual defenders. So no I don't still take him over Neymar, but when Pep leaves that could well change again. Mario's talent has gotten under-rated just because he's not a goalscorer like Messi yet pep keeps trying to force him to become that kind of player, even though that's never been Mario's game.

As for Kane, I like that kid. His off the ball movement is very mueller-esque and he's on great form. But, just like mueller, he's not in their class for talent. Still an awesome youngin and one of the few really compelling reasons to watch the EPL this year; just not one with the raw talent of a Neymar/Gotze/Eggestein/Werner

[Dirk]

:oops:

The guy will have to leave, the fans hate him.

Looks like Benzema will be out vs Atletico. Let's see if Ancelotti gets creative. Atletico will press like hell early to get that away goal

Doubt it. Atletico will sit back as always. Frustrate Real and then try to make the most of dead ball situations or pounce on one of Ramo's typical giveaways.

That's not how they've beaten them this year though. They come out pressing hard and usually get an early goal and then sit back and defend a little more. The usually take the midfield out of the game. I think they sat back on the last game just to avoid an away goal, they should be more aggressive in defense this time trying to get a mistake off the pressure

An Atletico team that is more aggressive pressing high, opens the game up and allows for Bale and Ronaldo's pace to be more of an issue. I don't think that'll happen. The interesting thing about these matchups is that Atletico are in Real's heads. They have a mental block - you can tell by how much they miss in front of goal or the bad decisions they make once they are in the final third. This is a typical case of the more the clock runs down, the more likely it is that Atletico will fluke into a goal, whether on a corner or on a mess up by Real's back four.

Benzema will play vs Atletico, but will miss the league game tomorrow.

[Ted Lasso]

I'm not sure he's better than Harry Kane tbh

He's a darn good player but people were pretending he's got Messi, Ronaldo, Best in the World potential. He's not that kind of player. He's David Silva.

I always compared him to Iniesta and he absolutely has that talent. He's stagnated a bit as pep is so obsessed with turning him into Messi rather than excepting that he's Iniesta, while Neymar has proven he can do work against actual defenders. So no I don't still take him over Neymar, but when Pep leaves that could well change again. Mario's talent has gotten under-rated just because he's not a goalscorer like Messi.

I don't find him to be similar to Iniesta stylistically - I doubt Gotze can function as a central midfielder primarily, for one thing - and i think David Silva is a much closer comparison.

Perhaps in terms of stature in a very successful team prime Iniesta is his max state, but Iniesta was so valuable at his best because he was such a rare type of player. He is the reason teams have taken chances on guys like Dembele who can go on mazy (yet ultimately unfruitful) runs centrally from deep in midfield.

[cgf]

He's a darn good player but people were pretending he's got Messi, Ronaldo, Best in the World potential. He's not that kind of player. He's David Silva.

I always compared him to Iniesta and he absolutely has that talent. He's stagnated a bit as pep is so obsessed with turning him into Messi rather than excepting that he's Iniesta, while Neymar has proven he can do work against actual defenders. So no I don't still take him over Neymar, but when Pep leaves that could well change again. Mario's talent has gotten under-rated just because he's not a goalscorer like Messi.

I don't find him to be similar to Iniesta stylistically - I doubt Gotze can function as a central midfielder primarily, for one thing - and i think David Silva is a much closer comparison.

Perhaps in terms of stature in a very successful team prime Iniesta is his max state, but Iniesta was so valuable at his best because he was such a rare type of player. He is the reason teams have taken chances on guys like Dembele who can go on mazy (yet ultimately unfruitful) runs centrally from deep in midfield.

I...that's exactly why I compare Mario to Iniesta. His ability to go on long mazy runs from the half line, even through crazy traffic, before playing a pass is exactly where he stands out the most; or at least it was before he left for Munich.

That's why I argued that his future should be deeper in the middle than the 10 spot he played before pep got a hold of him; and why I thought that Götze-Thiago in front of Lahm/Javi would be the midfield trio that they rode to glory when pep was brought in and Gotze/thiago announced.

[Ted Lasso]

I always compared him to Iniesta and he absolutely has that talent. He's stagnated a bit as pep is so obsessed with turning him into Messi rather than excepting that he's Iniesta, while Neymar has proven he can do work against actual defenders. So no I don't still take him over Neymar, but when Pep leaves that could well change again. Mario's talent has gotten under-rated just because he's not a goalscorer like Messi.

I don't find him to be similar to Iniesta stylistically - I doubt Gotze can function as a central midfielder primarily, for one thing - and i think David Silva is a much closer comparison.

Perhaps in terms of stature in a very successful team prime Iniesta is his max state, but Iniesta was so valuable at his best because he was such a rare type of player. He is the reason teams have taken chances on guys like Dembele who can go on mazy (yet ultimately unfruitful) runs centrally from deep in midfield.

I...that's exactly why I compare Mario to Iniesta. His ability to go on long mazy runs from the half line, even through crazy traffic, before playing a pass is exactly where he stands out the most; or at least it was before he left for Munich.

That's why I argued that his future should be deeper in the middle than the 10 spot he played before pep got a hold of him.

I assumed so, but Gotze is not physical or defensive enough a player to survive at central midfield permanently.

Pirlo is not physical but his positioning is brilliant. Yaya Toure doesn't even bother with defensive fundamentals at times, but he can bulldoze people. And such players still need to be compensated for to create tactical balance. If you've got neither attribute, then you're an attacking midfielder, especially if your defensive strength is high pressing like Gotze.

[DD12]

Hold on hold on pep is leaving now? I thought they were going to be the best in Europe and would destroy every european team said by you while i was saying he will be fired and he is an awful coach.

[ppedro123]

Bayern has like 13 players fully fit.

Calm down, people.

[Merc_Porto]

Bayern is still the favorite to go through. No doubt about that.

[DD12]

Bayern has like 13 players fully fit.

Calm down, people.

Is that our problem if their management didn't invest in their depth of the squad?

In fact, they can go through this stage also. I've said numerous times to take a bet with someone who thinks Bayern will win it all but there is no answer so far I am sure if bayern wins, they will come out like they did when Germany won the WC

[cgf]

I don't find him to be similar to Iniesta stylistically - I doubt Gotze can function as a central midfielder primarily, for one thing - and i think David Silva is a much closer comparison.

Perhaps in terms of stature in a very successful team prime Iniesta is his max state, but Iniesta was so valuable at his best because he was such a rare type of player. He is the reason teams have taken chances on guys like Dembele who can go on mazy (yet ultimately unfruitful) runs centrally from deep in midfield.

I...that's exactly why I compare Mario to Iniesta. His ability to go on long mazy runs from the half line, even through crazy traffic, before playing a pass is exactly where he stands out the most; or at least it was before he left for Munich.

That's why I argued that his future should be deeper in the middle than the 10 spot he played before pep got a hold of him.

I assumed so, but Gotze is not physical or defensive enough a player to survive at central midfield permanently.

Pirlo is not physical but his positioning is brilliant. Yaya Toure doesn't even bother with defensive fundamentals at times, but he can bulldoze people. And such players still need to be compensated for to create tactical balance. If you've got neither attribute, then you're an attacking midfielder, especially if your defensive strength is high pressing like Gotze.

There would certainly be a learning curve and he'd need to keep bulking up, but the later is true if he's to become the 9 that pep wants him to be to. As for his positioning, I was always happy with how well he read the action against the ball. True BVB pressed high, but Mario was often closer to Ilkay/Kehl/Bender than he was to Lewy and Reus as the man supporting the press, not leading it on the frontline. Which is why I figured he would have an easier transition into a deeper position than Kroos, who's done very well in deeper spots since then.

Mario would never be a playmaking 6 like Pirlo cause he needs to be able to run with the ball; nor will he ever be a physical beast like Yaya. But if he was converted into an 8 he could absolutely become a brilliant one like Iniesta did. Wouldn't happen over night, but once he adjusted to the position and learned its nuances he could be very special in that role...especially if thiago was ever healthy enough to play the Xavi role as the more stationary metronome.

[cgf]

Bayern has like 13 players fully fit.

Calm down, people.

Is that our problem if their management didn't invest in their depth of the squad?

In fact, they can go through this stage also. I've said numerous times to take a bet with someone who thinks Bayern will win it all but there is no answer so far I am sure if bayern wins, they will come out like they did when Germany won the WC

...you know that that was the bet I have on going, right? If chelsea had won I'd be wearing a pats/Boston avi after this season, if Bayern win I get to pick a Giants/pats Avi.

Their injury crisis goes beyond roster planning. The guys who've missed serious time this year could make a CL winning starting 11. We're talking about Robben, Ribery, Thiago, Schweini, Lahm, Alaba, Benatia, Badstuber, and Javi missing serious time and I'm not sure that's everyone who's gone down this year.

That's:
Ribery - xxx - Robben
Thiago - Basti
Javi
Alaba - Bads - Benatia - Lahm

Who have missed serious pt.

I really dislike them, only BFC do I truly hate, and even I have to admit that their injury crisis has been as bad as Dortmund or Schalke's this year.

Makes me happy they thought that a 100000000 year old Xabi would help fix this, but that's still a crazy amount of man games lost for an extraordinary amount of talent.

[TyrusRose2425]

Bayerns ridiculous depth is the reason we are still somewhat breathing. Better management of depth? Lol wtf they might have the deepest team in the world

[DD12]

If they had, they didnt have 12 fully fit players.

[Gandalf]

Wth..do you want a team to have 30+ players or what? And let them all just rot on the bench IN CASE of major injury crisis...???

[Andi Obst]

Wth..do you want a team to have 30+ players or what? And let them all just rot on the bench IN CASE of major injury crisis...???

Yeah, let's do it the Magath-way and have 35 players on the team

[TyrusRose2425]

If they had, they didnt have 12 fully fit players.

Then by your logic no team in the world ever bothered to get enough depth ever

[DD12]

Well you are going to play with what you have. If your backups are not good, then no need to complain. We made semi finals 13 players in euro08 and 4-5 players were playing at the position they have never played before.

Also, bayern's current squad is still good for porto.

[TyrusRose2425]

Well you are going to play with what you have. If your backups are not good, then no need to complain. We made semi finals 13 players in euro08 and 4-5 players were playing at the position they have never played before.

Also, bayern's current squad is still good for porto.

You can't have 11 quality backups. Backups have to be versatile and slot into different positions or you'll have chemistry issues all year, unless you're banking on an ultra rare situation like Bayern this year. It's a problem when most of the starting 11 is injured and then their backups are hurt too. Everything else is just FIFA 15 talk where you can have a team with 40 players rated 80+ and have no issues.

[EArl]

No Modric, Bale, Marcelo and now possibly no Benzema really does stack the odds in Atletis favor. Good thing its in Bernabeu which is about the only thing they have looking forward for themselves.

[Dirk]

No Modric, Bale, Marcelo and now possibly no Benzema really does stack the odds in Atletis favor. Good thing its in Bernabeu which is about the only thing they have looking forward for themselves.

Terrible luck. Benzema is now unlikely to play according to their papers - I think he will play though(too important of a game and of a player to miss out on the game of the seaason) but it doesn't look like he will be fully fit.

I think Coentrao will be fine, he has a good history in these sort of games. More reliable than Marcelo on the defensive end and ok going forward - again just not sure about his fitness, seems to be always hurt.

Bale has been struggling this season and hasn't made a jump in his form for Real. He's had massive problems dealing with the lack of space and has been found out a few too many times not really still being able to play in tighter spaces. He'll be a big miss though, because he's an athlete and he would be huge to pressure without the ball and then take advantage of the two or three times he'd get the ball in space.

Real Madrid will need to get creative and... pratical. I wouldn't be shocked if they played Pepe in midfield or something like that. No need to try and be adventurous in the lineup. They have a Brazilian guy who just arrived, Illarramendi who hasn't responded well to the high fee he cost. On the other side, they'll probably face Tiago, Gabi, Koke, Arda who operate like a machine and have been a nightmare for Real. Very challenging situation. I think Real need to play it safe in midfield, match their four guys and hope that Isco breaks off his slump and puts in a good shift in midfield.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4_qO026U0w[/youtube]

Porto fans at the airport to show support as players departed for Germany.

Still pessimistic about this. Just think something bad will happen(look for the team to shoot themselves in the foot or ahem a little help from the ref) or more simply, Bayern will naturally be better and do enough to qualify, last year during the first half they had a good spell of pressure and if they're able to do that for a longer period, I can see Porto buckling.

Porto are coached by a guy who is very close to Guardiola and share the same philosophy. It's a team that's based on possession, high pressure... and they are going up against a team filled with world champions, at their venue... and will be asked to defend and be disciplined. Something they haven't been doing much all season and aren't really adapted to it. I also miss seeing a speedy guy like Tello on the lineup, in the first leg, Porto made the most of mistakes and a long ball forward, but only had two good counter attacks outside that. It would be surprising to see Porto going through without having to score away and for that they'll have to make the most of the few chances they'll have with a team that's more adapted to play possession football, not sure they'll be able to have periods where they can control the ball against a team like Bayern and in Germany.

This season there's a drop off from last year in quality. Atletico isn't as good. Real's health issues. Bayern's health issues. Barcelona is not really much better than last year but they've been effective(scoring from dead ball situations, grinding out results more than in the past)... there's no dominant team though. Barcelona is the favourite by default but no team is as scary as they were in previous occasions.