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Nuntius wrote:

Blame Rasho wrote:Most people “don’t know” how big of a country Indonesia is.

Yeah, I got that. I was just expanding on that part of the post.

druggas wrote:People taking sports way too seriously.

KhalilS wrote:

druggas wrote:People taking sports way too seriously.

I don't think this was the case in Indonesia, but many times, sports rivalry comes from sectarian/class/ethnic/religious background, Galsgow Rangers (Protestant) Vs Celtic (Irish Catholic) in Scotland, Bercelona represents the Catalan, Athletico Bilbao represents and Basque is Spain, while Real Madrid is the royal club, so in many cases, it is more serious than just sports rivalry.
Western societies are too rich, and comfy for the sectarian violence in football matches now, but lest we forget that barely 30 years ago, a fight broke in the Balkan between Serbs and Croat in a football match, and in other places in the world bloody conflicts are still very much alive.

KhalilS wrote:

druggas wrote:People taking sports way too seriously.

I don't think this was the case in Indonesia, but many times, sports rivalry comes from sectarian/class/ethnic/religious background, Galsgow Rangers (Protestant) Vs Celtic (Irish Catholic) in Scotland, Bercelona represents the Catalan, Athletico Bilbao represents and Basque is Spain, while Real Madrid is the royal club, so in many cases, it is more serious than just sports rivalry.
Western societies are too rich, and comfy for the sectarian violence in football matches now, but lest we forget that barely 30 years ago, a fight broke in the Balkan between Serbs and Croat in a football match, and in other places in the world bloody conflicts are still very much alive.

basketballwacko2 wrote:

One Last Shot wrote:This is one of the most devastating event and 2nd most casualties in sports history. I just found out that in 1964, same thing happen in Peru with more than 300 killed. Same sports. Maybe football fans are really passionate about the game.

www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/football/breaking-indonesia-fans-dead-riot-28132714.amp

Nothing like this has ever happened at an American "Football" game.

iLLmatic860 wrote:I thought it was football football but still crazy lol

theforumblue wrote:

Nuntius wrote:

Blame Rasho wrote:Most people “don’t know” how big of a country Indonesia is.

Yeah, I got that. I was just expanding on that part of the post.

for some reason i just thought of it as bunch of medium sized islands. had no idea how big it was. i knew they were largely muslims but didnt realize they had the largest population of muslims in the world.

Nuntius wrote:So, based on the article in the OP (and obviously assuming that their reporting is accurate) this is what happened:

- Fans of the home team stormed the pitch after their team lost.

- The police pushed them back into the stands, hitting some with their batons and kicking others.

- Tear gas was launched on the pitch and into the stands as the situation escalated.

- Fans struggled to find refuge and many have subsequently lost their lives after falling to the ground or being trampled on.

- Local media outlet Kompas claims the tear gas did not disperse, leading to shortness of breath and loss of consciousness.

Based on all that, this was not a situation were fans of opposing teams came to blows. This looks to be between and the fans and the police and, sadly, it seems that the police escalated that situation by throwing tear gas into the stands. Doing that is incredibly dangerous. The stands are not a flat surface. If you cannot see due to the tear gas then you can easily trip, fall and get crushed. It also causes panic and panic in such an environment can easily cause stampedes. We have seen that happen in the past in similar events in stadiums (the Karaiskakis Stadium disaster always come to mind when I read about stuff like that but that's definitely because I'm Greek and I grew up hearing about that particular tragedy).

The fact that the tear gas did not disperse could mean that they were expired. I have seen police forces use expired tear gas pretty often in my neck of the woods so it wouldn't shock me if that was the case here. This seems like an extremely sad situation that could have been avoided. I hope that the families of the victims are able to find peace. Rest in peace

Blame Rasho wrote:I love soccer but honestly Indonesia has never been on my radar as a football crazy country. I had to check their ranking and they are ranked 155 in fifa which is absurd given how big that country is. Most people know have a grasp of how big that country is.

heezyo2o wrote:

Blame Rasho wrote:I love soccer but honestly Indonesia has never been on my radar as a football crazy country. I had to check their ranking and they are ranked 155 in fifa which is absurd given how big that country is. Most people know have a grasp of how big that country is.

Population theory never really works in sports otherwise countries like the US would be near the top all the time

RSP83 wrote:

Nuntius wrote:So, based on the article in the OP (and obviously assuming that their reporting is accurate) this is what happened:

- Fans of the home team stormed the pitch after their team lost.

- The police pushed them back into the stands, hitting some with their batons and kicking others.

- Tear gas was launched on the pitch and into the stands as the situation escalated.

- Fans struggled to find refuge and many have subsequently lost their lives after falling to the ground or being trampled on.

- Local media outlet Kompas claims the tear gas did not disperse, leading to shortness of breath and loss of consciousness.

Based on all that, this was not a situation were fans of opposing teams came to blows. This looks to be between and the fans and the police and, sadly, it seems that the police escalated that situation by throwing tear gas into the stands. Doing that is incredibly dangerous. The stands are not a flat surface. If you cannot see due to the tear gas then you can easily trip, fall and get crushed. It also causes panic and panic in such an environment can easily cause stampedes. We have seen that happen in the past in similar events in stadiums (the Karaiskakis Stadium disaster always come to mind when I read about stuff like that but that's definitely because I'm Greek and I grew up hearing about that particular tragedy).

The fact that the tear gas did not disperse could mean that they were expired. I have seen police forces use expired tear gas pretty often in my neck of the woods so it wouldn't shock me if that was the case here. This seems like an extremely sad situation that could have been avoided. I hope that the families of the victims are able to find peace. Rest in peace

I'm a local there. You describe what happened correctly. It's been on the news all day. The whole country is mourning the loss.

Just want to add a few additional details. This match was between 2 of the biggest rivalry in the local league, it's between 2 clubs (Arema and Persebaya) from the same province (East Java). We don't have that kind of rivalry equivalent in the NBA. But this is normal in soccer (usually called derby match).

Yes, the police security protocol was at fault here. But at the same time, Indonesia's national soccer association and the league organizer is one of the worst in the world. Prior to the match they've been warned by security intelligence that they should move the match to earlier time to avoid hosting the match at evening time, which according to the security intelligence they found high security concern/risk. But that warning was ignored. Another stupid thing was the league organizer somehow sold more tickets (42k) more than the stadium capacity allowed (35k). Despite they were also given permission to only sell 25k tickets based on agreement with the police to reduce risk. This was somehow ignored and the police did nothing. Yes, this country is severely corrupted.