The Official 2024 Offseason Thread

[King4Day]

Has anyone heard from SunsRback4Good?
It doesn't seem to let me PM so I'm not sure if there's an issue with their account or mine.

[Ghost of Kleine]

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10122234-a-3-team-trade-to-land-kevin-durant-with-the-golden-state-warriors

A 3-Team Trade to Land Kevin Durant with the Golden State Warriors

ANDY BAILEY X
MAY 23, 2024

The Trade

Suns Receive:
Jonathan Kuminga, Brandin Podziemski, Kevon Looney, Caleb Houstan, a 2025 first-round pick from Orlando (via Denver), a 2026 first-round pick from Golden State, a 2028 first-round pick from Golden State

Suns Lose:
Kevin Durant and a 2028 second-round pick (via Boston)

Magic Receive:
Chris Paul, Gary Payton II, and a 2028 second-round pick (via Boston)

Magic Lose:
Jett Howard, Caleb Houstan, and a 2025 first-round pick (via Denver)

Warriors Receive:
Kevin Durant and Jett Howard.

IF Durant decides he wants to leave..................................................................

Normally I don't really like the returns being offered for KD, But I'd think this is one of the better packages I've seen from Golden State. Although I don't really think Orlando would do this. And I'm not sure if I'd rather have Wiggins over Kuminga for overall production/impact. I don't really know that much about Kuminga in comparison to Wiggins?

Would anyone here do this package (IF KD asked out) for this package? or would you want different players coming back? I for my part kind of think this is solid depth pieces AND the 3 firsts look very promising too.

[bwgood77]

Value wise I think yes we were not going to get a better immediate deal than trading CP3 for Beal but that move immediately handicapped any future moves we could have made to sign a MLE level player down the line.

On paper this looks great but as the playoffs showed we would have been better off going for a big that could contribute and we didn't need another shooting guard for offense. We should have prioritized rebounding and defense not more offense.

We were already handicapped. Who do you really think we would have gotten for the MLE? So ultimately, keeping CP3 and Shamet this year? Then letting them expire and use the MLE this summer?

If we kept CP3 and Shamet this year we would have certainly been a lot worse. If we traded them for something else (which would have been hard to do since they had negative value) we would have had to take salary back, and not likely get a very useful player. I doubt a team would have traded an expiring for CP3 and Shamet so we likely still have another big contract (like Poole or Simmons or whatever) and can't utilize the MLE anyway.

Once we made the KD trade we were screwed. That was 1 million x worse than the Beal trade, which was amazing we even did...I thought we would possibly cut CP3 and eat the $15 million last summer. That would leave Shamet to trade and maybe the MLE which likely doesn't get you much.

I don't disagree that we need a better big, but it's not like there are options out there. Nurkic isn't the right C for this team for the playoffs...but we were not likely finding a better C with him...unless it was a different trade utililizing Ayton. But we also got Allen.

No matter what we did we probably were not going to be a serious contender...but as I've mentioned before I would have kept our core and picks and retooled...we would have had lots of options and picks and wouldn't have to sacrifice our future for an old KD that will likely break down sooner than later.

I don't know if Washington would have agreed but we could have traded Shamet + the #22 pick for Gafford?

Or maybe Little plus one of our minimum signings like KBD or Yuta plus the #22 pick for Gafford? I'm of the opinion that a MLE type player would have been more impactful us given how poorly Beal performed against the Wolves.

He was just a net negative and a non factor and for 50 million that is just something I cannot stomach.

Gafford has went from underrated to overrated pretty quickly. As a starting C he wouldn't have done much. Lively is much better for Dallas. Anyway, having Beal instead of Chris Paul and Gafford, still makes us better. And do we still do the Ayton trade in your scenario to get Allen and Nurkic? Or keep Ayton? Or trade him for someone else? Not sure who would have wanted him...since most teams are pretty set at C.

[bwgood77]

We were already handicapped. Who do you really think we would have gotten for the MLE? So ultimately, keeping CP3 and Shamet this year? Then letting them expire and use the MLE this summer?

If we kept CP3 and Shamet this year we would have certainly been a lot worse. If we traded them for something else (which would have been hard to do since they had negative value) we would have had to take salary back, and not likely get a very useful player. I doubt a team would have traded an expiring for CP3 and Shamet so we likely still have another big contract (like Poole or Simmons or whatever) and can't utilize the MLE anyway.

Once we made the KD trade we were screwed. That was 1 million x worse than the Beal trade, which was amazing we even did...I thought we would possibly cut CP3 and eat the $15 million last summer. That would leave Shamet to trade and maybe the MLE which likely doesn't get you much.

I don't disagree that we need a better big, but it's not like there are options out there. Nurkic isn't the right C for this team for the playoffs...but we were not likely finding a better C with him...unless it was a different trade utililizing Ayton. But we also got Allen.

No matter what we did we probably were not going to be a serious contender...but as I've mentioned before I would have kept our core and picks and retooled...we would have had lots of options and picks and wouldn't have to sacrifice our future for an old KD that will likely break down sooner than later.

I don't know if Washington would have agreed but we could have traded Shamet + the #22 pick for Gafford?

Or maybe Little plus one of our minimum signings like KBD or Yuta plus the #22 pick for Gafford? I'm of the opinion that a MLE type player would have been more impactful us given how poorly Beal performed against the Wolves.

He was just a net negative and a non factor and for 50 million that is just something I cannot stomach.

We couldn't trade #22 at the past deadline or past offseason.

Oh yeah, plus that. We can't even trade it until after the draft, or draft night, so we still would have had him this year (Shamet).

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Once we made the KD trade we were screwed.

Nutshelled even more. Fn fratboy front officing.

You know... if I look at Ishbia's decisions through a marketing lens, they make a lot more sense. Not marketing for the Suns, but for himself. He wants exposure, to be in the news. Sure, it'd be nice to win - that's good PR, too. But big names and big money will put you in the news as well.

You know what doesn't make headlines? Reasonableness, steadiness, stealth and subtlety. Player development. Focusing on the team's long-term trajectory. Patience. Being "hands off."

Obviously he's also trying to win, but I've always been very skeptical that you can just spend your way to contention.

The only indicator I can think of to suggest Mat Ishbia doesn't care about his PR is his decision to call our G League team the Valley Suns! that's terrible

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

The only indicator I can think of to suggest Mat Ishbia doesn't care about his PR is his decision to call our G League team the Valley Suns! that's terrible

I thought a second about this... calling the G Leaguers the "Valley Suns" might make PR sense if you were considering changing the name of the team:

Does "The Arizona Suns" roll off the tongue? I don't know, but it would make headlines.

[sunsbum]

For the life of me, I don’t understand why these old guys get pay raises when you know their production is going south.

How I view every politician rn.

[NE1Care]

Goodbye guys, it’s been fun while it lasted. But I have nobody in my life and it’s finally time to leave earth. It’s been a pleasure getting to know you all over the last decade and I’ll cherish every little moment. My life is in gods hands now as the clock is ticking away. I’ll likely miss watching Suns games and maybe just maybe they’ll win a title one year, but it’ll happen without me watching it. Well, I have nothing else to say, again it’s been a privilege making GT’s and getting to know everyone here. Goodbye.

We are all in this together. Where are you at? Please give me a call and let's talk. You do not know me, I do not know you but we both love the Suns. Let's talk. I was unable to private message you.
-Matt twozerotwo215-ate23ate.

[garrick]

We were already handicapped. Who do you really think we would have gotten for the MLE? So ultimately, keeping CP3 and Shamet this year? Then letting them expire and use the MLE this summer?

If we kept CP3 and Shamet this year we would have certainly been a lot worse. If we traded them for something else (which would have been hard to do since they had negative value) we would have had to take salary back, and not likely get a very useful player. I doubt a team would have traded an expiring for CP3 and Shamet so we likely still have another big contract (like Poole or Simmons or whatever) and can't utilize the MLE anyway.

Once we made the KD trade we were screwed. That was 1 million x worse than the Beal trade, which was amazing we even did...I thought we would possibly cut CP3 and eat the $15 million last summer. That would leave Shamet to trade and maybe the MLE which likely doesn't get you much.

I don't disagree that we need a better big, but it's not like there are options out there. Nurkic isn't the right C for this team for the playoffs...but we were not likely finding a better C with him...unless it was a different trade utililizing Ayton. But we also got Allen.

No matter what we did we probably were not going to be a serious contender...but as I've mentioned before I would have kept our core and picks and retooled...we would have had lots of options and picks and wouldn't have to sacrifice our future for an old KD that will likely break down sooner than later.

I don't know if Washington would have agreed but we could have traded Shamet + the #22 pick for Gafford?

Or maybe Little plus one of our minimum signings like KBD or Yuta plus the #22 pick for Gafford? I'm of the opinion that a MLE type player would have been more impactful us given how poorly Beal performed against the Wolves.

He was just a net negative and a non factor and for 50 million that is just something I cannot stomach.

Gafford has went from underrated to overrated pretty quickly. As a starting C he wouldn't have done much. Lively is much better for Dallas. Anyway, having Beal instead of Chris Paul and Gafford, still makes us better. And do we still do the Ayton trade in your scenario to get Allen and Nurkic? Or keep Ayton? Or trade him for someone else? Not sure who would have wanted him...since most teams are pretty set at C.

I would have tried to play up DA's value at least since his trade value after the playoffs was at its lowest, showcase him throughout the season and see if teams are interested.

You are right though that it was primarily the KD trade that screwed us, not having enough draft picks to use in future trades and then gutting the team of enough decent contracts to use in trades.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

[Saberestar]

What about Jose Alvarado as a trade target?

I think he checks some boxes for us:

He is a PG capable of changing the pace of the game.
He is young (26) and we need to get a bit younger next season.

Defensive mentality. He is a pest and creates havoc, nice POA defender even though he is small.

Offensively he is a good ball handler but he can play off the ball too. Good on the catch-and-shot from 3.

High effort, high motor ALWAYS. $2M in 2024/25.

Would you trade #22 for him?

[Qwigglez]

Read on Twitter

It's like the Suns looked at one metric that showed Nurkic being a good defender against Jokic and said "Yup, let's get him." Instead of looking at how poor Nurkic is against all other teams and how bad he performs in the playoffs.

[PerkinsFor3]

What about Jose Alvarado as a trade target?

I think he checks some boxes for us:

He is a PG capable of changing the pace of the game.
He is young (26) and we need to get a bit younger next season.

Defensive mentality. He is a pest and creates havoc, nice POA defender even though he is small.

Offensively he is a good ball handler but he can play off the ball too. Good on the catch-and-shot from 3.

High effort, high motor ALWAYS. $2M in 2024/25.

Would you trade #22 for him?

Why would NOP do that?

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

It's like the Suns looked at one metric that showed Nurkic being a good defender against Jokic and said "Yup, let's get him." Instead of looking at how poor Nurkic is against all other teams and how bad he performs in the playoffs.

[RaisingArizona]

Has anyone heard from SunsRback4Good?
It doesn't seem to let me PM so I'm not sure if there's an issue with their account or mine.

I am checking in on this. We have a mutual friend. I'll keep you posted.

[Saberestar]

What about Jose Alvarado as a trade target?

I think he checks some boxes for us:

He is a PG capable of changing the pace of the game.
He is young (26) and we need to get a bit younger next season.

Defensive mentality. He is a pest and creates havoc, nice POA defender even though he is small.

Offensively he is a good ball handler but he can play off the ball too. Good on the catch-and-shot from 3.

High effort, high motor ALWAYS. $2M in 2024/25.

Would you trade #22 for him?

Why would NOP do that?

Well, I haven't think from the Pelicans side. Alvarado just came to my mind as a potential trade target who plays PG.

#22 is a good asset. I know that they have #21, so probably they aren't interested about it.

[PerkinsFor3]

Even if they didnt have a 1st, they wouldnt be interested, as its hard to find a player as good as Alvarado with the 20th pick in a draft.

[bigfoot]

For the life of me, I don’t understand why these old guys get pay raises when you know their production is going south.

How I view every politician rn.

How most youngsters in real jobs feel about those 50+ year old managers, directors, and C-suiters.

[kennydorglas]

Goodbye guys, it’s been fun while it lasted. But I have nobody in my life and it’s finally time to leave earth. It’s been a pleasure getting to know you all over the last decade and I’ll cherish every little moment. My life is in gods hands now as the clock is ticking away. I’ll likely miss watching Suns games and maybe just maybe they’ll win a title one year, but it’ll happen without me watching it. Well, I have nothing else to say, again it’s been a privilege making GT’s and getting to know everyone here. Goodbye.

Stay strong my Boi.
We all love u here and hope to keep seeing your GT's.

[Qwigglez]

Alvarado isn't worth a 1st round pick. He's basically unplayable in the playoffs as he can be easily exploited because of his size. He might have looked good against the Suns a couple playoffs ago but that's because he had to face senior Chris Paul and Cam Payne. Against the OKC Thunder he was awful going 3-20 from the field. We already got Jusuf Nurkic with the 3-17 record in the playoffs.