Suns 2012+ Outlook

[thamadkant]

Guys

This is inspired by the "Least brightest future..." thread on the General Forums.

Suns technically... HAVE NO FRANCHISE player or potential to be once Nash, Hill retire.

-Clark was a top 5 talent, but was never developed IN-GAME to fully utilize his talents. Traded.
-R.Lopez showed glimpses, but they remained Glimpses... he is playing like a backup center.
-Dragic is a tweener, a drunken gambler who lost it last night's version of Kirk Heinrich with some dribbling skills similar to Ginobili.

-This season, if the Suns continue to play and compete... they might get 8th spot... first round fodder. And technically get No.16..... when the franchise players are usually top 10 and top 5 really.


-2012+... next big year for FA.... big market teams with potential money... include Lakers... and you know they will spend over the cap to continue their run.



The only way I can see Suns being relevant is to draft young studs which in turn attract the Big name FAs to come.... thats one advantage over the "playoff" bound big market teams at the moment, Boston, LA, New York, Miami etc are all playoff bound for the next 3 years.

A way for a 2nd tier big city like PHX to attract talent is by having YOUNG players who show star potential... and thats not happening at the moment... a lot of fans don't want to TANK... I understand.. but sometimes you have to take a step back to jump 3 steps forward...

-Why not take a risk with A.Randolph with the Magic pick.... instead of drafting the next Alando Tucker.... or R.Lopez.... Once he adds 30 pounds he'd be scary.

Let's face it, players like Arenas, Boozer etc, who came as late picks are 1 in a hundred chance of occuring.

-Suns MUST definitely buy out Carter's contract next year... they can keep him for a reasonable price though.

-For 2012+, Suns must start turning the wheels NOW....

-Warm, Sunny weather, Golf aren't enough to compete with BIG CITY teams.... you have to have YOUNG talent to attract the big names....

[Frank Lee]

-Why not take a risk with A.Randolph with the Magic pick.... instead of drafting the next Alando Tucker.... or R.Lopez.... Once he adds 30 pounds he'd be scary.

Why not quit mentioning that ...like forever. There are better picks available. We are NOT getting him for #25 no matter how many times it is said. We need to pony up and put ours on the table. Its the only way.

This team is being built to add both free agents and youngsters. Tanking is not an option nor necessary. Certainly not this yr.

[MaryvalesFinest]

The Phoenix metro area is a top 10/arguably top 5 NBA destination, that will always attract free agents.

I think the bigger question mark is drafting rather than free agency. In the past this has been one of the worse drafting teams but with Kerr, Griffin and Quinter all resigning and bringing in LB it should improve.

I'm not calling him a savior or anything because none of us know what his drafting style is like but in the past 4 years the drafts consisted of Tucker, Strawberry, Rob Lopez, Dragic and Clark. So it's probably an upgrade right?

[carey]

You make some great points, many of which have been covered here a whole lot. I think you are a great poster, but you need to organize your thoughts more coherently. I would try to do away with the ellipses entirely. Some of your sentences have three or four of them.

Suns MUST definitely buy out Carter's contract next year... they can keep him for a reasonable price though.

I still think there is a good chance he'll be gone at the trading deadline. I also think there's no chance he will resign here. Reasonable price is also debatable. He's looking for one last pay-day.

I pretty much agree that our future is fairly bleak. I am not sure really what we can do. If teams wanted the assets we do have, I am 100% certain we would have traded for a PF by now.

I don't know how you think Clark was a top 5 talent. He was a risk even for a lottery pick. Every thing I read said he had a huge problem keeping his head in the game.

If the Knicks wanted the Orlando pick for AR they probably would have taken it already. They are holding out for something better like our first rounder. They will get something in the early to mid teens from someone for him.

Edit: Submitted to soon. Anyway, Phoenix is a great city to live in. I miss it for sure. I think as long as we can field a competitive team FAs will want to sign here.

[mikefly3113]

alright, I've been high on A Randolph since he came into the league but when you've been in and out as well as inconsistent on the two most offensive friendly systems in the league (Then Don Nelson and Mike D'antoni) there has to be something wrong with the kid.

If we don't resign carter then next year will have a pretty bad team which isn't the end of the world cause will have a high draft pick. I just pray we save our money and don't blow it again on players like warrick and childress. try to trade those guys for cap space if possible.

I'm hoping the suns will go into the summer of 2012 with with 1) four guys under contract; Dudley, Dragic, Frye, and Gortat. (throw the ageless one and maybe just maybe robin in there too). 2) 3-4 young draft prospects. 3) $40 million cash, with that money get Deron Williams and Dwight Howard. They are the two best players at there position and would love to play together.

D Will and Howard with good role players like Frye Dudley etc... with good prospects and you have one hell of a team.

[thamadkant]

Regarding Dwight Howard..

I do have a feeling that Lakers have him on their radar.
By 2012, Kobe would be a complimentary player, Gasol will still be pretty darn good. They'll have enough money depending if Kobe would sign for 15-16 million a year... to continue Lakers dominance by going for Dwight....

All Dwight has to say is.. he wants to play for Lakers... and we all know, Lakers will spend extra to get their team contending.

New York also would be interested.... Imagine a team of Amare, Dwight and Melo OR Chris Paul... depending on the Melo sweepstakes go.

Toronto will offer everything and the world for Dwight/Deron too...


The Suns in the past GOT GREAT TRADES...
- Charles Barkley coming in... going to Finals soon after.
- Danny Manning... was a very good player until injuries.
- Clifford Robinson... a 2nd tier star but still... he was very good for the Suns
- Cassel, Horry etc... wasnt long but Cassel eventually became a top tier pg for a few seasons.
- Penny + Kidd + Gugliota coming in... Penny/Kidd were called to be the Backcourt of the generation... Penny was top 5 player, Kidd was top 10.... Gugliota was a 20/10 player....
INJURIES happened and the rest was history..
- Marbury... cant really hate him as a Sun.. he was a 20/10 player and he got the Suns to the playoffs... who remembers the Spurs vs Suns playoff round.. buzzer beater from Stephon.
- Nash.....Joe Johnson.....Q..... BEST Offense ever....
- Shaq... Diesel.. playing for the Suns... wow.. never imagined it.. sure he didnt fit in.. but Shaq played for the Suns.. its like MJ playing for us... sort of.
- Grant Hill... former NEXT MJ... still balling close to 40 years old.

- Now Vince Carter... former top guard/forward in the league, most respected swingman dunker since Jordan... Half Man Half Amazing....


The point is...Suns basically had a GREAT run STARS coming in.. either on their prime or on their decline... because Suns HAD attractive appeal... good collection of talent and potential and SYSTEM.

but in the future... I just have doubts... because (1) No System post Nash, back to conventional... WITHOU Conventional personnel and players to boot (2) No high potential Youth...... (3) BIG Cities are forming SUPER TEAMS.....

Its pretty bleak...

[grumpysaddle]

Does this thread really need to exist? Hasn't this been made ten times in the past 2 weeks already, in different fashions? (not trying to backseat mod, but seriously, should everyone that uses the board make a new thread to post their individual thoughts on the Suns future?)

[Calvin Klein]

The Suns in the past GOT GREAT TRADES...

- Danny Manning... was a very good player until injuries.

- Cassel, Horry etc... wasnt long but Cassel eventually became a top tier pg for a few seasons.

- Penny + Kidd + Gugliota coming in... Penny/Kidd were called to be the Backcourt of the generation... Penny was top 5 player, Kidd was top 10.... Gugliota was a 20/10 player....
INJURIES happened and the rest was history..

- Marbury... cant really hate him as a Sun.. he was a 20/10 player and he got the Suns to the playoffs... who remembers the Spurs vs Suns playoff round.. buzzer beater from Stephon.

- Shaq... Diesel.. playing for the Suns... wow.. never imagined it.. sure he didnt fit in.. but Shaq played for the Suns.. its like MJ playing for us... sort of.


.

How are those great trades?? None of those ever worked out.

You're even saying that the Cassell/Horry was a good trade because they became great players when they left Phoenix

[thamadkant]

The fact that Suns got A-Star listed Stars.... in comparison to teams like Bucks, 76ers, Warriors etc.

Suns basically got A-list Stars some point or the other, either on the rise or declining....

In the future, Its hard to imagine Suns getting an A-lister.... like Dwight, Deron, Chris Paul etc...


Like when the Suns got Penny with Kidd and Gugliota, Suns were initially thought to be a mini-Super team, with 2 premier guards and a star big man..... just a shame with the injuries...

Cassel and Horry, were a hit and miss, Horry would probably played for Suns longer if it wasnt for Ainge... Cassel was just beginning to shine, but Suns didnt hold onto him.. dont know the full story really...

Danny Manning was a very good player that... again... got injured... but talent wise, he was a star.

Again.. the POINT is... Suns usually, in the past, attracted A-listers and got some.... championship or no... Suns got some solid A-list stars..... the future its hard to picture it.. DUE to the Suns not having the personnel at the FO and/or the lack of youth potentials.

[thamadkant]

Does this thread really need to exist? Hasn't this been made ten times in the past 2 weeks already, in different fashions? (not trying to backseat mod, but seriously, should everyone that uses the board make a new thread to post their individual thoughts on the Suns future?)

I thin it offers a different perspective... on not just Post-Nash... but the effects of NY, LA, Miami, Boston etc re-igniting the Super teams... and whats the chances of Suns becomming a super team... or lack of potential.

[Calvin Klein]

I understand. Still, none of those (except for Kidd and maybe Penny) were A list.

[Herman4MVP]

=

[DRK]

The Phoenix metro area is a top 10/arguably top 5 NBA destination, that will always attract free agents.

I think the bigger question mark is drafting rather than free agency. In the past this has been one of the worse drafting teams but with Kerr, Griffin and Quinter all resigning and bringing in LB it should improve.

I'm not calling him a savior or anything because none of us know what his drafting style is like but in the past 4 years the drafts consisted of Tucker, Strawberry, Rob Lopez, Dragic and Clark. So it's probably an upgrade right?

I disagree with that statement. The Suns have not been poor at drating at all. Sure, Tucker was a bust, but so are so many other players picked late in the 1st round. Dragic was a great pickup in the second round, and despite trading them, we were the ones responsible for drafting Rajan Rondo, Luol Deng and Nate Robinson.

[lilfishi22]

I think our front office knows we don't have a franchise guy outside of Nash and I believe that they are banking on signing one during the off-season. Guys still want to play with Nash and Nash could arguably resign with the Suns if the FO manages to right the ship. We have a decent amount of assets this season and a lot of quality role players we can put around a future franchise guy.

[MaryvalesFinest]

The Phoenix metro area is a top 10/arguably top 5 NBA destination, that will always attract free agents.

I think the bigger question mark is drafting rather than free agency. In the past this has been one of the worse drafting teams but with Kerr, Griffin and Quinter all resigning and bringing in LB it should improve.

I'm not calling him a savior or anything because none of us know what his drafting style is like but in the past 4 years the drafts consisted of Tucker, Strawberry, Rob Lopez, Dragic and Clark. So it's probably an upgrade right?

I disagree with that statement. The Suns have not been poor at drating at all. Sure, Tucker was a bust, but so are so many other players picked late in the 1st round. Dragic was a great pickup in the second round, and despite trading them, we were the ones responsible for drafting Rajan Rondo, Luol Deng and Nate Robinson.

Dragic as a pick in the late 40's was it? Was alright but they overpayed a ton to get him. Also for the other guys I thought they were pre arranged draft deals with the other team, like the Suns just drafted those guys for those other teams.

[JohnVancouver]

Dragic as a pick in the late 40's was it? Was alright but they overpayed a ton to get him. Also for the other guys I thought they were pre arranged draft deals with the other team, like the Suns just drafted those guys for those other teams.

Right - we get no point for drafting any of those guys - Rondo, Fernandez, et al. We did it at the other GMs behest ... unless we get points for not screwing it up and mistakenly drafting the wrong player

[DRK]

Dragic as a pick in the late 40's was it? Was alright but they overpayed a ton to get him. Also for the other guys I thought they were pre arranged draft deals with the other team, like the Suns just drafted those guys for those other teams.

Right - we get no point for drafting any of those guys - Rondo, Fernandez, et al. We did it at the other GMs behest ... unless we get points for not screwing it up and mistakenly drafting the wrong player

Oh. My mistake then.

[hunterxaz]

Clark ... top 5 talent? Are you out of your god damn mind?

Come on now, no need for the second part

-Miko

[Frank Lee]

Clark ... top 5 talent? Are you out of your god damn mind?

Come on now, no need for the second part

-Miko

hehehe... I was thinking the same thing Haz.... but just waited for you to chime in.

Will we ever shake the loss of Earl ?

This month.... 3 appearances in 12 games. 1 of 6, 4pts, 3 rbs,.... 16 minutes. I just dont get the love.