Suns lack of free throw shooting.

[SunsRback4Good]

I remember all those years from 2004 to 2010 where we had good free throw shooters. You had guys like Nash every year knocking down .900 from the line. J- Rich, Bell, Stoudemire and Frye knocking down .800+ from the line. Guys like Grant Hill and Goran Dragic hitting .700+ from the line. The worst free throw shooters I can recall from 2004-2012 we've had was Shaq and Amundson.

This year we've got 13 players on our roster. So not counting Childrish because he hasn't attempted a free throw this season. Out of 12 players only 3 are shooting .800 and higher. Those 3 players are Nash .883, Channing Frye .866 and Michael Redd at barely .800 .....So the other 9 players are under .800 and that's unacceptable and needs to be fixed immediately.

[Wannabe MEP]

meh. the biggest difference in our overall FT% has to do with the bigs that get fouled a lot. So this year we're almost exactly the same as last year, better than when we had Shaq, and worse than when Amar'e was our primary paint-dweller. In my book the only real issue is Gortat, and what are you gonna do about it? His percentage certainly isn't bad for a center, and it's clearly good enough that our offense is very efficient when he goes to the line for two (129 points per 100 possessions). I'm very happy overall with Gortat as a player, so I'm not gonna quibble about his FT%.

Dudley missing 3 in a row? Small sample size and/or momentary lapse in confidence. Sometimes you miss one at a critical moment and then start over-thinking.

(ps--thread title is misleading)

[YFZblu]

Dudley missing 3 in a row? Small sample size and/or momentary lapse in confidence. Sometimes you miss one at a critical moment and then start over-thinking.

Yep - That, and who knows what is going on with him physically. Might have been tired, sore, could have been hit a few plays back. All on top of the typical thigns like over-thinking and confidence.

[Jdiddy701]

I've been saying it all year.. It's embarrassing.

[nevetsov]

Forget about free throw shooting, prior to the last game our three point percentage has been disgusting. Extremely un-suns like. Would love to see the stats on that one.

[Revived]

If there's one thing you can take from pre season it would be FT shooting because if you shoot bad in pre season, chances are you will shoot bad in the reg season also.

And Dragic again did not look good on his FT shooting.

I can't remember the last player who was very good shooting from 3 (40%+) and from mid range that sucks at the FT line.

If this continues, teams will start Hack-A-Dragic and then Dragic may play away from contact so that he doesn't get fouled.

I don't understand why it's hard for a professional player who is as good as he is to hit like around 82-85%.

I notice Dragic rarely shoots our techs despite being our best player and guard. It's always Green or Bledsoe. I thought this might motivate him into becoming a better FT shooter. He doesn't need to be automatic like Nash but 75% is unacceptable for a player with his ability.

[Zelaznyrules]

If there's one thing you can take from pre season it would be FT shooting because if you shoot bad in pre season, chances are you will shoot bad in the reg season also.

And Dragic again did not look good on his FT shooting.

I can't remember the last player who was very good shooting from 3 (40%+) and from mid range that sucks at the FT line.

If this continues, teams will start Hack-A-Dragic and then Dragic may play away from contact so that he doesn't get fouled.

I don't understand why it's hard for a professional player who is as good as he is to hit like around 82-85%.

I notice Dragic rarely shoots our techs despite being our best player and guard. It's always Green or Bledsoe. I thought this might motivate him into becoming a better FT shooter. He doesn't need to be automatic like Nash but 75% is unacceptable for a player with his ability.

If he shoots 75% and gets 20 attempts in one game, he'll make 15 free throws. If he were an 82% free throw shooter, he'd make 16 free throws. Do you really think teams will start hacking him for such a small difference? 75% is a little low for a guard but it's impact on our season is likely to be virtually unnoticeable.

[Frank Lee]

Ha Z.... was doing the same math a few minutes ago when I first read this. That said, an 80% clip is a respectable mark.

Upon seeing the headline, I thought this was focused on FT attempts. I wonder how those will compare to last yr or the league average. After watching 2-3 games so far.... our guards spend a lot of time picking themselves up after drives.

[bwgood77]

Ha Z.... was doing the same math a few minutes ago when I first read this. That said, an 80% clip is a respectable mark.

Upon seeing the headline, I thought this was focused on FT attempts. I wonder how those will compare to last yr or the league average. After watching 2-3 games so far.... our guards spend a lot of time picking themselves up after drives.

Upon seeing the headline, I started to read the first post only to get to where it talked about Childress and then I realized this thread is two years old. Funny that people are responding to it as if the OP was talking about this season.

[b-ball forever]

Dragic's free throw shooting isn't bad enuf to go Hack A Shaq on. Even at 65% FT shooting it's still very risky tactic to attempt, and Goran shoots way better than that.

The only reason it was useful on Shaq is cuz Shaq was a 52% FT shooter AND a devastating offensive force with the ball in his hands.


Our FT shooting should improve a bit this year thanks to I.Thomas who is a 86% FT shooter, and the likely improved FT shooting of our younger players. Frye was a good FT shooter, but his loss will barely make any impact on the Suns overall FT shooting since he barely ever got to the line (only 1.2 attempts per game!)

[Frank Lee]

Ha Z.... was doing the same math a few minutes ago when I first read this. That said, an 80% clip is a respectable mark.

Upon seeing the headline, I thought this was focused on FT attempts. I wonder how those will compare to last yr or the league average. After watching 2-3 games so far.... our guards spend a lot of time picking themselves up after drives.

Upon seeing the headline, I started to read the first post only to get to where it talked about Childress and then I realized this thread is two years old. Funny that people are responding to it as if the OP was talking about this season.

On going discussion of shooting % perhaps ?
The Dragical decline from the FT line was a subject once heavily discussed. On GD's first run w/phnx, somebody (RunD?) served up some crow on it, as he had a sh*tty % then too. Then he cut his foot and became a Texan.

[RunDogGun]

Ha Z.... was doing the same math a few minutes ago when I first read this. That said, an 80% clip is a respectable mark.

Upon seeing the headline, I thought this was focused on FT attempts. I wonder how those will compare to last yr or the league average. After watching 2-3 games so far.... our guards spend a lot of time picking themselves up after drives.

Upon seeing the headline, I started to read the first post only to get to where it talked about Childress and then I realized this thread is two years old. Funny that people are responding to it as if the OP was talking about this season.

On going discussion of shooting % perhaps ?
The Dragical decline from the FT line was a subject once heavily discussed. On GD's first run w/phnx, somebody (RunD?) served up some crow on it, as he had a sh*tty % then too. Then he cut his foot and became a Texan.

It was weird noticing it. And I first saw it from one of his Euro summer games. After you challenged me, I had to look up his percentages, and the stats showed a slight yet declining percentage. I think last year, he often would miss that first free throw, so if it was an and1 or a tech, it would appear that he shot worse, because some of the time, there wasn't a second ft attempt to even things out.

And then there are some games where he kills it from the line.

But if we were applying this to the current squad, and IT goes to the line as often as he did in preseason, we should have a decent percentage through him alone. This will be another area where we feel the loss of Frye, who shot pretty well from the line, even in games where he could make an outside shot.

[Revived]

Dragic's free throw shooting isn't bad enuf to go Hack A Shaq on. Even at 65% FT shooting it's still very risky tactic to attempt, and Goran shoots way better than that.

The only reason it was useful on Shaq is cuz Shaq was a 52% FT shooter AND a devastating offensive force with the ball in his hands.


Our FT shooting should improve a bit this year thanks to I.Thomas who is a 86% FT shooter, and the likely improved FT shooting of our younger players. Frye was a good FT shooter, but his loss will barely make any impact on the Suns overall FT shooting since he barely ever got to the line (only 1.2 attempts per game!)

Maybe not hack a Shaq but I think teams will deliberately foul him as soon as he gets in the paint so that he's put at the FT line instead of converting the layup. Teams sometime hesitate to do this against guys who are good FT shooters like Westbrook/CP3 etc because those guys will likely hit the FTs plus the defender just got the foul for no reason.

With Dragic, chances are much higher that he will miss at least 1.

He needs to improve at least for the sake of the hits and hard fouls he will have to endure otherwise.

[Zelaznyrules]

Dragic's free throw shooting isn't bad enuf to go Hack A Shaq on. Even at 65% FT shooting it's still very risky tactic to attempt, and Goran shoots way better than that.

The only reason it was useful on Shaq is cuz Shaq was a 52% FT shooter AND a devastating offensive force with the ball in his hands.


Our FT shooting should improve a bit this year thanks to I.Thomas who is a 86% FT shooter, and the likely improved FT shooting of our younger players. Frye was a good FT shooter, but his loss will barely make any impact on the Suns overall FT shooting since he barely ever got to the line (only 1.2 attempts per game!)

Maybe not hack a Shaq but I think teams will deliberately foul him as soon as he gets in the paint so that he's put at the FT line instead of converting the layup. Teams sometime hesitate to do this against guys who are good FT shooters like Westbrook/CP3 etc because those guys will likely hit the FTs plus the defender just got the foul for no reason.

With Dragic, chances are much higher that he will miss at least 1.

He needs to improve at least for the sake of the hits and hard fouls he will have to endure otherwise.

No matter how you look at it, chances are NOT much higher, in fact, they are only marginally higher. In his last three seasons he's been shooting free throws at a .765 clip. Even if he'd made every single free throw over those three seasons he would have only added 1 point per game to his totals. Assuming I've done the math correctly, it seems you are making way too much of this.

[lilfishi22]

Over a season the difference between 82% and 75% from the field is fairly minimal. Like someone mentioned above, it equates to about 1 extra FT made over 20 attempts.

It certainly wouldn't work over the course of a game BUT his FT% down the line is where the issue is. According to 82games.com his FT% drops to 43% in the "clutch". That's unacceptable for a star player who's expected to carry the team. Only Birdman and Drummond shoots a worse FT% in the clutch.

Luckily, Bledsoe is a better clutch player than Dragic

[Zelaznyrules]

Over a season the difference between 82% and 75% from the field is fairly minimal. Like someone mentioned above, it equates to about 1 extra FT made over 20 attempts.

It certainly wouldn't work over the course of a game BUT his FT% down the line is where the issue is. According to 82games.com his FT% drops to 43% in the "clutch". That's unacceptable for a star player who's expected to carry the team. Only Birdman and Drummond shoots a worse FT% in the clutch.

Luckily, Bledsoe is a better clutch player than Dragic

I agree, that's unacceptable and not just for a player expected to carry a team.

[Revived]

No matter how you look at it, chances are NOT much higher, in fact, they are only marginally higher. In his last three seasons he's been shooting free throws at a .765 clip. Even if he'd made every single free throw over those three seasons he would have only added 1 point per game to his totals. Assuming I've done the math correctly, it seems you are making way too much of this.

When I get the time, I'll check the stats to see if you did the math correctly.

Over a season the difference between 82% and 75% from the field is fairly minimal. Like someone mentioned above, it equates to about 1 extra FT made over 20 attempts.

It certainly wouldn't work over the course of a game BUT his FT% down the line is where the issue is. According to 82games.com his FT% drops to 43% in the "clutch". That's unacceptable for a star player who's expected to carry the team. Only Birdman and Drummond shoots a worse FT% in the clutch.

Luckily, Bledsoe is a better clutch player than Dragic

Dragic isn't very clutch period, not just his FTs.

I remember there was a guy who posted the stats that compared Dragic and Bledsoe's FG % in clutch situations and it wasn't close.

I love Dragic but one of the reasons I wanted Bledsoe back was because he has the "it" factor in clutch moment. Not CP3 or Lillard level but still got it.

[gaspar]

Stats from last year, per 36 in the clutch (last 5 min, +/- 5 pts):

Dragic 13.8 pts, 3.0 ast, 3.4 reb, 1.7 stl, 2.7 tov, .421 FG%, .111 3P%, .438 FT%
Bledsoe 31.7 pts, 6.6 ast, 4.6 reb, 2.3 stl, 4.3 tov, .464 FG%, .353 3P%, .774 FT%
Thomas 27.7 pts, 4.3 ast, 3.8 reb, 2.0 stl, 3.8 tov, .400 FG%, .333 3P%, .923 FT%

Curry 27.8 pts, 4.5 ast, 6.5 reb, 1.4 stl, 4.1 tov, .411 FG%, .280 3P%, 1.000 FT%
Paul 29.6 pts, 7.9 ast, 6.0 reb, 1.9 stl, 1.9 tov, .406 FG%, .333 3P%, .786 FT%
Lillard 28.3 pts, 3.2 ast, 3.6 reb, 0.6 stl, 3.2 tov, .473 FG%, .442 3P%, .860 FT%

[Revived]

Thanks gaspar.

Brings an interesting dilemma for Hornacek...last 5 mins of game and if we absolutely can't go to 3 PG lineup due to match up reasons, then which two guards should be on the court, Dragic/Bledsoe or Bledsoe/Thomas?

Even though the clutch stats aren't in his favor and his FT shooting leaves a lot to be desired, I think I still go with Dragic/Bledsoe.

[lilfishi22]

Dragic isn't very clutch period, not just his FTs.

I remember there was a guy who posted the stats that compared Dragic and Bledsoe's FG % in clutch situations and it wasn't close.

I love Dragic but one of the reasons I wanted Bledsoe back was because he has the "it" factor in clutch moment. Not CP3 or Lillard level but still got it.

I think that was me. Don't think it was on the Suns board though