Season Speculation, Trade Ideas and Discussion

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=zzkgjpj

Minny adds its 2017 1st, unprotected.

I think I'd do this. Minny would be a contender next year with that team I think.

So far, the trade board thinks Minny would go for it. In that case, we should also ask for Bazz. Why not.

[gaspar]

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=zzkgjpj

Minny adds its 2017 1st, unprotected.

This is horrendous for the Suns. Minny would easily make the playoffs this year with Bled, PJ and Tyson. All the Suns would get from this this trade is a mid-first round pick and Rubio on a $30m/yr contract.

[Barkley_34]

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=zzkgjpj

Minny adds its 2017 1st, unprotected.

This is horrendous for the Suns. Minny would easily make the playoffs this year with Bled, PJ and Tyson. All the Suns would get from this this trade is a mid-first round pick and Rubio on a $30m/yr contract.

Horrible

[King4Day]

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=zzkgjpj

Minny adds its 2017 1st, unprotected.

I think I'd do this. Minny would be a contender next year with that team I think.

So far, the trade board thinks Minny would go for it. In that case, we should also ask for Bazz. Why not.

Adding a 3rd team like Philly could work too. Maybe they'd take the Minny first rounder and change for Noel (to the Suns). Work out the center logjam after.

[AtheJ415]

In everyone's quest to get a pass first PG, I don't understand why everyone simply disregards that Bledsoe is simply better at the game of basketball than guys like Rubio and Rondo. Pass first does not equal better. Not when they can't shoot whatsoever.

[AtheJ415]

I think I'd do this. Minny would be a contender next year with that team I think.

So far, the trade board thinks Minny would go for it. In that case, we should also ask for Bazz. Why not.

Adding a 3rd team like Philly could work too. Maybe they'd take the Minny first rounder and change for Noel (to the Suns). Work out the center logjam after.

I'd rather have the 1st than Noel. Draft a center who is athletic and/or can shoot with the pick and has good knees. Noel is about to get paid, and there's not as much value to paying a guy market value compared to drafting a guy under the rookie cap. Particularly a non-star with tons of question marks like Noel (knees, work ethic, etc.).

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

So far, the trade board thinks Minny would go for it. In that case, we should also ask for Bazz. Why not.

Adding a 3rd team like Philly could work too. Maybe they'd take the Minny first rounder and change for Noel (to the Suns). Work out the center logjam after.

I'd rather have the 1st than Noel. Draft a center who is athletic and/or can shoot with the pick and has good knees. Noel is about to get paid, and there's not as much value to paying a guy market value compared to drafting a guy under the rookie cap. Particularly a non-star with tons of question marks like Noel (knees, work ethic, etc.).

I was alerted to the fact that Minny can't trade its 2017 first due to the fact that they owe Atlanta a lottery-protected first in 2018 and 2019 (which converts to a second rounder if Minny's still in the lottery at that time). I proposed a modification whereby we sent Knight to Atlanta for that first and for Splitter and give back to Minnesota their 2018 pick, with Minny adding Shabazz to the deal instead of Jordan Hill. If Minny's willing to go that far down the road, maybe we could also get them to make that 2019 pick unprotected.

Minny sends: Rubio, Pekovic, Muhammad, 2017 1st, renounces protection on 2019 1st
Minny gets: Bledsoe, Chandler, Tucker, MIN 2018

ATL sends: Splitter, MIN pick (lotto-protected, converts to 2nd)
ATL gets: Brandon Knight

Phoenix sends: Bledsoe, Knight, Tucker, Chandler
Phoenix receives: Rubio, Pekovic, Muhammad, Splitter, MIN 2017, MIN 2019

I'd do that if I couldn't get a better deal. Those are the four guys I want gone. Rubio is the type of PG I'd like to see run the show while we get our **** together.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

In everyone's quest to get a pass first PG, I don't understand why everyone simply disregards that Bledsoe is simply better at the game of basketball than guys like Rubio and Rondo. Pass first does not equal better. Not when they can't shoot whatsoever.

No, I understand. I wouldn't deal Bled for Rubio straight up. I want value in return, and just as important, I want to want to watch Suns games again.

[carey]

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=zzkgjpj

Minny adds its 2017 1st, unprotected.

I think I see what you're trying to do but any trade where the other team gets the 3 best players in a 6 player deal is not a good trade even with that pick coming back. It may be too late for them to make a real playoff push though who knows. Even if the pick is in the late teens that is not a lot of value for Bledsoe, Chandler and Tucker.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=zzkgjpj

Minny adds its 2017 1st, unprotected.

I think I see what you're trying to do but any trade where the other team gets the 3 best players in a 6 player deal is not a good trade even with that pick coming back. It may be too late for them to make a real playoff push though who knows. Even if the pick is in the late teens that is not a lot of value for Bledsoe, Chandler and Tucker.

I know, I know. I'm just desperate to move on. I'm really hoping we can get either Orlando or Milwaukee to fork over two firsts for Bled. I want the pain to be over. It's Tyler time.

[lilfishi22]

In everyone's quest to get a pass first PG, I don't understand why everyone simply disregards that Bledsoe is simply better at the game of basketball than guys like Rubio and Rondo. Pass first does not equal better. Not when they can't shoot whatsoever.

In my opinion, this team should be all about maximising the abilities of our young guys. Bledsoe is without a doubt a better player than Rubio and Rondo but he doesn't make guys like Len, Booker, Warren or our rookies better. Bledsoe is at his best in the clutch when he has the ball in his hands and getting to the rim. Matter of fact, Bledsoe is only behind Westbrook in Pts in the clutch. That's awesome and it's won us a few games. But if we're talking youth development...I want Booker and Warren to be the ones taking well set up shots in the clutch. Bledsoe right now is playing to win and is taking all the responsibility and on a winning team, that's exactly what you want. But on this team where you have two potentially great scorers, I want a guy like Rubio or some other pass-first PG setting things up for them. I don't want to lose but if we lost because Warren misses a shot on a well-run play set up by a true PG, then I can't be unhappy about that.

Now, I'm only of this opinion because our coach doesn't coach and in our situation, it's easier to trade for a floor general than it is to replace our dud general. If we had a system where we actually had some plays and where Booker and Warren are put in positions to succeed rather than just falling back on Bledsoe every time to save us, then I'd agree with you.

[thamadkant]

If Suns wants to go youth....

I still think go for Okafor.

Okafor's per 36 this year
18.5 ppg, 7.3 rbs, 2 blks, 15 FGA, 53 FG%, 54 TS%

Porzingis per 36 this year
20.9 ppg, 7.9 rbs, 1.9 blks, 17 FGA, 45 FG%, 55 TS%

Towns per 36 this year
21.9 ppg, 11.1 rbs, 1.5 blks, 18 FGA, 47 FG%, 55 TS%

[thamadkant]

That Suns and Mavs trade proposal here was pretty interesting.

Bledsoe, Chandler and Tucker for Bogut and Williams and a draft pick.

I dont think Mavs will give up their 2017 pick, because they are so bad this season and even a resurgence would just put them around 30 wins.

But next season's pick may be available.... Even with no protection. Assuming Cuban will reload heavily this offseason... With Bledsoe and Chandler and Tucker... They have a decent lineup.

Chandler, Nowitski, Barnes, Matthews, Bledsoe as starters would be interesting.

[lilfishi22]

That Suns and Mavs trade proposal here was pretty interesting.

Bledsoe, Chandler and Tucker for Bogut and Williams and a draft pick.

I dont think Mavs will give up their 2017 pick, because they are so bad this season and even a resurgence would just put them around 30 wins.

But next season's pick may be available.... Even with no protection. Assuming Cuban will reload heavily this offseason... With Bledsoe and Chandler and Tucker... They have a decent lineup.

Chandler, Nowitski, Barnes, Matthews, Bledsoe as starters would be interesting.

With Carlise still around, they could do work next season.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Cuban already said he won't trade the pick for anything less than a top 5 talent, which we do not have and cannot procure for him.

[RaisingArizona]

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=zzkgjpj

Minny adds its 2017 1st, unprotected.

no

[NavLDO]

Spoiler:

I'm totally 100% in agreement with all that I've quoted.

I find this section of the article to be spot on:



It seems like everyone can see it. Hopefully the best deals possible will be made.

I think most of us are of this mindset. I know some posters like Frank hate the draft and hope approach but to me it's just the most realistic way for this team to get good again. I'm all for acquiring talent by all avenues but I just don't see a star walking through the door as a FA next summer and the trade market is tricky since guys like Cousins who might be available have question marks surrounding them and if they do hit the market they will have multiple teams bidding so the cost will be high. Plus say you are able to trade for a star after giving a big package would this team be good enough around them to compete? Probably not; so then you could end up with a disgruntled star who might be leaving when their contract is up. Organic growth is the most clear path but it's going to take patience and some luck.

Exactly. If you want to get back to contention, our best course is not to gut our assets for a superstar and try to more successfully build around him than his former team. For instance, trading everybody for Cousins makes us the Kings, not a contender. Signing him in FA if he ever becomes available would be a different ball game.

The draft is our best friend here, and we've done well in it. Sucking for a couple more years and hitting with our picks is the best bet. We still need upgrades at C, PG, and probably as a backup wing (2-3). We could accomplish all of these if we get high picks in the next couple of drafts and build from within. Free agency is also a better avenue because you give up cap space but not picks to acquire guys.

If we continue to add guys 25 and under who fit the style of play we are attempting to run, trade the current vets who still have value or who are in the way of the youngsters, and then add guys via draft and FA, we will be so much better set up for the long haul than in the future.

I'm pretty confident in Booker and Warren and one of Chriss/Bender becoming damn good.

We just need backups for those guys and starters at the 1 and 5. Len can be the 5 in a more limited role, and I think he's shown that thus far.

Actually, he's shown the opposite. He fares much better when in a starter-minute role; it's when he's forced into that 'limited role' is when he typically plays his poorest. I'm not saying Len is the best starting Center we should ever aspire for, but until we find a better one, allowing Len to...oh, I don't know, start consistently for half the season or so as an inside 5 (not some hybrid 'stretch-5 failed-experiment like last season), you'll see he gives us a solid defensive presence and rebounding that few NBA Centers can match. The 'proof is in the pudding', as they say, and if you look at the numbers, Len has shown to be a double digit rebounder and 2+ Blks-level Center per 25 minutes in games where he plays about as much or more this season.

If we keep Len, and continue to vary his minutes where he gets 15 mpg one game, and 30 mpg the next, and back again, then yes, he will likely continue to 'look' average, and honestly, then we should trade him and keep Chandler, because Len is NOT a good back-up Center, IMO. His stats are not 'linear' in accumulation; it's really the oddest thing.

[NavLDO]

In everyone's quest to get a pass first PG, I don't understand why everyone simply disregards that Bledsoe is simply better at the game of basketball than guys like Rubio and Rondo. Pass first does not equal better. Not when they can't shoot whatsoever.

In my opinion, this team should be all about maximising the abilities of our young guys. Bledsoe is without a doubt a better player than Rubio and Rondo but he doesn't make guys like Len, Booker, Warren or our rookies better. Bledsoe is at his best in the clutch when he has the ball in his hands and getting to the rim. Matter of fact, Bledsoe is only behind Westbrook in Pts in the clutch. That's awesome and it's won us a few games. But if we're talking youth development...I want Booker and Warren to be the ones taking well set up shots in the clutch. Bledsoe right now is playing to win and is taking all the responsibility and on a winning team, that's exactly what you want. But on this team where you have two potentially great scorers, I want a guy like Rubio or some other pass-first PG setting things up for them. I don't want to lose but if we lost because Warren misses a shot on a well-run play set up by a true PG, then I can't be unhappy about that.

Now, I'm only of this opinion because our coach doesn't coach and in our situation, it's easier to trade for a floor general than it is to replace our dud general. If we had a system where we actually had some plays and where Booker and Warren are put in positions to succeed rather than just falling back on Bledsoe every time to save us, then I'd agree with you.

Excellent point. I was going to say something similar in that Bled is not getting the rest of our guys involved enough; if we have a 'Rubio'-esque PG, he could to that better, IMO. Not to mention, it forces Watson to play Len more as a starter, where I think he'll play a lot better. And if I'm wrong, and he doesn't, wouldn't we rather like to know that by the end of his season, rather than halfway through his 2nd contract at $18M per when Tyson is gone??

There is a lot to like about a deal like that, but obviously, the pick would have to be available, so add maybe Dieng or Bazz with Hill?? IDK, but the whole 'addition by subtraction' deal here, IMO. Bled/Tyson-out; Rubio/Len-in to the starting line-up.

[thamadkant]

Cuban already said he won't trade the pick for anything less than a top 5 talent, which we do not have and cannot procure for him.

The 2017 pick is not in play. 2018 pick however As I mentioned will likely be the one dangled.

[DirtyDez]

Cuban already said he won't trade the pick for anything less than a top 5 talent, which we do not have and cannot procure for him.

The 2017 pick is not in play. 2018 pick however As I mentioned will likely be the one dangled.

It could be in play after the lottery results if they fall below #2. During the season yeah, no point in trading since they've dug themselves a hole. Cuban is saying all the right things.