2018 FA & Trade Discussion 5: Is there a POINT ???

[JMac1]

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Let me worry about that four years from now.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Here's two trades that could be done with either Dragic or wall coming back.

1- Phoenix/Miami: Phoenix trades Trevor Arizas' expiring, and Ryan Anderson.

Miami trades: Goran Dragic, Kelly olynyk, and Bam Adebayo to the suns.

Phoenix is able to dump Anderson's contract in return for taking Olynyks' contract back in return. But gets a good young big man additionally.

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yc5poydb .


The next trade is a straight up trade of John Wall and Austin rivers' 12 million expiring for Ryan Anderson, Josh Jackson and Dragan Bender.


http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yc5poydb .

[WeekapaugGroove]

Here's two trades that could be done with either Dragic or wall coming back.

1- Phoenix/Miami: Phoenix trades Trevor Arizas' expiring, and Ryan Anderson.

Miami trades: Goran Dragic, Kelly olynyk, and Bam Adebayo to the suns.

Phoenix is able to dump Anderson's contract in return for taking Olynyks' contract back in return. But gets a good young big man additionally.

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yc5poydb .


The next trade is a straight up trade of John Wall and Austin rivers' 12 million expiring for Ryan Anderson, Josh Jackson and Dragan Bender.


http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yc5poydb .

I don't think Miami does that because I don't think moving Olynyks deal is that important to them and they like Bam. What I posted earlier is a more realistic where they trade James Johnson and Dragic for Anderson, Daniels, and Bender. That saves them around 15M next year to stay away from the tax and saves them all of Johnson's 16 Mil the summer of 2020 opening up even more space when Whiteside, Olynyk and Tyler Johnson all expire. For Miami it would basically be tanking for two years and going into 2020 with a ton of cap space and two lotto picks.

[Fo-Real]

There will always be worries about age, decline and future production but as Sunsfan is saying, no risk it no biscuit. Gotta take a chance at some time, and that chance may fail but if you never swing you wont ever hit the damn ball. Hoping to add average talent like Rozier and Tyus Jones and expecting major team improvement is lunacy. Wall has been and is considered a star, better than Booker and Booker is not a complete ball hog and I think will defer to Wall in most situations like he did to Bledso (and he should not have with Bled). Hell man, you talked me into it... TURN YOUR KEY SARVER!!!! Granted, I dont think there is a chance in hell that we land him.

You can risk it more smartly with another player. Taking risk just because it might lead to reward is stupid. Trading for a guy who makes 45 mil a year when we can sign a litany of comparable players for half that is stupid. Trading assets for said guy is stupider. Trading assets for said guy when we could trade those for somebody who makes MUCH less and is a better fit and or higher upside is the supidest.

And who is that now, will be in the future or has been in the last 10 or so years? High salary is the way of the NBA, sticker shock has always been there but the salaries keep going up to swallow the increase. Who determines what smartly is without using hindsight to say I told you so as to that dude worked or did not? There will be no way of knowing before hand if someone will be a homerun or a swing and a miss. Gotta take the bat off your shoulder at some point.

[AtheJ415]

There will always be worries about age, decline and future production but as Sunsfan is saying, no risk it no biscuit. Gotta take a chance at some time, and that chance may fail but if you never swing you wont ever hit the damn ball. Hoping to add average talent like Rozier and Tyus Jones and expecting major team improvement is lunacy. Wall has been and is considered a star, better than Booker and Booker is not a complete ball hog and I think will defer to Wall in most situations like he did to Bledso (and he should not have with Bled). Hell man, you talked me into it... TURN YOUR KEY SARVER!!!! Granted, I dont think there is a chance in hell that we land him.

You can risk it more smartly with another player. Taking risk just because it might lead to reward is stupid. Trading for a guy who makes 45 mil a year when we can sign a litany of comparable players for half that is stupid. Trading assets for said guy is stupider. Trading assets for said guy when we could trade those for somebody who makes MUCH less and is a better fit and or higher upside is the supidest.

And who is that now, will be in the future or has been in the last 10 or so years? High salary is the way of the NBA, sticker shock has always been there but the salaries keep going up to swallow the increase. Who determines what smartly is without using hindsight to say I told you so as to that dude worked or did not? There will be no way of knowing before hand if someone will be a homerun or a swing and a miss. Gotta take the bat off your shoulder at some point.

The play on the court does. John Wall is at best a top 40 NBA player and is being paid as a top 5 player going forward. He is more likely to get worse than better over the course of his deal, and off the course his teammates have been complaining about him for 2 years and his team is currently falling apart while he is getting fined for his behavior. In this case you don't need hindsite to see this is a horrid idea. All you need is site. Look at the dude, his salary, his advanced numbers, his off the court issues. Then compare that to who we KNOW will be available this offseason. Do that and the answer is obvious. No offense, but this is an easy one.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Last trade idea for now is Phoenix suns/Milwaukee Bucks:

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yc94wxnb .

The suns basically send Trevor Arizas' expiring contract along with the Milwaukee pick back to the bucks.....

In return, Phoenix gets John Henson, Thon Maker, and Malcolm Brogdon.

Milwaukee gets it's pick back, and also gets 15 million in cap savings to add another quality piece to their core for contention through free agency.

Phoenix gets a good defensive forward prospect in John Henson, also taking a flier on Thon Maker at the 4 as well, He's still big, mobile, and filled with talent. But the real prize is Malcolm Brogdon.

I put Josh Jackson, Dragan Bender, Troy Daniels, and Richaun Holmes in order to make the numbers work, but pieces, picks could be added if needed, within reason!

[BobbieL]

Here's two trades that could be done with either Dragic or wall coming back.

1- Phoenix/Miami: Phoenix trades Trevor Arizas' expiring, and Ryan Anderson.

Miami trades: Goran Dragic, Kelly olynyk, and Bam Adebayo to the suns.

Phoenix is able to dump Anderson's contract in return for taking Olynyks' contract back in return. But gets a good young big man additionally.

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yc5poydb .


The next trade is a straight up trade of John Wall and Austin rivers' 12 million expiring for Ryan Anderson, Josh Jackson and Dragan Bender.


http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yc5poydb .

I don't think Miami does that because I don't think moving Olynyks deal is that important to them and they like Bam. What I posted earlier is a more realistic where they trade James Johnson and Dragic for Anderson, Daniels, and Bender. That saves them around 15M next year to stay away from the tax and saves them all of Johnson's 16 Mil the summer of 2020 opening up even more space when Whiteside, Olynyk and Tyler Johnson all expire. For Miami it would basically be tanking for two years and going into 2020 with a ton of cap space and two lotto picks.

What Rileys number - it makes too much sense to me (granted, I proposed the same thing but still) - I think Goran would be okay moving back to Phoenix with Kokoskov. Though I read an article in AZCentral in May that said he was very happy in Florida, had built found his house (mansion?) , even had a landscaper for the first time in his life.

[Fo-Real]

You can risk it more smartly with another player. Taking risk just because it might lead to reward is stupid. Trading for a guy who makes 45 mil a year when we can sign a litany of comparable players for half that is stupid. Trading assets for said guy is stupider. Trading assets for said guy when we could trade those for somebody who makes MUCH less and is a better fit and or higher upside is the supidest.

And who is that now, will be in the future or has been in the last 10 or so years? High salary is the way of the NBA, sticker shock has always been there but the salaries keep going up to swallow the increase. Who determines what smartly is without using hindsight to say I told you so as to that dude worked or did not? There will be no way of knowing before hand if someone will be a homerun or a swing and a miss. Gotta take the bat off your shoulder at some point.

The play on the court does. John Wall is at best a top 40 NBA player and is being paid as a top 5 player going forward. He is more likely to get worse than better over the course of his deal, and off the course his teammates have been complaining about him for 2 years and his team is currently falling apart while he is getting fined for his behavior. In this case you don't need hindsite to see this is a horrid idea. All you need is site. Look at the dude, his salary, his advanced numbers, his off the court issues. Then compare that to who we KNOW will be available this offseason. Do that and the answer is obvious. No offense, but this is an easy one.

So is there a player in the NBA (a pg) who falls into your realm of worth the risk at that kind of money at all weather available or not? I can't think of one is there anyone that would fit that bill for you because everybody has flaws everybody has issues.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Here's two trades that could be done with either Dragic or wall coming back.

1- Phoenix/Miami: Phoenix trades Trevor Arizas' expiring, and Ryan Anderson.

Miami trades: Goran Dragic, Kelly olynyk, and Bam Adebayo to the suns.

Phoenix is able to dump Anderson's contract in return for taking Olynyks' contract back in return. But gets a good young big man additionally.

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yc5poydb .


The next trade is a straight up trade of John Wall and Austin rivers' 12 million expiring for Ryan Anderson, Josh Jackson and Dragan Bender.


http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yc5poydb .

I don't think Miami does that because I don't think moving Olynyks deal is that important to them and they like Bam. What I posted earlier is a more realistic where they trade James Johnson and Dragic for Anderson, Daniels, and Bender. That saves them around 15M next year to stay away from the tax and saves them all of Johnson's 16 Mil the summer of 2020 opening up even more space when Whiteside, Olynyk and Tyler Johnson all expire. For Miami it would basically be tanking for two years and going into 2020 with a ton of cap space and two lotto picks.

I did that trade with the idea of saving the suns the 2 million difference per year if possible. But I'm actually fine with either player coming back as long ss Ryan Anderson is going out, and Dragic is coming back to us!

With that being said, I do prefer James Johnson to Kelly olynyk, due to his defensive versatility!....But was trying to squeeze the extra 2 million in contractual difference as we'd be taking on a third year for either player.

[Ghost of Kleine]

That's why they get paid so well! Because they move teams so often. But it would be awesome if it were to happen...

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[bwgood77]

Though he has been promoted as such, Wall isn’t a leader. But he is the most influential energy source. If he comes to play, so does everyone else. If he’s not up for it, the team collapses. Wall should be entering his prime but appears to be regressing at the worst possible time — with a supermax extension worth $170 million set to kick in next season. The Wizards did what Sacramento was unwilling to do with DeMarcus Cousins, what Chicago was unwilling to do with Jimmy Butler, and what Indiana was likely unwilling to do with Paul George (before he asked out) — and that’s pay a really good player money what should be reserved for truly transcendent talents. Both sides showed loyalty and now appear shackled by their commitment.

If the Wizards were getting something close to the best of Wall, the contract would be easier to stomach. But he’s been working himself into shape since the season began and has yet to play with the explosion, speed and rage that have come to define his game. The problem isn’t that he won’t play with that passion, it’s that he probably can’t. Keep in mind, he has had three knee surgeries since 2016. He’s been called out for his clubbing and remained defiant in his choices, despite the optics of being the face of a franchise headed nowhere.

The Wizards slapped Wall with a fine for his outburst with Brooks, a rare — or possibly first — instance in which his insubordination was punished during his nine seasons with the organization. As a product of Kentucky’s basketball factory who has also been shielded from accountability in Washington, Wall has been treated as if he’s arrived before truly earning that spot. The status he wants still requires him to hunt it down.

https://theathletic.com/665972/2018/11/20/michael-lee-the-wizards-are-a-myth-that-isnt-working-out-and-all-there-is-hope-for-now-is-change/

[Mjee]

Read on Twitter

Let me worry about that four years from now.

We are already crippled now without a point gaurd .....

Might as well get Wall

[WeekapaugGroove]

Last trade idea for now is Phoenix suns/Milwaukee Bucks:

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yc94wxnb .

The suns basically send Trevor Arizas' expiring contract along with the Milwaukee pick back to the bucks.....

In return, Phoenix gets John Henson, Thon Maker, and Malcolm Brogdon.

Milwaukee gets it's pick back, and also gets 15 million in cap savings to add another quality piece to their core for contention through free agency.

Phoenix gets a good defensive forward prospect in John Henson, also taking a flier on Thon Maker at the 4 as well, He's still big, mobile, and filled with talent. But the real prize is Malcolm Brogdon.

I put Josh Jackson, Dragan Bender, Troy Daniels, and Richaun Holmes in order to make the numbers work, but pieces, picks could be added if needed, within reason!

If the bucks prioritize resigning Middletown and bledsoe next summer and feel by doing so they will be priced out of brogdons market this is something they could consider.

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[bwgood77]

Last trade idea for now is Phoenix suns/Milwaukee Bucks:

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yc94wxnb .

The suns basically send Trevor Arizas' expiring contract along with the Milwaukee pick back to the bucks.....

In return, Phoenix gets John Henson, Thon Maker, and Malcolm Brogdon.

Milwaukee gets it's pick back, and also gets 15 million in cap savings to add another quality piece to their core for contention through free agency.

Phoenix gets a good defensive forward prospect in John Henson, also taking a flier on Thon Maker at the 4 as well, He's still big, mobile, and filled with talent. But the real prize is Malcolm Brogdon.

I put Josh Jackson, Dragan Bender, Troy Daniels, and Richaun Holmes in order to make the numbers work, but pieces, picks could be added if needed, within reason!

If the bucks prioritize resigning Middletown and bledsoe next summer and feel by doing so they will be priced out of brogdons market this is something they could consider.

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Bledsoe playing pretty well this year.

[BobbieL]

Last trade idea for now is Phoenix suns/Milwaukee Bucks:

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yc94wxnb .

The suns basically send Trevor Arizas' expiring contract along with the Milwaukee pick back to the bucks.....

In return, Phoenix gets John Henson, Thon Maker, and Malcolm Brogdon.

Milwaukee gets it's pick back, and also gets 15 million in cap savings to add another quality piece to their core for contention through free agency.

Phoenix gets a good defensive forward prospect in John Henson, also taking a flier on Thon Maker at the 4 as well, He's still big, mobile, and filled with talent. But the real prize is Malcolm Brogdon.

I put Josh Jackson, Dragan Bender, Troy Daniels, and Richaun Holmes in order to make the numbers work, but pieces, picks could be added if needed, within reason!

If the bucks prioritize resigning Middletown and bledsoe next summer and feel by doing so they will be priced out of brogdons market this is something they could consider.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

Bledsoe playing pretty well this year.

Interesting deal with the Bucks -- good thought process. Again, who do they want to bring back - Middleton for sure. Bledsoe or Brogdon. Hensons and Makers salary for next year is $13.5 -- might work

[SuperSunsFan]

Suns using their capspace to sign a marquee free agent when the opportunity presents itself is sounding a lot like gun nuts claiming they are holding on to their guns to fight the tyrannic government, you know its never going to happen. you know they are all talk and will be chickened out when the situation arises that truly calls for them to take action.

[SuperSunsFan]

Every NBA superstar has issues, but John Wall is a cancer...period.

Stars I wouldn't trade for under any circumstances due to attitude:
-John Wall
-Cousins
-Carmelo
-Whiteside

Stars I wouldn't trade for due to injury/contract issues
-Wall
-Love
-Griffin
-Hayward

We're better off rolling the dice on a guy like DAR via trade or maxing Borgdon then taking Wall for free.

Give me a hard working young guy fighting for that first big contract and national attention (endorsement money) over a guy locked into his second max deal that doesn't seem to care about winning and is notorious for his teammates hating him.

That is what people said about Barkley in 1992 as well, they said we shouldn't trade for Barkley because he was a cancer in the locker room with a huge ego and bad attitude. If we trade for Wall he will be instantly the second most talented Sun ever, even more so than Nash by a mile.

[Hesh]

If McD didn't get fired he'd be throwing everything we have to get Wall. That was his dream, to acquire a disgruntled star. Since he missed out the last few disgruntled stars, with PG being a our biggest need, and the position we're in, I have a feeling he'd go all in.

[WeekapaugGroove]

Last trade idea for now is Phoenix suns/Milwaukee Bucks:

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yc94wxnb .

The suns basically send Trevor Arizas' expiring contract along with the Milwaukee pick back to the bucks.....

In return, Phoenix gets John Henson, Thon Maker, and Malcolm Brogdon.

Milwaukee gets it's pick back, and also gets 15 million in cap savings to add another quality piece to their core for contention through free agency.

Phoenix gets a good defensive forward prospect in John Henson, also taking a flier on Thon Maker at the 4 as well, He's still big, mobile, and filled with talent. But the real prize is Malcolm Brogdon.

I put Josh Jackson, Dragan Bender, Troy Daniels, and Richaun Holmes in order to make the numbers work, but pieces, picks could be added if needed, within reason!

If the bucks prioritize resigning Middletown and bledsoe next summer and feel by doing so they will be priced out of brogdons market this is something they could consider.

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Bledsoe playing pretty well this year.

He really has. Prior to the season I would have ranked the guys they wanted to bring back as Middleton, brogdon, bledsoe but now I'd have to rank bledsoe ahead of brogdon he's just a more dynamic player. Curious to see how deep into lux tax they will be willing to go.

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[Ghost of Kleine]

Last trade idea for now is Phoenix suns/Milwaukee Bucks:

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yc94wxnb .

The suns basically send Trevor Arizas' expiring contract along with the Milwaukee pick back to the bucks.....

In return, Phoenix gets John Henson, Thon Maker, and Malcolm Brogdon.

Milwaukee gets it's pick back, and also gets 15 million in cap savings to add another quality piece to their core for contention through free agency.

Phoenix gets a good defensive forward prospect in John Henson, also taking a flier on Thon Maker at the 4 as well, He's still big, mobile, and filled with talent. But the real prize is Malcolm Brogdon.

I put Josh Jackson, Dragan Bender, Troy Daniels, and Richaun Holmes in order to make the numbers work, but pieces, picks could be added if needed, within reason!

If the bucks prioritize resigning Middletown and bledsoe next summer and feel by doing so they will be priced out of brogdons market this is something they could consider.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

Bledsoe playing pretty well this year.

Agreed, So you're telling me there's a chance!

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