Game 34: Oklahoma City Thunder (12-21) @ Phoenix Suns (26-7) l Wednesday l 7 PM

[Jdiddy701]

Someone has to get on Mikal. There’s no way he should end the game with 5pts with DA and Crowder not playing. He really needs to be a lot more aggressive.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Ghost of Kleine]

Why is Wainwright not in uniform? Cant be covid since he on the sidelines and didn’t know he was hurt.

Lower back issues since the Memphis game I think.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Getting worked by a big 3 of Ty Jerome, Aaron Wiggins, and Mike Muscala lol

Yeah! I really wanted Aaron Wiggins in the oft mentioned Kenrich Williams trade by David@4point play. Either him or Tre Mann. But if Payne is getting back on track, Definitely Wiggins. Also mentioned him in my 2nd round value picks prior to the draft. But I know no one thinks much of 2nd round prospects. Still would like to get him somehow before he really blows up even more. He's very versatile and super solid obviously. He'd be a great Nader replacement

[Mr Puddles]

Nice block by Jalen Smith there. Glad to see him get an opportunity again. Perhaps he'll be able to carve out a role with the team after all.

Or perhaps this allows us to showcase him, increase his value and package him with Shamet (and Saric?) for an upgrade.

Like Shamet, Saric, Smith + a pick for Gordon

[Ghost of Kleine]

The Bright Side (@BrightSideSun) Tweeted:
#FACTS

Read on Twitter

?s=20

[Slim Charless]

Wow. Kings just did Dallas like they did us in that early season game.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Phoenix Suns (@Suns) Tweeted:
Book reaches 10k
Coach Young's first win in the head coach seat

( VIA @JaValeMcGee) https://t.co/x8eUFrpuAx

Read on Twitter

?s=20

[Revived]

Getting worked by a big 3 of Ty Jerome, Aaron Wiggins, and Mike Muscala lol

Yeah! I really wanted Aaron Wiggins in the oft mentioned Kenrich Williams trade by David@4point play. Either him or Tre Mann. But if Payne is getting back on track, Definitely Wiggins. Also mentioned him in my 2nd round value picks prior to the draft. But I know no one thinks much of 2nd round prospects. Still would like to get him somehow before he really blows up even more. He's very versatile and super solid obviously. He'd be a great Nader replacement

Wiggins was drafted with one of the 1st rd picks we got in the Dragic trade.

[sunsbg]

Booker warming up before dropping 50 on his favorite Celtics.

[Mulhollanddrive]

Devin Booker's pull up 3s are still going in, every team needs an unstoppable weapon and that could be our upgrade.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Getting worked by a big 3 of Ty Jerome, Aaron Wiggins, and Mike Muscala lol

Yeah! I really wanted Aaron Wiggins in the oft mentioned Kenrich Williams trade by David@4point play. Either him or Tre Mann. But if Payne is getting back on track, Definitely Wiggins. Also mentioned him in my 2nd round value picks prior to the draft. But I know no one thinks much of 2nd round prospects. Still would like to get him somehow before he really blows up even more. He's very versatile and super solid obviously. He'd be a great Nader replacement

Wiggins was drafted with one of the 1st rd picks we got in the Dragic trade.

Are you sure he was a 1st round pick though man?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.si.com/nba/thunder/.amp/news/surprise-performer-thunder-rookie-aaron-wiggins-could-be-latest-draft-steal

After being selected late in the second round of the 2021 NBA Draft, Thunder two-way rookie Aaron Wiggins could be a steal.

The next player who has real potential to fall in that same category is Aaron Wiggins, who they selected No. 55 overall in the 2021 NBA Draft.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcsports.com/washington/wizards/marylands-aaron-wiggins-drafted-second-round-oklahoma-city-thunder%3famp

Ex-Terp Wiggins drafted in second-round by Thunder

July 30, 2021

The Oklahoma City Thunder selected Wiggins with the 55th overall pick in the 2021 NBA Draft. Wiggins joins Josh Giddey, Tre Mann and Jeremiah Robinson-Earl as the four selections that will be headed to OKC this season.
Maryland Men’s Basketball (@TerrapinHoops) Tweeted:
"With the 55th pick of the 2021 NBA Draft, the Oklahoma City Thunder select Aaron Wiggins, from the University of Maryland."

The Moment. https://t.co/4jb1Ulh1Ll

Read on Twitter

?s=20

As mentioned, SELECTED AT 55, AS A LATE 2ND ROUND PICK He's yet another steal from the 2nd round that represents a great low cost contractually controlled impact asset with escalating alue. But you have to actually be willing to do tour homework as a franchise in order to maximize hidden value in the draft. This is how the top franchises stay relevant when their cap gets tight. But also the best way for struggling rebuilding franchises that are not free agent destinations to begin trending upwards again. We really whiffed on Wiggins who could've been had with a late 2nd. And is definitely going to be an impact player. Along with a few others also there in the 2nd round. All because we prioritized veterans like Elfrid Payton, Chandler Hutchinson, etc.

How are those players working out FG or us? Not sure anyone could honestly say they'd rather have Payton or Hutchinson over someone like Aaron Wiggins, or many others (Herbert Jones is another example) that we passed on in the 2nd round that are also having significant impacts for their teams.

[NapoleonII]

You really can't place too much blame on 50+ draft selections.

For every 50th round pick, there's 10 guys that could have gone at the same spot that went undrafted, and 10 more above and below them that aren't seeing a single minute on the floor, will NEVER see an NBA minute and will play overseas or in the G league. There's just too many variables - opportunity, lack of scouting (IE let's see where Aaron Wiggins is 2-3 years from now), team needs, injuries, etc.

Maybe we can judge franchises and scouts on sure things like Draymond going at 35, or Jokic at 40-something, but Aaron Wiggins? Most likely nah.

Payton was CP3 going down insurance, Chandler Hutchinson was an afterthought with our top 9 set in stone.

[Saberestar]

The Phoenix Suns have agreed to sign G League guard M.J. Walker with a 10-day hardship contract on Thursday.

A rookie out of Florida State, Walker went undrafted but signed with the New York Knicks for training camp. He was waived by the NBA team in October but joined the G League’s Westchester Knicks.

The 6-foot-5, 213-pound guard has averaged 10.2 points, 3.5 rebounds and 2.7 assists in 29.4 minutes per game starting for Westchester.

He’s shooting 41% overall and 41% from three, taking 4.3 of his 8.7 attempts per game from beyond the arc.

https://arizonasports.com/story/2950947/phoenix-suns-to-sign-m-j-walker-on-10-day-hardship-deal-report/

[Ghost of Kleine]

You really can't place too much blame on 50+ draft selections.

For every 50th round pick, there's 10 guys that could have gone at the same spot that went undrafted, and 10 more above and below them that aren't seeing a single minute on the floor, will NEVER see an NBA minute and will play overseas or in the G league. There's just too many variables - opportunity, lack of scouting (IE let's see where Aaron Wiggins is 2-3 years from now), team needs, injuries, etc.

Maybe we can judge franchises and scouts on sure things like Draymond going at 35, or Jokic at 40-something, but Aaron Wiggins? Most likely nah.

Payton was CP3 going down insurance, Chandler Hutchinson was an afterthought with our top 9 set in stone.

You really can't place too much blame on 50+ draft selections.

I apologize if I'm misunderstanding your statement here?? Do you mean to say th hat you can't put too much stock into prospects selected in the 50 or later range? I can partially agree with that statement in that players selected in that range or later- undrafted are usually lesser known commodities with a smaller sample size to go off off than more highly touted prospects, and those more well known prospects that play for bigger schools and garner more coverage due to their larger scale playing time and roles in a more well known environment.

It's predominantly why they end up getting drafted late as they're not really a well known commodity or playing for a bigger school and as a result getting more national coverage to market themselves. However, that doesn't negate/ conceal their individual skillsets and talents that they possess either. It usually just hides/ camouflages it behind those teams mediocrity more, resulting in those very prospects becoming hidden gems for teams that have done more extensive research to find these hidden talents not recieving as much recognition due to their situation/ environment.

For every 50th round pick, there's 10 guys that could have gone at the same spot that went undrafted, and 10 more above and below them that aren't seeing a single minute on the floor, will NEVER see an NBA minute and will play overseas or in the G league. There's just too many variables - opportunity, lack of scouting (IE let's see where Aaron Wiggins is 2-3 years from now), team needs, injuries, etc.

I absolutely agree with this perspective in that there are many variables to a prospects success, as you do eloquently pointed out in this comment! But.................. That's exactly why doing your " due diligence" (extensive research/ interviews, etc) into a prospect, their production, basketball IQ and maturity, specific complimentary skillsets, strengths and weaknesses to ensure that you find the very best possible fit for your franchise is so very important! Obviously it's merely a matter of the franchises level of commitment to researching prospective prospects in their range that will determine their level of success. The odds being swayed greatly in the favor of teams that are actually willing to do in depth research beyond basic and general surface information.
As the saying goes......... " You get back what you put in."

Maybe we can judge franchises and scouts on sure things like Draymond going at 35, or Jokic at 40-something, but Aaron Wiggins? Most likely nah.

Not sure how people would classify Draymond Green and Nikola Jokic as " sure things" when they fell all the way to the 2nd round?? Green (35) , and Jokic ( 41). If they weren't undiscovered or hidden talents and were in fact seen as " sure things" would they really have been passed on by so many teams? They were hidden gems that teams either didn't do enough research on, or teams had questions about. So that caused them to fall through the cracks! And all the way to the 2nd round.

But since both have proven to be so versatile and productive with little to no discernable weaknesses, I'd wager the reason that they truly fell so far is many teams simply not doing as much homework on them as Denver did! Denver did the work and as a result, got an MVP caliber player out of it IN THE 2ND ROUND. And Golden state did the extensive research on Green, And as a result, got a perennial DPOTY player out of it IN THE 2ND ROUND.

- How did 35 teams genuinely miss on Green?
- How did 41 teams genuinely miss on Jokic?
- How did 39 teams genuinely miss on Middleton?
- How did 30 teams genuinely miss on Butler?
Are all of these teams in each draft just that unlucky? Did all of these teams just decide to be generous and pass on these players so other teams could be more successful? Or is it likey that they just didn't choose to due as much research as the teams that actually drafted them, Giving those specific franchises a decided edge! The 2nd round is a great tool to take a flyer on potentially undiscovered and relatively unknown talents at a minimal cost and with minimum risk involved. But you actually have to do significant work to identify the best talent and value if you want to put the odds in your favor. I'm going to disagree with you on Wiggins. I don't at all see his recent production being an outlier event. But to each their own I guess?

Payton was CP3 going down insurance, Chandler Hutchinson was an afterthought with our top 9 set in stone.

Payton has been a fringe bust throughout his career. No team has valued him enough to keep him, if this wasn't true, He wouldn't have been available for the minimum, Nor would he have been willing to accept a deep benchwarmers ' role. He could be a decent backup guard but he can't shoot, doesn't pass to open shooters ( tunnel vision), has poor shot selection. But he is a reasonable defender due go his size. This is adequate during the season, But won't be at all in the playoffs, as he just can't space the floor. He may be just insurance in case of a Paul injury, But be honest............
Would you really want Payton leading our bench if Paul went down knowing he can't shoot, doesn't prefer to pass (alpha mentality), and makes poor decisions. Personally I'd rather of had any of Miles McBride, Jared Butler, Jason Preston, Ayo Dosunma. Or one of many reasonable free agent vet guards or a guard via trade? Regardless, I'd definitely be looking to upgrade his spot via buyout pool.

IF Hutchinson was an afterthought, then there were many better options still available that we could've chosen even later in free agency for the minimum. IF Hutchinson still hasn't even proven to be able to earn playing time for a team obviously thin on the backup wing with Nader out, Then why not choose one of the many available options that were still out there on the late free agency market.

Better yet, ON A TWO WAY SLOT why not actually take a flier on someone like Herb Jones or maybe any of: Joe Weiscamp ( a 6'6 version of Shamet), Isiah Livers ( Dillon Brooks 2.0), JT Thor ( prime Al Fariq Aminu), Kessler Edwards ( Robert Covington), BJ Boston (smaller Brandon Ingram), Scotty Lewis ( Poor man's D Wade). Or any of the other more proven vet minimum players still unsigned. Point being, IF Hutchinson was chosen after the top 9 ( full rotation) was finished, then why not save that two way spot for a higher upside prospect or a vet min wing that you know can actually play? Otherwise it's just wasted salary.

I guess our perspectives will just have to differ on these things?

[Ghost of Kleine]

The Phoenix Suns have agreed to sign G League guard M.J. Walker with a 10-day hardship contract on Thursday.

A rookie out of Florida State, Walker went undrafted but signed with the New York Knicks for training camp. He was waived by the NBA team in October but joined the G League’s Westchester Knicks.

The 6-foot-5, 213-pound guard has averaged 10.2 points, 3.5 rebounds and 2.7 assists in 29.4 minutes per game starting for Westchester.

He’s shooting 41% overall and 41% from three, taking 4.3 of his 8.7 attempts per game from beyond the arc.

https://arizonasports.com/story/2950947/phoenix-suns-to-sign-m-j-walker-on-10-day-hardship-deal-report/

[dremill24]

You really can't place too much blame on 50+ draft selections.

For every 50th round pick, there's 10 guys that could have gone at the same spot that went undrafted, and 10 more above and below them that aren't seeing a single minute on the floor, will NEVER see an NBA minute and will play overseas or in the G league. There's just too many variables - opportunity, lack of scouting (IE let's see where Aaron Wiggins is 2-3 years from now), team needs, injuries, etc.

Maybe we can judge franchises and scouts on sure things like Draymond going at 35, or Jokic at 40-something, but Aaron Wiggins? Most likely nah.

Payton was CP3 going down insurance, Chandler Hutchinson was an afterthought with our top 9 set in stone.

You really can't place too much blame on 50+ draft selections.

I apologize if I'm misunderstanding your statement here?? Do you mean to say th hat you can't put too much stock into prospects selected in the 50 or later range? I can partially agree with that statement in that players selected in that range or later- undrafted are usually lesser known commodities with a smaller sample size to go off off than more highly touted prospects, and those more well known prospects that play for bigger schools and garner more coverage due to their larger scale playing time and roles in a more well known environment.

It's predominantly why they end up getting drafted late as they're not really a well known commodity or playing for a bigger school and as a result getting more national coverage to market themselves. However, that doesn't negate/ conceal their individual skillsets and talents that they possess either. It usually just hides/ camouflages it behind those teams mediocrity more, resulting in those very prospects becoming hidden gems for teams that have done more extensive research to find these hidden talents not recieving as much recognition due to their situation/ environment.

For every 50th round pick, there's 10 guys that could have gone at the same spot that went undrafted, and 10 more above and below them that aren't seeing a single minute on the floor, will NEVER see an NBA minute and will play overseas or in the G league. There's just too many variables - opportunity, lack of scouting (IE let's see where Aaron Wiggins is 2-3 years from now), team needs, injuries, etc.

I absolutely agree with this perspective in that there are many variables to a prospects success, as you do eloquently pointed out in this comment! But.................. That's exactly why doing your " due diligence" (extensive research/ interviews, etc) into a prospect, their production, basketball IQ and maturity, specific complimentary skillsets, strengths and weaknesses to ensure that you find the very best possible fit for your franchise is so very important! Obviously it's merely a matter of the franchises level of commitment to researching prospective prospects in their range that will determine their level of success. The odds being swayed greatly in the favor of teams that are actually willing to do in depth research beyond basic and general surface information.
As the saying goes......... " You get back what you put in."

Maybe we can judge franchises and scouts on sure things like Draymond going at 35, or Jokic at 40-something, but Aaron Wiggins? Most likely nah.

Not sure how people would classify Draymond Green and Nikola Jokic as " sure things" when they fell all the way to the 2nd round?? Green (35) , and Jokic ( 41). If they weren't undiscovered or hidden talents and were in fact seen as " sure things" would they really have been passed on by so many teams? They were hidden gems that teams either didn't do enough research on, or teams had questions about. So that caused them to fall through the cracks! And all the way to the 2nd round.

But since both have proven to be so versatile and productive with little to no discernable weaknesses, I'd wager the reason that they truly fell so far is many teams simply not doing as much homework on them as Denver did! Denver did the work and as a result, got an MVP caliber player out of it IN THE 2ND ROUND. And Golden state did the extensive research on Green, And as a result, got a perennial DPOTY player out of it IN THE 2ND ROUND.

- How did 35 teams genuinely miss on Green?
- How did 41 teams genuinely miss on Jokic?
- How did 39 teams genuinely miss on Middleton?
- How did 30 teams genuinely miss on Butler?
Are all of these teams in each draft just that unlucky? Did all of these teams just decide to be generous and pass on these players so other teams could be more successful? Or is it likey that they just didn't choose to due as much research as the teams that actually drafted them, Giving those specific franchises a decided edge! The 2nd round is a great tool to take a flyer on potentially undiscovered and relatively unknown talents at a minimal cost and with minimum risk involved. But you actually have to do significant work to identify the best talent and value if you want to put the odds in your favor. I'm going to disagree with you on Wiggins. I don't at all see his recent production being an outlier event. But to each their own I guess?

Payton was CP3 going down insurance, Chandler Hutchinson was an afterthought with our top 9 set in stone.

Payton has been a fringe bust throughout his career. No team has valued him enough to keep him, if this wasn't true, He wouldn't have been available for the minimum, Nor would he have been willing to accept a deep benchwarmers ' role. He could be a decent backup guard but he can't shoot, doesn't pass to open shooters ( tunnel vision), has poor shot selection. But he is a reasonable defender due go his size. This is adequate during the season, But won't be at all in the playoffs, as he just can't space the floor. He may be just insurance in case of a Paul injury, But be honest............
Would you really want Payton leading our bench if Paul went down knowing he can't shoot, doesn't prefer to pass (alpha mentality), and makes poor decisions. Personally I'd rather of had any of Miles McBride, Jared Butler, Jason Preston, Ayo Dosunma. Or one of many reasonable free agent vet guards or a guard via trade? Regardless, I'd definitely be looking to upgrade his spot via buyout pool.

IF Hutchinson was an afterthought, then there were many better options still available that we could've chosen even later in free agency for the minimum. IF Hutchinson still hasn't even proven to be able to earn playing time for a team obviously thin on the backup wing with Nader out, Then why not choose one of the many available options that were still out there on the late free agency market.

Better yet, ON A TWO WAY SLOT why not actually take a flier on someone like Herb Jones or maybe any of: Joe Weiscamp ( a 6'6 version of Shamet), Isiah Livers ( Dillon Brooks 2.0), JT Thor ( prime Al Fariq Aminu), Kessler Edwards ( Robert Covington), BJ Boston (smaller Brandon Ingram), Scotty Lewis ( Poor man's D Wade). Or any of the other more proven vet minimum players still unsigned. Point being, IF Hutchinson was chosen after the top 9 ( full rotation) was finished, then why not save that two way spot for a higher upside prospect or a vet min wing that you know can actually play? Otherwise it's just wasted salary.

I guess our perspectives will just have to differ on these things?

Cmon, the more reasonable interpretation of the bolded part is that holding it against a front office for passing on Jokic/Draymond, who have proven to be some of the best players in the whole world, is not even remotely on the same level as holding it against them for passing on Wiggins, who has had like 3 good games his whole career and may very well not be on an NBA roster in 12 months.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Spoiler:

You really can't place too much blame on 50+ draft selections.

For every 50th round pick, there's 10 guys that could have gone at the same spot that went undrafted, and 10 more above and below them that aren't seeing a single minute on the floor, will NEVER see an NBA minute and will play overseas or in the G league. There's just too many variables - opportunity, lack of scouting (IE let's see where Aaron Wiggins is 2-3 years from now), team needs, injuries, etc.

Maybe we can judge franchises and scouts on sure things like Draymond going at 35, or Jokic at 40-something, but Aaron Wiggins? Most likely nah.

Payton was CP3 going down insurance, Chandler Hutchinson was an afterthought with our top 9 set in stone.

You really can't place too much blame on 50+ draft selections.

I apologize if I'm misunderstanding your statement here?? Do you mean to say th hat you can't put too much stock into prospects selected in the 50 or later range? I can partially agree with that statement in that players selected in that range or later- undrafted are usually lesser known commodities with a smaller sample size to go off off than more highly touted prospects, and those more well known prospects that play for bigger schools and garner more coverage due to their larger scale playing time and roles in a more well known environment.

It's predominantly why they end up getting drafted late as they're not really a well known commodity or playing for a bigger school and as a result getting more national coverage to market themselves. However, that doesn't negate/ conceal their individual skillsets and talents that they possess either. It usually just hides/ camouflages it behind those teams mediocrity more, resulting in those very prospects becoming hidden gems for teams that have done more extensive research to find these hidden talents not recieving as much recognition due to their situation/ environment.

For every 50th round pick, there's 10 guys that could have gone at the same spot that went undrafted, and 10 more above and below them that aren't seeing a single minute on the floor, will NEVER see an NBA minute and will play overseas or in the G league. There's just too many variables - opportunity, lack of scouting (IE let's see where Aaron Wiggins is 2-3 years from now), team needs, injuries, etc.

I absolutely agree with this perspective in that there are many variables to a prospects success, as you do eloquently pointed out in this comment! But.................. That's exactly why doing your " due diligence" (extensive research/ interviews, etc) into a prospect, their production, basketball IQ and maturity, specific complimentary skillsets, strengths and weaknesses to ensure that you find the very best possible fit for your franchise is so very important! Obviously it's merely a matter of the franchises level of commitment to researching prospective prospects in their range that will determine their level of success. The odds being swayed greatly in the favor of teams that are actually willing to do in depth research beyond basic and general surface information.
As the saying goes......... " You get back what you put in."

Maybe we can judge franchises and scouts on sure things like Draymond going at 35, or Jokic at 40-something, but Aaron Wiggins? Most likely nah.

Not sure how people would classify Draymond Green and Nikola Jokic as " sure things" when they fell all the way to the 2nd round?? Green (35) , and Jokic ( 41). If they weren't undiscovered or hidden talents and were in fact seen as " sure things" would they really have been passed on by so many teams? They were hidden gems that teams either didn't do enough research on, or teams had questions about. So that caused them to fall through the cracks! And all the way to the 2nd round.

But since both have proven to be so versatile and productive with little to no discernable weaknesses, I'd wager the reason that they truly fell so far is many teams simply not doing as much homework on them as Denver did! Denver did the work and as a result, got an MVP caliber player out of it IN THE 2ND ROUND. And Golden state did the extensive research on Green, And as a result, got a perennial DPOTY player out of it IN THE 2ND ROUND.

- How did 35 teams genuinely miss on Green?
- How did 41 teams genuinely miss on Jokic?
- How did 39 teams genuinely miss on Middleton?
- How did 30 teams genuinely miss on Butler?
Are all of these teams in each draft just that unlucky? Did all of these teams just decide to be generous and pass on these players so other teams could be more successful? Or is it likey that they just didn't choose to due as much research as the teams that actually drafted them, Giving those specific franchises a decided edge! The 2nd round is a great tool to take a flyer on potentially undiscovered and relatively unknown talents at a minimal cost and with minimum risk involved. But you actually have to do significant work to identify the best talent and value if you want to put the odds in your favor. I'm going to disagree with you on Wiggins. I don't at all see his recent production being an outlier event. But to each their own I guess?

Payton was CP3 going down insurance, Chandler Hutchinson was an afterthought with our top 9 set in stone.

Payton has been a fringe bust throughout his career. No team has valued him enough to keep him, if this wasn't true, He wouldn't have been available for the minimum, Nor would he have been willing to accept a deep benchwarmers ' role. He could be a decent backup guard but he can't shoot, doesn't pass to open shooters ( tunnel vision), has poor shot selection. But he is a reasonable defender due go his size. This is adequate during the season, But won't be at all in the playoffs, as he just can't space the floor. He may be just insurance in case of a Paul injury, But be honest............
Would you really want Payton leading our bench if Paul went down knowing he can't shoot, doesn't prefer to pass (alpha mentality), and makes poor decisions. Personally I'd rather of had any of Miles McBride, Jared Butler, Jason Preston, Ayo Dosunma. Or one of many reasonable free agent vet guards or a guard via trade? Regardless, I'd definitely be looking to upgrade his spot via buyout pool.

IF Hutchinson was an afterthought, then there were many better options still available that we could've chosen even later in free agency for the minimum. IF Hutchinson still hasn't even proven to be able to earn playing time for a team obviously thin on the backup wing with Nader out, Then why not choose one of the many available options that were still out there on the late free agency market.

Better yet, ON A TWO WAY SLOT why not actually take a flier on someone like Herb Jones or maybe any of: Joe Weiscamp ( a 6'6 version of Shamet), Isiah Livers ( Dillon Brooks 2.0), JT Thor ( prime Al Fariq Aminu), Kessler Edwards ( Robert Covington), BJ Boston (smaller Brandon Ingram), Scotty Lewis ( Poor man's D Wade). Or any of the other more proven vet minimum players still unsigned. Point being, IF Hutchinson was chosen after the top 9 ( full rotation) was finished, then why not save that two way spot for a higher upside prospect or a vet min wing that you know can actually play? Otherwise it's just wasted salary.

I guess our perspectives will just have to differ on these things?

Cmon, the more reasonable interpretation of the bolded part is that holding it against a front office for passing on Jokic/Draymond, who have proven to be some of the best players in the whole world, is not even remotely on the same level as holding it against them for passing on Wiggins, who has had like 3 good games his whole career and may very well not be on an NBA roster in 12 months.

Of course I understand the disparity in projected outcomes/percieved impact. But that's not the premise or the point here. The point is in that you greatly increase your odds of finding legitimate value/ talent/ productive impact players by doing in depth research. Regardless of specific level of individual talent, the premise is that your odds of legitimately identifying potential contributors vs. just randomly going off media hype / majority narrative with fingers crossed and hoping for the best outcome is highly predicated upon the level of investment in the process towards targeted prospects.

If you do a better/ deeper/ more intrinsic job, You get a better understanding of the prospect, his potential, mindset, skillset, etc. It really doesn't matter whether we're discussing Green, Jokic, or even Wiggins. The whole argument is based upon being able to recognize discernible talent or not. In any of yhe players discussed, many teams have passed on them, allowing them.to fall to the 2nd round. Only to later discover that those very players are providing impact/ production for the team that was actually able to identify them.