2016 NBA Summer League

[Frank Lee]

jesus wood.... home grown = american

[bwgood77]

I was talking about you lumping all Euro players into one bucket, as if they have the same bbiq, mr. quickwit. But I guess you could say the same for lumping all americans into the same bbiq bucket as well. But if that's the case, I can understand why you might not like him.

[darealjuice]

For anyone that's freaking out about Bender shooting poorly thus far and calling him a bust, take a look at Ingram in Summer League: 9.8 ppg, 4 rpg, 1.3 apg, .5 bpg, .5 spg, 31.6 FG% (12 of 38), 15.3 3PT% (2 of 13). Let's not overreact to Summer League.

[gaspar]

Bender's future is stretch PF...that's where his strengths lie.

Not a good rim protector at this stage so playing at C isn't a great idea, and I think his height actually does him a disservice at SF because wings can strip him easily.

Right now Bender doesn't have the strength to defend PFs but his perimeter defense is phenomenal, so playing him at SF makes sense.

Ulis looks like a less explosive Chris Paul. CP3 at 6-0 was one of the best if not the best defensive point guard in the league in the last decade. I see no reason why Ulis at 5-10 can't be at least average.

As for Dunn, Summer League is where slashing guards feast. Players like Josh Selby, Marcus Banks or Archie Goodwin looked like future stars in the Summer League.

[Qwigglez]

For anyone that's freaking out about Bender shooting poorly thus far and calling him a bust, take a look at Ingram in Summer League: 9.8 ppg, 4 rpg, 1.3 apg, .5 bpg, .5 spg, 31.6 FG% (12 of 38), 15.3 3PT% (2 of 13). Let's not overreact to Summer League.

Thats because Ingram is a bust though.

[SSOL]

People in here thinking these players are out of the box ready crack me up. RELAX.

[Frank Lee]

I was talking about you lumping all Euro players into one bucket, as if they have the same bbiq, mr. quickwit. But I guess you could say the same for lumping all americans into the same bbiq bucket as well. But if that's the case, I can understand why you might not like him.

I do not dislike Bender. I think he has a better chance to succeed than Chriss.

The uber optimism around here is normal I guess, considering the only thing we had to look forward to for the past 6 months was this draft. I do question the assets given up to move up 5 spots to select Chriss. Would have been just fine with a few draft and stash guys. Oh well, I keep thinking a trade is brewing as I do not think we addressed our needs too well in free agency. Another subpar semi tank year will be another year wasted. We don't own these guys. And in today's arena, there is so much player movement, if you don't start winning, you will see an exodus of talent.

[bwgood77]

I was talking about you lumping all Euro players into one bucket, as if they have the same bbiq, mr. quickwit. But I guess you could say the same for lumping all americans into the same bbiq bucket as well. But if that's the case, I can understand why you might not like him.

I do not dislike Bender. I think he has a better chance to succeed than Chriss.

The uber optimism around here is normal I guess, considering the only thing we had to look forward to for the past 6 months was this draft. I do question the assets given up to move up 5 spots to select Chriss. Would have been just fine with a few draft and stash guys. Oh well, I keep thinking a trade is brewing as I do not think we addressed our needs too well in free agency. Another subpar semi tank year will be another year wasted. We don't own these guys. And in today's arena, there is so much player movement, if you don't start winning, you will see an exodus of talent.

I think Bender will be better than Chriss too, mostly because of IQ and just the little things. I think he will help Chriss be better though. When they play together, set him up with nice passes, etc, and also will be someone Chriss can learn the little things from. I do think many will like Chriss better because he will be more of a highlight reel. Chriss will on the surface look better to many early.

I love Chriss too though and earlier really wanted him at 13. I was a little uneasy taking him at 4 because I think his bust factor is bigger.

I also think a trade is probably coming. Perhaps not before the season starts, but also maybe before it starts if the right deal is there.

[Frank Lee]

At this point, we have what we have.... can't blame Chriss, just hope he puts the work in. I think he logs most of his minutes in the D league. He needs to play.

[NTB]

http://hoopslab.rotowire.com/post/147439185066/vegas-summer-league-2016-day-7

One more article praises Bender

[JMac1]

Bender's future is stretch PF...that's where his strengths lie.

Not a good rim protector at this stage so playing at C isn't a great idea, and I think his height actually does him a disservice at SF because wings can strip him easily.

Right now Bender doesn't have the strength to defend PFs but his perimeter defense is phenomenal, so playing him at SF makes sense.

Ulis looks like a less explosive Chris Paul. CP3 at 6-0 was one of the best if not the best defensive point guard in the league in the last decade. I see no reason why Ulis at 5-10 can't be at least average.

As for Dunn, Summer League is where slashing guards feast. Players like Josh Selby, Marcus Banks or Archie Goodwin looked like future stars in the Summer League.

It's funny. I think we don't want to or can't see Ulis being our future PG because he is so small and we want a 6'2-6'4 PG, but the guy does nothing but play well.

I haven't been high on him, because of his physical attributes, but I don't see why we are putting a bench ceiling on the guy. That's not the guy that I pictured playing next to Booker in 3-4 years, but...... could he?

If Ulis plays in the NBA like he has at Kentucky and in the SL..... maybe he and his Buddy could be our back court of the future.?

[JMac1]

Chris Paul is 6'1 with shoes..

[NTB]

http://www.nba.com/video/games/suns/2016/07/15/vegas-tyler-ulis-mix.nba/?cid=nbacomsocial_tw_sf30991709

[tweet]https://twitter.com/KeithSmithNBA/status/753943120597749760[/tweet]

[NavLDO]

This constant disclaimer of youth will get old. A rookie is a rookie. Some will play and contribute from day one... others will take 2-3 yrs to get into the NBA groove. Some wont make it, but have a 4 yr guarantee. Take a look at Len... we still don't quite know what we have with him, and yet, we will be faced with re-signing him. The only advantage we have is we can pay him more than the next team...and yet it was our dime and time spent developing him.

I just don't see any valid comparison argument about players/rookies who are 3-4 ys older than these unready projects, the one and done-ers. Personally, I see better value in a player who is ready to play, than one who will spend half his time in the D league and the rest of it with may be mop up meaningless minutes, just on the hopes he gets better. Goodwin is yet another example of a kid who just wasn't ready for the NBA. The league is littered with them. To me, there is far less risk in taking a kid like Dunn or Sabonis than our moon shooting toddlers . No hate here... just opinion based on the crap shoot facts and stats of rookies.

Yeah, you're right Frank, we shouldn't have taken Booker...but by all means, use the complete other side of the spectrum-example on our team to make your point...

Booker missed his first 8 three pointers in summer league too, and of course people saying "I can't believe we took a SG that can't hit a 3. We should have taken Portis who is more nba ready "

And then to contradict, yourself Frank...which is it...is "This constant disclaimer of youth will get old. A rookie a rookie" or "is there far less risk in taking a kid like Dunn or Sabonis than our moon shooting toddlers."

Of course there is "potential" for less risk with a similarly graded Senior over a Freshman, but it's about talent and team fit, and nobody is going to convince me that Dunn was a better fit for us with the fact that a) We're rebuilding and b) We have plenty of YOUNG guards, and seeing that Dunn doesn't look to me as being much, if any better than Bledsoe, why put yourself in a position to 'force' a trade, when we have a glaring need for 'bigs', and oh look, there's the guy that everyone thought was going to be gone at 3, staring us in the face!!

Then, with Chriss sliding and our relative dearth in picks and Guards, why not trade up and take the guy our FO was split upon taking at 4, sitting there at 9? Yeah, Sabonis would've been safer...likely...but Sabonis can't come close to moving like or shooting from length like Chriss has shown.

But I get it, Frank, McD can 'do no right'...hey look, Frank, isn't that on of your originals, McDoNoRight?? Anyway, what's done is done, and McD has seemingly 'hit' more often than not on picks than 'miss', so I'll trust McD on this, especially if this was simply the right way to use our assets to 'double our chances' that at least one 'hits'. I'm actually ok with that, but to me, at worst, I see two starters in 2-3 years somewhere between the 3-5 spots...MAYBE one of them is a top 6th man in the league. And with Ulis??? Hell, I like what I see from Ulis more than what I've seen what Dunn can do, but then again, Dunn's only played in 2 games, so that's not really a fair comparison.

[bwgood77]

Yeah, you're right Frank, we shouldn't have taken Booker...but by all means, use the complete other side of the spectrum-example on our team to make your point...

Booker missed his first 8 three pointers in summer league too, and of course people saying "I can't believe we took a SG that can't hit a 3. We should have taken Portis who is more nba ready "

An then to contradict, yourself Frank...which is it...is "This constant disclaimer of youth will get old. A rookie a rookie" or "is there far less risk in taking a kid like Dunn or Sabonis than our moon shooting toddlers."

Of course there is "potential" for less risk with a similarly graded Senior over a Freshman, but it's about talent and team fit, and nobody is going to convince me that Dunn was a better fit for us with the fact that a) We're rebuilding and b) We have plenty of YOUNG guards, and seeing that Dunn doesn't look to me as being much, if any better than Bledsoe, why put yourself in a position to 'force' a trade, when we have a glaring need for 'bigs', and oh look, there's the guy that everyone thought as going to be gone at 3, staring us in the face!!

Then, with Chriss sliding and our relative dearth in picks and Guards, why not trade up and take the guy our FO was split upon taking at 4, sitting there at 9? Yeah, Sabonis would've been safer...likely...but Sabonis can't come close to moving like or shooting from length like Chriss has shown.

But I get it, Frank, McD can 'do no right'...hey look, Frank, isn't that on of your originals, McDoNoRight?? Anyway, what's done is done, and McD has seemingly 'hit' more often than not on picks than 'miss', so I'll trust McD on this, especially if this was simply the rig way to use our assets to 'double our chances' that at least one 'hits'. I'm actually ok with that, but to me, at worst, I see two starters in 2-3 years somewhere between the 3-5 spots...MAYBE one of them is a top 6th man in the league. And with Ulis??? Hell, I like what I see from Ulis more than what I've seen what Dunn can do, but ten again, Dunn's only played in 2 games, so that's not really a fair comparison.

Didn't Bender dominate Sabonis in a h2h competition a couple years ago when he was a couple years younger? Because Sabonis got playing time against college guys in a weak conference, and Bender got a deal with a high level professional team in the second best league in the world and didn't get much playing time, he is MUCH safer? I like Sabonis but I don't buy it. He certainly seems to have a much lower ceiling. He might be a little more ready now because he's been playing, but I think Bender catches up within a year.

[NavLDO]

I was talking about you lumping all Euro players into one bucket, as if they have the same bbiq, mr. quickwit. But I guess you could say the same for lumping all americans into the same bbiq bucket as well. But if that's the case, I can understand why you might not like him.

He would like him if McD didn't pick him....you haven't figured that out yet??

Just diggin' a little on you Frank; I've said a many times, I actually DO hold you in high regard (much higher than you, me, but that's ok, I haven't watched enough over the past couple of years to impart any worthwhile opinions), even if your opinion is on the complete opposite side of the spectrum as mine. I know you've given McD props from time to time.

Thanks for your, as BW mentioned, quick (and I'll add extremely 'dry') wit and humor.

[NavLDO]

I was talking about you lumping all Euro players into one bucket, as if they have the same bbiq, mr. quickwit. But I guess you could say the same for lumping all americans into the same bbiq bucket as well. But if that's the case, I can understand why you might not like him.

I do not dislike Bender. I think he has a better chance to succeed than Chriss.

The uber optimism around here is normal I guess, considering the only thing we had to look forward to for the past 6 months was this draft. I do question the assets given up to move up 5 spots to select Chriss. Would have been just fine with a few draft and stash guys. Oh well, I keep thinking a trade is brewing as I do not think we addressed our needs too well in free agency. Another subpar semi tank year will be another year wasted. We don't own these guys. And in today's arena, there is so much player movement, if you don't start winning, you will see an exodus of talent.

Oh, I don't agree, that's why McD has been collecting assets, to use them on either a trade up in the draft, or to trade for a star. And IMO, we aren't ready for a 'star'--give Book another season, along with a healthy Warren and Bled, and I think we will.

But if you are correct, and we do trade for a 'star', I wonder if Chriss might be a piece that's included?? Booker won't be, but I COULD see McD using Bender, or Chriss, in a pkg with Knight, and maybe Goodwin, and Warren (I hope not; I'm really high on Warren), or hopefully, Chandler, to bring back a 'star'. I think Ulis has shown that he could hold his own for 15 minutes a game in relief of Bledsoe.

Bledsoe/Ulis
Booker/Jenkins
"Star" or (Warren)/Tucker/(Bender)
"Star" or Dudley/(Chriss)
Len/(Chandler)/Williams

What do you think Frank (honest question)? Do you think we are ready for a 'star' SF or PF with that roster?? Maybe, but I'd like to see what Chriss and/or Bender can show this season before we trade them away; I'd hate to trade away one of them without knowing anything yet, or asically, at this stage of our 'knowledge' of their game.

But hey, if we do trade to bring in a 'star', then maybe next year we look a lot more 'desirable' as a FA destination?!?!

[bwgood77]

I was talking about you lumping all Euro players into one bucket, as if they have the same bbiq, mr. quickwit. But I guess you could say the same for lumping all americans into the same bbiq bucket as well. But if that's the case, I can understand why you might not like him.

I do not dislike Bender. I think he has a better chance to succeed than Chriss.

The uber optimism around here is normal I guess, considering the only thing we had to look forward to for the past 6 months was this draft. I do question the assets given up to move up 5 spots to select Chriss. Would have been just fine with a few draft and stash guys. Oh well, I keep thinking a trade is brewing as I do not think we addressed our needs too well in free agency. Another subpar semi tank year will be another year wasted. We don't own these guys. And in today's arena, there is so much player movement, if you don't start winning, you will see an exodus of talent.

Oh, I don't agree, that's why McD has been collecting assets, to use them on either a trade up in the draft, or to trade for a star. And IMO, we aren't ready for a 'star'--give Book another season, along with a healthy Warren and Bled, and I think we will.

But if you are correct, and we do trade for a 'star', I wonder if Chriss might be a piece that's included?? Booker won't be, but I COULD see McD using Bender, or Chriss, in a pkg with Knight, and maybe Goodwin, and Warren (I hope not; I'm really high on Warren), or hopefully, Chandler, to bring back a 'star'. I think Ulis has shown that he could hold his own for 15 minutes a game in relief of Bledsoe.

Bledsoe/Ulis
Booker/Jenkins
"Star" or (Warren)/Tucker/(Bender)
"Star" or Dudley/(Chriss)
Len/(Chandler)/Williams

What do you think Frank (honest question)? Do you think we are ready for a 'star' SF or PF with that roster?? Maybe, but I'd like to see what Chriss and/or Bender can show this season before we trade them away; I'd hate to trade away one of them without knowing anything yet, or asically, at this stage of our 'knowledge' of their game.

But hey, if we do trade to bring in a 'star', then maybe next year we look a lot more 'desirable' as a FA destination?!?!

I think there is close to zero chance we trade Chriss or Bender as high as they seemed to be on them and as much as they maneuvered in the draft to get them. I'd be surprised with Warren too, but I guess not AS surprised.

I think Tucker and Warren start the season playing most of the SF minutes, with some of Dudley, and then at some point, or maybe perhaps before the season, Tucker gets traded, and Warren and Bender play the SF minutes. The reason I think Tucker probably starts the season is so we can integrate Bender into the lineup slowly. Same with Chriss playing some minutes at PF...but he would come along even more slowly. And perhaps if we keep Tucker, Bender plays some at 4 as well early, alternating with Dudley until Chriss is ready and Tucker is traded.

[Frank Lee]

If you do not field a competitive team, you run the risk of your own players wanting to win...elsewhere. Bledsoe is a good example. How much longer do we have him here ? We might lose Len next year as well, more so from economics.

I don't know what 'star' is worth giving up a couple of good players/picks, and I don't think it is a question if we are ready for one. Being ready, to me, is having the ways and means to acquire one.So yes, I think we are ready. We have enough talent here and in my demented old schooling mind, all we are lacking is an effective 2 way PF. This team is ready to win now. Bled is ready, Booker, Warren, Len, Chandler, Knight... they are all ready especially after last yr... and what do we do... sign freaking Dudley to fill the glaring PF hole. Who cares about drafting a pair of them... production now would go along ways.

I don't know what you guys are afraid of....Winning perhaps....and losing a couple spots in the holy draft ...???

Sadly, I do think the FO is content with running a PG/3wing/C offense and looks to be set for a 'bombs away' season. Adding Duds and Barbasoso just smells of it. Perhaps for now, and I hope it is temporary, they(FO) believe platooning Dudley/Tucker/and(?) at PF is going to be good enough. It looks like a mess to me and once again, we become a jumpshooting team with little to no inside presence.

There is still plenty of time between now and Oct though.

[Frank Lee]

.....
I think there is close to zero chance we trade Chriss or Bender as high as they seemed to be on them and as much as they maneuvered in the draft to get them. I'd be surprised with Warren too, but I guess not AS surprised.

I think Tucker and Warren start the season playing most of the SF minutes, with some of Dudley, and then at some point, or maybe perhaps before the season, Tucker gets traded, and Warren and Bender play the SF minutes. The reason I think Tucker probably starts the season is so we can integrate Bender into the lineup slowly. Same with Chriss playing some minutes at PF...but he would come along even more slowly. And perhaps if we keep Tucker, Bender plays some at 4 as well early, alternating with Dudley until Chriss is ready and Tucker is traded.

I will agree with this., kind of.

To think Chriss will be ready for anything but mop up minutes is getting way ahead of the game. He can run fast and jump high, but he's no superman. To think otherwise is not fair to him. I am likely alone in thinking (as it goes against the starry-eyed hopers), he spends most of the season in the D league, getting valuable minutes. And I would not be surprised to see Ulis there too, feeding him the oops. Perhaps we see them both at Phnx games.... but their postcards home will be from Prescott.