NBA Draft and NCAA Basketball

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Gotta wonder what Wendell Carter Jr would be rated if Bagley wasn't there. He's still having a pretty impressive season averaging 13.5/9/2/2 blocks on 60/45/66 (low volume 3 but seems like he's not afraid to shoot it). Might need to catch some more Duke games and get a better look at him.

I do think Wendell benefits from the ability to camp in the lane at the College level. He's not that mobile, though he is smart. I've soured on him just slightly.

[MrMiyagi]

The biggest problem with Trae Young's game is he has no one else on his team to shoulder the load so he takes some not so great shots. He's a worthy #1 pick if Ayton weren't around. Haven't gotten to see Bagley yet, but Trae Young is probably my #2 prospect.

[jcsunsfan]

The biggest problem with Trae Young's game is he has no one else on his team to shoulder the load so he takes some not so great shots. He's a worthy #1 pick if Ayton weren't around. Haven't gotten to see Bagley yet, but Trae Young is probably my #2 prospect.

Ayton did not have a great game today.

[bwgood77]

The biggest problem with Trae Young's game is he has no one else on his team to shoulder the load so he takes some not so great shots. He's a worthy #1 pick if Ayton weren't around. Haven't gotten to see Bagley yet, but Trae Young is probably my #2 prospect.

Ayton did not have a great game today.

The good thing about Ayton today is he had 6 blocks. He hasn't had a lot of big shot blocking games. What exactly is it about Ayton that makes him #1 on both of your boards? I mean I'm an AZ fan but I am not as impressed with him as I expected. Sometimes I feel he just kind of goes through the motions. I mean he has the size and the NBA body and I think he will score well from inside and get a lot of rebounds, but I don't know about defense and shot blocking (though, like I said, the blocks today is encouraging in that respect).

But in today's league the impact bigs unless they are phenomenal passers like Jokic are defensive studs, some of which provide a lot of rim protection.

As far as Young...yeesh...39 shots? 14 makes? Obviously he's a great shooter and scored a lot but I wonder why he doesn't shoot better from 2 pt range. He was 40% from 3...8 of 20, and 6 of 19 from 2. He also turns it over a lot.

But his usage is so high and he gets a lot of assists and you know he can make those shots that I am not worried too much about his translation because teams won't be able to focus solely on him in the NBA.

I wish I was able to see more of Porter. I feel like we need another shooter and ball handler, so I like the idea of Doncic or Young, but Porter might be that Durant/George type. We would need his shooting despite us having a bunch of 3s and 4s.

It's tough for me to rank Jackson ahead of Ayton but the fact that he is a shot blocking, defensive big who can hit the 3 really checks all the NBA boxes.

It feels like in the old NBA Ayton and Bagley are hands down 1 and 2 no questions and now all the other guys I named and maybe Bamba check more boxes for what successful NBA teams have these days so it's really a tough draft to really evaluate at the top.

[MrMiyagi]

The biggest problem with Trae Young's game is he has no one else on his team to shoulder the load so he takes some not so great shots. He's a worthy #1 pick if Ayton weren't around. Haven't gotten to see Bagley yet, but Trae Young is probably my #2 prospect.

Ayton did not have a great game today.

The good thing about Ayton today is he had 6 blocks. He hasn't had a lot of big shot blocking games. What exactly is it about Ayton that makes him #1 on both of your boards? I mean I'm an AZ fan but I am not as impressed with him as I expected. Sometimes I feel he just kind of goes through the motions. I mean he has the size and the NBA body and I think he will score well from inside and get a lot of rebounds, but I don't know about defense and shot blocking (though, like I said, the blocks today is encouraging in that respect).

But in today's league the impact bigs unless they are phenomenal passers like Jokic are defensive studs, some of which provide a lot of rim protection.

As far as Young...yeesh...39 shots? 14 makes? Obviously he's a great shooter and scored a lot but I wonder why he doesn't shoot better from 2 pt range. He was 40% from 3...8 of 20, and 6 of 19 from 2. He also turns it over a lot.

But his usage is so high and he gets a lot of assists and you know he can make those shots that I am not worried too much about his translation because teams won't be able to focus solely on him in the NBA.

I wish I was able to see more of Porter. I feel like we need another shooter and ball handler, so I like the idea of Doncic or Young, but Porter might be that Durant/George type. We would need his shooting despite us having a bunch of 3s and 4s.

It's tough for me to rank Jackson ahead of Ayton but the fact that he is a shot blocking, defensive big who can hit the 3 really checks all the NBA boxes.

It feels like in the old NBA Ayton and Bagley are hands down 1 and 2 no questions and now all the other guys I named and maybe Bamba check more boxes for what successful NBA teams have these days so it's really a tough draft to really evaluate at the top.

You feel like Ayton "just kind of goes through the motions" but I feel like the game comes easy to him. He knows what to do, he doesn't panic. The Cats struggle when they can't get him the ball.

Next time you watch a Suns game, watch Alex Len and then imagine Ayton in his place. When Len swats a ball blindly outward hoping a teammate will get the ball? Ayton grabs the ball and we get another possession. When Len gets blocked by someone smaller than him? It's an Ayton dunk. When Len switches onto a guard and blown past for an easy lay-in? Ayton forces a contested jumper or gets a block from behind. Imagine having a guy you can actually dump the ball to in the post and isn't going to fumble the ball away or smack the back iron with the ball. A guy who can pass out of a double team to give an open shot. A guy most opponents have to double team or give up 2 points.

Honestly, Ayton in the NBA is going to be better than he is now thanks to spacing. In college, teams are starting to pack the paint with a zone and clog passing lanes to him (not to mention Sean Miller's Cats have always struggled against the zone anyway). You can't really do that in the NBA.

[bwgood77]

Ayton did not have a great game today.

The good thing about Ayton today is he had 6 blocks. He hasn't had a lot of big shot blocking games. What exactly is it about Ayton that makes him #1 on both of your boards? I mean I'm an AZ fan but I am not as impressed with him as I expected. Sometimes I feel he just kind of goes through the motions. I mean he has the size and the NBA body and I think he will score well from inside and get a lot of rebounds, but I don't know about defense and shot blocking (though, like I said, the blocks today is encouraging in that respect).

But in today's league the impact bigs unless they are phenomenal passers like Jokic are defensive studs, some of which provide a lot of rim protection.

As far as Young...yeesh...39 shots? 14 makes? Obviously he's a great shooter and scored a lot but I wonder why he doesn't shoot better from 2 pt range. He was 40% from 3...8 of 20, and 6 of 19 from 2. He also turns it over a lot.

But his usage is so high and he gets a lot of assists and you know he can make those shots that I am not worried too much about his translation because teams won't be able to focus solely on him in the NBA.

I wish I was able to see more of Porter. I feel like we need another shooter and ball handler, so I like the idea of Doncic or Young, but Porter might be that Durant/George type. We would need his shooting despite us having a bunch of 3s and 4s.

It's tough for me to rank Jackson ahead of Ayton but the fact that he is a shot blocking, defensive big who can hit the 3 really checks all the NBA boxes.

It feels like in the old NBA Ayton and Bagley are hands down 1 and 2 no questions and now all the other guys I named and maybe Bamba check more boxes for what successful NBA teams have these days so it's really a tough draft to really evaluate at the top.

You feel like Ayton "just kind of goes through the motions" but I feel like the game comes easy to him. He knows what to do, he doesn't panic. The Cats struggle when they can't get him the ball.

Next time you watch a Suns game, watch Alex Len and then imagine Ayton in his place. When Len swats a ball blindly outward hoping a teammate will get the ball? Ayton grabs the ball and we get another possession. When Len gets blocked by someone smaller than him? It's an Ayton dunk. When Len switches onto a guard and blown past for an easy lay-in? Ayton forces a contested jumper or gets a block from behind. Imagine having a guy you can actually dump the ball to in the post and isn't going to fumble the ball away or smack the back iron with the ball. A guy who can pass out of a double team to give an open shot. A guy most opponents have to double team or give up 2 points.

Honestly, Ayton in the NBA is going to be better than he is now thanks to spacing. In college, teams are starting to pack the paint with a zone and clog passing lanes to him (not to mention Sean Miller's Cats have always struggled against the zone anyway). You can't really do that in the NBA.

I agree with all that. His passing is good and his finishing, dunking, rebounding are good. With shooting range that is nice. I guess it's more of the defensive stuff. I do think he will look better in the NBA than in college which is hard to say for guards...though I think Young would have it a bit easier than he currently does...not scoring 48 of course but I think his efficiency would go up and turnovers would go down due to less attention.

I think he'd obviously be a huge upgrade and probably the best true C the Suns have ever had but with centers being less important these days that doesn't make it quite as appealing.

I will be very interested to see how the top 7 picks are made....I think in most years past it was fairly easy to figure out the order near the top, outside of that crazy year with Len and Bennett...but this year it seems it could play out a number of ways within the top 5 or 6, though I'd be pretty surprised if Doncic lasted past 2 or 3 and Ayton past 3. Bagley seems like he will go top 4 or could go 1 and Porter may have gone 1st before injury and now some thing Young is up there in the top 4 or so. This is a year the 5th, 6th or 7th pick may feel easier because you don't have a choice to make and might have less chance to screw up.

[gaspar]

They need to verify Ayton's age. He doesn't look like a teenager at all. He seems to be in his physical prime already. I don't think he can get any bigger or stronger than he already is. That's why it's hard for me to be impressed with him dominating 6'9" college centers.

[Kerrsed]

They need to verify Ayton's age. He doesn't look like a teenager at all. He seems to be in his physical prime already. I don't think he can get any bigger or stronger than he already is. That's why it's hard for me to be impressed with him dominating 6'9" college centers.

I didnt realize im going to have to go all Thon Maker again! LMAO

[kennydorglas]

Yeah, Ayton looks like Greg Oden lol

[jcsunsfan]

I just can't stop thinking about Trae Young though. He has taken a team that no one expected would be that good and has them ranked #4 in the country. He did that scoring 30 points and 10 assist. He is the focus of the defense for every opponent. Think about Markelle Fultz and Ben Simmons. Everyone excused their teams' poor performances because they "had no one around the star player." I am not sure Oklahoma has any better supporting cast.

Trae is smallish. He is not a good defender. But everything else points to superstar. Getting the #1 pick would be such a dilemma for me. Ayton or Trae. But the reason for Ayton is that he is a franchise center, and the Suns have never had one of those in his prime. But Trae, to me is more of a sure thing AND our greatest need.

[bwgood77]

I just can't stop thinking about Trae Young though. He has taken a team that no one expected would be that good and has them ranked #4 in the country. He did that scoring 30 points and 10 assist. He is the focus of the defense for every opponent. Think about Markelle Fultz and Ben Simmons. Everyone excused their teams' poor performances because they "had no one around the star player." I am not sure Oklahoma has any better supporting cast.

Trae is smallish. He is not a good defender. But everything else points to superstar. Getting the #1 pick would be such a dilemma for me. Ayton or Trae. But the reason for Ayton is that he is a franchise center, and the Suns have never had one of those in his prime. But Trae, to me is more of a sure thing AND our greatest need.

Maybe we end up third and Doncic and Ayton go 1 and 2. Maybe Bagley goes 1. I agree. It's scary not to take Young if he could potentially be the next Curry.

I don't know where you draw the line with this group on top tier. The 4th pick might be our least likely scenario at this point. It feels we will land somewhere in the 5-7 range, so that would give us a potential draft range of 1-3 or probably 5-8 or maybe 9.

You figure it's likely if you end up with the 5th worst record, that if you don't move up to top 3, you probably move down one spot, because it seems that very ofte some team in the 5-9 range jumps top 3, knocking everyone down a spot. Hopefully we just don't move down two spots again. That would be awful if we ended up like 6th worst record and got 8th pick.

Sitting in the 6 spot now we get Bamba in most mock sims on tankathon. I got Porter once when we jumped to 3 and Young once when dropping to 7 and Jackson once dropping to 7.

http://www.tankathon.com/mock_draft

[sunsbum]

I'm glad someone else voted to take Bamba #1 over all with me

too bad zach collins isn't on the list.

[Mulhollanddrive]

What I've learnt during this era is choosing favourites pre-draft becomes irrelevent by December.

I'd love Ayton, Doncic, Young but just about everyone loved Fultz, Ball, Jackson too so ultimately pre-draft perceptions are done within 6 months and you just hope you got the best player.

[Revived]

The biggest problem with Trae Young's game is he has no one else on his team to shoulder the load so he takes some not so great shots. He's a worthy #1 pick if Ayton weren't around. Haven't gotten to see Bagley yet, but Trae Young is probably my #2 prospect.

Yeah Young takes some terrible terrible contested shots.

And he also seems a little too 3pt happy. I get it that he’s trying to mimic Curry’s game but even Curry has the ability to drive by most players in the league with his ball handling ability which is how he’s able to create some space on his 3s.

I can’t believe he took 40 shots against Oklahoma State. I get it that his team sucks besides him but holy crap 40 shots as the de facto PG? Seems a bit much.

He’s the most hyped player in college basketball right now with his ceiling being Steph Curry and his floor being Jimmer Fredette. In reality he probably ends up somewhere in between.

[kennydorglas]

Stepien's TOP 10 against .500+ opponents

Luka Doncic (6 games) .584 TS% 30.44 USG% +9.2 NetRating 21.23 PER
DeAndre Ayton (12 games) .638 TS% 26.79 USG% +23.4 NetRating 27.54 PER
Michael Porter
Trae Young (11 games) .595 TS% 42.95 USG% +14.1 NetRating 27.87 PER
Jaren Jackson (12 games) .675 TS% 23.48 USG% +37.6 NetRating 27.08 PER
Marvin Bagley III (10 games) .666 TS% 25.91 USG% +28.8 NetRating 27.26 PER
Mohamed Bamba (13 games) .565 TS% 21.09 USG% +17 NetRating 25.43 PER
Mikal Bridges (62 games) .651 TS% 16.99 USG% +28.4 NetRating 20.65 PER
Collin Sexton (12 games) .519 TS% 32.17 USG% +5.3 NetRating 17.32 PER
Wendell Carter Jr. (10 games) .633 TS% 21.02 USG% +32.3 NetRating 24.23 PER

[Foliohattu]

If we don't get a pg with our lottery pick(s), how do you guys like Jalen Brunson from Villanova with our 2nd? Was watching Villanova because of Bridges, but Brunson looks like a nice shooter and playmaker, probably don't have the physical tools to be more than a good back up?

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

If we don't get a pg with our lottery pick(s), how do you guys like Jalen Brunson from Villanova with our 2nd? Was watching Villanova because of Bridges, but Brunson looks like a nice shooter and playmaker, probably don't have the physical tools to be more than a good back up?

Watching Ulis every night has made me wary of undersized PGs. He could be a fine backup, but I'm not interested in drafting anyone who doesn't have starter potential at this point. I expect there will be better prospects available with our second pick.

Sexton reminds me of Sam Cassell. Cassell was a helluva player. Don't think anyone's in love with him, though, based on his lack of efficiency this year. OTOH, he made some incredible passes in the McDonalds All-American game.

[Foliohattu]

Watching Ulis every night has made me wary of undersized PGs. He could be a fine backup, but I'm not interested in drafting anyone who doesn't have starter potential at this point. I expect there will be better prospects available with our second pick.

Yeah I get that, though Brunson is 6'2 and Ulis 5'10 (but their wingspans are much closer and Ulis was a much better defender at college level). But I think I could look past even Ulis' size if he could shoot.

[kennydorglas]

If we don't get a pg with our lottery pick(s), how do you guys like Jalen Brunson from Villanova with our 2nd? Was watching Villanova because of Bridges, but Brunson looks like a nice shooter and playmaker, probably don't have the physical tools to be more than a good back up?

Watching Ulis every night has made me wary of undersized PGs. He could be a fine backup, but I'm not interested in drafting anyone who doesn't have starter potential at this point. I expect there will be better prospects available with our second pick.

Sexton reminds me of Sam Cassell. Cassell was a helluva player. Don't think anyone's in love with him, though, based on his lack of efficiency this year. OTOH, he made some incredible passes in the McDonalds All-American game.

Sexton won me over in this McDonalds game too.
It's pretty wild to see him falling apart with a pretty good team like Alabama.
Still think he's a baller tho

[bwgood77]

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