Is Kieff dogging it?

[jcsunsfan]

As far as my opinion goes about players demanding trades and who they wanna play with - when you are paid millions to play a game, you stfu and do what you are told by coaching staff and FO and wear a huge smile on top of that. Now, I'm an economic analyst and know about value added and the rest of it, so no point in explaining that to me. Anyway, I believe these guys don't have the moral right to act like that in the face of all the hard working people paying their insane (and undeserved imo salaries) with hard earned money. Moreover, Kieff really needs to think about how the Suns as an organisation took the extra step and got Marcus without really needing him and how if another team had drafted Kieff the two would only meet each other when their respective teams play.
In short, I would keep Kieff in any case - no matter what he says or wants, step on his neck and make him honor his 8 million dollars contract. Too bad contracts in the NBA are so much in players' favor.

I agree. But this is all speculation at this point. Keef has not said anything publicly except very cryptic messages on twitter. Gambo has his "sources" but who knows who they are. I am not a huge Keef fan, but I don't want to speculate either. He needs some time to adjust, fine. Then he just needs to show up like a pro and play like a pro. I am going to give him the benefit of the doubt and expect that he is going to do that. I hope the Suns expect that too. They can see what is out there in trade, but by no means do they have to do a trade.

BTW. Having fun watching the TT negotiations in Cleveland. It might be advantageous for Cleveland if he takes the QO. They can look at him for another year and have him play cheap. The cost to Cleveland at signing him for what RichP wants is astronomical because of the tax.

[sunstrooper]

Yeah, i guess it came out a bit more emotional than needed and looks like I assumed Kieff did/said something that he actually didn't. So, my mistake. As I said, I want him on that team playing his best game.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

I think our FO knew what it was doing by trading Marcus. I think they like being in the position of having to trade players for reasons other than basketball. It gives other teams the impression that we value our players more than we really do.

[jcsunsfan]

I think our FO knew what it was doing by trading Marcus. I think they like being in the position of having to trade players for reasons other than basketball. It gives other teams the impression that we value our players more than we really do.

Say what? I don't know if I follow what you just said.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

I think our FO knew what it was doing by trading Marcus. I think they like being in the position of having to trade players for reasons other than basketball. It gives other teams the impression that we value our players more than we really do.

Say what? I don't know if I follow what you just said.

I'm saying - maybe we want to trade Keef, but don't want other teams thinking that we want to trade him, because that might make other teams question his value. So we make it look like we're being forced to do it. Just speculating.

[Sunsdeuce]

So who is more hated now....Horry or Morris?

[DirtyDez]

So who is more hated now....Horry or Morris?

Horry x 1000000000000000000

[letsgosuns]

So who is more hated now....Horry or Morris?

Horry.

[JohnWall2]

Who's with me:

Morris, Bledsoe and a 1st for Kyrie?

Lets get it done!!

[JMac1]

It's actually not that surprising. Thompson and Bledsoe are both represented by Rich Paul. This sort of scorched earth negotiating style seems to be Paul's modus operandi. It worked out well for Bledsoe. And it will work out well for Thompson. If he signs the qualifying offer, he'll be an unrestricted free agent next summer when an unprecedented number of teams have max-level salary space. If the Cavs cave, he gets his max money and gets to stay with Cleveland. The only way it backfires is if TT suffers a catastrophic injury next season before he signs a long-term deal. It's time to re-visit the narrative that the Suns somehow botched the Bledsoe negotiations last summer. It wasn't the Suns. It was dealing with Rich Paul. This is what he does to get his clients paid.

I was going to say the same. If he can stay healthy, this is a smart decision, because he will REALLY be overpaid next summer. Hopefully not by us though. I doubt Ryan would want to deal with Rich Paul anyway.

I'm surprised no one has come up with this scenario, in light of what's going on with TT:

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=omlrrqu

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Tucker / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len

Or, I like this one even better!

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ph8plkt

Irving / Price
Knight / Goodwin / Booker
Warren / Weems / J. Harris
Thompson / Teletovic / Leuer
Chandler / Len / Mozgov

Gives Cleveland:

Bledsoe / Williams / Dellavadova
Tucker / Shumpert
Bron / R. Jefferson / J. Jones
Love / Kieff / (J. Jones) / (Tucker)
Varejao / (Kieff)

They'd have a very versatile, but more importantly, win NOW team.

Kieff > TT
Bled = Irving
Tucker > Harris

That leaves having to replace Mozgov...shouldn't be that hard, especially considering, in a pinch, playing small ball, Tucker can play the 4, Kieff can play the 5.

Yeah, we lose a bit with Thompson vice Kieff, but gain Mozgov, and with Len able to play some PF, it appears, we should be in decent shape. I actually like that for both teams.

I stopped reading when I saw you place Goodwin over Booker in two different lineups. If you want to be taken seriously, you cant do things like that.

[Bucks2585]

http://www.azcentral.com/story/sports/nba/suns/2014/09/29/phoenix-suns-markieff-marcus-morris-contract-nba-lon-babby/16457719/

I mean, how much do you think it has to do with this? Not just the same household idea, thats a different thing altogether, but the fact that they determined their contracts based on staying together and one was traded?

They could see it as a betrayal of the fact that the contract itself was offered with the idea that they would stay together.

[RaisingArizona]

http://www.azcentral.com/story/sports/nba/suns/2014/09/29/phoenix-suns-markieff-marcus-morris-contract-nba-lon-babby/16457719/

I mean, how much do you think it has to do with this? Not just the same household idea, thats a different thing altogether, but the fact that they determined their contracts based on staying together and one was traded?

They could see it as a betrayal of the fact that the contract itself was offered with the idea that they would stay together.

I'm sure that's what they think and I'm not sure what has been said to them in terms of a promise but it's absurd for them to think they would be able to play their whole careers together. Shouldn't Kieff just be happy we brought his brother here for a year and a half? Ok, new FO rule, no bringing in anyone's brother-- it just ends in a mess.

[aewyatt7]

You guys do know Houston was going to send him to the d league right? I expect marcus to get into that same position while being a piston... honestly Marcus should of thanked us for helping him stay in the league.... sorry just a frustrated night. At least has come out finally and demands a trade. Not just gambo talking

[LukasBMW]

Stop for a minute and think.

For those of you who are stats junkies or watched every game last year (like I did), put aside the Morris twins actions and tell me what you think of them as ball players.

Marcus:
-excellent size for SF position
-Great backup stretch 4
-excellent mid range jumper
-reliable 3 point shot
-good defender if he's not guarding a super quick "3" or a big "4"
-Gives us options with our lineup due to his versatility

Say what you want about Marcus, but I thought he played excellent for us last year. His midrange shots seemed to go down more then they popped out. He bailed us out often when the time was running down and he had to nail a 17-18 footer. He also allowed us to play "big" when he and his brother played the 3/4 with Len at 5 and Tucker at 2. That lineup was legit!

Keef
-Was clutch and hit some big shots
-Made Kevin Love look silly one game
-Has an even more reliable mid range game
-Was a decent defender
-Was extending his range
-Was quickly becoming a Rasheed Wallace and thus allstar caliber player

You could argue Keef would put up LMA numbers with more touches and minutes. He was our best player in the clutch and stats showed that we would almost always win when he played well. People bash him for his defense and rebounding but his defense was not THAT bad. I know I'll get flamed for the "allstar caliber" comment, but he was very efficient for us last year.

Keef and Dragic were our best players.

I'd trade Blesdoe and Knight straight up for a happy Keef and happy Dragic.

Were going to miss both this year and we will be a lottery team unless we replace Keef with an allstar caliber PF.

[garrick]

Keiff was by no means becoming a all star!
I think we've pretty much seen his ceiling and he is what he is and that is a sort of stretch four with streaky shooting.
Role players like him have no business demanding trades, only franchise players can do that an he is no franchise player.


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[Nando88]

He's a good player who still has room to get better. He holding himself back by being a complete moron and this whole team FOE BS. Dude your an adult with millions at your finger tips. Grow up already


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[NTB]

http://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2015/8/11/9134747/markieff-morris-says-that-he-wont-be-playing-for-suns-this-year

Have anyone read this?

http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/sixers/20150812_Markieff_Morris_demands_trade_from_Suns.html

This is the original.

[saintEscaton]

Stop for a minute and think.

For those of you who are stats junkies or watched every game last year (like I did), put aside the Morris twins actions and tell me what you think of them as ball players.

Marcus:
-excellent size for SF position
-Great backup stretch 4
-excellent mid range jumper
-reliable 3 point shot
-good defender if he's not guarding a super quick "3" or a big "4"
-Gives us options with our lineup due to his versatility

Say what you want about Marcus, but I thought he played excellent for us last year. His midrange shots seemed to go down more then they popped out. He bailed us out often when the time was running down and he had to nail a 17-18 footer. He also allowed us to play "big" when he and his brother played the 3/4 with Len at 5 and Tucker at 2. That lineup was legit!

Keef
-Was clutch and hit some big shots
-Made Kevin Love look silly one game
-Has an even more reliable mid range game
-Was a decent defender
-Was extending his range
-Was quickly becoming a Rasheed Wallace and thus allstar caliber player

You could argue Keef would put up LMA numbers with more touches and minutes. He was our best player in the clutch and stats showed that we would almost always win when he played well. People bash him for his defense and rebounding but his defense was not THAT bad. I know I'll get flamed for the "allstar caliber" comment, but he was very efficient for us last year.

Keef and Dragic were our best players.

I'd trade Blesdoe and Knight straight up for a happy Keef and happy Dragic.

Were going to miss both this year and we will be a lottery team unless we replace Keef with an allstar caliber PF.

So Queef is a future perennial All-Star/love child hybrid of Sheed/LMA? I know there's a league wide dearth at PF but come on now you can't be serious. He's a wannabe SG trapped in a PF's body who will never play up to his size like a big because he is too complacent to establish an inside presence.

He tries to emulate Sheed's Bad Boy antics and body language but comes off as a petulant crybaby and can't channel his lack of temperament into on the court passion. Extrapolating his per 36 numbers skews the picture because you can't just assume that he would maintain the same FG% if given more minutes and touches on an expanded higher volume. He was an negative in Offensive Box/Plus minus meaning he was below the league average in points contributed per 100 team possesions and saw a decrease in Player Efficiency Rating even though his usage rate remained the same as 13-14 season when he was a 6th man.

He is a black hole who relies solely on his one-dimensional game that consists of taking the most inefficient shot in the game through the most inefficient set up( predomnantly through ISO post-ups and rarely through pick n' pops) and his detrimental ball stopping kills movement and thus is a wash. He showed promise behind the arc his rookieseason but it was momentary flash in the pan/deceiving fools gold.

Ever since he has regressed in this department both in 3pt% and attempts per game indicating that he will never be a Stretch 4 as he now only takes treys from the top of the key when he has the room when a defender sags off of him. His "clutchness" in crunch time can also be attributed to the defensive schemes of most NBA teams that predominantly aim to prevent the offense from being able to get off the most efficient shots by sealing off the perimeter/ restrict easy basket and protect the paint and this overcompensation sometimes gives him good midrange looks

Edit...broke into paragraphs so people would read. When I first saw it I thought, no way I will read that, but since everyone's opinions are valued, I thought it was worthy to break down for readable purposes.

[phrazbit]

Stop for a minute and think.

For those of you who are stats junkies or watched every game last year (like I did), put aside the Morris twins actions and tell me what you think of them as ball players.

Marcus:
-excellent size for SF position
-Great backup stretch 4
-excellent mid range jumper
-reliable 3 point shot
-good defender if he's not guarding a super quick "3" or a big "4"
-Gives us options with our lineup due to his versatility

Say what you want about Marcus, but I thought he played excellent for us last year. His midrange shots seemed to go down more then they popped out. He bailed us out often when the time was running down and he had to nail a 17-18 footer. He also allowed us to play "big" when he and his brother played the 3/4 with Len at 5 and Tucker at 2. That lineup was legit!

Keef
-Was clutch and hit some big shots
-Made Kevin Love look silly one game
-Has an even more reliable mid range game
-Was a decent defender
-Was extending his range
-Was quickly becoming a Rasheed Wallace and thus allstar caliber player

You could argue Keef would put up LMA numbers with more touches and minutes. He was our best player in the clutch and stats showed that we would almost always win when he played well. People bash him for his defense and rebounding but his defense was not THAT bad. I know I'll get flamed for the "allstar caliber" comment, but he was very efficient for us last year.

Keef and Dragic were our best players.

I'd trade Blesdoe and Knight straight up for a happy Keef and happy Dragic.

Were going to miss both this year and we will be a lottery team unless we replace Keef with an allstar caliber PF.

I feel like you watched a completely different set of players.

Marcus was a flat out lousy player. Inconsistent, unreliable, poor defender, bad decision maker, awful rebounder, even his supposed "strength" as 3pt shooter was hardly worth noting, 36% is nothing to bank on. He was, at best, a decent reserve.

Markieff ranks somewhere between a poor starter and a solid reserve. He has a legit mid-range and interior game, his range seemed to be shrinking, not extending, he was an awful rebounder, iffy defender, lousy at team basketball, really only worked well in isolation. The Wallace comparison is laughable. The only thing they had in common was a short fuse. Wallace however frequently used his to bring up his intensity, while Markieff just threw tantrums. Wallace was significantly better at ever facet of actual basketball. And Markieff was NOT efficient last year. A PER of 15 is nothing to brag about. That is nothing even remotely near "all-star" caliber. Markieff was actually worse last season than he was the year before. He was significantly less efficient, shot a worse percentage and even his poor rebounding rate declined. Bledsoe is a much... much... much better player.

Markieff might be more talented than Teletovic but if Tovic can stay healthy I expect we will be better with him than we were with Markieff because Tovic can spread the court. Similar to how Markieff was better than Frye but we were WAY better with Frye out there because his spacing changed the entire dynamic of the offense.

And besides, if our season was resting on a mediocre player like Marqueef then it was doomed regardless. No one is going anywhere riding someone of his replaceable ability.

[Mulhollanddrive]

McDonough has gone into his secret agent mode, no information comes out from his office.