Official Trade Thread: New Year, New Thread, New Laughs

[thamadkant]

WHY ARE WE GOING ALL-IN RIGHT NOW WITH THE FOURTH YOUNGEST TEAM IN THE LEAGUE?

Suns ARE NOT going ALL-IN...

Thats the point.

Hence it was a stupid trade offer to begin with.
Noah --> perfect for a ALL-IN team.
Len --> perfect for a team building their core

[thamadkant]

Is this really worth both Morris, plumlee and Thomas?

#9 Serge Ibaka
Oklahoma City Thunder2015 Record: 20-20
PPG RPG APG
14.5 7.3 0.9

I'll pass. Seems to me Suns get robbed in that deal.

I'd do it, Ibaka is a mid range shooting PF who alters shot... perfect next to Len.. with Wright off the bench.
Gives minutes to Goodwin, Ennis, Warren too since it eases up the log jam in veteran wings.

[letsgosuns]

Outside of trading Plumlee and/or Thomas for draft picks or the like, I would prefer the Suns stand pat unless they are getting back a superstar. Noah, Ibaka, Lopez, none of those guys are what the Suns need. They are not superstars and have most likely already maxed out their potential. They are not going to get any better. The Suns currently have a group of young guys including Len that have not come close to scratching the surface of their potential. By the way, I would venture to guess that Len is probably one of the most untouchables players in the league right now along with Lebron and Durant. I really mean that. Anyone who understands that centers like him are once in a decade type players that you can build a championship roster with would agree.

[lilfishi22]

Is this really worth both Morris, plumlee and Thomas?

#9 Serge Ibaka
Oklahoma City Thunder2015 Record: 20-20
PPG RPG APG
14.5 7.3 0.9

I'll pass. Seems to me Suns get robbed in that deal.

Really? We're here trying to get rid of IT and Plumlee isn't worth more than a late 1st so it's essentially the Morri for Ibaka. I'd make that trade any day of the week and I think we are the ones in the ski mask. Ibaka might not be as versatile offensively as the Morri but he's many worlds apart when it comes to defense.

[Sunsdeuce]

Alex len
Season:
PPG RPG APG
6.3 6.0 0.4

Since starting:
Last 5 games:
PPG RPG APG
9.2. 11. 0.4

Last 10 games:
PPG RPG APG
7.1 8.4. 0.6

Last 20 games:
PPG RPG APG
6.8 7.2 0.5



Noah:
PPG RPG APG
7.6 9.4 3.6


Len stats are trending up very quickly since starting. Anyone who wants Noah over len right now hasnt done their homework. Len's value is way more than Noah's right now! Because of age, potential and current performance.

[Sunsdeuce]

Is this really worth both Morris, plumlee and Thomas?

#9 Serge Ibaka
Oklahoma City Thunder2015 Record: 20-20
PPG RPG APG
14.5 7.3 0.9

I'll pass. Seems to me Suns get robbed in that deal.

Really? We're here trying to get rid of IT and Plumlee isn't worth more than a late 1st so it's essentially the Morri for Ibaka. I'd make that trade any day of the week and I think we are the ones in the ski mask. Ibaka might not be as versatile offensively as the Morri but he's many worlds apart when it comes to defense.

I want a post player. Someone who demands a double team. Ibaka isn't getting double team anytime soon. Ibaka is great for okc because they have a superstar in Durant. Ibaka isn't asked to do more than rebound and get put backs. I am not a huge fan of markieff but his post game is far better than ibaka.

Regardless, ryan mcd will never do this deal. He wants a superstar if he is going to give up that much. So you guys can discuss this all day. This ain't happening.

[lilfishi22]

Is this really worth both Morris, plumlee and Thomas?

#9 Serge Ibaka
Oklahoma City Thunder2015 Record: 20-20
PPG RPG APG
14.5 7.3 0.9

I'll pass. Seems to me Suns get robbed in that deal.

Really? We're here trying to get rid of IT and Plumlee isn't worth more than a late 1st so it's essentially the Morri for Ibaka. I'd make that trade any day of the week and I think we are the ones in the ski mask. Ibaka might not be as versatile offensively as the Morri but he's many worlds apart when it comes to defense.

I want a post player. Someone who demands a double team. Ibaka isn't getting double team anytime soon. Ibaka is great for okc because they have a superstar in Durant. Ibaka isn't asked to do more than rebound and get put backs. I am not a huge fan of markieff but his post game is far better than ibaka.

I don't rate Kieff's post game at all. He scores more off jumpers than in the post and rarely (if ever, now that I'm thinking about it) does he get double teamed. I think the difference between their offensive games is small compared to the difference on the defensive end.

[RunDogGun]

I will choose Len (21 years old) over Noah (29 years old) with this Suns team going forward any day of the week.




Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

Did you post this twice to imply "and twice on Sunday"?

[Christine-In-AZ]

Wicked thought, but there's no way OKC is trading "Sir Chewbacca" to the Suns...well? Not now anyway.

[JDLAW]

Its amazing that we make up these wild, impossible blockbuster trades in which teams would completely change their identity or tear down their quality playoff teams (including the Suns) in mid-season - Ibaka for half of the Suns team, half of the Suns team for Jefferson, have the roster for Hayward and Kanter, stip the roster bare for Mello, trade the young center the Suns drafted last year for a much older player who has knee issues that is causing his game to decline. We then pound these into dust and nothing ever happens, because there was never a chance they would happen.

The Suns are looking to trade Plumlee, for a reason that is speculated to be unhappiness with position in the rotation - do not know because it has not been reported. Assuming this is the case, the Suns will try to accommodate his request to be moved if they can do so without giving him away. It will be much more difficult than you might imagine because of his low salary.

[thamadkant]

Alex len
Season:
PPG RPG APG
6.3 6.0 0.4

Since starting:
Last 5 games:
PPG RPG APG
9.2. 11. 0.4

Last 10 games:
PPG RPG APG
7.1 8.4. 0.6

Last 20 games:
PPG RPG APG
6.8 7.2 0.5



Noah:
PPG RPG APG
7.6 9.4 3.6


Len stats are trending up very quickly since starting. Anyone who wants Noah over len right now hasnt done their homework. Len's value is way more than Noah's right now! Because of age, potential and current performance.

In a playoff environment, where veteran play and experience come to play, Noah would be ideal.

Len will get there one day, but Noah is a seasoned veteran. We dont know how Len will play in a high pressure game yet.

Noah also has that extra gear where he could rise up to get 20 rebounds 5 blocks and huge defensive plays under critical moments.

Len will one day... but not yet.

So for the Bulls or any of the top 4 teams, Noah would have an advantage over Len due to him being "proven".

But Len will get there one day if he continues to improve.


Suns will not trade Len for Noah... unless Suns were fighting for the championship this season.

[LukasBMW]

I understand Miles wants a trade, but I'm glad the Suns front office is not going to do it unless we get a good return for our asset.

Yes, Plum-dawg has played like poo-poo, but 7 foot centers with 40"+ verticals don't come around all that often. I really think his problems are metal. He played well last year with absolutely no pressure.

I'm down to trade him, but only for a 1st rounder pick in the 12-22 range or as part of a larger package.

[MrMiyagi]

Alex len
Season:
PPG RPG APG
6.3 6.0 0.4

Since starting:
Last 5 games:
PPG RPG APG
9.2. 11. 0.4

Last 10 games:
PPG RPG APG
7.1 8.4. 0.6

Last 20 games:
PPG RPG APG
6.8 7.2 0.5



Noah:
PPG RPG APG
7.6 9.4 3.6


Len stats are trending up very quickly since starting. Anyone who wants Noah over len right now hasnt done their homework. Len's value is way more than Noah's right now! Because of age, potential and current performance.

In a playoff environment, where veteran play and experience come to play, Noah would be ideal.

Len will get there one day, but Noah is a seasoned veteran. We dont know how Len will play in a high pressure game yet.

Noah also has that extra gear where he could rise up to get 20 rebounds 5 blocks and huge defensive plays under critical moments.

Len will one day... but not yet.

So for the Bulls or any of the top 4 teams, Noah would have an advantage over Len due to him being "proven".

But Len will get there one day if he continues to improve.


Suns will not trade Len for Noah... unless Suns were fighting for the championship this season. ... and were super old and couldn't wait one more season because half their roster is likely to retire.

Fixed it for you

[Blackification]

Miles looked very disinterested after he got benched, he already lost his buddy Frye and now that Shav his new bff is gone i'm not surprised at all he wants out.

Hopefully it will be a package deal for a decent return. I trust McDonough to get good value

[NashtyNas]

Thank you 1Upz and Lilfishi for actually reading my post and understanding my analysis.
You guys have seen me posting as a Suns supporter for years on the General and Trade Board so you must know where I am coming from.
Some others clearly have an issue with people who disagree with them and are hellbent on proving some sort of agenda that I frankly want nothing to do with.

My point stands. If we want to remain in a situation where we fight for the 8th seed and miss out year in and year out, keeping Len and all our current guys intact makes sense. My issue with such a frame of mind is simply that we are going to be stuck in this mediocrity perpetually if we don't make moves. Again, for those that keep arguing Len is better NOW than Noah, you're flat out wrong. Noah's raw numbers are down because he's now playing Gasol AND Mirotic and Gibson is still around. Those guys all get their own too, but most importantly, Gasol does best at C and therefore that has affected Noah greatly, not to mention his injury which has definitely deterred him. Noah is by far the better player today regardless of a small sample size of mediocre stats. He was the DPOY not too long ago, you don't go from being DPOY to Plumlee at the age of 29 without legitimate reasons.

My point was simply that some fans need to be much more objective about the assets we have instead of being homers and touting the proverbial horn. I gave the example of Plumlee which most of you witnessed first hand. He was playing out of his mind last year and clearly overachieving. Many of us wanted to move him this off-season when his value was at it's highest. Our FO held on too long and now we'd be happy if he netted us a late first. We've done that in the past with other players we drafted or developed. We wait too long with huge expectations only to later let that player go in FA or move then when value lowers due to whatever number of factors. I don't want to be in that position any longer, and the only way to avoid that is to capitalize on our assets when you can. A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush, and although some of you seem to believe Len is already that bird, he's barely hatched out of the egg. You don't know yet whether he's going to fly or whether he's a gimp, and you can't claim he's going to be a high flyer based on a ~20 game sample.

[NashtyNas]

Also, for all those touting us being one of the youngest teams, that means very little. All our young talent outside of Len is questionable as NBA talent. I love Archie's athleticism, Ennis and his floor general capabilities and Warren's knack for putting it in the basket. However, we have not seen any of that from any of them on the NBA level and it's not right to assume that those skills will translate at a high enough level without seeing anything whatsoever.

For the players in our regular rotation, here are the ages:
Dragic - 28
Bledsoe - 25
Markieff & Marcus - 25
Thomas - 25
Green - 28
Tucker - 29
Wright - 27
Len - 21
Plumlee - 26

The absolute YOUNGEST player in our rotation is Len. The rest of those guys are pretty much what they are at this point. Whatever improvement we've seen the last 2 years from the Twins is probably about what we can expect from them here on out. The rest of the guys other than Len are also what they are. So unless Len turns into Shaq offensively, we aren't going anywhere without making moves. That is assuming we manage to keep Dragic after standing pat, which is a high probability but not a guarantee.

[MrMiyagi]

Also, for all those touting us being one of the youngest teams, that means very little. All our young talent outside of Len is questionable as NBA talent. I love Archie's athleticism, Ennis and his floor general capabilities and Warren's knack for putting it in the basket. However, we have not seen any of that from any of them on the NBA level and it's not right to assume that those skills will translate at a high enough level without seeing anything whatsoever.

For the players in our regular rotation, here are the ages:
Dragic - 28
Bledsoe - 25
Markieff & Marcus - 25
Thomas - 25
Green - 28
Tucker - 29
Wright - 27
Len - 21
Plumlee - 26

The absolute YOUNGEST player in our rotation is Len. The rest of those guys are pretty much what they are at this point. Whatever improvement we've seen the last 2 years from the Twins is probably about what we can expect from them here on out. The rest of the guys other than Len are also what they are. So unless Len turns into Shaq offensively, we aren't going anywhere without making moves. That is assuming we manage to keep Dragic after standing pat, which is a high probability but not a guarantee.

I love how everyone complains that freshmen come out of college too early and aren't ready for the NBA, but when an NBA team decides to take their time to develop them, it means that they are "questionable as NBA talent".

Well, they'll only learn by playing in real NBA games

Then why the heck did you wish they stayed in college? Isn't being around NBA players, practicing against them, learning their work habits the same or even better than playing a few more years in college?

[lazyboy62]

One that works. From what I've read on the Chicago board I think, fan wise theis could be an exit stratigy:
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine

Why it works for Chicago: Open's price range options in the summer. The Taj contract won't work for the players that they have to sign. Chicago also net's younger players under better contracts. They get there 3 guy in Green and another power to play in the post. Thomas is just Thomas.

Why it works for Phonix: Young guy Snell with hops. Expiring contract in Dunleavy. A true starting 4 for boards and shots. Gotta say that Taj is better then either of the brothers in my opinon.

[MrMiyagi]

One that works. From what I've read on the Chicago board I think, fan wise theis could be an exit stratigy:
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine

Why it works for Chicago: Open's price range options in the summer. The Taj contract won't work for the players that they have to sign. Chicago also net's younger players under better contracts. They get there 3 guy in Green and another power to play in the post. Thomas is just Thomas.

Why it works for Phonix: Young guy Snell with hops. Expiring contract in Dunleavy. A true starting 4 for boards and shots. Gotta say that Taj is better then either of the brothers in my opinon.

What players do I have to plug into the trade machine to show me what you are trying to propose?

[TASTIC]

How about Plumlee + a 2nd to BOS for Olynyk?

Has 3pt range, very good passer and I'm not sure if he's the longterm 4 or 5 in BOS?