2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part IV

[Ghost of Kleine]

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Has everyone seen these tweets before KD deleted them? Could there be some tension or possibly even a rift brewing between Book and KD?

He's clearly calling out Bickley's comments

For sure man! That's why it says @ Bickley. But my point is that he also references " the narrative they're running with in Phoenix " like he's low key separating himself from the locational distinction or something. And he also does reference how when Booker plays great, no one credits him with influencing that, but when he struggles, then it's because of his presence."

Surely the underlying tone of his response shows that he's at least frustrated and feeling a certain way about the narratives circulating around. It's situations/ narratives, etc like these that can foster contempt and occupational rifts. But hopefully it doesn't happen with these narratives between them.

[Saberestar]

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Has everyone seen these tweets before KD deleted them? Could there be some tension or possibly even a rift brewing between Book and KD?

He's clearly calling out Bickley's comments

For sure man! That's why it says @ Bickley. But my point is that he also references " the narrative they're running with in Phoenix " like he's low key separating himself from the locational distinction or something. And he also does reference how when Booker plays great, no one credits him with influencing that, but when he struggles, then it's because of his presence."

Surely the underlying tone of his response shows that he's at least frustrated and feeling a certain way about the narratives circulating around. It's situations/ narratives, etc like these that can foster contempt and occupational rifts. But hopefully it doesn't happen with these narratives between them.

Lol, you really tried to create a make up story behind a couple of simple sentences @ Bickley.

He said what he said. If he wanted to say other things he would have say it.

[garrick]

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For everyone that was arguing that Sarver didn't choose who he specifically wanted in the McDonough era. To the Ayton or Doncic choice argument, this is yet another clear example of an arrogant owner making decisions himself and taking any final decision out of the GMs' hands. Sarver loved control and calling the shots.

Clearly the same most likely applies with Doncic as it did here with SGA on draft day.

In hindsight no one had SGA really high on their radar and I think Mikail had ties to the front office which is one reason they really wanted him.

[Calvin Klein]

KD has been in this situation for 10 years now. Toxic as ****.

[BobbieL]

Between KD, Booker, Grayson, and O'Neal, I have to wonder how many 1st round picks the Suns will get and also how many young prospects. I'd expect any decent veterans acquired for salary matching purposes in the KD and Book trades will be moved for future draft capital come next all-star break. The way I see it is Beal leads a bunch of young guys for the 25/26 and 26/27 seasons.

Yep - this is the way I see it as well. And possibly, Beal could be traded in the summer of 2026 as he becomes an expiring. Granted, what team will have $50m of bad contracts to switch back for Beal.

If Ishbia does what needs to be done, and that is trade Booker too with Durant, the next two years could be pretty bad. But it needs to happen.

[Djedefre]

the next two years could be pretty bad.

Last two years were pretty horrific, so yeah, i think we can all live with that. Not to mention the fact that when you have young players you can at least get excited for the future and make some sense in everything bad and ugly around you. Nothing worse than being faux-contender and consistently mediocre. This team is not only unsuccessful, but plain ugly to watch and disgusting to root for. It's the first time in my life as a suns fan i'm genuinely struggling to feel anything towards this group of guys. I mean we had bad, very bad teams this last decade and a half, but i never felt like this. Never ever.

[RaisingArizona]

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JJ made 1 great move with CP3 and everything else has been utterly bad his entire tenure.

[dremill24]

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Granted, they did give up a lot. But its a little disingenuous to act like they got that Coulibaly pick for Beal. Though it was roped into a 3-team deal involving Beal, it was really just Indiana trading the #7 pick to Washington for #8 and a couple 2nds (one of which came from Phoenix).

[sunsbum]

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JJ made 1 great move with CP3 and everything else has been utterly bad his entire tenure.

not true. Ishbia has been controlling the trades. Jones has also drafted fairly well. In fact Portland radio cannot stop talking about tumani. They are calling him the next Scottie Pippen and if he continues to improve offensively the way he has…

[sunsfan1o1]

Gotta stop playing a lineup of jones, booker, Allen and Plumlee. That’s wild.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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[RaisingArizona]

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JJ made 1 great move with CP3 and everything else has been utterly bad his entire tenure.

not true. Ishbia has been controlling the trades. Jones has also drafted fairly well. In fact Portland radio cannot stop talking about tumani. They are calling him the next Scottie Pippen and if he continues to improve offensively the way he has…

He doesn't get credit for drafting someone he then shipped out before he played a game lol

[RaisingArizona]

JJ made 1 great move with CP3 and everything else has been utterly bad his entire tenure.

not true. Ishbia has been controlling the trades. Jones has also drafted fairly well. In fact Portland radio cannot stop talking about tumani. They are calling him the next Scottie Pippen and if he continues to improve offensively the way he has…

He doesn't get credit for drafting someone he then shipped out before he played a game lol. Even before Ish his trades and drafts have been bad

[Ghost of Kleine]

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Granted, they did give up a lot. But its a little disingenuous to act like they got that Coulibaly pick for Beal. Though it was roped into a 3-team deal involving Beal, it was really just Indiana trading the #7 pick to Washington for #8 and a couple 2nds (one of which came from Phoenix).

I get what you're saying that it wasn't detailed in the initial framework of the trade. However, it doesn't happen if they don't get that pick to utilize in that slight trade back scenario.

So for this illustration, it's still legitimate as a factor/ inclusion piece to the ultimate outcome same as with any other trade. Because if those assets aren't present, the chain of sequences leading to that outcome is broken and quite likely doesn't happen? But for me personally, I'm not even focusing on the Coulilaby aspect in my value assessment.

For me I was very oppositional to the Beal trade on the premise of leverage we clearly had but never utilized. We bid against ourselves in an unnecessary overpay and gave up critical value in not having control of our picks in those pick swap years, etc. Our value assessment in trade negotiations was/ is pretty bad obviously.
That was my frustration.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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JJ made 1 great move with CP3 and everything else has been utterly bad his entire tenure.

And if being honest, even the Paul trade could be argued was a result mostly orchestrated by Booker himself as Paul (himself) even said that it was Booker that convinced him to come to Phoenix.

But Jones I guess did play his part by signing off on the deal and giving up a 1st in the Paul deal. After all, Jones greatest strength is very casually giving up assets in a trade. But again, even that trade could be argued didn't have much to do with him at all.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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For everyone that was arguing that Sarver didn't choose who he specifically wanted in the McDonough era. To the Ayton or Doncic choice argument, this is yet another clear example of an arrogant owner making decisions himself and taking any final decision out of the GMs' hands. Sarver loved control and calling the shots.

Clearly the same most likely applies with Doncic as it did here with SGA on draft day.

In hindsight no one had SGA really high on their radar and I think Mikail had ties to the front office which is one reason they really wanted him.

Sure! Except of course for the GM that is actively trying to trade up for them in a trade scenario just like in the tweet above indicates. Apparently he was high on that GMs radar.

But all too often people forget that the owner has/ employs having final authority in trades. And Sarver is a definite megalomaniac control freak. So McDonough apparently did have him as his target, but was overridden by Sarver for the Bridges trade.

Now everyone loves Bridges, and he's a great player, but obviously not MVP level great. And who knows how many/ or what key trades Sarver ALSO overruled with his typical power play/ dictator attitude. And maybe, just maybe, that's what the lions' share of their public conflict was about.


Being a GM in name only and not truly being allowed to make decisions, picks, trades, because the owner overrules them. As we can see Ishbias' proclivity to do even now.

[BobbieL]

the next two years could be pretty bad.

Last two years were pretty horrific, so yeah, i think we can all live with that. Not to mention the fact that when you have young players you can at least get excited for the future and make some sense in everything bad and ugly around you. Nothing worse than being faux-contender and consistently mediocre. This team is not only unsuccessful, but plain ugly to watch and disgusting to root for. It's the first time in my life as a suns fan i'm genuinely struggling to feel anything towards this group of guys. I mean we had bad, very bad teams this last decade and a half, but i never felt like this. Never ever.

100% agree. This team is not fun to watch and will only get worse in future years if they keep Booker. He needs to be traded. This isn't see what you can get for Durant, fill in around the edges. No, this is trade Booker, trade Durant, try to get below the second apron in the summer of 2026 and move forward. Hence, when the Twolves are mentioned Randle is a huge expiring contract for the summer of 2026.

[BobbieL]

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JJ made 1 great move with CP3 and everything else has been utterly bad his entire tenure.

Durant, Ayton and Beal trades
Oh for 3

Terrible trades

[Frank Lee]

The thought of paying Booker 70 million a year should be terrifying. I don’t care what the salary cap is. This is a one and a half trick pony who by default has been anointed the Lord and Savior of Phoenix.

Blasphemy.

[dremill24]

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Granted, they did give up a lot. But its a little disingenuous to act like they got that Coulibaly pick for Beal. Though it was roped into a 3-team deal involving Beal, it was really just Indiana trading the #7 pick to Washington for #8 and a couple 2nds (one of which came from Phoenix).

I get what you're saying that it wasn't detailed in the initial framework of the trade. However, it doesn't happen if they don't get that pick to utilize in that slight trade back scenario.

So for this illustration, it's still legitimate as a factor/ inclusion piece to the ultimate outcome same as with any other trade. Because if those assets aren't present, the chain of sequences leading to that outcome is broken and quite likely doesn't happen? But for me personally, I'm not even focusing on the Coulilaby aspect in my value assessment.

For me I was very oppositional to the Beal trade on the premise of leverage we clearly had but never utilized. We bid against ourselves in an unnecessary overpay and gave up critical value in not having control of our picks in those pick swap years, etc. Our value assessment in trade negotiations was/ is pretty bad obviously.
That was my frustration.

I was more commenting on the X poster who failed to include that context. The Wiz and Pacers would have found a way to get their deal done regardless of the Beal trade, they just roped it all together for cap purposes so giving up that extra 2nd wasn't going to make or break that part of it.

But yes, the Beal trade was not great from a vision standpoint or from an asset management standpoint. That X poster should just not be insinuating that they got the #7 pick (Coulibaly) for Beal.