2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V

[SunsRback4Good]

Can we also

FIRE GAMBO

Guy is the worst

Then who will I listen to on 98.7?

[Son of Ra]

I don't get not being open to trading Booker from fans or FO. I don't need another season of Booker fronting this team to last place in the Pacific Division. Seen that way too many times now.

Absolutely, because realistically at this point we've had him in every different scenario from front office, players, coach, tactics, position etc possible and at this point it's time to admit we've exhausted all our options. He's a good 2 or 3 in a well run system but he's not a guy you build around or hold onto whatever may come. He's replaceable. Especially his attitude, lack of leadership, fight and lackluster motivation.
I've been on the trade Booker train for a while and I think at this point there's absolutely nothing this franchise can do other than a complete, ruthless teardown. **** now moves. Picks, young players - take 80 cents on the dollar over nothing - new FO, GM, scouts everything. Financially this is a huge undertaking but when you're already paying this much for this bad a team this can't be an issue. And this payroll is coming off the books anyways. Now is the time to experiment, find and put the right people in the right places and be ready when we have picks and players again.

[bwgood77]

Too bad the two depressed fanbases that were contenders in recent years can't combine teams. Us and Dallas...

Kyrie, Book, KD, AD, Lively, with a bench of Tyus Jones, Beal, Naji Marshall, PJ Washington, Gafford and more reserves like Grayson Allen, Royce O'Neal, Kai Jones, Dinwiddie, Ryan Dunn, Max Christie. Oso, Plumlee, Powell.

[thamadkant]

Luka and the Lakers are gonna run the Pacific Division for at least the next three years. That's how good he is and how aging and/or bad the rest of the division is.

Hence I am 100% OK in trading Booker, KD to any of Thunder, Rockets, even Warriors and Spurs.... help those teams top up to ensure Luka and Lakers don't make it out of West.

NBA wants Celtics vs Lakers to be a thing in the next 3 or so years.... but suns can definitely prevent that and ensure Laker fans can go **** themselves.

[Saberestar]

Who though?

i always see this option presented by guys here but none one ever gives up names. I did.....and people don't like the option. Which I understand as PG's deal sucks....that's the kind of thing that will be available to us. I don't see any other players that teams will off-load. FTR Philly will be paying us XT picks in order to take that deal from them. I am not saying we do a stright swap for free. We'll be getting paid.

But enough about me. Who do you think is an acceptable trade of "smaller more tradable assests" that we can get for Beal and what picks do you want to attach to him?

TIA

I talked about it before, the Orlando Magic trade.

KCP + Jonathan Isaac + Gary Harris
for
Bradley Beal + 2027 FRP (worse of 3 teams).

Beal played for the Florida Gators.
His family and him love the warm weather.
He would start for them. Prominent role.

Thank you for giving a name. KCP is a bad deal so ORL would love to get rid of him no doubt and I agree that Beal would like the warm weather, I'm not sure they need his skill set from the SG spot and I do not think he starts over Suggs. They would have to play two SGs-like we do now with Book and him.

Isaac, I like as I brought trading for him for years back when we had Ayton. Not sure his health is any better than Beal's but he is elite on D when he plays. Personally, I am not a fan of giving away more stuff to get rid of a player and would rather take picks/young players to roll the dice on another team's bad stuff.

Good post though.

Suggs would start at PG and Beal at SG. Wagner at SF and Banchero at PF.

[thamadkant]

Trading Beal by attaching assets and futute picks would be an Ishiba kind deal.

If you look up what the Suns traded for Beal, it would make you very depressed. It's franchise suicide basically, a case needs to be raised to investigate the robbery. By adding more assets to get rid of him is just pure mockery of the franchise.


Best move is to hold onto him and get his numbers up as tank commander then unload him as an expiring for assets.

[BobbieL]

Too bad the two depressed fanbases that were contenders in recent years can't combine teams. Us and Dallas...

Kyrie, Book, KD, AD, Lively, with a bench of Tyus Jones, Beal, Naji Marshall, PJ Washington, Gafford and more reserves like Grayson Allen, Royce O'Neal, Kai Jones, Dinwiddie, Ryan Dunn, Max Christie. Oso, Plumlee, Powell.

both teams were self-inflicted if you will

Doncic for AD -- I just don't get that one

Oh boy, almost like he is working for the Lakers

[BobbieL]

Trading Beal by attaching assets and futute picks would be an Ishiba kind deal.

If you look up what the Suns traded for Beal, it would make you very depressed. It's franchise suicide basically, a case needs to be raised to investigate the robbery. By adding more assets to get rid of him is just pure mockery of the franchise.


Best move is to hold onto him and get his numbers up as tank commander then unload him as an expiring for assets.

Yes, and the first reports made it seem like the Suns got a steal
Well, the "fine print" showed they massively overpaid - - the market, like Durant was limited and still they overpaid.
the Wizards getting an expiring Shamet and Paul should have been MORE than enough

So what terrible player will Ishbia trade for now and give up picks?
My money is still on PG13

[thamadkant]

So the Magic proposal is good but Magic would need incentives to take Beal, but if they are willing to send someone like Isaac then I'm OK, purely because he is a player of need.


So recap.

KD to Rockets for Smith or Eason, 2027 Suns pick and salary filler. Would be a fall back deal from them.

Booker to Thunder for Holmgren would be a dream. But Pistons has Ausar, Ivey, salary filler and a first rounder or two.


Magic and Suns agree to a Beal for Isaac, salary filler.

Suns get younger, athleticism and defense, while adding picks. Form a new strategy and system focused on length, athleticism, defense.

[bwgood77]

Well, at this point that’s like me saying that we need to discuss about trading for Wemby in this offseason because it would be good for the Suns.

It's not happening.

I don't get it - if Ishbia isn't willing to discuss trading Booker than he is 100% complete full of **** about winning a title. If the goal is to win a title - which Ishbia says is his goal - why wouldn't that be an option.

If the goal is to hopefully have a player on the court that will attract fans to attend games- fine. But not being open to trading Booker isn't about doing everything to win a title.

Everyone involved with the Suns says that Book will stay on the Suns next year. Ishbia and Book themselves and all the insiders.

I am not saying if it's is a great idea or a bad idea, I am just saying that is a meaningless discussion to talk about potential trades for Book this summer because he will not be on the market.

Yeah, but no player or front office says we will trade someone this summer while the season is ongoing. Brooklyn kept saying they were keeping KD and he wanted to stay there. Until he asked them privately. Same goes for most players that get moved.

I don't necessarily think he will get move, but if they were planning on looking into it I don't think they'd be doing anything different, because this will give them better leverage in a deal to get a great package.

[bwgood77]

Read on Twitter

Maybe for like 7 years.

[Saberestar]

Trading Beal by attaching assets and futute picks would be an Ishiba kind deal.

If you look up what the Suns traded for Beal, it would make you very depressed. It's franchise suicide basically, a case needs to be raised to investigate the robbery. By adding more assets to get rid of him is just pure mockery of the franchise.


Best move is to hold onto him and get his numbers up as tank commander then unload him as an expiring for assets.

Yes, and the first reports made it seem like the Suns got a steal
Well, the "fine print" showed they massively overpaid - - the market, like Durant was limited and still they overpaid.
the Wizards getting an expiring Shamet and Paul should have been MORE than enough

So what terrible player will Ishbia trade for now and give up picks?
My money is still on PG13

Yeah, I recognize that I was wrong about it because I really thought the trade was very good for us because of Beal's age and recent All-Star status.

I think he would be much better and much healthier...but no, he has been like Jordan Clarkson on a $50M per year contract playing half of the games without any serious injury. This season he has been IN and OUT 11 different times... wow.

He will not get his numbers up because his body is broken. He needs so much rest after a few consecutive games that is getting ridiculous at this point. It's better to lost a #29 or #30 pick in 2027 that struggle with his presence on the team with his NTC.

We can get multiple (decent) players and gain much needed flexibility to fill the roster or make more moves later.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

KD to Houston! (He loves Udoka and already works out with their young players every summer anyways.)
Booker to Detroit! Booker gets to go home and be around family and friends, and Ishbia and Thomas can follow along, too, giving us back our franchise!

Houston-
KD for D Brooks/ Sheppard/ J Smith Jr/ Landale/ Whitmore/ PHX 25' 1st ( 9th pick).


Detroit-
Booker for Stewart/ Ivey/ Thompson (**or Holland)/ Klintman/ DET 26' 1st/ DET 28' 1st/ DET 2030 1st.

PG- FA / Sheppard/ Gillespie.
SG- D Brooks/ Ivey/ Allen.
SF- Thompson/ Dunn/ Whitmore/ Klintman.
PF- J Smith Jr/ Stewart/ Bol Bol.
C- Richards/ Ighodaro/ Landale.

** Trade Allen and Royce for:

Allen:
- To Orlando for Bidatze/ Harris ($7 million expiring).
- To Charlotte for Grant Williams/ CHO 25' 2nd (33rd pick)/ NOP 25' 2nd (34th pick).
- To Philly for Oubre/ Council/ Bona/ PHI 25' 2nd ( 35th pick).

O'neale:
- To San Antonio for Sochan/ 26' 2nd via POR or NOP (no protections).
- To Utah for KMart Jr/ DAL 25' 2nd ( 44th pick)/ LAC 25' 2nd (52nd pick).
- To Brooklyn for Clowney/ ATL 26' 2nd.

[sunsbum]

So I know what Gambo says per the Sabrestar post but trading Booker should be discussed

Bro you literally talk about it every day. In fact I propose we have a trade Booker thread so yall stop gumming this one.

[BobbieL]

Trading Beal by attaching assets and futute picks would be an Ishiba kind deal.

If you look up what the Suns traded for Beal, it would make you very depressed. It's franchise suicide basically, a case needs to be raised to investigate the robbery. By adding more assets to get rid of him is just pure mockery of the franchise.


Best move is to hold onto him and get his numbers up as tank commander then unload him as an expiring for assets.

Yes, and the first reports made it seem like the Suns got a steal
Well, the "fine print" showed they massively overpaid - - the market, like Durant was limited and still they overpaid.
the Wizards getting an expiring Shamet and Paul should have been MORE than enough

So what terrible player will Ishbia trade for now and give up picks?
My money is still on PG13

Yeah, I recognize that I was wrong about it because I really thought the trade was very good for us because of Beal's age and recent All-Star status.

I think he would be much better and much healthier...but no, he has been like Jordan Clarkson on a $50M per year contract playing half of the games without any serious injury. This season he has been IN and OUT 11 different times... wow.

He will not get his numbers up because his body is broken. He needs so much rest after a few consecutive games that is getting ridiculous at this point. It's better to lost a #29 or #30 pick in 2027 that struggle with his presence on the team with his NTC.

We can get multiple (decent) players and gain much needed flexibility to fill the roster or make more moves later.

A Beal trade like the above - probably worth a late FRP as long as the expirings. Otherwise, not worth it - I just don't think the difference between Isaac and a vet minimum will make or break the Suns. $50m of cap space in two years, especially if you offload Allen and O"Neal, that will be HELP the Suns

Ishbia has to get out of the mindset of a quick fix

[Puff]

I understand all the posts wanting to trade both KD and Book to gain youth, talent and draft picks.

However, has any franchise traded their best two players, by a long shot, while keeping their biggest problem?

While the rebuild is probably in order and necessary it still does not make sense in a lot of ways. We are going to trade our best two players that were picked to play for the US at the Olympics while keeping a guy that cannot stay on the court and is a disaster when he is on the court while be coached by a guy that does not communicate with his team or the press. Has this ever happened before?

I just cannot envision a team that trades both Booker and KD while keeping Bradley fcking Beal. It makes no sense.

If KD and Book are both traded or if only KD gets traded, Beal has to get moved somehow, someway, somewhere.

Those suggesting that they would be fine with him on the roster for the next two years are just nuts. Oh yeah, they say he could just play the Booker role. Why don't you ask the Dallas fans if they think AD can just play the Luka role. At least AD is still tradeable.

[BobbieL]

I understand all the posts wanting to trade both KD and Book to gain youth, talent and draft picks.

However, has any franchise traded their best two players, by a long shot, while keeping their biggest problem?

While the rebuild is probably in order and necessary it still does not make sense in a lot of ways. We are going to trade our best two players that were picked to play for the US at the Olympics while keeping a guy that cannot stay on the court and is a disaster when he is on the court while be coached by a guy that does not communicate with his team or the press. Has this ever happened before?

I just cannot envision a team that trades both Booker and KD while keeping Bradley fcking Beal. It makes no sense.

If KD and Book are both traded or if only KD gets traded, Beal has to get moved somehow, someway, somewhere.

Those suggesting that they would be fine with him on the roster for the next two years are just nuts. Oh yeah, they say he could just play the Booker role. Why don't you ask the Dallas fans if they think AD can just play the Luka role. At least AD is still tradeable.

Seriously - you really are trying to compare AD to Luka
Booker and Beal - they at least play the same position, 2G
Luka and Davis are vastly different players
booker career wise averages more and is certainly the better player than Beal - I will grant you that

[sunsbum]

Why tf would we give anything to get rid of Beal. Just sit him untill he requests a trade.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

I mean, he's really not wrong here!

[BobbieL]

Read on Twitter

I mean, he's really not wrong here!

Its like Hollinger is reading the board. Ishbia not having patience has been a killer
Hollinger is also the first national person that I can recall that said Ishbia totally overpaid for Durant. Even if he is Kevin Freaking Durant.