2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 3 - Trade season begins

[Frank Lee]

Trade for Pascal is a win win
We win short term
They win long term

I could see Jones doing it. I’m on the fence.

[Ryu]

Would the Suns add a conditional '23 1st in a Shamet/Saric for Christian Wood and Frank Ntilikina deal? If so, what conditions would be required?

I wouldn't. Wood is nice, wanted him in the offseason but we were focused on KD....I don't like Franky Smokes and while it would be great to offload Shamet and Saric, the conditions I would add to the 1st would be so restrictive, it may as well be a 2nd or two.

No clue why Dallas would do it....Wood is like their 2nd best player

It looks like Wood is a tank commander, good for tanking teams, bad for winning. Hey, Mavs are 15-16 with him as a second best player.

With that being said I am curious why Raptors are this bad? They have this board`s favorite Pascal Siakam and a ton of good players like Van Vleet, Barnes, Anunoby, Trent Jr etc. and they are 13-18 so far.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Would the Suns add a conditional '23 1st in a Shamet/Saric for Christian Wood and Frank Ntilikina deal? If so, what conditions would be required?

I wouldn't. Wood is nice, wanted him in the offseason but we were focused on KD....I don't like Franky Smokes and while it would be great to offload Shamet and Saric, the conditions I would add to the 1st would be so restrictive, it may as well be a 2nd or two.

No clue why Dallas would do it....Wood is like their 2nd best player

It looks like Wood is a tank commander, good for tanking teams, bad for winning. Hey, Mavs are 15-16 with him as a second best player.

With that being said I am curious why Raptors are this bad? They have this board`s favorite Pascal Siakam and a ton of good players like Van Vleet, Barnes, Anunoby, Trent Jr etc. and they are 13-18 so far.

FVV having a nightmare season, Barnes suffering a severe sophomore slump, Gary Trent struggling with his shot as well.

Biggest things are (1) lack of a traditional big man, resulting in the league's worst Defensive Rebounding % and (2) league's second-worst 3FG%. Of their top 8 guys, their best 3FG shooter has been Siakam at 36%. FVV shooting 32%, Trent shooting 33.5%. The fact that the whole team struggles shooting suggests a roster construction/offensive scheme issue. I can see why they're looking to blow it up.

Siakam's the guy they have to move, obviously. Most valuable player, 28 years old. I'm sure he's the guy JJ would most like to trade for. The question is whether they'd need DA to pull the trigger. Not sure we're contenders without DA, but who knows what JJ thinks. Maybe a three-team deal with Poeltl coming here or going to TOR works.

[garrick]

Would the Suns add a conditional '23 1st in a Shamet/Saric for Christian Wood and Frank Ntilikina deal? If so, what conditions would be required?

I wouldn't. Wood is nice, wanted him in the offseason but we were focused on KD....I don't like Franky Smokes and while it would be great to offload Shamet and Saric, the conditions I would add to the 1st would be so restrictive, it may as well be a 2nd or two.

No clue why Dallas would do it....Wood is like their 2nd best player

It looks like Wood is a tank commander, good for tanking teams, bad for winning. Hey, Mavs are 15-16 with him as a second best player.

With that being said I am curious why Raptors are this bad? They have this board`s favorite Pascal Siakam and a ton of good players like Van Vleet, Barnes, Anunoby, Trent Jr etc. and they are 13-18 so far.

It's a team of role players and Siakam just isn't a superstar that can carry the team offensively.

[Ryu]

I wouldn't. Wood is nice, wanted him in the offseason but we were focused on KD....I don't like Franky Smokes and while it would be great to offload Shamet and Saric, the conditions I would add to the 1st would be so restrictive, it may as well be a 2nd or two.

No clue why Dallas would do it....Wood is like their 2nd best player

It looks like Wood is a tank commander, good for tanking teams, bad for winning. Hey, Mavs are 15-16 with him as a second best player.

With that being said I am curious why Raptors are this bad? They have this board`s favorite Pascal Siakam and a ton of good players like Van Vleet, Barnes, Anunoby, Trent Jr etc. and they are 13-18 so far.

FVV having a nightmare season, Barnes suffering a severe sophomore slump, Gary Trent struggling with his shot as well.

Biggest things are (1) lack of a traditional big man, resulting in the league's worst Defensive Rebounding % and (2) league's second-worst 3FG%. Of their top 8 guys, their best 3FG shooter has been Siakam at 36%. FVV shooting 32%, Trent shooting 33.5%. The fact that the whole team struggles shooting suggests a roster construction/offensive scheme issue. I can see why they're looking to blow it up.

Siakam's the guy they have to move, obviously. Most valuable player, 28 years old. I'm sure he's the guy JJ would most like to trade for. The question is whether they'd need DA to pull the trigger. Not sure we're contenders without DA, but who knows what JJ thinks. Maybe a three-team deal with Poeltl coming here or going to TOR works.

Thanks.

So, many on here would like to trade DA (and couple of firsts) for Siakam only for us to have a lack of traditional big man resulting in the league`s worst defensive rebounding? Sounds like a plan.

[bwgood77]

I thought people liked Poeltl and many didn't like Ayton.

Anyway, Siakam is a no brainer but like I said, no one else averages 24/8/7 in the NBA except Luka and Jokic.

You don't trade guys like that. Not for Ayton. They will want to get better in trade, not worse.

Once Barnes gets better and they add a pick (which they are good at) and Koloko progresses, they will be good.

I am unsure why people expect teams in the mix and competitive to trade All NBA players to us. He's probably a top 5 player in the east. Off the top of my head the only guys I take ahead of him are Giannis, Tatum, KD and Embiid, but even for a team like Toronto, they wouldn't trade him for KD...given age.

Honestly when push comes to shove, I don't really think even Tatum is better, he's just younger with more upside and is tops in MVP race moreso because of Boston's record. If Toronto was 22-8 Siakam would likely be up there.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Would the Suns add a conditional '23 1st in a Shamet/Saric for Christian Wood and Frank Ntilikina deal? If so, what conditions would be required?

Yeah sorry!
Unless the 23' first was basically top 28 protected and then if not conveyed becomes a 2nd. Or similar to what others have suggested. Not sure why so many people are intent on pilfering the suns 23' first in all manner of trades honestly. I mean if the suns are good then it's at best a late first. But obviously if teams are anticipating a collapse ( which is wholly possible still) then this becomes a very bad trade for Phoenix in hindsight. So not sure why the 23' pick is being so adamantly thrown in to every possible phoenix trade out there!!

[Saberestar]

I am not even entertaining the idea of Siakam...come on, they will not trade him.

[bwgood77]

OK, I changed poll. I know some like Okongwu a lotand others realize in his 3rd year he's not able to supplant Capela, so he wouldn't give us the offense, and would more strictly be a defensive switcher who can only score at the rim. From 3-10 ft he shoots 38.7%. So people wanting that second shot creator, it's not coming there.

Then Collins is good and many like him but also has the messed up finger.

Though given many not liking or lukewarmm on Ayton, likely assuming guys like Collins/Okongwu are more consistent in putting up good #s (along with any big on any other team), they would go for it.

[Desertfox]

Would the Suns add a conditional '23 1st in a Shamet/Saric for Christian Wood and Frank Ntilikina deal? If so, what conditions would be required?

Yeah sorry!
Unless the 23' first was basically top 28 protected and then if not conveyed becomes a 2nd. Or similar to what others have suggested. Not sure why so many people are intent on pilfering the suns 23' first in all manner of trades honestly. I mean if the suns are good then it's at best a late first. But obviously if teams are anticipating a collapse ( which is wholly possible still) then this becomes a very bad trade for Phoenix in hindsight. So not sure why the 23' pick is being so adamantly thrown in to every possible phoenix trade out there!!

Because everyone and their grandmother knows that 1st round pick is burning a hole in JJ's pocket and he will get rid of it as soon as he can.

[Slim Charless]

Would the Suns add a conditional '23 1st in a Shamet/Saric for Christian Wood and Frank Ntilikina deal? If so, what conditions would be required?

I wouldn't. Wood is nice, wanted him in the offseason but we were focused on KD....I don't like Franky Smokes and while it would be great to offload Shamet and Saric, the conditions I would add to the 1st would be so restrictive, it may as well be a 2nd or two.

No clue why Dallas would do it....Wood is like their 2nd best player

They do it to acquire more picks to chase a bigger and better star.

[Blonde]

Ayton for Collins + Okongwu is a pass for me. Ayton is the best individual player in the group + highest untapped potential there. I like Collins, but he’s closer in value to Cam Johnson than he is to Ayton. Okongwu might be good soon? I’m just not ready to trade a major piece for a gamble that he can be a starting C on a deep playoff run as soon as this year. Any trade where we give up Ayton needs to be a no brainer ceiling raiser this year like KD or Siakam.

[Slim Charless]

I wouldn't. Wood is nice, wanted him in the offseason but we were focused on KD....I don't like Franky Smokes and while it would be great to offload Shamet and Saric, the conditions I would add to the 1st would be so restrictive, it may as well be a 2nd or two.

No clue why Dallas would do it....Wood is like their 2nd best player

It looks like Wood is a tank commander, good for tanking teams, bad for winning. Hey, Mavs are 15-16 with him as a second best player.

With that being said I am curious why Raptors are this bad? They have this board`s favorite Pascal Siakam and a ton of good players like Van Vleet, Barnes, Anunoby, Trent Jr etc. and they are 13-18 so far.

FVV having a nightmare season, Barnes suffering a severe sophomore slump, Gary Trent struggling with his shot as well.

Biggest things are (1) lack of a traditional big man, resulting in the league's worst Defensive Rebounding % and (2) league's second-worst 3FG%. Of their top 8 guys, their best 3FG shooter has been Siakam at 36%. FVV shooting 32%, Trent shooting 33.5%. The fact that the whole team struggles shooting suggests a roster construction/offensive scheme issue. I can see why they're looking to blow it up.

Siakam's the guy they have to move, obviously. Most valuable player, 28 years old. I'm sure he's the guy JJ would most like to trade for. The question is whether they'd need DA to pull the trigger. Not sure we're contenders without DA, but who knows what JJ thinks. Maybe a three-team deal with Poeltl coming here or going to TOR works.

You nailed it imo. Good post.

The rest of the league figured out their "long bois" gimmick and just started forcing them to hit 3s...which they can't do. FVV sucking has left them with a massive gap in shooting.

Siakam is the most obvious target as he's the oldest and the most valuable. They need shooting and a true 5.

An Ayton+CamJo for Siakim+Koloko deal makes a ton of sense for both teams. Maybe we add in a pick this year to cover the gap but I think that's a pretty even deal. Either way the 2 teams seem like they can fix each other's problems nicely.

[sunsfan1o1]

Would the Suns add a conditional '23 1st in a Shamet/Saric for Christian Wood and Frank Ntilikina deal? If so, what conditions would be required?

I wouldn't. Wood is nice, wanted him in the offseason but we were focused on KD....I don't like Franky Smokes and while it would be great to offload Shamet and Saric, the conditions I would add to the 1st would be so restrictive, it may as well be a 2nd or two.

No clue why Dallas would do it....Wood is like their 2nd best player

It looks like Wood is a tank commander, good for tanking teams, bad for winning. Hey, Mavs are 15-16 with him as a second best player.

With that being said I am curious why Raptors are this bad? They have this board`s favorite Pascal Siakam and a ton of good players like Van Vleet, Barnes, Anunoby, Trent Jr etc. and they are 13-18 so far.

Because those players are not as good as they seem. Especially not Trent Jr.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Would the Suns add a conditional '23 1st in a Shamet/Saric for Christian Wood and Frank Ntilikina deal? If so, what conditions would be required?

Yeah sorry!
Unless the 23' first was basically top 28 protected and then if not conveyed becomes a 2nd. Or similar to what others have suggested. Not sure why so many people are intent on pilfering the suns 23' first in all manner of trades honestly. I mean if the suns are good then it's at best a late first. But obviously if teams are anticipating a collapse ( which is wholly possible still) then this becomes a very bad trade for Phoenix in hindsight. So not sure why the 23' pick is being so adamantly thrown in to every possible phoenix trade out there!!

Because everyone and their grandmother knows that 1st round pick is burning a hole in JJ's pocket and he will get rid of it as soon as he can.

For sure!
Ever since that stupid article came out wherein Jones gaffed and said the draft isn't important and he doesn't even really scout it or pay attention to it, everyone just assumes that the suns are complete morons and would be ecstatic to just hand over assets even in garbage trades with lesser value coming back while thanking them for the priviledge.

I sincerely hope that the new ownership takes a completely different approach to the draft with more legitimate investment in high level scouting and talent evaluation so we can actually extract value out of it rather than just bypassing it altogether in favor of low ceiling inconsistent fringe nba talents that were previously prioritized over legitimate reliable contributors just to save money and Carter to Saver's parsimonious proclivities.

[sunsfan1o1]

I thought people liked Poeltl and many didn't like Ayton.

Anyway, Siakam is a no brainer but like I said, no one else averages 24/8/7 in the NBA except Luka and Jokic.

You don't trade guys like that. Not for Ayton. They will want to get better in trade, not worse.

Once Barnes gets better and they add a pick (which they are good at) and Koloko progresses, they will be good.

I am unsure why people expect teams in the mix and competitive to trade All NBA players to us. He's probably a top 5 player in the east. Off the top of my head the only guys I take ahead of him are Giannis, Tatum, KD and Embiid, but even for a team like Toronto, they wouldn't trade him for KD...given age.

Honestly when push comes to shove, I don't really think even Tatum is better, he's just younger with more upside and is tops in MVP race moreso because of Boston's record. If Toronto was 22-8 Siakam would likely be up there.

I guess you and Masai think alike. That’s why raptors keep losing they think Siakam is that guy. Lol. Top 5 player in the East is crazy. I don’t even know if he’s top 10.
I’d take Trae, Tatum, Jaylen Brown, Donovan Mitchell, Mobley, Garland, Haliburton, Jimmy Butler, Adebayo, Giannis, Holiday, Middleton, Banchero, Embiid, KD, Kyrie, Lamelo, over him and maybe more. That’s just the East. His stats are inflated.

[Slim Charless]

I thought people liked Poeltl and many didn't like Ayton.

Anyway, Siakam is a no brainer but like I said, no one else averages 24/8/7 in the NBA except Luka and Jokic.

You don't trade guys like that. Not for Ayton. They will want to get better in trade, not worse.

Once Barnes gets better and they add a pick (which they are good at) and Koloko progresses, they will be good.

I am unsure why people expect teams in the mix and competitive to trade All NBA players to us. He's probably a top 5 player in the east. Off the top of my head the only guys I take ahead of him are Giannis, Tatum, KD and Embiid, but even for a team like Toronto, they wouldn't trade him for KD...given age.

Honestly when push comes to shove, I don't really think even Tatum is better, he's just younger with more upside and is tops in MVP race moreso because of Boston's record. If Toronto was 22-8 Siakam would likely be up there.

I guess you and Masai think alike. That’s why raptors keep losing they think Siakam is that guy. Lol. Top 5 player in the East is crazy. I don’t even know if he’s top 10. His stats are inflated.

100%

I can name almost 15 players better than him in the East right now.

He's stat padding due to everyone sucking and has brought the team to the lottery as a result. He's a classic #2, nowhere near good enough to carry a team. Not a Tatum/Biid/Trae/Giannis. Jimmy Butler is better too. Among many others.

Ayton and CamJo is a great deal for Toronto. I'll add a first if they add Koloko.

[RedIndian]

Read on Twitter

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[spanishninja]

Read on Twitter

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This guy has Michigan connections. DID HE BUY THE TEAM FOR BOOKER?

[RedIndian]

Apparently he played for Michigan State and won a national title in 2000. Worth about 5.5 billion