The One And Only Offseason Thread 5: Dinnertime!

[Kerrsed]

The rondo/Bledsoe rumors are floating around again. Rondo wants to test free agency next season so the suns could lose him for nothing at all. Come one, come all how does a rondo/dragic backcourt sound. Backcourt 2015 anyone?

I think Rondo will end up in Houston. The Rockets will strike out on obtaining Dragic or Bledsoe and Rubios price will be too damn high. Boston seems like they are fine going forward with a Smart/Bradley backcourt, and they could use whatever assets the Rockets offer (HOU 1st/NOP 1st/Capella/Jones/Papanikolaou) to help them in their re-build.

Rondo/Harden/Ariza/Moti/Howard

Rockets also have their full TPE, and BAE to use. Lets say they get Ilyasova(or Bass) with TPE, and O'Neal with BAE.

Rondo, Beverley
Harden, Daniels
Ariza, Garcia
Ilyasova, Motiejunas
Howard, O'Neal

I'm curious from a non biased perspective, if healthy, how good would a team like that be in your guys opinions? Is it on OKC's level? better or equal to the Clips etc?

There is no team in the West on OKC's level because there is no player on Durants level. Add in Westbrook, who i believe is a Tier 2 player (Durant & Lebron being the only in Tier 1), and they are on a whole 'nother playing field.

With the team you listed, i believe that would be good enough for maybe top 5-6 in the west. Definite playoff team. On par with the Clippers.

[ThatBoyNick]

I think Rondo will end up in Houston. The Rockets will strike out on obtaining Dragic or Bledsoe and Rubios price will be too damn high. Boston seems like they are fine going forward with a Smart/Bradley backcourt, and they could use whatever assets the Rockets offer (HOU 1st/NOP 1st/Capella/Jones/Papanikolaou) to help them in their re-build.

Rondo/Harden/Ariza/Moti/Howard

Rockets also have their full TPE, and BAE to use. Lets say they get Ilyasova(or Bass) with TPE, and O'Neal with BAE.

Rondo, Beverley
Harden, Daniels
Ariza, Garcia
Ilyasova, Motiejunas
Howard, O'Neal

With the team you listed, i believe that would be good enough for maybe top 5-6 in the west. Definite playoff team. On par with the Clippers.

I was thinking more top 3-4, what other couple of teams do you think could push a squad like that to the 6th seed?

1 Spurs
2 OKC
3 Rockets(Clippers)
4 Clippers(Rockets)

Would be a huge disappointment for the Rockets land Rondo and get the 6th seed, one seed worse than we were last year. Eh i'm babbling on the wrong forum, thanks for your input on a hypothetical rockets roster lol.

[Kerrsed]

Well obviously the Suns would be 3rd seed.

Actually, now that you mention it, i think you guys would be 3rd or 4th. I do think that GS/POR/MEM will be right on your guys (or Clippers) heels though. Its going to be a real tight race in the west, more so than years past.

[ThatBoyNick]

Well obviously the Suns would be 3rd seed.

Actually, now that you mention it, i think you guys would be 3rd or 4th. I do think that GS/POR/MEM will be right on your guys (or Clippers) heels though. Its going to be a real tight race in the west, more so than years past.

What's that chick's name? I can't stop watching your thumbnail gif.

Edit - nevermind I see the name boxxy in your sig lol.

[JTrain]

That starting lineup would be among the best three in the NBA. The depth is questionable though. I would put them right where you do... after the Thunder and Spurs but neck and neck with LAC.

[JTrain]

Rockets also have their full TPE, and BAE to use. Lets say they get Ilyasova(or Bass) with TPE, and O'Neal with BAE.

Rondo, Beverley
Harden, Daniels
Ariza, Garcia
Ilyasova, Motiejunas
Howard, O'Neal

With the team you listed, i believe that would be good enough for maybe top 5-6 in the west. Definite playoff team. On par with the Clippers.

I was thinking more top 3-4, what other couple of teams do you think could push a squad like that to the 6th seed?

1 Spurs
2 OKC
3 Rockets(Clippers)
4 Clippers(Rockets)

Would be a huge disappointment for the Rockets land Rondo and get the 6th seed, one seed worse than we were last year. Eh i'm babbling on the wrong forum, thanks for your input on a hypothetical rockets roster lol.

Do you think Morey would accept Bledsoe for NOP 1st, Jones, Johnson and Papadopolous?

[gaspar]

Do you think Morey would accept Bledsoe for NOP 1st, Jones, Johnson and Papadopolous?

I'm pretty sure McDonough wouldn't take it. 3 backups (including two 2nd round picks who didn't play a minute in the NBA and most likely wouldn't even crack the Suns rotation) and a crappy pick is not enough for a player like Bledsoe. We need a "quantity for quality" type of trade, not the other way around. The Suns have enough depth, we need stars.

[TASTIC]

I don't want anything to do with Rondo.

Too many miles on his tyres and anyone questioning Bledsoe's health but wanting Rondo need to look at his GP:

Season Age GP Missed
2006-07 20 78 4
2007-08 21 77 5
2008-09 22 80 2
2009-10 23 81 1
2010-11 24 68 14
2011-12* 25 53 13
2012-13 26 38 44
2013-14 27 30 52

[JTrain]

Do you think Morey would accept Bledsoe for NOP 1st, Jones, Johnson and Papadopolous?

I'm pretty sure McDonough wouldn't take it. 3 backups (including two 2nd round picks who didn't play a minute in the NBA and most likely wouldn't even crack the Suns rotation) and a crappy pick is not enough for a player like Bledsoe. We need a "quantity for quality" type of trade, not the other way around. The Suns have enough depth, we need stars.

Terrence Jones is a starter. He might not be a star yet, but at 22 years old he had a WS/48 of .169 (better than Dwight Howard) and a PER of 19.1.

Among players that young (or younger), Jones ranked:

- 4th in WS/48 (behind Davis, Leonard and Drummond)
- 5th in PER (behind Davis, Drummond, Irving and Leonard)

Also, Johnson has potential to be a quality backup SG, and the Pels pick would probably be in the 10-14 range, which absolutely could produce a great player.

[JTrain]

And I like Keef, but if you look at the advanced stats, Jones has a better PER, WS/48, higher eFG% and turns it over at about half the rate that Keef does. He's also a better shot blocker. And he's ONLY 22.

Having both of these guys would be great for us. I like Keef off the bench with Mook and I think Jones has a higher ceiling.

[JTrain]

[ThatBoyNick]

Do you think Morey would accept Bledsoe for NOP 1st, Jones, Johnson and Papadopolous?

I have no idea, I have a feeling all of this will unravel soon enough though.

[ThatBoyNick]

The Suns have enough depth, we need stars.

Would you like to know how a team like the Suns could get a star? Asset stacking. Suns are too good to tank, and Phoenix isn't attracting any star FA's. Sounds familiar to me... oh yeah! The suns are in the exact position as the 2011-12 Rockets were lol.

That "crappy pick" is highly likely to be a late lottery pick, The Rockets traded Lowry, who's a quality PG just like Bledsoe, for a late lottery pick. The Rockets then got Harden with that late lottery pick, Jeremy Lamb and a 1 year rental of K.Martin. I'll be damned if you say that the Pelicans pick, Jones (better than Lamb) Johnson (Looks promising) and Papanikolaou isn't better or equal to the package that netted us Harden. Not that i'm sure Morey would even give up that much.

If the Suns keep stacking assets, it will be inevitable that you guys land a disgruntled star.

BTW the market for Bledsoe is very limited. There are very few teams who are in need of a PG, willing to give Bledsoe a max contract, willing to gamble on Bledsoe's health and willing to give up multiple assets for Bledsoe on top of all that. If you think A late lotto, Jones, Johnson and Papanikolaou is way too crappy for Bledsoe, i'm afraid you might be quite disappointed if the Suns indeed end up trading Bledsoe.

[gaspar]

The Suns have enough depth, we need stars.

Would you like to know how a team like the Suns could get a star? Asset stacking. Suns are too good to tank, and Phoenix isn't attracting any star FA's. Sounds familiar to me... oh yeah! The suns are in the exact position as the 2011-12 Rockets were lol.

That "crappy pick" is highly likely to be a late lottery pick, The Rockets traded Lowry, who's a quality PG just like Bledsoe, for a late lottery pick. The Rockets then got Harden with that late lottery pick, Jeremy Lamb and a 1 year rental of K.Martin. I'll be damned if you say that the Pelicans pick, Jones (better than Lamb) Johnson (Looks promising) and Papanikolaou isn't better or equal to the package that netted us Harden. Not that i'm sure Morey would even give up that much.

If the Suns keep stacking assets, it will be inevitable that you guys land a disgruntled star.

BTW the market for Bledsoe is very limited. There are very few teams who are in need of a PG, willing to give Bledsoe a max contract, willing to gamble on Bledsoe's health and willing to give up multiple assets for Bledsoe on top of all that. If you think A late lotto, Jones, Johnson and Papanikolaou is way too crappy for Bledsoe, i'm afraid you might be quite disappointed if the Suns indeed end up trading Bledsoe.

Disgruntled star such as... Bledsoe? The Harden trade is a great example why the Suns shouldn't trade Bledsoe for Houston's pu pu platter.

[gaspar]

Do you think Morey would accept Bledsoe for NOP 1st, Jones, Johnson and Papadopolous?

I'm pretty sure McDonough wouldn't take it. 3 backups (including two 2nd round picks who didn't play a minute in the NBA and most likely wouldn't even crack the Suns rotation) and a crappy pick is not enough for a player like Bledsoe. We need a "quantity for quality" type of trade, not the other way around. The Suns have enough depth, we need stars.

Terrence Jones is a starter. He might not be a star yet, but at 22 years old he had a WS/48 of .169 (better than Dwight Howard) and a PER of 19.1.

Among players that young (or younger), Jones ranked:

- 4th in WS/48 (behind Davis, Leonard and Drummond)
- 5th in PER (behind Davis, Drummond, Irving and Leonard)

Also, Johnson has potential to be a quality backup SG, and the Pels pick would probably be in the 10-14 range, which absolutely could produce a great player.

1. Jones is, at best, as good as Markieff (IMO, he's worse). We need to get someone who's clearly better than what we already have, if we are trading our best 2-way player since Marion.
2. The Suns have Ennis and Goodwin as 2 projects to develop in the backcourt. I don't see any chance Johnson would get ANY playing time at all for the next 2 years in Phoenix. You can find this kind of players in free agency for vet min every year.
3. Sure, the Pelicans pick could be in the 10-14 range, or it could be #19, or #24 in 2019, or a couple of 2nd rounders in 2020 and 2021, or the Suns could draft a bust...

Bledsoe is a sure thing. These assets most likely won't amount to anything special.

[batsmasher]

Bledsoe is a sure thing.

Which is why we should give him a max already!!

[gaspar]

Bledsoe is a sure thing.

Which is why we should give him a max already!!

IMO he has the talent and ability of a max player, but those knees...

[King4Day]

The reason it could pay to make the Rondo deal is:

If Bledsoe is adamant that he will sign the QO, then during this season, we will get very little for him by the deadline if we decide to trade him as the team receiving him won't have his bird rights AND EB also needs to approve a trade to that team.

If we trade for Rondo, that team has better control over him long term if he's just looking for the money.

Regarding the offseason being disappointing...

Last year, the team wasn't designed to compete for a playoff spot. We're rebuilding and what McDonough did last offseason was great for asset accumulation and youth development. It just happened to workout that our team was far more competitive than anyone could have imagined.

I believe McDonough is still looking at the bigger picture. If he felt Bledsoe was THE guy who could be the eventual tipping point towards true contention, he would likely have given in. Neither he, nor other GM's around the league feel this way so he's not budging on his offer.

His mindset is to bide his time and strike when the time is right. Until then, continue to build up assets and develop the young talent.

With or without Bledsoe, we weren't winning a title. So no need to stunt our flexibility for the sake of overpaying a player who isn't a franchise changer.

[Zelaznyrules]

Bledsoe is a sure thing.

Which is why we should give him a max already!!

It's all about market value. It makes no sense to outbid ourselves. It would be one thing to raise the offer a bit in a give and take negotiation but just giving in is bad business.

[bwgood77]

Rockets also have their full TPE, and BAE to use. Lets say they get Ilyasova(or Bass) with TPE, and O'Neal with BAE.

Rondo, Beverley
Harden, Daniels
Ariza, Garcia
Ilyasova, Motiejunas
Howard, O'Neal

With the team you listed, i believe that would be good enough for maybe top 5-6 in the west. Definite playoff team. On par with the Clippers.

I was thinking more top 3-4, what other couple of teams do you think could push a squad like that to the 6th seed?

1 Spurs
2 OKC
3 Rockets(Clippers)
4 Clippers(Rockets)

Would be a huge disappointment for the Rockets land Rondo and get the 6th seed, one seed worse than we were last year. Eh i'm babbling on the wrong forum, thanks for your input on a hypothetical rockets roster lol.

That team could be great if they played well together. I somewhat agree with Kerrsed, and OKC/SA are 1-2. I think people underrate Memphis though. When Gasol was healthy they had the best record in the league. I think the Rockets, Memphis and the Clips would be up for 3-4-5 with Dallas and GS not far behind. So they could finish anywhere in that order. The west is so close that almost if any of the 8 playoff teams could be in the 8 spot. As it currently stands I think it would likely be Houston though, and there may be others knocking on the playoff door. It likely comes down to who gets most impacted by injuries this year as usual.