Official Trade Thread: Part 3

[Kerrsed]

I would. Cousins is an absolute stud.

I would trade the Sun, Moon and Stars to get him.

[Saberestar]

Cousins is more "toxic" than Beasley, he is a real problem in the locker room for Sacto. I do not want Cousins, he is not coachable and he is not a hard worker.

[sunskerr]

Idk, maybe we should just wait till the offseason and try to acquire Eric Gordon again.

[nevetsov]

I think it's a lot simpler than we realize.

With Beasley, we are the worst defensive team in the league.

Without Beasley, we are the best defensive team in the league.

So it doesn't matter if Scola and Dragic suck at D, as long as Beas is subtracted from the Suns' equation, we are a significantly better team.

His contract isn't too bad in so far as he's an expiring next year (third year is a team option I believe). That means he's not completely untradeable.

Gortat, Beas and Marshall for Jefferson. Jazz fans are ok with it. So am I.

Dragic, Telfair, Garrett
Brown, Tucker
Dudley, Tucker, Johnson
Morris, Scola, Zeller
Jefferson, O'Neal, Frye

[Kerrsed]

Gortat, Beas and Marshall for Jefferson. Jazz fans are ok with it. So am I.

Dragic, Telfair, Garrett
Brown, Tucker
Dudley, Tucker, Johnson
Morris, Scola, Zeller
Jefferson, O'Neal, Frye

I have been following Gortat/Beasley threads on many many other boards and did see this offer from a Jazz fan. Honestly i dont know if i like this one, or the Milsap one, or actually either of them. Both Milsap and Jefferson are Free Agents next year, and they could just decide to walk instead of being stuck on a craptastic Suns team. More-so, if they did want to play for us, we could just approach them in Free Agency with a boat-load of cash and use Gortat/Beasley for players at other spots.

Jefferson has been having a great year and would be a great rebounding/defensive C for us, but at what price? He's currently getting $15M a season, and i would expect him to want around the same with a slight raise. Is that what a low end rebuilding team needs to do at this point? Im not quite sure. I also dont know if the Jazz would actually bite on that trade. They currently have 2 young budding bigs on their bench that they have already let know are their future. Why go after Gortat when you have Kanter waiting in the wings?

There was also more to that trade idea:

Al Jefferson, Raja Bell and Alec Burks for Marcin Gortat, Channing Frye and Wesley Johnson.

So we are also giving up a usable big in Frye and a $4M expiring in Johnson for a Raja Bell who hasnt played in over a year and who has been instructed to stay away from the team, and Burks, who is a young 6'6 SG with a 3.6PER on a team that is desperate for a SG.

If we got a guarantee from Jefferson that he would re-sign and at a good price, i would be all for it. 20/10/1 players with a 21PER dont grow on trees. He seems like he has a good head on his shoulders and seems to have a good attitude even though he has been stuck on sh*t teams his whole career. He also brings a toughness that we lack and could be that solid veteran presence that we need.

After all that, i still dont know exactly where i stand on this idea. I think more than anything i have a problem with the money that i expect he expects. And if i have a problem with the money issue, i KNOW Sarver will have a problem with the money issue.

[EB2]

I know. I just don't think Ellis could be a top 3 player on a contending team. The one time Golden State made the playoffs in 06, Ellis came off the bench. Maybe he needs to go back to the bench again.

We're not trading for Ellis to become title contenders and compete with Miami and OKC. We're trading for him to help us become a playoff team since the FO is all about that.

Isn't the goal for every team to compete for a championship. I kind of want to see the Suns win a championship in the next 5-10 years, not be a treadmill team.

[carey]

Beasley-Morris-Lakers 1st 2012 for Boozer.

Beasley is only guaranteed $3M in '14-'15 so the Bulls would be saving something like $30M. We'd have to swallow a lot of salary but at least we'd get a hard working player with a decent brain in his head. Brown is only partially guaranteed next year and Scola will be movable if we choose to do so. If we do that, depending on what we take back for Brown and Scola, we'd be looking at a team salary of $44M to $52M next season. Still plenty of money to pursue FAs.

We could even sign Mayo if Dallas doesn't give him the $$ he wants. I think Dragic-Mayo-Dudley-Boozer-Gortat with a top 5 draft pick this year, and another 1st rounder from the Lopez trade is much better than what we have this year.

[Kerrsed]

Well, i was snooping around the Jazz board, and they really really really like the idea of going after Gasol. Many would be willing to give up an arm and a leg for him (Jefferson+Milsap), so i came up with this 3-way beaut!

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=b8dtsbp

Jazz get: Gasol/Gortat/Morris/Marshall
Lakers get: Millsap/Frye/Bell/Johnsons expiring
Suns get: Jefferson/Favors

Utah gets their new PF and C. By adding Gasol, Favors would be held back even more and get even less minutes. Here they get a replacement for him in Morris. They also get Gortat at C, seeming how many of them view Kanter as a bust and more of a back-up C. They re-supply their team with players on2-3 year deals, so they dont just lose the soon to be FA's (Milsap/Jefferson) to other teams due to them not having the capspace to pay them. They also some-what solve their future PG problems by getting Marshall, who seems like he can be made into a Jazz like player (Stockton-like).
MoWill/Hayward/Williams/Gasol/Gortat --------- Marshall/Foye/Evans/Morris/Kanter

Lakers turn Gasol into more usable players in a D'antoni system. Milsap would provide them an instant upgrade over MWP at SF and Frye would give them D'antonis favorite stretch 4 to put next to Howard. Bell gives them that defense for when they need to rest Kobe and Johnson is thrown in to make the salarys match. This would make them a deadly team.
Nash/Kobe/Milsap/Frye/Howard ---------- Blake/Bell/MWP/Jamison/Hill

Suns get 2 defensive Bigs out of the deal that they can build a team around. One a highly touted high lotto pick, that has been stuck behind other, but has shown flashes of brilliance in the minutes that he does get (Favors), and a defensive/rebounding machine in the paint (Jefferson).
Dragic/Brown/Beasley/Favors/Jefferson --------- Telfair/Tucker/Dudley/Scola/O'Neal

[Kerrsed]

With 3:25 left in the second quarter of the Mavericks’ 119-96 victory over Sacramento, Kings center DeMarcus Cousins delivered what replays showed to be a back-hand, closed-fist punch to O.J. Mayo’s groin. The incident occured while the two were fighting for position. Cousins and Mayo were whistled for a double-technical foul for jawing at one another following the blow. “I told him, ‘Man, play basketball,’ ” Mayo said. “ ’You’ve got a chance to be a good player, but when you do stuff like that, you’re like a garbage player. It’s not a sign of being great.’” Dallas Morning News

“Man, that guy has mental issues,” Mayo said. “He’s a talented player. He has an opportunity to be the face of the organization, but I don’t think he wants it.” Dallas Morning News

[Ryu]

Ugh, Carey. I`d hate to see Boozer, his subpar defence and his 15/16 mil salary on rebuilding Suns team.

On the other hand, Kerssed`s plan with Ellis and Sanders would be, at least, exciting to watch.

[TruthTelling]

Beasley-Morris-Lakers 1st 2012 for Boozer.

Beasley is only guaranteed $3M in '14-'15 so the Bulls would be saving something like $30M. We'd have to swallow a lot of salary but at least we'd get a hard working player with a decent brain in his head. Brown is only partially guaranteed next year and Scola will be movable if we choose to do so. If we do that, depending on what we take back for Brown and Scola, we'd be looking at a team salary of $44M to $52M next season. Still plenty of money to pursue FAs.

We could even sign Mayo if Dallas doesn't give him the $$ he wants. I think Dragic-Mayo-Dudley-Boozer-Gortat with a top 5 draft pick this year, and another 1st rounder from the Lopez trade is much better than what we have this year.

Beyond stupid proposal.

People are so freaking impatient it's a joke. What is the point of giving away Beasley and using assets like Morris and a draft pick to do it?

we are REBUILDING anyway, we are BAD anyway

Does this trade make us better? No, Does it improve our cap? No, does it reduce our assets? Yes.

Why would we want Boozer to start for our team and give away Morris to do this? Id rather keep Morris and anyone half way reasonable thinking person would feel the same.

The impatience with Beasley is ridiculous. You all knew it was a project and not going to be decided 25 games into a season.

Where is the blame for Gortat and Dragic? They have been terrible as well.

[carey]

I don't consider Morris an asset or a part of our future. He's another of our front office's big mistakes. Like Earl Clark. Like Kendall Marshall. At least Kieff is finally shooting over 40%, but just barely.

I think once you figure out that Beasley is the anti-Nash, someone that makes the players around them much worse than they actually are you'll come around to my way of thinking.

It doesn't have to be Boozer. It could be anyone from a team looking to cut salary that would take on Beasley as a means to get out of paying the LT or the supertax.

But thanks for your constructive criticism, if you can call it that.

[TruthTelling]

And if you did that trade we would be

1. have less picks
2. be even older , we are still one of the oldest teams in the league already
3. we would be still bad and you would just focus your hate on someone other than Beasley, probably Boozer

That trade is just pointless, there is absolutely no reason for us to just ditch Beasley since we are under the cap anyway with nobody to spend the money on really.

[rsavaj]

Great must-read breakdown of our trade assets: http://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2012/ ... r-on-trade

[rsavaj]

From the comments section from the link above:

Minor quibbles.
If the Suns are expecting to get back return commensurate with a 15/10 player on a reasonable contract for Gortat they might as well not consider trading him, because I seriously doubt there is another team that would entertain the idea of including assets for a trade based on that set of criteria.

Gortat has had ONE season where he was a 15/10 player and is currently an 11/8 player. Many people felt he was a product of Nash. Gortat is working hard to prove them right, which ironically is the first time Gortat and hard work have been in the same sentence this season. Throw in the aspect that many might consider that he is disgruntled and pouting and his trade value might even be lower than it was when the Suns acquired him. Even his contract isn’t as enticing since he’s playing like a fringe starter. $7 million for an 11/8 guy isn’t exactly a coup.

Hopefully my dotage is catching up to me and I’m wrong about this.

I would include Telfair and JO as movable pieces, more likely as part of a package. I can see a team that needs a backup point or center showing interest, maybe closer to the deadline. Those are always positions of need.

I would absolutely be pursuing all my options right now if I was associated with the Suns front office. It’s not that difficult to see they are on a direct course to be fired. Here are a few of the more obvious actions I would take and reasons for them:

A. Fire Turner. No matter what the talent is, he evidently sucks at his job. He is also an ideal patsy to divert blame from the front office along the lines of, “Turner isn’t doing an adequate job of coaching up the talent.”

B. Trade Gortat. Tell Gentry to showcase him. No more pulling him in games he’s playing well. Get him early touches to try to get him going. If he can get it together for a little bit, the Suns might be able to get something better than some expired coupons for him.

C. Be as honest as possible with the fan base. Be accountable. Let them know these moves have been made because this franchise will not tolerate languid and lackluster performances from the staff and players. Decisive action needs to be taken or else the team will lose what’s left of its invested fan base. Teams that suck and don’t take action send the message to their fans that 1. they aren’t fully commited to winning, 2. they’re incompetent and incapable of implementig the right kind of change and 3. they don’t care enough about the fans to do everything possible to give them a product they can take pride in. For a prime example see Cardinals, Arizona.

[TruthTelling]

Gortat for Evan Turner - throw in some spare parts on both sides to adjust the value accordingly.

Put Turner at the 2 this year, slide him over to the 3 spot when we draft Goodwin (or Bazz, McLemore, Smart)

[nevetsov]

Gortat, Beas and Marshall for Jefferson. Jazz fans are ok with it. So am I.

Dragic, Telfair, Garrett
Brown, Tucker
Dudley, Tucker, Johnson
Morris, Scola, Zeller
Jefferson, O'Neal, Frye

I have been following Gortat/Beasley threads on many many other boards and did see this offer from a Jazz fan.

There was also more to that trade idea:

Al Jefferson, Raja Bell and Alec Burks for Marcin Gortat, Channing Frye and Wesley Johnson.

I was actually referring to my trade proposal which preceded those, both in this thread and in the Gasol thread on the Jazz board.

Worst case scenario (or best case depending on how you view it) is that Jefferson is a rental and expires. Him, combined with Johnson equates to near $20m coming off the books.

That, coupled with our picks, should be enough to solidify the SG and C positions in the offseason.

[Saberestar]

Kevin Love anyone?
http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/22 ... ut_Wolves_

Gortat and Markieff + 2 First Round Picks Top 7 protected ??

I am dreaming...

[Frank Lee]

Well,.......

Jazz get: Gasol/Gortat/Morris/Marshall
Lakers get: Millsap/Frye/Bell/Johnsons expiring
Suns get: Jefferson/Favors

.......

So the fLakes would be happy to get Millsap plus three guys who may never contribute on the court again ? I dont see that happening. Nice one though Homer. I think Gasol would get more. Heck, I think they'd be better off dealing straight with Utah.

I agree with this thought plucked from bsos article...

Marcin Gortat
Don't expect the Suns to trade Marcin Gortat for two or three more role players. If Gortat is traded, it's got to be for a better future asset than he currently is at his peak. The Suns should not sell low on Gortat. They should require teams to give up assets worthy of a 15 and 10 player on a meager contract for this season and next.

Its simple.... you keep theGORTAT. He will be more valuable next yr as an expiring. To me, I find it ridiculous we are not running an offensive scheme to benefit him. In fact, I find it ridiculous we are not running an offensive scheme period. Right now, its every man for himself... and hope you get a chance before Brown or Measley get the ball.

If we trade I'd deal Dudley, Morris, Oneal, Telfair, Marshall, a later pick.... any combo of the bunch. I dont think Measley or Shannon the Cannon would have a market and I dont see how any team would take Frye.... Not until his med situation is confirmed.

Tucker, theG, theD, and Scola are my only keepers. May be Duds too, but I think a package with him and ONeal may get something of interest/value. I would dangle them to Boston and try to work a third team in. I am also curious about the Burks kid... he graded out pretty well if I remember right.

So... looks like we stand pat eh ?

[YFZblu]

I think we may be focusing too much on players at the moment, and not enough on our upcoming picks. Any chance someone can post our draft picks over the next few years? IE what rounds, who we get them from, are they protected, etc.