2020 NBA Draft Prospect Watch - Revised Poll

[bigfoot]

When a hobby becomes a vice.....

To each their own eh Frank.

When you get a job in an NBA scouting department don't forget all your RealGM buds.

[Ghost of Kleine]

When a hobby becomes a vice.....

To each their own eh Frank.

When you get a job in an NBA scouting department don't forget all your RealGM buds.

No way that I ever could Big!

[bwgood77]

To each their own eh Frank.

How about posting your overall big board, not for the Suns, but overall, for say, top 30. It would be interesting to compare that to first and second rookie teams.

You could also note which you think are long term plays after lising a player, who you wouldn't expect to make the all rookie team but long term would be a top 10 player from the class.

Then, as a second add on, you could do an adjusted one specifically for the Suns.

You seem to like almost everyone to some extent so I'd be interested in seeing a big board.

[Ghost of Kleine]

To each their own eh Frank.

How about posting your overall big board, not for the Suns, but overall, for say, top 30. It would be interesting to compare that to first and second rookie teams.

You could also note which you think are long term plays after lising a player, who you wouldn't expect to make the all rookie team but long term would be a top 10 player from the class.

Then, as a second add on, you could do an adjusted one specifically for the Suns.

You seem to like almost everyone to some extent so I'd be interested in seeing a big board.

Very true man! I do really like a lot of attributes and skillsets of many different prospects in this draft. So that might definitely be an interesting idea. If it truly interests you, I'll look into it k.

[bwgood77]

To each their own eh Frank.

How about posting your overall big board, not for the Suns, but overall, for say, top 30. It would be interesting to compare that to first and second rookie teams.

You could also note which you think are long term plays after lising a player, who you wouldn't expect to make the all rookie team but long term would be a top 10 player from the class.

Then, as a second add on, you could do an adjusted one specifically for the Suns.

You seem to like almost everyone to some extent so I'd be interested in seeing a big board.

Very true man! I do really like a lot of attributes and skillsets of many different prospects in this draft. So that might definitely be an interesting idea. If it truly interests you, I'll look into it k.

Yes, it does, many posters have their big boards on the draft board in the mock draft section...some do mocks, others big boards...but you probably do as much research as anyone. viewforum.php?f=38

[Ghost of Kleine]

To each their own eh Frank.

How about posting your overall big board, not for the Suns, but overall, for say, top 30. It would be interesting to compare that to first and second rookie teams.

You could also note which you think are long term plays after lising a player, who you wouldn't expect to make the all rookie team but long term would be a top 10 player from the class.

Then, as a second add on, you could do an adjusted one specifically for the Suns.

You seem to like almost everyone to some extent so I'd be interested in seeing a big board.

So just for clarification. You're interested in my personal big board, As in wherein I personally would rate the prospects in terms of value,draft rank etc, OR my big board in terms of where i expect them to go ( numerically) on draft night?

[cberry78]

To each their own eh Frank.

How about posting your overall big board, not for the Suns, but overall, for say, top 30. It would be interesting to compare that to first and second rookie teams.

You could also note which you think are long term plays after lising a player, who you wouldn't expect to make the all rookie team but long term would be a top 10 player from the class.

Then, as a second add on, you could do an adjusted one specifically for the Suns.

You seem to like almost everyone to some extent so I'd be interested in seeing a big board.

So just for clarification. You're interested in my personal big board, As in wherein I personally would rate the prospects in terms of value,draft rank etc, OR my big board in terms of where i expect them to go ( numerically) on draft night?

Personally, I'd like to see both.

It's pretty obvious that you do your research, and while you may look at these prospects with rose-colored glasses (especially when it comes to the Suns), you haven't been extremely "off" in your evaluations and break downs of the prospects.

[bwgood77]

To each their own eh Frank.

How about posting your overall big board, not for the Suns, but overall, for say, top 30. It would be interesting to compare that to first and second rookie teams.

You could also note which you think are long term plays after lising a player, who you wouldn't expect to make the all rookie team but long term would be a top 10 player from the class.

Then, as a second add on, you could do an adjusted one specifically for the Suns.

You seem to like almost everyone to some extent so I'd be interested in seeing a big board.

So just for clarification. You're interested in my personal big board, As in wherein I personally would rate the prospects in terms of value,draft rank etc, OR my big board in terms of where i expect them to go ( numerically) on draft night?

Not where you expect them to go....I think you've posted that a number of times.

but,

How you rank them as overall talent (A BIG BOARD) not thinking about the Suns. Then where you rank them if you were drafting for the Suns (A SUNS BIG BOARD).

[Ghost of Kleine]

How about posting your overall big board, not for the Suns, but overall, for say, top 30. It would be interesting to compare that to first and second rookie teams.

You could also note which you think are long term plays after lising a player, who you wouldn't expect to make the all rookie team but long term would be a top 10 player from the class.

Then, as a second add on, you could do an adjusted one specifically for the Suns.

You seem to like almost everyone to some extent so I'd be interested in seeing a big board.

So just for clarification. You're interested in my personal big board, As in wherein I personally would rate the prospects in terms of value,draft rank etc, OR my big board in terms of where i expect them to go ( numerically) on draft night?

Personally, I'd like to see both.

It's pretty obvious that you do your research, and while you may look at these prospects with rose-colored glasses (especially when it comes to the Suns), you haven't been extremely "off" in your evaluations and break downs of the prospects.

Thanks man!

[Ghost of Kleine]

How about posting your overall big board, not for the Suns, but overall, for say, top 30. It would be interesting to compare that to first and second rookie teams.

You could also note which you think are long term plays after lising a player, who you wouldn't expect to make the all rookie team but long term would be a top 10 player from the class.

Then, as a second add on, you could do an adjusted one specifically for the Suns.

You seem to like almost everyone to some extent so I'd be interested in seeing a big board.

So just for clarification. You're interested in my personal big board, As in wherein I personally would rate the prospects in terms of value,draft rank etc, OR my big board in terms of where i expect them to go ( numerically) on draft night?

Not where you expect them to go....I think you've posted that a number of times.

but,

How you rank them as overall talent (A BIG BOARD) not thinking about the Suns. Then where you rank them if you were drafting for the Suns (A SUNS BIG BOARD).

Ok, Will do

[bwgood77]

So just for clarification. You're interested in my personal big board, As in wherein I personally would rate the prospects in terms of value,draft rank etc, OR my big board in terms of where i expect them to go ( numerically) on draft night?

Not where you expect them to go....I think you've posted that a number of times.

but,

How you rank them as overall talent (A BIG BOARD) not thinking about the Suns. Then where you rank them if you were drafting for the Suns (A SUNS BIG BOARD).

Ok, Will do

btw, where you expect them to go is not a big board, it's a mock draft.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Not where you expect them to go....I think you've posted that a number of times.

but,

How you rank them as overall talent (A BIG BOARD) not thinking about the Suns. Then where you rank them if you were drafting for the Suns (A SUNS BIG BOARD).

Ok, Will do

btw, where you expect them to go is not a big board, it's a mock draft.

Yep! Good point. I'll get on it.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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[Kerrsed]

Man, i was going to post my own Big Board, but damn its hard to figure out what exactly the parameters are to constitute a "Big Board". I mean is it just based on talent? Like talent where they stand right now or expectations in the league? If its the later, then you have to figure in things such as how many years do you go forward before you have a cut-off? Like there are older guys that will make an impact in year one....but others that will take years to develop to reach that talent that could very well surpass those older players. And then there is also the issue of NBA teams. A guy like Riller could come in and help a team like us ASAP and thus inflating his stock while if he went to a more veteran playoff team he would be burried on the bench and look like an utter bust. Reminds me of the Rondo situation. We drafted him and sent him to Boston right away. In Boston he got to start and develop right away, and that helped mold him into the player he became. If we kept him he wouldnt have turned out into nearly the player he became. He would have been stuck on the bench behind Nash and Banks lucky to get 2 minutes every 5 games or so. We also know that his defense wouldnt have developed into anything resembling what it became.

SO yeah, im lost when it comes to a Big Board and how to read/do it. Is it ranked as who we think the best players are at the time of the draft or the first NBA season or by the end of their rookie contract or even overall NBA career? How much do we factor in "Potential"?

[Kerrsed]

1.Ball - Very Ben Simmons like. If Simmons can succeed in the NBA, Melo can too.
2.Okongwu - His defensive versatility is what will keep him employed and at a solid level.
3.Toppin - Amare 2.0. Lacks defense, but can score at will. Teams always need a guy that can score.
4.Hayes - More potential than current skills. End up with the Spurs and be their Parker/Ginobilli crossover.
5.Wiseman - Old school big man that can get you 20/10 a night in the paint.
6.Haliburton - High IQ PG. Can do EVERYTHING, but none of it at a high level.
7.Avdija - Great passing forward. Could be a point forward.
8.Edwards - Scoring. I think he is kinda undersized and will have issues in the league.
9.Vassell - 3&D player that every team needs off the bench.
10.Nesmith - Best shooter in the draft.

11.Anthony - Top HS prospect, solid all around game. Lackluster in college after injury.
12.Smith - High IQ player. Solid offense and solid defense. Downside is he plays at a slower speed than everyone else.
13.Bey - Tyler, 3&d player, reminds me of Ariza (When he was good)
14.Lewis Jr. - Solid defender, plays at one speed;FAST! Needs to work on his shooting.
15.Reed - Solid defender, good offense in the paint. Reminds me a bit of early Paul Millsap (Before he shot mid range).
16.Maxey - SG from Kentucky. Thats all that needs to be said.
17.Riller - Looks good all around, but dont know how it will translate against much much much better opponents.
18.Okoro - Solid defender with limited offense.
19.Williams - Good offense, good defense, but i question his basketball IQ. Very very turnover prone.
20.Pokuševski - Has great all around skills and is full of potential, but stick thin. Will need to pack on a ton of muscle.

21.Bane - High IQ wing. Good all around game, but lacks athleticism. Plays on skill and heart alone.
22.Green - Under preforming 3&D player. Good size and length
23.Bey#2 - 3&D player. Good size and length
24.Carey Jr. - Kanter 2.0. Classic C. 15/10 player, with low basketball IQ and bad defense.
25.Stewart - Good size PF with a motor.
26.Hampton - Highly hyped prospect from HS, didnt show much against weak competition in Australia.
27.Mannion - A lesser TJ McConnell. Good for off the bench minutes every couple of games.
28.Perry - Solid offensive PF.
29.Maledon - Just here for potential.
30.Oturu -20/10 offensive C. Has been working on adding range. Needs to also work on speed as he is slooooooow.

[bwgood77]

Man, i was going to post my own Big Board, but damn its hard to figure out what exactly the parameters are to constitute a "Big Board". I mean is it just based on talent? Like talent where they stand right now or expectations in the league? If its the later, then you have to figure in things such as how many years do you go forward before you have a cut-off? Like there are older guys that will make an impact in year one....but others that will take years to develop to reach that talent that could very well surpass those older players. And then there is also the issue of NBA teams. A guy like Riller could come in and help a team like us ASAP and thus inflating his stock while if he went to a more veteran playoff team he would be burried on the bench and look like an utter bust. Reminds me of the Rondo situation. We drafted him and sent him to Boston right away. In Boston he got to start and develop right away, and that helped mold him into the player he became. If we kept him he wouldnt have turned out into nearly the player he became. He would have been stuck on the bench behind Nash and Banks lucky to get 2 minutes every 5 games or so. We also know that his defense wouldnt have developed into anything resembling what it became.

SO yeah, im lost when it comes to a Big Board and how to read/do it. Is it ranked as who we think the best players are at the time of the draft or the first NBA season or by the end of their rookie contract or even overall NBA career? How much do we factor in "Potential"?

I think it's a combination. I would say first and foremost talent in the long run, but not so much years from now..it should start to be realized within 2-3 years, before you make decisions...and strides showing early. But also balance that somewhat with immediate contribution, sure floors vs the high floor but more potential busts..which players might be worth the risk? Is a Sekou Doumbaya worth more at draft time than a Cam Johnson because of the higher potential upside but bigger bust potential? Things like that.

This is why I have people responding to questions about who to draft by answering BPA because theoretically BPA indicates BPA now, but most draft guys would probably lean towards BPA long term with a relatively high floor, though maybe not as high as some, with maybe not as much talent now, like a 1 year guy vs a 3 or 4 year guy (few 3-4 year guys are usually taken high) but a lot higher upside. This may be changing somewhat with guys like Curry, McCollum, Draymond being really successful, but not to a large degree because people still put high stock in HS rankings, thus a guy like Reddish is hard to let go of for someone who proved themselves more in college...or Barrett even.

[Kerrsed]

I think it's a combination. I would say first and foremost talent in the long run, but not so much years from now..it should start to be realized within 2-3 years, before you make decisions...and strides showing early. But also balance that somewhat with immediate contribution, sure floors vs the high floor but more potential busts..which players might be worth the risk? Is a Sekou Doumbaya worth more at draft time than a Cam Johnson because of the higher potential upside but bigger bust potential? Things like that.

This is why I have people responding to questions about who to draft by answering BPA because theoretically BPA indicates BPA now, but most draft guys would probably lean towards BPA long term with a relatively high floor, though maybe not as high as some, with maybe not as much talent now, like a 1 year guy vs a 3 or 4 year guy (few 3-4 year guys are usually taken high) but a lot higher upside. This may be changing somewhat with guys like Curry, McCollum, Draymond being really successful, but not to a large degree because people still put high stock in HS rankings, thus a guy like Reddish is hard to let go of for someone who proved themselves more in college...or Barrett even.

Well i did mine on a combo of those. I tried to include a few words as to why i put them where i did and why i think they could make it with a team beyond a few seasons. Early on you got the guys with the best highest skills. A few guys based off of potential sprinkled in, followed up by the most common traits that all NBA teams need (3&D wings). Towards the end i started going with more big guys, most who have one or two solid skillsets (Like scoring and rebounding). Those are the end of the bench bigs that always seem to stick around. I also tried to look at size and wingspan being a factor. Im sorry, but seeing guys under 6"3 that play SG or PG with no passing skills just wont cut it. Look at IT. Solid shooter, solid playmaker, but his size makes him almost unusable in the league, so if he cant make it with his "Better than most" skillset, i highly doubt any of these other small guys will.

And also i just dont see what exactly makes Edwards the top guy in the draft. Ive watched a bunch of film and i just dont see it. I think he is going to bust and bust hard. As a 6"5 SG, he is kinda small. Sure he can get 20 points a game, but his percentages are pretty bad and he forces up some really bad shots. His defense is rather lackluster as well. I just dont see the hype. I mean people give Ball crap for being a poor shooter, but Edwards isnt that much better (38%&25% vs 40%&30%). At least Ball has other skills to contribute like his great playmaking/passing and solid defense.

[Ghost of Kleine]

1.Ball - Very Ben Simmons like. If Simmons can succeed in the NBA, Melo can too.
2.Okongwu - His defensive versatility is what will keep him employed and at a solid level.
3.Toppin - Amare 2.0. Lacks defense, but can score at will. Teams always need a guy that can score.
4.Hayes - More potential than current skills. End up with the Spurs and be their Parker/Ginobilli crossover.
5.Wiseman - Old school big man that can get you 20/10 a night in the paint.
6.Haliburton - High IQ PG. Can do EVERYTHING, but none of it at a high level.
7.Avdija - Great passing forward. Could be a point forward.
8.Edwards - Scoring. I think he is kinda undersized and will have issues in the league.
9.Vassell - 3&D player that every team needs off the bench.
10.Nesmith - Best shooter in the draft.

11.Anthony - Top HS prospect, solid all around game. Lackluster in college after injury.
12.Smith - High IQ player. Solid offense and solid defense. Downside is he plays at a slower speed than everyone else.
13.Bey - Tyler, 3&d player, reminds me of Ariza (When he was good)
14.Lewis Jr. - Solid defender, plays at one speed;FAST! Needs to work on his shooting.
15.Reed - Solid defender, good offense in the paint. Reminds me a bit of early Paul Millsap (Before he shot mid range).
16.Maxey - SG from Kentucky. Thats all that needs to be said.
17.Riller - Looks good all around, but dont know how it will translate against much much much better opponents.
18.Okoro - Solid defender with limited offense.
19.Williams - Good offense, good defense, but i question his basketball IQ. Very very turnover prone.
20.Pokuševski - Has great all around skills and is full of potential, but stick thin. Will need to pack on a ton of muscle.

21.Hampton - Highly hyped prospect from HS, didnt show much against weak competition in Australia.
22.Green - Under preforming 3&D player. Good size and length
23.Bey#2 - 3&D player. Good size and length
24.Carey Jr. - Kanter 2.0. Classic C. 15/10 player, with low basketball IQ and bad defense.
25.Stewart - Good size PF with a motor.
26.Bane - High IQ wing. Good all around game, but lacks athleticism. Plays on skill and heart alone.
27.Mannion - A lesser TJ McConnell. Good for off the bench minutes every couple of games.
28.Perry - Solid offensive PF.
29.Maledon - Just here for potential.
30.Oturu -20/10 offensive C. Has been working on adding range. Needs to also work on speed as he is slooooooow.

Great big board man!
As always, Your presentation and insights are top notch! I really look forward to seeing your mock as well.

[Kerrsed]

Great big board man!
As always, Your presentation and insights are top notch! I really look forward to seeing your mock as well.

The mock is going to be difficult this year because i am expecting a lot more movement this year than in years past. I dont think any team is absolutely in love with any of the players, so they will be willing to move up or down easier. Im guessing there will be easily at least 5 picks in the lotto moved to different teams.

[Saberestar]

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