Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continues

[Scutt]

Barring any major injury I think we have a shot at the 2nd Round in the playoffs. We're a good defensive team when healthy who gives up 2nd chance points and points in the paint against bigger teams.
In terms of my west coast rankings I think it still goes.
1 Spurs
2 Portland
3 OKC
4 LAC
5 Phx
6 GSW
7 Mem
8 Dal
Wild Card team NO Pelicans

Portland 2nd?

I'd have to bet something more like

1. OKC (missed westbrook for awhile last year and still nearly had best record)
2. SA
3. MEM
4. LAC
5. DAL
6. PHX
7. POR
8. GS

Houston barely misses, and New Orleans fairly close.

Both of you really think Houston isn't going to make the playoff's? I know they lost Chandler Parsons, but like them or not, Howard and Harden are some of the best at their positions. I do agree that the Pelicans are a wild card, and I think they might get that last spot with them pairing Asik with Davis. I see the Suns and Dallas as the ones on the outside looking in, I hope I am wrong, but the West is just so stacked. Dragic, Green, and Markieff should all be looking to up their games to get paid, but I am not sure how team chemistry will play out with so many guards and I am still not convinced we didn't highly overachieve to get those 48 wins last year. My guess is something like this:

1. OKC
2. SA
3. LAC
4. HOUS
5. MEM
6. POR
7. GS
8. NO or possibly DAL or PHX

[RunDogGun]

I don't know about Houston. IT sure seemed as if they can't help but blame each other and fight in the game. So while they maybe great at their positions, I could see friction and chemistry issues hindering their games.

[JTrain]

...Plumlee is close to his ceiling. Nothing against him he's still a lot better then we thought when the Scola trade happened.

I'm more optimistic about Plumlee. Even though he's 25, last year was pretty much his rookie season. Bigs can take 3-4 years to develop into much and his athleticism is a great start. I think he will make strides this year.

[letsgosuns]

Dallas was the only team that pushed San Antonio to 7 games in the playoffs last season. They shuffled their team around this offseason and added Tyson Chandler and Chandler Parsons. I see them as a top 3 or 4 team in the West if they are healthy. I think the two biggest candidates for taking a step back are the Trailblazers and Rockets. I would rank the teams in the West the following way:

Spurs
Thunder
Clippers
Mavericks
Grizzlies
Warriors
Suns
Rockets

The Trailblazers may have made the second round of the playoffs, but they struggled mightily the second half of last year beating playoff teams. Then the Rockets lost Parsons which I think is a big blow to their team. They basically have Harden (who is amazing), Howard, and a bunch of role players. It is very difficult to win games relying on only two players. I do think it is very possible that there could be a Western team with 50 wins next season that misses the playoffs. If that happens, the league really has to think about adjusting the conferences. It is difficult to have a team like the Suns finishing 9th in West last year with the same record as the 3rd seed in the East.

[bwgood77]

Barring any major injury I think we have a shot at the 2nd Round in the playoffs. We're a good defensive team when healthy who gives up 2nd chance points and points in the paint against bigger teams.
In terms of my west coast rankings I think it still goes.
1 Spurs
2 Portland
3 OKC
4 LAC
5 Phx
6 GSW
7 Mem
8 Dal
Wild Card team NO Pelicans

Portland 2nd?

I'd have to bet something more like

1. OKC (missed westbrook for awhile last year and still nearly had best record)
2. SA
3. MEM
4. LAC
5. DAL
6. PHX
7. POR
8. GS

Houston barely misses, and New Orleans fairly close.

Both of you really think Houston isn't going to make the playoff's? I know they lost Chandler Parsons, but like them or not, Howard and Harden are some of the best at their positions. I do agree that the Pelicans are a wild card, and I think they might get that last spot with them pairing Asik with Davis. I see the Suns and Dallas as the ones on the outside looking in, I hope I am wrong, but the West is just so stacked. Dragic, Green, and Markieff should all be looking to up their games to get paid, but I am not sure how team chemistry will play out with so many guards and I am still not convinced we didn't highly overachieve to get those 48 wins last year. My guess is something like this:

1. OKC
2. SA
3. LAC
4. HOUS
5. MEM
6. POR
7. GS
8. NO or possibly DAL or PHX

Well, I think Phx could be on the outside looking in as well, but I decided to put them in there this year. I think after the top 4, it is neck and neck for 5-9 and possibly NO.

Houston was healthy all year last year, and they lost Parsons and Asik. I just don't think they have any depth. I think Memphis is just about as good as anyone when healthy, and I think Dallas will be improved quite a bit...I think Carlisle is a phenomenal coach and with the addition of Tyson Chandler and Parsons I don't see how they don't get better. They lost Calderon, but I think between Felton and Nelson, one of those guys will be servicable.

GS is a question mark because of their frontcourt. Portland we seemed to compete well against...I'm just not sure about them...after they caught fire at the beginning of the year, they really came close to falling near the bottom of the playoff race, before winning a few at the end.

I think Houston, Portland, GS and Phx will be pretty close. Phx could easily be 9th, but I could see them ahead of those teams too.

Much of this will depend on injuries as usual. They killed a bunch of teams last year. Portland, Houston and Dallas were relatively healthy, but Dallas probably improved their squad the most out of all the teams. LAC and GS both missed guys for a few weeks (Iggy and Paul). Memphis, OKC and us had major injuries, so I think if these three teams are healthy, they SHOULD improve the most on their record, along with Dallas who had the biggest upgrades to roster.

[RunDogGun]

...Plumlee is close to his ceiling. Nothing against him he's still a lot better then we thought when the Scola trade happened.

I'm more optimistic about Plumlee. Even though he's 25, last year was pretty much his rookie season. Bigs can take 3-4 years to develop into much and his athleticism is a great start. I think he will make strides this year.

He looked pretty bad in the SL save maybe one game, so I really hope he has worked on his game since then.

[batsmasher]

He looked pretty bad in the SL save maybe one game, so I really hope he has worked on his game since then.

I thought he played quite well in SL. He was a significant difference on defense. That jump hook is going to take time.

[Sunsdeuce]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/mookmorris2/status/515196394286489600[/tweet]

[drewsprocket]

Barring any major injury I think we have a shot at the 2nd Round in the playoffs. We're a good defensive team when healthy who gives up 2nd chance points and points in the paint against bigger teams.
In terms of my west coast rankings I think it still goes.
1 Spurs
2 Portland
3 OKC
4 LAC
5 Phx
6 GSW
7 Mem
8 Dal
Wild Card team NO Pelicans

Portland 2nd?

I'd have to bet something more like

1. OKC (missed westbrook for awhile last year and still nearly had best record)
2. SA
3. MEM
4. LAC
5. DAL
6. PHX
7. POR
8. GS

Houston barely misses, and New Orleans fairly close.

Both of you really think Houston isn't going to make the playoff's? I know they lost Chandler Parsons, but like them or not, Howard and Harden are some of the best at their positions. I do agree that the Pelicans are a wild card, and I think they might get that last spot with them pairing Asik with Davis. I see the Suns and Dallas as the ones on the outside looking in, I hope I am wrong, but the West is just so stacked. Dragic, Green, and Markieff should all be looking to up their games to get paid, but I am not sure how team chemistry will play out with so many guards and I am still not convinced we didn't highly overachieve to get those 48 wins last year. My guess is something like this:

1. OKC
2. SA
3. LAC
4. HOUS
5. MEM
6. POR
7. GS
8. NO or possibly DAL or PHX

I think you're right about Houston on second thought but I'm not sold on them going past 5th seed tops. I love harden but he's over rated. Portland I see making the biggest leap this year.

[JDLAW]

It has already started - the insane Goran Dragic trades:


Post#1 Ily and Dragic to Rox
Today 2:58 pm by Xman
Houston goes all in to round out its roster.
Houston has a star center and shooting guard. Ariza at SF seems like a solid fit and decent starter - not great by any means. Beverly at PG is a little weak but not devastating. PF has not been good and the best PF (TJones) does not well in the system.

Milwaukee has been rumored as willing to give up a couple of 2nds if someone will take Ily and his contract. Ily is a negative value player but would fit fairly well in Houston.
Dragic has just had his best season but may be the odd man out in PHX if they want to get what they van before he its the market (how much $$ is PHX willing to spend at pg?).

If PHX decided it was not going to pay Dragic and wanted to get value now, I think the best offers would come from Dallas and Detroit. Most other teams either have point guards, no trade bait or no interest.
If Detroit is willing to over Monroe and a first, then that is probably the best deal available. A bad contract and a couple of first would not match what Rox would offer. Same goes for Dallas - 2 first, JNelson and Wright is not as much as possible Rox offer.

Rox - send Canaan, TE, 2017 1st, NO 1st in 2015, 2 2nds in 2015
- get Dragic, Ily
Milw - sends Ily, 2 2nd rounders in 2015
- gets JTerry, Canaan
PHX - sends Dragic
- gets TE, four 2nds in 2015, NO 1st in 2015, Hou 1st in 2017

If PHX really wanted Capela or some other Rox player, they could be added in fairly easily.

Milwaukee: dumps a bad contract fairly cheaply.
Hou: adds a couple of players for its tradeable assets. Ily is overpaid but should fit well. Dragic would really round out the offense - but would require a serious overpay in the offseason.
PHX: This would leave PHX with up to 4 firsts next year and five seconds - that gives you some control over the draft. Take into account that Boston is also hording picks and the picks have even more value.

This deal would leave Houston with:
pg: Dragic, Beverly, Ish Smith
sg: Harden, TDaniels
sf: Ariza, FGarcia, Papanikolaou, Covington
pf: Ily, TJones, JAdrien, Motie, JPowell, TBlack
c: Howard, JDorsey, Capela

PHX could also ask for and get Beverly, Papanikolaou, TJones, Motie and Capela since they are all young with potential. That would be the limit of Rox trade assets.

That would be an expensive starting 5: 7.5, 14.7, 8.6, 7.9, 21.4 = 60.4 this year. figure about 10 more next year just because of dragic and contract increases. Luxury tax time.

I know a lot of people will say Dragic will not be dealt - and they are probably right - I am think 60-70% odds he stays. BUT, if PHX is not willing to pay him max then they should get value for him now.
Xman
Rookie
Posts: 1,142
And1: 20
Joined: Jun 9, 2005

[Sunsdeuce]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ericsports/status/515296728644194305[/tweet]

[carey]

It has already started - the insane Goran Dragic trades:

Rox - send Canaan, TE, 2017 1st, NO 1st in 2015, 2 2nds in 2015
- get Dragic, Ily
Milw - sends Ily, 2 2nd rounders in 2015
- gets JTerry, Canaan
PHX - sends Dragic
- gets TE, four 2nds in 2015, NO 1st in 2015, Hou 1st in 2017

Oh, man. When is the last time you saw such a craptastic haul for a 3rd team All-NBA player. Gross.

[i505]

Bledsoe going back to #12?

[Nando88]

Lol how old is that pic. Two baby dragons lol


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[wheezy]

It has already started - the insane Goran Dragic trades:

Rox - send Canaan, TE, 2017 1st, NO 1st in 2015, 2 2nds in 2015
- get Dragic, Ily
Milw - sends Ily, 2 2nd rounders in 2015
- gets JTerry, Canaan
PHX - sends Dragic
- gets TE, four 2nds in 2015, NO 1st in 2015, Hou 1st in 2017

Oh, man. When is the last time you saw such a craptastic haul for a 3rd team All-NBA player. Gross.

Easily one of the worst fake trades I've ever seen.

[Sunsdeuce]

Lol how old is that pic. Two baby dragons lol


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

Prob pretty old.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[Sunsdeuce]

It has already started - the insane Goran Dragic trades:

Rox - send Canaan, TE, 2017 1st, NO 1st in 2015, 2 2nds in 2015
- get Dragic, Ily
Milw - sends Ily, 2 2nd rounders in 2015
- gets JTerry, Canaan
PHX - sends Dragic
- gets TE, four 2nds in 2015, NO 1st in 2015, Hou 1st in 2017

Oh, man. When is the last time you saw such a craptastic haul for a 3rd team All-NBA player. Gross.

Easily one of the worst fake trades I've ever seen.

Law, my friend, you have to know that's horrible for the suns. First off, dragic should be the last player on anyone's mind to trade. I would venture to say dragic is nearly untouchable. Second, any trade where dragic is involved has to result in the suns receiving an All-star player.


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[JDLAW]

Oh, man. When is the last time you saw such a craptastic haul for a 3rd team All-NBA player. Gross.

Easily one of the worst fake trades I've ever seen.

Law, my friend, you have to know that's horrible for the suns. First off, dragic should be the last player on anyone's mind to trade. I would venture to say dragic is nearly untouchable. Second, any trade where dragic is involved has to result in the suns receiving an All-star player.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

I did not put this out there - it comes from the trade board. My comments were about the same as Carey's. It is awful.

[lilfishi22]

It has already started - the insane Goran Dragic trades:

Rox - send Canaan, TE, 2017 1st, NO 1st in 2015, 2 2nds in 2015
- get Dragic, Ily
Milw - sends Ily, 2 2nd rounders in 2015
- gets JTerry, Canaan
PHX - sends Dragic
- gets TE, four 2nds in 2015, NO 1st in 2015, Hou 1st in 2017

Mate that is quality lulz for my Friday morning

[Christine-In-AZ]

It has already started - the insane Goran Dragic trades:


Post#1 Ily and Dragic to Rox
Today 2:58 pm by Xman
Houston goes all in to round out its roster.
Houston has a star center and shooting guard. Ariza at SF seems like a solid fit and decent starter - not great by any means. Beverly at PG is a little weak but not devastating. PF has not been good and the best PF (TJones) does not well in the system.

Milwaukee has been rumored as willing to give up a couple of 2nds if someone will take Ily and his contract. Ily is a negative value player but would fit fairly well in Houston.
Dragic has just had his best season but may be the odd man out in PHX if they want to get what they van before he its the market (how much $$ is PHX willing to spend at pg?).

If PHX decided it was not going to pay Dragic and wanted to get value now, I think the best offers would come from Dallas and Detroit. Most other teams either have point guards, no trade bait or no interest.
If Detroit is willing to over Monroe and a first, then that is probably the best deal available. A bad contract and a couple of first would not match what Rox would offer. Same goes for Dallas - 2 first, JNelson and Wright is not as much as possible Rox offer.

Rox - send Canaan, TE, 2017 1st, NO 1st in 2015, 2 2nds in 2015
- get Dragic, Ily
Milw - sends Ily, 2 2nd rounders in 2015
- gets JTerry, Canaan
PHX - sends Dragic
- gets TE, four 2nds in 2015, NO 1st in 2015, Hou 1st in 2017

If PHX really wanted Capela or some other Rox player, they could be added in fairly easily.

Milwaukee: dumps a bad contract fairly cheaply.
Hou: adds a couple of players for its tradeable assets. Ily is overpaid but should fit well. Dragic would really round out the offense - but would require a serious overpay in the offseason.
PHX: This would leave PHX with up to 4 firsts next year and five seconds - that gives you some control over the draft. Take into account that Boston is also hording picks and the picks have even more value.

This deal would leave Houston with:
pg: Dragic, Beverly, Ish Smith
sg: Harden, TDaniels
sf: Ariza, FGarcia, Papanikolaou, Covington
pf: Ily, TJones, JAdrien, Motie, JPowell, TBlack
c: Howard, JDorsey, Capela

PHX could also ask for and get Beverly, Papanikolaou, TJones, Motie and Capela since they are all young with potential. That would be the limit of Rox trade assets.

That would be an expensive starting 5: 7.5, 14.7, 8.6, 7.9, 21.4 = 60.4 this year. figure about 10 more next year just because of dragic and contract increases. Luxury tax time.

I know a lot of people will say Dragic will not be dealt - and they are probably right - I am think 60-70% odds he stays. BUT, if PHX is not willing to pay him max then they should get value for him now.
Xman
Rookie
Posts: 1,142
And1: 20
Joined: Jun 9, 2005

If you're pulling these trade thoughts from "Clutchfans" forum 75% of the contributers there are completely delusional. Facts or any care of NBA realities are simply ignored so they can continue mentally masterbating.