2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 3 - Trade season begins

[bwgood77]

You nailed it imo. Good post.

The rest of the league figured out their "long bois" gimmick and just started forcing them to hit 3s...which they can't do. FVV sucking has left them with a massive gap in shooting.

Siakam is the most obvious target as he's the oldest and the most valuable. They need shooting and a true 5.

An Ayton+CamJo for Siakim+Koloko deal makes a ton of sense for both teams. Maybe we add in a pick this year to cover the gap but I think that's a pretty even deal. Either way the 2 teams seem like they can fix each other's problems nicely.

That's not a bad deal for them, but there is no indication they would trade him, and Siakam likes it there. Ayton and Cam may not. Cam is injury prone.

Is Ayton's contract better than Siakam's next one?

Anyway, any trade "rumors" with them are those speculative ones that say "other teams are monitoring their situation". I wonder how we'd address rebounding but if we put him at PF we should be ok with a decent C.

But IF they move him, right now would be the time, with 1.5 years left on contract.

There is, of course the risk that he would leave in 2024 when he is a FA. Most guys coming off their 2nd contracts want to test the FA market.

I think it might be more likely Toronto is a buyer, trading OG, Trent and a pick for someone like Capela, and running something like FVV, Barnes, Porter, Siakam, Capela. That's just kind of a first thought of the type of guy, or they pry a big from Orlando for less or a guy like Myles Turner for OG and Koloko or something.

OG had wanted out and there apparently has been friction with Trent.

Raptors problem is that they have no real PG, no real SG and no real C. FVV is 6'1 but really he is a SG (in a small PG's body). GTJ is also a small (and not athletic) SG getting paid too much (18 mill/yr?). No real C is also a bit of an issue on D, but they negate some of that with the swarming 6'7 - 6'8 - 6'9 guys (basically everybody on their roster). They would be better even if they got back a bit less talent for some of their guys, they need players who fit their positions of need somehow.

Siakam averages 7 apg and FVV averages over 6. FVV is more of a PG than many guys in the PG spot. Siakam is a point center, like Jokic.

Siakam has a 7'3 wingspan and 9ft standing reach. He can definitely play C and it's their best lineup but they can also play others...between Boucher, Achiuwa and Koloko, they play 60 mpg...so really Siakam doesn't play C all or even most of the time. Depends on the matchup.

[oddity]

Does anyone know if Gary Trent Jr. is available? I think he'd be a perfect addition to our bench next to D Lee and Payne. He'd be like an extreme upgrade from Shamet, and he can actually take it himself sometimes. I hear he's looking to test the waters in free agency with the Raptors struggling, and they seem to be hesitant on giving him the money he wants. I'd definitely look into that if I were JJ

[Slim Charless]

That's not a bad deal for them, but there is no indication they would trade him, and Siakam likes it there. Ayton and Cam may not. Cam is injury prone.

Is Ayton's contract better than Siakam's next one?

Anyway, any trade "rumors" with them are those speculative ones that say "other teams are monitoring their situation". I wonder how we'd address rebounding but if we put him at PF we should be ok with a decent C.

But IF they move him, right now would be the time, with 1.5 years left on contract.

There is, of course the risk that he would leave in 2024 when he is a FA. Most guys coming off their 2nd contracts want to test the FA market.

I think it might be more likely Toronto is a buyer, trading OG, Trent and a pick for someone like Capela, and running something like FVV, Barnes, Porter, Siakam, Capela. That's just kind of a first thought of the type of guy, or they pry a big from Orlando for less or a guy like Myles Turner for OG and Koloko or something.

OG had wanted out and there apparently has been friction with Trent.

Raptors problem is that they have no real PG, no real SG and no real C. FVV is 6'1 but really he is a SG (in a small PG's body). GTJ is also a small (and not athletic) SG getting paid too much (18 mill/yr?). No real C is also a bit of an issue on D, but they negate some of that with the swarming 6'7 - 6'8 - 6'9 guys (basically everybody on their roster). They would be better even if they got back a bit less talent for some of their guys, they need players who fit their positions of need somehow.

Siakam averages 7 apg and FVV averages over 6. FVV is more of a PG than many guys in the PG spot. Siakam is a point center, like Jokic.

Siakam has a 7'3 wingspan and 9ft standing reach. He can definitely play C and it's their best lineup but they can also play others...between Boucher, Achiuwa and Koloko, they play 60 mpg...so really Siakam doesn't play C all or even most of the time. Depends on the matchup.

Send that post to Mat and JJ....they need to get on that by the tradeline. That, or have a sit down with Monty and explain to him what Ayton can do with more touches.

Either way something needs to happen here and soon if we wanna win. A new, young, loaded owner winning a chip this year would make us the most popular FA destination by far if we can make it happen.

[bwgood77]

Raptors problem is that they have no real PG, no real SG and no real C. FVV is 6'1 but really he is a SG (in a small PG's body). GTJ is also a small (and not athletic) SG getting paid too much (18 mill/yr?). No real C is also a bit of an issue on D, but they negate some of that with the swarming 6'7 - 6'8 - 6'9 guys (basically everybody on their roster). They would be better even if they got back a bit less talent for some of their guys, they need players who fit their positions of need somehow.

Siakam averages 7 apg and FVV averages over 6. FVV is more of a PG than many guys in the PG spot. Siakam is a point center, like Jokic.

Siakam has a 7'3 wingspan and 9ft standing reach. He can definitely play C and it's their best lineup but they can also play others...between Boucher, Achiuwa and Koloko, they play 60 mpg...so really Siakam doesn't play C all or even most of the time. Depends on the matchup.

Send that post to Mat and JJ....they need to get on that by the tradeline. That, or have a sit down with Monty and explain to him what Ayton can do with more touches.

Either way something needs to happen here and soon if we wanna win. A new, young, loaded owner winning a chip this year would make us the most popular FA destination by far if we can make it happen.

We have as many wins as anyone in the west (WITHOUT CROWDER, CAM FOR MOST OF SEASON, PAUL FOR MOST OF SEASON, AYTON FOR 4+ GAMES, BOOKER FOR 2 PLUS A TERRIBLE 4 GAME SLUMP).

Given all that, I like where we are, ESPECIALLY if Paul ISN'T quite as washed as we were thinking and just needed a couple weeks to get his legs under him and his conditioning back after not being able to keep up conditioning with the heel.

Cam will come back and we will add something for Crowder.

I like that we have a new rich owner so we can likely now trade for a longer term contract or a guy we could re-sign like Kuzma AND re-sign Cam.

[bwgood77]

Does anyone know if Gary Trent Jr. is available? I think he'd be a perfect addition to our bench next to D Lee and Payne. He'd be like an extreme upgrade from Shamet, and he can actually take it himself sometimes. I hear he's looking to test the waters in free agency with the Raptors struggling, and they seem to be hesitant on giving him the money he wants. I'd definitely look into that if I were JJ

I think he might be, but for someone like a Cam, not someone like a Shamet and late first rounder...or Jae and 1st.

[oddity]

Does anyone know if Gary Trent Jr. is available? I think he'd be a perfect addition to our bench next to D Lee and Payne. He'd be like an extreme upgrade from Shamet, and he can actually take it himself sometimes. I hear he's looking to test the waters in free agency with the Raptors struggling, and they seem to be hesitant on giving him the money he wants. I'd definitely look into that if I were JJ

I think he might be, but for someone like a Cam, not someone like a Shamet and late first rounder...or Jae and 1st.

Yeah that might be too high a price to pay. He'd sure be fantastic here tho

[sunsbg]

It should be exciting for the players to know big things are coming with the new owner. Maybe all will try even harder now. If they spend big on players at the deadline imagine how cool it would be to win a title at first year of the new ownership or at least make some noise in the playoffs like a year ago.

[BobbieL]

It should be exciting for the players to know big things are coming with the new owner. Maybe all will try even harder now. If they spend big on players at the deadline imagine how cool it would be to win a title at first year of the new ownership or at least make some noise in the playoffs like a year ago.

I just hope he is financially consistent. Meaning don't trade away draft picks to sign Marcus Banks.

Sarver was so wishy washy

It would be nice if this guy is willing to pay the lux tax - big time

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

[sunsbg]

It should be exciting for the players to know big things are coming with the new owner. Maybe all will try even harder now. If they spend big on players at the deadline imagine how cool it would be to win a title at first year of the new ownership or at least make some noise in the playoffs like a year ago.

I just hope he is financially consistent. Meaning don't trade away draft picks to sign Marcus Banks.

Sarver was so wishy washy

It would be nice if this guy is willing to pay the lux tax - big time

Sarver is a banker, who hired McD. Both had no clue about basketball. I have a lot more trust in this guy and Jones.

[Ghost of Kleine]

It should be exciting for the players to know big things are coming with the new owner. Maybe all will try even harder now. If they spend big on players at the deadline imagine how cool it would be to win a title at first year of the new ownership or at least make some noise in the playoffs like a year ago.

I just hope he is financially consistent. Meaning don't trade away draft picks to sign Marcus Banks.

Sarver was so wishy washy

It would be nice if this guy is willing to pay the lux tax - big time

I think given their wealth between the two brothers being over 11 million, And also given their apparent competitive nature too, there won't be any issues with spending whatsoever! Most importantly as a "walk on" (undiscovered talent) I'd believe he'd recognize the importance of not looking past hidden talent or under the radar potential. He also mentioned the importance of spending to bring in the most talent you can to help push you closer to a championship! I fully expect big and exciting things!

[King4Day]

Would the Suns add a conditional '23 1st in a Shamet/Saric for Christian Wood and Frank Ntilikina deal? If so, what conditions would be required?

I wouldn't. Wood is nice, wanted him in the offseason but we were focused on KD....I don't like Franky Smokes and while it would be great to offload Shamet and Saric, the conditions I would add to the 1st would be so restrictive, it may as well be a 2nd or two.

No clue why Dallas would do it....Wood is like their 2nd best player

I actually wouldn't understand why Dallas would do it. They regress and our pick won't be worth anything. Not a good way to make Luka happy

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

[Slim Charless]

Jesus. Did any of you know that Koloko has a 7'5 wingspan? With 9'5 standing reach?

Holy hell. If we trade Ayton there, we NEED to get this dude back.

The more I think about it, a Koloko/Siakam combo sounds pretty nice to pair with Booker and Mikal for the next 5 years. I think that's a championship winning team. Even more so with CP3

[WeekapaugGroove]

Would the Suns add a conditional '23 1st in a Shamet/Saric for Christian Wood and Frank Ntilikina deal? If so, what conditions would be required?

I wouldn't. Wood is nice, wanted him in the offseason but we were focused on KD....I don't like Franky Smokes and while it would be great to offload Shamet and Saric, the conditions I would add to the 1st would be so restrictive, it may as well be a 2nd or two.

No clue why Dallas would do it....Wood is like their 2nd best player

I actually wouldn't understand why Dallas would do it. They regress and our pick won't be worth anything. Not a good way to make Luka happy

Kind of a catch 22 because if Dallas is already willing to move while they fight for their playoff life then that's a major red flag. Usually takes a team a year or two to get to that point with Christian. There's a reason he's never stuck anywhere.

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[spanishninja]

I wouldn't. Wood is nice, wanted him in the offseason but we were focused on KD....I don't like Franky Smokes and while it would be great to offload Shamet and Saric, the conditions I would add to the 1st would be so restrictive, it may as well be a 2nd or two.

No clue why Dallas would do it....Wood is like their 2nd best player

I actually wouldn't understand why Dallas would do it. They regress and our pick won't be worth anything. Not a good way to make Luka happy

Kind of a catch 22 because if Dallas is already willing to move while they fight for their playoff life then that's a major red flag. Usually takes a team a year or two to get to that point with Christian. There's a reason he's never stuck anywhere.

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let's see a few more games of Wood struggling as a starter too. they thought before having him off the bench was a mistake lol

[sunskerr]

I think there is just something tactically wrong with what the Raptors are doing. Apparently Nick Nurse is under a bit of scrutiny. That roster is pretty decent.

[bwoolf2]

That's not a bad deal for them, but there is no indication they would trade him, and Siakam likes it there. Ayton and Cam may not. Cam is injury prone.

Is Ayton's contract better than Siakam's next one?

Anyway, any trade "rumors" with them are those speculative ones that say "other teams are monitoring their situation". I wonder how we'd address rebounding but if we put him at PF we should be ok with a decent C.

But IF they move him, right now would be the time, with 1.5 years left on contract.

There is, of course the risk that he would leave in 2024 when he is a FA. Most guys coming off their 2nd contracts want to test the FA market.

I think it might be more likely Toronto is a buyer, trading OG, Trent and a pick for someone like Capela, and running something like FVV, Barnes, Porter, Siakam, Capela. That's just kind of a first thought of the type of guy, or they pry a big from Orlando for less or a guy like Myles Turner for OG and Koloko or something.

OG had wanted out and there apparently has been friction with Trent.

Raptors problem is that they have no real PG, no real SG and no real C. FVV is 6'1 but really he is a SG (in a small PG's body). GTJ is also a small (and not athletic) SG getting paid too much (18 mill/yr?). No real C is also a bit of an issue on D, but they negate some of that with the swarming 6'7 - 6'8 - 6'9 guys (basically everybody on their roster). They would be better even if they got back a bit less talent for some of their guys, they need players who fit their positions of need somehow.

Siakam averages 7 apg and FVV averages over 6. FVV is more of a PG than many guys in the PG spot. Siakam is a point center, like Jokic.

Siakam has a 7'3 wingspan and 9ft standing reach. He can definitely play C and it's their best lineup but they can also play others...between Boucher, Achiuwa and Koloko, they play 60 mpg...so really Siakam doesn't play C all or even most of the time. Depends on the matchup.

Siakim is a very good player but understand his numbers would likely drop here, he won't be the primary scorer or ball handler the ball won't be in his hand nearly as often as it is for the Raptors, everyone just assumes everything transfers when it doesn't work that way. He would be a tremendous addition but you lose Ayton it's going to have a bigger impact than people think and losing 10 years of age and basketball, he isn't the defensive anchor for Raptors although a good defender he isn't a screen and roll player so you are talking apples and oranges two very different players and styles of play, Suns would have to adjust offense and defensively.

[lilfishi22]

I think there is just something tactically wrong with what the Raptors are doing. Apparently Nick Nurse is under a bit of scrutiny. That roster is pretty decent.

Haven't followed the Raptors issues much but on paper, having a bunch of 6'6-6'9 multi-skilled guys on the court shouldn't be a bad thing. They are high IQ, multi-skilled and good team guys so it's odd they are struggling this bad

[lilfishi22]

Raptors problem is that they have no real PG, no real SG and no real C. FVV is 6'1 but really he is a SG (in a small PG's body). GTJ is also a small (and not athletic) SG getting paid too much (18 mill/yr?). No real C is also a bit of an issue on D, but they negate some of that with the swarming 6'7 - 6'8 - 6'9 guys (basically everybody on their roster). They would be better even if they got back a bit less talent for some of their guys, they need players who fit their positions of need somehow.

Siakam averages 7 apg and FVV averages over 6. FVV is more of a PG than many guys in the PG spot. Siakam is a point center, like Jokic.

Siakam has a 7'3 wingspan and 9ft standing reach. He can definitely play C and it's their best lineup but they can also play others...between Boucher, Achiuwa and Koloko, they play 60 mpg...so really Siakam doesn't play C all or even most of the time. Depends on the matchup.

Siakim is a very good player but understand his numbers would likely drop here, he won't be the primary scorer or ball handler the ball won't be in his hand nearly as often as it is for the Raptors, everyone just assumes everything transfers when it doesn't work that way. He would be a tremendous addition but you lose Ayton it's going to have a bigger impact than people think and losing 10 years of age and basketball, he isn't the defensive anchor for Raptors although a good defender he isn't a screen and roll player so you are talking apples and oranges two very different players and styles of play, Suns would have to adjust offense and defensively.

Numbers is a bit whatever. If Booked was traded to another team, he probably wouldn't have the same stats either because of the team make up, schemes and whatever else. But if we were to trade for Siakam, it isn't because of his numbers because that will change, it's because of the skill set and experience he's bringing to the table. As for losing DA, it would be a loss of high % buckets but I think you could get about 90% of what he brings for half the cost. Ultimately, elite teams just don't need a $30m+ big man unless he's THE guy.