2019 season speculation including trade ideas

[bwgood77]

In what way it would cripple the spacing? You mean Ayton and Adams? You can separate their minutes so they play maybe 10 minutes a game together, it won't kill us and is nothing in comparison to the added defense and injury crisis security.

Just keep Baynes as the backup C for 20 mil less and similar if not better impact.

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You didn't really address my question and just tooted your own horn.

As currently constructed Suns defense lagging behind the offense. Defense was really bad in games Baynes was out. Baynes isn't reliable and Ayton is far from good on D. Having another top end defensive big isn't going to hurt us in any way.

Not sure why you say Baynes isn't reliable because he took a hard fall. So he's missed 8 of 21 games so far. That isn't typical of him for the last 3 years. Plus, Booker, for example, missed 10 of our first 29 games but I didn't hear people saying he wasn't reliable.

[m1chal]

I can't really understand your guys love for over-the-hill, overpaid and injury prone players like Love, Griffin or LMA. It would be good to have an upgrade at PF but:
1. we really don't know how the team plays because of Ayton's stupidity, perhaps it's going to work perfectly? Ayton-Saric and Baynes-Kaminsky look good on paper,
2. we are not winning the chip this year anyway. We are going to call it a very succesful season if we make the playoffs so why should we cripple our future cap space with those huge contracts?

Unless we are trading for Sabonis, Isaac or someone like these guys (yeah, I know) I think we should stay put. Perhaps we could trade TJ at the deadline if a good opportunity arises but that's it.

[RiRuHoops]

Just keep Baynes as the backup C for 20 mil less and similar if not better impact.

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You didn't really address my question and just tooted your own horn.

As currently constructed Suns defense lagging behind the offense. Defense was really bad in games Baynes was out. Baynes isn't reliable and Ayton is far from good on D. Having another top end defensive big isn't going to hurt us in any way.

Not sure why you say Baynes isn't reliable because he took a hard fall. So he's missed 8 of 21 games so far. That isn't typical of him for the last 3 years. Plus, Booker, for example, missed 10 of our first 29 games but I didn't hear people saying he wasn't reliable.

AB plays reckless play style. He takes charges, falls to the ground and he's a big body. He's high injury risk in my eyes. He's already had 2 separate injuries this season (calf and some flex hip rotator?). Plus he's an expiring and there was some talk of his hoping for a contender. You never know what happens in the summer. Some stonewall contender knocks on his door and he says see ya Suns. So adding another good defensive big is never a bad move in my book.

Also Baynes has had terrific connection with Rubio, it would suck if their playing times get separated if Baynes plays limited minutes off the bench.

[WeekapaugGroove]

In what way it would cripple the spacing? You mean Ayton and Adams? You can separate their minutes so they play maybe 10 minutes a game together, it won't kill us and is nothing in comparison to the added defense and injury crisis security.

Just keep Baynes as the backup C for 20 mil less and similar if not better impact.

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You didn't really address my question and just tooted your own horn.

As currently constructed Suns defense lagging behind the offense. Defense was really bad in games Baynes was out. Baynes isn't reliable and Ayton is far from good on D. Having another top end defensive big isn't going to hurt us in any way.

I guess I assumed the spacing issue created whenever you would have Adams and Ayton on the floor together would be pretty self explanatory. They have a combined 0 made 3s in their entire NBA career. While I do think Ayton can/will stretch out to there at some point he still has NEVER hit an NBA 3. So if you played them together teams simply would not guard them outside and would pack the paint and make everyones life harder.

I don't love the idea of playing Ayton and Baynes together much but at least baynes can hit and open 3.

Oh and if you're worried about losing baynes this summer it should be noted backup C is probably the easiest thing in the NBA to find in the cheap. Much better ways for this team to spend 25mil than on a backup for Ayton.



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[BobbieL]

I can't really understand your guys love for over-the-hill, overpaid and injury prone players like Love, Griffin or LMA. It would be good to have an upgrade at PF but:
1. we really don't know how the team plays because of Ayton's stupidity, perhaps it's going to work perfectly? Ayton-Saric and Baynes-Kaminsky look good on paper,
2. we are not winning the chip this year anyway. We are going to call it a very succesful season if we make the playoffs so why should we cripple our future cap space with those huge contracts?

Unless we are trading for Sabonis, Isaac or someone like these guys (yeah, I know) I think we should stay put. Perhaps we could trade TJ at the deadline if a good opportunity arises but that's it.

You make two good points
1) do not want long term cap
2) how will these guys play with Ayton

[RiRuHoops]

I can't really understand your guys love for over-the-hill, overpaid and injury prone players like Love, Griffin or LMA. It would be good to have an upgrade at PF but:
1. we really don't know how the team plays because of Ayton's stupidity, perhaps it's going to work perfectly? Ayton-Saric and Baynes-Kaminsky look good on paper,
2. we are not winning the chip this year anyway. We are going to call it a very succesful season if we make the playoffs so why should we cripple our future cap space with those huge contracts?

Unless we are trading for Sabonis, Isaac or someone like these guys (yeah, I know) I think we should stay put. Perhaps we could trade TJ at the deadline if a good opportunity arises but that's it.

2 points:

Cap space doesn't do much for teams that aren't top destinations. Knicks are prime example. Suns don't have a good reputation either.

Sometimes you have to take risks with big names. If you don't take risks and rely on internal development you just stay on that treadmill most of the time. But risks are risks. They either work out or they don't.

[WeekapaugGroove]

I can't really understand your guys love for over-the-hill, overpaid and injury prone players like Love, Griffin or LMA. It would be good to have an upgrade at PF but:
1. we really don't know how the team plays because of Ayton's stupidity, perhaps it's going to work perfectly? Ayton-Saric and Baynes-Kaminsky look good on paper,
2. we are not winning the chip this year anyway. We are going to call it a very succesful season if we make the playoffs so why should we cripple our future cap space with those huge contracts?

Unless we are trading for Sabonis, Isaac or someone like these guys (yeah, I know) I think we should stay put. Perhaps we could trade TJ at the deadline if a good opportunity arises but that's it.

2 points:

Cap space doesn't do much for teams that aren't top destinations. Knicks are prime example. Suns don't have a good reputation either.

Sometimes you have to take risks with big names. If you don't take risks and rely on internal development you just stay on that treadmill most of the time. But risks are risks. They either work out or they don't.

Now I do agree with you here. I'd have interest in love or Griffin is the asset cost to aquire was reasonable and sarver is ok going into the tax on the final years of their deals after an Ayton extension. LMA I'm less interested in but wouldn't kill them for that move if it was a reasonable cost.

Adams well just have to agree to disagree

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[RiRuHoops]

2 points:

Cap space doesn't do much for teams that aren't top destinations. Knicks are prime example. Suns don't have a good reputation either.

Sometimes you have to take risks with big names. If you don't take risks and rely on internal development you just stay on that treadmill most of the time. But risks are risks. They either work out or they don't.

Now I do agree with you here. I'd have interest in love or Griffin is the asset cost to aquire was reasonable and sarver is ok going into the tax on the final years of their deals after an Ayton extension. LMA I'm less interested in but wouldn't kill them for that move if it was a reasonable cost.

Adams well just have to agree to disagree

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I'd agree with you on both Love and LMA stance. But not Griffin. Over the hill athletic savant that is injury prone, just nope. Plus he doesn't play much defense and is quite ball dominant. I don't feel the fit at all.

Adams is a just a different animal though. He's only 26 so fits the team here, improves the defense that is our weakness. And he expires in 2021 even if he doesn't work out here. Good insurance long term if Ayton remains soft and doesn't grow a pair. If the cost is only Tyler and Dario then why the hack not ?

[WeekapaugGroove]

2 points:

Cap space doesn't do much for teams that aren't top destinations. Knicks are prime example. Suns don't have a good reputation either.

Sometimes you have to take risks with big names. If you don't take risks and rely on internal development you just stay on that treadmill most of the time. But risks are risks. They either work out or they don't.

Now I do agree with you here. I'd have interest in love or Griffin is the asset cost to aquire was reasonable and sarver is ok going into the tax on the final years of their deals after an Ayton extension. LMA I'm less interested in but wouldn't kill them for that move if it was a reasonable cost.

Adams well just have to agree to disagree

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I'd agree with you on both Love and LMA stance. But not Griffin. Over the hill athletic savant that is injury prone, just nope. Plus he doesn't play much defense and is quite ball dominant. I don't feel the fit at all.

Adams is a just a different animal though. He's only 26 so fits the team here, improves the defense that is our weakness. And he expires in 2021 even if he doesn't work out here. Good insurance long term if Ayton remains soft and doesn't grow a pair. If the cost is only Tyler and Dario then why the hack not ?

Griffin is absolutely a big risk, but if he was healthy he'd be the best player on this team and give them a shot to be a real hard out in the playoffs.

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[RiRuHoops]

Now I do agree with you here. I'd have interest in love or Griffin is the asset cost to aquire was reasonable and sarver is ok going into the tax on the final years of their deals after an Ayton extension. LMA I'm less interested in but wouldn't kill them for that move if it was a reasonable cost.

Adams well just have to agree to disagree

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I'd agree with you on both Love and LMA stance. But not Griffin. Over the hill athletic savant that is injury prone, just nope. Plus he doesn't play much defense and is quite ball dominant. I don't feel the fit at all.

Adams is a just a different animal though. He's only 26 so fits the team here, improves the defense that is our weakness. And he expires in 2021 even if he doesn't work out here. Good insurance long term if Ayton remains soft and doesn't grow a pair. If the cost is only Tyler and Dario then why the hack not ?

Griffin is absolutely a big risk, but if he was healthy he'd be the best player on this team and give them a shot to be a real hard out in the playoffs.

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Haha but he's never healthy in the playoffs. He's the dumbest of risks. Clippers were happy wash their hands there. And look at them now. Jerry West is the best. Follow the very best and smart people. Plus I'm not sure how Blake in his 30s going to be the best player anywhere. Stay away from athletic allstars on big contracts in their 30s unless their name is Lebron James

[WeekapaugGroove]

I'd agree with you on both Love and LMA stance. But not Griffin. Over the hill athletic savant that is injury prone, just nope. Plus he doesn't play much defense and is quite ball dominant. I don't feel the fit at all.

Adams is a just a different animal though. He's only 26 so fits the team here, improves the defense that is our weakness. And he expires in 2021 even if he doesn't work out here. Good insurance long term if Ayton remains soft and doesn't grow a pair. If the cost is only Tyler and Dario then why the hack not ?

Griffin is absolutely a big risk, but if he was healthy he'd be the best player on this team and give them a shot to be a real hard out in the playoffs.

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Haha but he's never healthy in the playoffs. He's the dumbest of risks. Clippers were happy wash their hands there. And look at them now. Jerry West is the best. Follow the very best and smart people. Plus I'm not sure how Blake in his 30s going to be the best player anywhere. Stay away from athletic allstars on big contracts in their 30s unless their name is Lebron James

Yeah his track record of being hurt in the playoffs is not good. It was really a shame last year because Blake was awesome in the regular season, probably a top 10-15 guy in the whole league.

The athletic thing is a valid point but Blake's done a pretty good job adjusting his game as he's gotten older. He's turned into a good outside shooter and he's still a really good playmaker. Also I should note I assume they would be basically getting him for matching contracts and spare parts in a salary dump.

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[Ghost of Kleine]

As I've previously mentioned , I'm really ok with either LaMarcus Aldridge OR Aaron Gordon because both players only have to years left on their deals, and would help us maintain cap flexibility heading into 2021 free agency.

At that point, You'd just have to ask yourself which of the two would offer the biggest immediate benefit both in terms of production, possible trade value, and in terms of general fit within the team's offensive/ defensive scheme. Although both are very different players, Each offers a significantly greater level of production and contribution than that of Tyler Johnson and even Saric in most capacities. If we're going younger, I'd look at Aaron Gordon ( in a marion type of role) maybe splitting time at the 3/4 to give us a different look at those positions.

And if we're going for more of a frontcourt presence to create more gravity for our shooters in Aytons' absence, Whilst also giving us another solid veteran option on offense, and more frontcourt depth, Then I'd look to Aldridge. I have to say that obviously I would be intrigued by upon Aytons' return, The possibilities of having both Ayton and Aldridge on either side consistently pulling defenders into the paint. And leaving Booker, Cam , Kaminsky, etc. Wide open on the perimeter. Plus the rebounding potential with always being able to have two dominant bigs in the rotation, as well as the vastly improved rebounding with having multiple 7 fters on the court at the same time.

Or with Aaron Gordon, In the pick and roll, along with Ayton and Oubre. All three vastly improving our frontcourt athleticism, drawing a lot more fouls on opposing teams, and helping fuel a possibly very exciting type of uber athletic high octane offensive option, again with Rubio tossing numerous lobs to any one of Ayton, Oubre, or Gordon. We'd be ultra athletic, high scoring, and very fun to watch! We could create our own version of "Lob City" even. And when Gordon's contract is set to expire in 21' it would give us maximum value, As he'd still be considered in his prime! Certainly much better value than that of Johnson's expiring alone. In the meantime, with either player, We'd get a major boost to our roster, acquire even more depth and have a very good insurance policy against further possible injuries to our frontcourt players. Our depth would also be downright scary!

We currently need a jolt, and should definitely consider the possibilities due to the low risk and high reward it would bring us.

[RiRuHoops]

Griffin is absolutely a big risk, but if he was healthy he'd be the best player on this team and give them a shot to be a real hard out in the playoffs.

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Haha but he's never healthy in the playoffs. He's the dumbest of risks. Clippers were happy wash their hands there. And look at them now. Jerry West is the best. Follow the very best and smart people. Plus I'm not sure how Blake in his 30s going to be the best player anywhere. Stay away from athletic allstars on big contracts in their 30s unless their name is Lebron James

Yeah his track record of being hurt in the playoffs is not good. It was really a shame last year because Blake was awesome in the regular season, probably a top 10-15 guy in the whole league.

The athletic thing is a valid point but Blake's done a pretty good job adjusting his game as he's gotten older. He's turned into a good outside shooter and he's still a really good playmaker. Also I should note I assume they would be basically getting him for matching contracts and spare parts in a salary dump.

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Just go after Love then. Better shooter, better rebounder, better at what we need. No need for Blake to take the ball out of our guards hands.

[BobbieL]

As I've previously mentioned , I'm really ok with either LaMarcus Aldridge OR Aaron Gordon because both players only have to years left on their deals, and would help us maintain cap flexibility heading into 2021 free agency.

At that point, You'd just have to ask yourself which of the two would offer the biggest immediate benefit both in terms of production, possible trade value, and in terms of general fit within the team's offensive/ defensive scheme. Although both are very different players, Each offers a significantly greater level of production and contribution than that of Tyler Johnson and even Saric in most capacities. If we're going younger, I'd look at Aaron Gordon ( in a marion type of role) maybe splitting time at the 3/4 to give us a different look at those positions.

And if we're going for more of a frontcourt presence to create more gravity for our shooters in Aytons' absence, Whilst also giving us another solid veteran option on offense, and more frontcourt depth, Then I'd look to Aldridge. I have to say that obviously I would be intrigued by upon Aytons' return, The possibilities of having both Ayton and Aldridge on either side consistently pulling defenders into the paint. And leaving Booker, Cam , Kaminsky, etc. Wide open on the perimeter. Plus the rebounding potential with always being able to have two dominant bigs in the rotation, as well as the vastly improved rebounding with having multiple 7 fters on the court at the same time.

Or with Aaron Gordon, In the pick and roll, along with Ayton and Oubre. All three vastly improving our frontcourt athleticism, drawing a lot more fouls on opposing teams, and helping fuel a possibly very exciting type of uber athletic high octane offensive option, again with Rubio tossing numerous lobs to any one of Ayton, Oubre, or Gordon. We'd be ultra athletic, high scoring, and very fun to watch! We could create our own version of "Lob City" even. And when Gordon's contract is set to expire in 21' it would give us maximum value, As he'd still be considered in his prime! Certainly much better value than that of Johnson's expiring alone. In the meantime, with either player, We'd get a major boost to our roster, acquire even more depth and have a very good insurance policy against further possible injuries to our frontcourt players. Our depth would also be downright scary!

We currently need a jolt, and should definitely consider the possibilities due to the low risk and high reward it would bring us.

I do want to see what Ayton brings to the core team. But I don’t see the major downside of LMA if the price is Tyler Saric and a playoff protected pick. His contract expires in 2021. So that’s good timing for free agency. He probably makes the team better. Not sure how he would play with Ayton. I get he is older than Love and Griffin but he is singled through 21. I am okay with it

[Dual]

I didnt know where to put this, so I put it here.

Read on Twitter

[Blonde]

Kevin Love having the longest contract of any of the guys who have been discussed makes him my least preferred option. On the books until 2023. You’d be relying on him staying healthy for that to not turn into a huge chunk of dead money, and that’s a risky gamble. If we’re not willing to trade much for him right now what will his value look like in 3 years? Not totally against a deal for him but I’ve definitely had a change of heart from where I was a month ago. Same holds true for Blake to a lesser extent.

Gallo is the name that gets brought up that I could go either way on. He’s shooting the lights out but I don’t really like giving up anything for an expiring who won’t take us over the top. If Dario was included for him we’d be giving up a lot on defense and on the glass. I think that would be a mistake. But if we were able to keep Dario that would be pretty great depth at the 4 and we could keep 1 if not both this summer if it worked well (does Dario throw a fit coming off the bench?). Gallo is maybe the most injury prone guy of the whole group and he’s 31 already (older than Blake, same as Love). Perhaps a big 1 year offer for him next year would be the best outcome.

[GoodBehavior]

It depends on your goal, if you're hoping to settle for just a playoff birth and a gentlemen sweep, then sure guys like Love, LMA, Adams will probably get you there. If you're hoping to maintain cap flexibility and be a legit threat for a deep run, you avoid those guys like plagues.

Steven Adams was unplayable last playoff sequence because he couldn't guard the pick and roll. Love needs a world-class set of teammates to offset his deficiency on the pick and roll. LMA has had a ton of trouble this year defending the pick and roll, due to age.

[Qwigglez]

I'm going to hop off the AG trade scenarios since it is seeming more and more unlikely that the Magic would trade him since they are currently the 8th best team in the East. Only scenario I could see the Magic trading him is if they get someone who immediately helps their team. Only player we could trade for him IMO is probably Kelly Oubre, since they both have somewhat similar contracts, and Oubre is more of a 3 than AG is. I can't see us trading KO though.

I could still see the Spurs trading LMA, last year at this time they were 10-11, and the Spurs ended up with a 48-34 record. Right now the Spurs are 8-14, and finish the month going against teams with a combined record of 97-115. Ten games, and they might be able to finish the 2019 year with a 14-18 record, which isn't so bad, still easily in the playoff race. Though if they finish the next ten games only winning 3, they could be 11-21, in which case I could see them potentially looking to make a deal. The Spurs first 4 games of 2020 is against the Thunder, and then the Bucks twice, and the Celtics. Easily could lose all four, and they'd be in big trouble. I'd trade for LMA, but only by trading Saric, Ty Johnson and perhaps a pick swap in 2024, so at the very least the Suns hedge a pick and not lose so much value on it. With better offers out there though I don't think the Spurs take any deal with the Suns without including Bridges or Cam Johnson, and that's an easy no for me.

Detroit has a very difficult rest of the month. Going against the Pacers tonight, Mavs, Rockets, Raptors, Celtics, Sixers, (Spurs), and Jazz. They could easily lose 8 of their next 12 and their record would end up being 12-26. I could absolutely see them trading off Blake Griffin for expiring contracts, and someone of value (Saric). I find it hard for a lot of teams to make a trade workout with the Pistons for Blake since he gets paid so much. For instance, if the Blazers wanted to trade for him, they'd have to give up Collins in order for salaries to match. Or they could trade both Whiteside and Bazemore, but that seems like a lateral move as they wouldn't have a center at that point. Denver would be my dark horse candidate to trade Millsap and maybe Porter Jr for Blake. Millsap though always seems to be a net positive so I'm not so sure Denver makes a deal.

[Bogyo]

2021 FA will be a non-event. Just like in other markets, if people are anticipating one thing, the other thing will happen.
I would bet on it that most of the names out there will either sign their extension next year (like Beal and CJ already did IIRC, and they are still on some peoples 2021 FA list), will be injured by then, or even worse re-injured George with his shoulders, Hayward anywhere, etc... or will be just like 33 years old looking for a 4 year supermax.
I say there will be no more than 2 of the names cited changing teams, IF that.
Maybe Gobert kicks the Jazz in the nuts if they are still not winning rings - which is likely. As likely as the Jazz getting rid of him quickly if they smell that, just like they did with DWill. They will max out Mitchell this summer, no doubt.

[Kerrsed]

One name that i have really yet to see anyone throw out there (So i will) is Green. GS has been DECIMATED by injuries this season. Draymond isnt that go-to-scorer PF that they need, he is more of a glue guy that contributes more everywhere else. That being said, he is having an extremely down season this year and there is rumblings that GS could look to move him despite re-inking him to a 4 year deal this offseason (3yr+1PO). He is also 29 years old. Dont know what exactly they would be looking for, but having his defensive presence leading the team, PHENOMENAL passing for a big, and 3 point shooting would be a major coup for us. He's making about a Mill less than TJ this season, so maybe some combo of that expiring and picks?

Could be an interesting move......if he can return to form playing next to actual NBA players and a system designed for passing and making the extra pass. One issue though is that he cant be traded until 4 days before the trade deadline, so that could be good or bad depending how you look at it. It could give us time to see what we really have with this current team at full strength.

Just a thought.