Suns Offseason Thread V: I Am My Brother's Kieffer

[Revived]

I think a person could argue that Hornacek has overachieved a bit given the talent he has been surrounded with. If you want a coach gone, you have to cite who you would replace him with. What available coach could come in and get more out of these players than Horny?

My ideal choice right now would be Ettore Messina. He's currently the Spurs assistant coach and has a ton of experience as a HC overseas as well and is regarded as one of the best European basketball coaches ever.

I want our next HC to be someone that stresses ball movement and defense. Someone like Mike Budenholzer who was the one that I was begging for back when we hired McD.

Back in regards to Messina, read this and tell me who wouldn't want him over Hornacek

http://www.denverstiffs.com/2015/3/11/8189423/coachs-resume-a-look-at-ettore-messina

http://www.thebirdwrites.com/2015/5/29/8679755/ettore-messina-pelicans-spurs-coach-demps-popovich

The biggest difference between the two is their personalities. While Hornacek is the type of guy who is really nice and wants to be friends with all his players, Messina is the type of guy who will bench you for remainder of the game and may next game as well if you aren't respectful in practice and games. He doesn't take crap, he won't let players walk all over him like Hornacek.

And imo that's exactly what this team needs right now. An authoritative HC.

[Gorilla Warfare]

Cavs pay Tristan Thompson 5 years $82 million ALL GUARANTEED. Oof.

[bwgood77]

Hornacek wants ball movement. The last thing he is doing is preaching iso. Our players resort to that due to inexperience and/or not playing together when things break down.

[batsmasher]

Wouldn't be surprised if both Jefferson and Sims get partially guaranteed deals. They both look good in their respective roles.

Jefferson as the hyper athletic defending big and Sims as the more traditional rebounding big. If I had to pick one I'd take Jefferson because of his freakish athleticism.

[Revived]

Heat have had quite a bit of our former players

viewtopic.php?f=20&t=1410675#start_here

[NTB]

Cavs pay Tristan Thompson 5 years $82 million ALL GUARANTEED. Oof.

So.. Rich Paul has done it again.

[DRK]

Cavs pay Tristan Thompson 5 years $82 million ALL GUARANTEED. Oof.

So.. Rich Paul has done it again.

Scum of a human being, but man hes got guts at the negotiation table.

Gotta give it to him. He gets his clients PAID

[King4Day]

Cavs pay Tristan Thompson 5 years $82 million ALL GUARANTEED. Oof.

So.. Rich Paul has done it again.

Not sure I'd say he did it again. I get the feeling Thompson told him, "Stop and just get a deal done". So he got an extra 2 mil out of it which I'm sure he could have gotten weeks/months ago.

Based on Woj's tweet, it sounds like the Cavs were never budging.

[King4Day]

Cavs pay Tristan Thompson 5 years $82 million ALL GUARANTEED. Oof.

So.. Rich Paul has done it again.

Scum of a human being, but man hes got guts at the negotiation table.

Gotta give it to him. He gets his clients PAID

Had the Cavs not been in their cap stranglehold, I think he would have gotten a smaller offer. I think this was more desperation to retain who they could as opposed to Paul getting his client paid. I want to see how he does when he has guys who are UFA's instead where teams can offer a contract for a player without fear they'll be matched.

[jcsunsfan]

Cavs pay Tristan Thompson 5 years $82 million ALL GUARANTEED. Oof.

So.. Rich Paul has done it again.

Scum of a human being, but man hes got guts at the negotiation table.

Gotta give it to him. He gets his clients PAID

Naw. If you are his client, and LBJ likes you, and you are a restricted FA, then he will put you through a long, adversarial negotiation to get you a contract that you could have gotten in the beginning if you had negotiated in good faith. If you are a client who is a rookie or a free agent, teams will avoid you like the plague.

[LukasBMW]

Rich Paul only won here because of Lebron.

If Lebron was on any other team, then no way TT gets a contract like this. The Cavs did this to keep Lebron happy.

It's mafia style/union style negotiation. But it will only work under certain circumstances. And you can bet that GM's around the league hate Rich Paul. Any rookie entering the draft who signs with "Klutz" sports is going to fall in the draft unless they are a sure fire star. No one is going to want to deal with this BS.

[SideSwipe]

Cavs pay Tristan Thompson 5 years $82 million ALL GUARANTEED. Oof.

So.. Rich Paul has done it again.

Scum of a human being, but man hes got guts at the negotiation table.

Gotta give it to him. He gets his clients PAID

Kevin Seraphin and Norris Cole say "hi"

You have Paul as an agent and know LeBron you have better chances- otherwise you are left to the dogs. I still think Paul is hurting his guys value. Harrel was thought to go mid-first round lasts into the second round, I guarantee you some teams thought "He's a talent, but then we have to deal with Paul. That's no final decision maker, but I guarantee you teams are thinking about it when considering FA's or trades. It's never good to bring animosity to a negotiating table because those sentiments are hard to shake on both sides. Cool heads and no emotion should rule the day, but long-term ROI should. Paul plays for short-term gains at the expense of his players long-term gains and his own reputation.

Eric Bledsoe, Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Norris Cole, Montrezl Harrell, LeBron James, Cory Joseph, Trey Lyles, Ben McLemore, Kevin Seraphin, Tristan Thompson.

Out of those clients, Bledsoe got a fair contract, which is likely to soon be undervalued. LBJ got his of course, Thompson is overpaid, but the rest of these guys are a mixed bag. Seraphin barely got to a team and Cole is pretty well in the same position despite having some talent.

Also, one day Rich Paul is likely to learn the difference between tough and unworkable. Good negotiators make tough deals, bad ones hold on to ideals for prides sake and walk away with no deal. I think Paul is somewhere in the middle of that learning process.

[batsmasher]

538 Suns preview is here.

http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/nba-phoenix-suns-preview-2015-16/

[kennydorglas]

"Finally, we must mention Devin Booker, not so much because he’s projected to do much, but because circumstances might press him into action. The main accomplishment for Booker — one of approximately 475 players drafted out of Kentucky last year — probably was getting more than 20 minutes a game on that squad. The good news is that he took about half his shots from 3-point range and hit a respectable 41.1 percent (note that college 3-pointers are easier). Sadly for Suns fans, he had only 17 steals in 38 games, so he’s obviously doomed."

[lilfishi22]

Interesting pre-seasons stats:

Total O-Reb leader: TJ Warren with 14
Total Assist leader: Weems/Knight tied with 23
FG% leader: Leuer at 57.6FG%
3PT% leader (10+ attempts): Leuer at 50% (10 3PA) then Kieff at 47.1% (17 3PA)
FTA leader: Kieff with 20FTA then Leuer with 19FTA( with 40min less)
TO per36: Knight with 4.5TO then Booker with 4.1TO

[Marz11]

"Finally, we must mention Devin Booker, not so much because he’s projected to do much, but because circumstances might press him into action. The main accomplishment for Booker — one of approximately 475 players drafted out of Kentucky last year — probably was getting more than 20 minutes a game on that squad. The good news is that he took about half his shots from 3-point range and hit a respectable 41.1 percent (note that college 3-pointers are easier). Sadly for Suns fans, he had only 17 steals in 38 games, so he’s obviously doomed."

Not sure if this a compliment to 18 year old Booker or a knock on the rest of the team, but he already looks like one of the most composed and mature players on the team.

[RaisingArizona]

"Finally, we must mention Devin Booker, not so much because he’s projected to do much, but because circumstances might press him into action. The main accomplishment for Booker — one of approximately 475 players drafted out of Kentucky last year — probably was getting more than 20 minutes a game on that squad. The good news is that he took about half his shots from 3-point range and hit a respectable 41.1 percent (note that college 3-pointers are easier). Sadly for Suns fans, he had only 17 steals in 38 games, so he’s obviously doomed."

This. Just because he's 18 doesn't mean he can't step in and do what he's really good at doing-- hitting shots.

[sunskerr]

It looks like our back court is set. But I had been thinking for a week or two about Dennis Schröder and how he's already nearly as good as Teague. I'm absolutely certain this guy is part of the next generation of top-flight point guards. He would fit the age bracket of our team perfectly. He's heading into his third year after averaging 10/4 in 19 minutes. He was killing it in Europe over the summer as well.

And sure enough he's already talking about his goal of starting. We pretty much have nothing to give Atlanta but man we could easily do a full rebuild if we acquired this guy and the Bledsoe/Knight tandem fails. Our team would be on easy mode in about 3 years if we had Schröder/Booker/Warren/Len.

[batsmasher]

And sure enough he's already talking about his goal of starting. We pretty much have nothing to give Atlanta but man we could easily do a full rebuild if we acquired this guy and the Bledsoe/Knight tandem fails. Our team would be on easy mode in about 3 years if we had Schröder/Booker/Warren/Len.

A full rebuild has never been, and never will be an option under McD. It's not the way he rolls, he's the Ainge protege. Sarver probably wouldn't allow it either, not because he's tight with money but because he'd be absolutely batpoop insane tanking in this market.

Which leads me to believe Bled is well and truly in the long term plans, no matter what happens. I can see every other piece sans Len/Warren/Book being up for trade. But no, I don't think this team will even consider rebuilding until it has some playoff success again.

[Saberestar]

It looks like our back court is set. But I had been thinking for a week or two about Dennis Schröder and how he's already nearly as good as Teague. I'm absolutely certain this guy is part of the next generation of top-flight point guards. He would fit the age bracket of our team perfectly. He's heading into his third year after averaging 10/4 in 19 minutes. He was killing it in Europe over the summer as well.

And sure enough he's already talking about his goal of starting. We pretty much have nothing to give Atlanta but man we could easily do a full rebuild if we acquired this guy and the Bledsoe/Knight tandem fails. Our team would be on easy mode in about 3 years if we had Schröder/Booker/Warren/Len.

Yes, I think the same.

I do not want to rebuild, but I think that Schroder can be a real good starter NOW in the NBA, and probably an All Star in the next few years.

I would trade Knight for Schroder + filler in a second.