2023-24 Season Discussion and Speculation - Free Agency Begins

[enigmatics]

If you can’t criticize an underachieving player then this forum has lost its purpose.

That what 50% of this board does. 50% of posters here get their joy by personally attacking Ayton. So trust me, the word “can’t” isn’t stopping people from attacking the kid.

With that said. There literally is no balance in peoples opinions on here. Perfect example, Ayton haters say he can’t rebound yet he is a top 10 rebounder. It’s fine to criticize but put some substance behind it instead of pure uncut hate.

Nobody has ever said that.

But please continue with the nonsensical arguments aimed at reducing the logical/rational ones that have been presented in here.

[enigmatics]

Jock was a rookie that never played before and McGee had some pretty damn good years for the Warriors and Lakers

Just looked at Mcgee career stats and for minutes played it was an avg year for him had some better years Lakers, Denver...

Jock was a rookie the prior year with the Spurs - he was not a rookie with the Suns.

[Fo-Real]

Big leave Britney alone energy in here today lol.

[TOO]

Mcgee has been played out of the league and it remains to see what Jock will do he played decent but when he had to start he got played off the court pretty quickly

Everybody loves the backup until he isn't the backup

Right, but the point was under Monty they played as well or better than they ever have.

Jock was a rookie that never played before and McGee had some pretty damn good years for the Warriors and Lakers

Just looked at Mcgee career stats and for minutes played it was an avg year for him had some better years Lakers, Denver...

Marginally better at best and also those were much closer to his prime years than what the Suns had. The per 100poss are all pretty close and Jock played 54 games for Spurs and improved under Monty. My point still stands, even with your semantics.

[TOO]

If you can’t criticize an underachieving player then this forum has lost its purpose.

That what 50% of this board does. 50% of posters here get their joy by personally attacking Ayton. So trust me, the word “can’t” isn’t stopping people from attacking the kid.

With that said. There literally is no balance in peoples opinions on here. Perfect example, Ayton haters say he can’t rebound yet he is a top 10 rebounder. It’s fine to criticize but put some substance behind it instead of pure uncut hate.

Nobody has ever said that.

But please continue with the nonsensical arguments aimed at reducing the logical/rational ones that have been presented in here.

The personally attacking me thing seems odd. Do people attack Ayton for what kind of human he is? I must've missed that.

[bwoolf2]

Right, but the point was under Monty they played as well or better than they ever have.

Jock was a rookie that never played before and McGee had some pretty damn good years for the Warriors and Lakers

Just looked at Mcgee career stats and for minutes played it was an avg year for him had some better years Lakers, Denver...

It doesn't no player developed under Monty and went on to a big payday, McGee was a 17 year veteran so it's not like he developed under Monty give me a break

Marginally better at best and also those were much closer to his prime years than what the Suns had. The per 100poss are all pretty close and Jock played 54 games for Spurs and improved under Monty. My point still stands, even with your semantics.

McGee was a 17 year veteran give me a break Monty didn't develop him and Jock was coming off an injury and covid and played sporatic minutes, can't just make crap up to fit your narrative

[SunsRback4Good]

If you can’t criticize an underachieving player then this forum has lost its purpose.

He has been criticized more than Donald Trump in the past few years. That’s how much Suns fans despise him. Whenever his name gets mentioned everyone comes out of the woodworks to state their negative opinion about him. No matter what Ayton says in an interview, people will interpret his words differently cause they’ve already made up their mind a long time ago that he should be despised. Even if he cures cancer everyone will still say “ but but he’s too soft who can’t dunk”.

Hyperbole much?

No! My sarcastic days are over. Im just tired seeing Ayton get blasted countless of times and nothing seems to be done. Will be interesting to see him dominate this year and all his haters still being in denial hoping he fails.

[bwgood77]

Ayton will very likely play better but you will still likely have the same people expressing negativity towards his game. He may play an otherwise great game, but not drive it one time he could, settling for a bank lay in, and have one turnover, and those people will focus on those two things. That's just the way it is. While most all other player's mistakes will get glossed over, even if they only have ok games.

[Jdiddy701]

He has been criticized more than Donald Trump in the past few years. That’s how much Suns fans despise him. Whenever his name gets mentioned everyone comes out of the woodworks to state their negative opinion about him. No matter what Ayton says in an interview, people will interpret his words differently cause they’ve already made up their mind a long time ago that he should be despised. Even if he cures cancer everyone will still say “ but but he’s too soft who can’t dunk”.

Hyperbole much?

No! My sarcastic days are over. Im just tired seeing Ayton get blasted countless of times and nothing seems to be done. Will be interesting to see him dominate this year and all his haters still being in denial hoping he fails.

I don’t think there’s anything more that the “haters” want than for him to ball out this season.


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[TOO]

He has been criticized more than Donald Trump in the past few years. That’s how much Suns fans despise him. Whenever his name gets mentioned everyone comes out of the woodworks to state their negative opinion about him. No matter what Ayton says in an interview, people will interpret his words differently cause they’ve already made up their mind a long time ago that he should be despised. Even if he cures cancer everyone will still say “ but but he’s too soft who can’t dunk”.

Hyperbole much?

No! My sarcastic days are over. Im just tired seeing Ayton get blasted countless of times and nothing seems to be done. Will be interesting to see him dominate this year and all his haters still being in denial hoping he fails.

I don't hate the kid and if he's dominant I'll gladly eat crow. I just don't believe he's wired that way.

[TOO]

Ayton will very likely play better but you will still likely have the same people expressing negativity towards is game. He may play an otherwise great game, but not drive it one time he could, settling for a bank lay in, and have one turnover, and those people will focus on those two things. That's just the way it is. While most all other player's mistakes will get glossed over, even if they only have ok games.

He should have his way this year, the amount of perimeter gravity the big 3 will draw should get him and the corner shooters ample opportunity to excel.

[SunsRback4Good]

Hyperbole much?

No! My sarcastic days are over. Im just tired seeing Ayton get blasted countless of times and nothing seems to be done. Will be interesting to see him dominate this year and all his haters still being in denial hoping he fails.

I don't hate the kid and if he's dominant I'll gladly eat crow. I just don't believe he's wired that way.

Sorry that I’ve got upset just upsetting seeing many turn on Ayton over an interview or anything else he says/does.

[SunsRback4Good]

Hyperbole much?

No! My sarcastic days are over. Im just tired seeing Ayton get blasted countless of times and nothing seems to be done. Will be interesting to see him dominate this year and all his haters still being in denial hoping he fails.

I don’t think there’s anything more that the “haters” want than for him to ball out this season.


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Of course they want the best for him, but everything seems to be micromanaged when it comes to Ayton. Like BW said if Ayton’s had a bad TO or settles for a jumper over taking it inside even though he had an impressive game.. well, then he will be criticized.

[WeekapaugGroove]

Ayton is criticized because he was the 1st overall pick and is on a max contract extension yet objectively hasn't lived up to either thing.

If he was the 15th pick and making $15 mil a year the conversation would be different.

It's really that simple.

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[bwgood77]

Ayton is criticized because he was the 1st overall pick and is on a max contract extension yet objectively hasn't lived up to either thing.

If he was the 15th pick and making $15 mil a year the conversation would be different.

It's really that simple.

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I don't think it would matter much if we was paid less than the max. He took a ton of criticism when on a rookie deal.

Or if he was the #3 or 4 pick.

Even before the max extension, he was far more hated by many than huge busts like Jackson, Bender, etc.

[WeekapaugGroove]

Ayton is criticized because he was the 1st overall pick and is on a max contract extension yet objectively hasn't lived up to either thing.

If he was the 15th pick and making $15 mil a year the conversation would be different.

It's really that simple.

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I don't think it would matter much if we was paid less than the max. He took a ton of criticism when on a rookie deal.

Or if he was the #3 or 4 pick.

Even before the max extension, he was far more hated by many than huge busts like Jackson, Bender, etc.

We'll have to agree to disagree on that.

Although there is a unique aspect with Ayton where half the fan base didn't want to draft him in the first place so that probably contributes. Especially since the guy the other half wanted ended up really good. I do think some of his biggest current haters were people who wanted to draft him and now feel like he let them down.

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[lilfishi22]

Kyle Lowry if somehow acquired would be the last missing piece to the puzzle for a possible dynasty in the makings. It would make our team even more stacked and the league might as well hand us our first nba championship trophy. Regardless if we acquire him or not, I can’t see us losing this year. I’ve never been more confident in a squad since 01 when I began watching suns basketball.

If Lowry was 30, maybe there's a dynasty in the making but dude will be 38 before the playoffs begin.

I think Lowry had a better season by EPM than Gordon, iirc. He was pretty effective off the bench, which helped limit the downsides of being 38. Wish Paul had that humility for us.

You're probably right but the definition of a dynasty isn't one year, it's multiple years and Lowry doesn't have multiple years of high level basketball left.

[Jdiddy701]

No! My sarcastic days are over. Im just tired seeing Ayton get blasted countless of times and nothing seems to be done. Will be interesting to see him dominate this year and all his haters still being in denial hoping he fails.

I don’t think there’s anything more that the “haters” want than for him to ball out this season.


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Of course they want the best for him, but everything seems to be micromanaged when it comes to Ayton. Like BW said if Ayton’s had a bad TO or settles for a jumper over taking it inside even though he had an impressive game.. well, then he will be criticized.

He should be criticized if it consistently happens, but I am done talking about Ayton.. we’ve all had this conversation the last 5 years. I am honestly tired of talking about him.

I am looking forward on watching him under Vogel. I’m hopeful!


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[lilfishi22]

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He has an opportunity every season to set his own narrative with his play as long as he's a Phoenix Sun

[lilfishi22]

Devin Booker giving us a sneak peek at the new Suns uniforms. Notice that the trim patterns match my latest predictions. You can also see a little bit of the sunburst on the white jersey. I need to adjust my colors a little bit camera setting/lighting can be tricky.

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What do you think? I am not sure about it...look OK jerseys.

Hard to beat the Valley jersey from two seasons ago but these are a nice throwback design