Alex Len

[rsavaj]

I actually like what Len has shown this year. He'll never be a great contributor on offense, but he's shown real skills as a rebounder and rim protector. If he sticks to that and improves his ability to finish around the rim, I think he's a more than capable starting center.

Also, I'm not sure we can call him a bust when the rest of his draft class was so bad. If you do a redraft, he still goes top 10.

[Christine-In-AZ]

Williams play has impressed me though, and I see no reason why Len cannot finish the year as the starter and Williams as the backup. We all know that is never happening though.

Len averaged over 30 minutes per and started nearly every post all-star game last year. He's had over 100 starts in his career. In my book the difference between him playing 18 minutes or starting & getting 30 is trivial in terms of his development, particularly that he got a lot of burn his 2nd and 3rd years.

Truly needing to earn more minutes seems a good long range strategy by the Suns...and it doesn't hurt to keep his overall numbers down with his free agency coming-up.

Even if Tyson doesn't miss a lot of games down the stretch, Len's PT will increase just like it did last year.

Frankly it strikes me odd that you find Len's playing time such a big issue. Yeah, ok, maybe I can see an argument that Chandler's presence is slowing down Len's growth, but he's in a situation that needs no rushing. I don't think Alex is complaining either. Is he? Has he?

[Scutt]

Williams play has impressed me though, and I see no reason why Len cannot finish the year as the starter and Williams as the backup. We all know that is never happening though.

Len averaged over 30 minutes per and started nearly every post all-star game last year. He's had over 100 starts in his career. In my book the difference between him playing 18 minutes or starting & getting 30 is trivial in terms of his development, particularly that he got a lot of burn his 2nd and 3rd years.

Truly needing to earn more minutes seems a good long range strategy by the Suns...and it doesn't hurt to keep his overall numbers down with his free agency coming-up.

Even if Tyson doesn't miss a lot of games down the stretch, Len's PT will increase just like it did last year.

Frankly it strikes me odd that you find Len's playing time such a big issue. Yeah, ok, maybe I can see an argument that Chandler's presence is slowing down Len's growth, but he's in a situation that needs no rushing. I don't think Alex is complaining either. Is he? Has he?

I like Alex Len and want to see him get a fair shot at developing and reaching his maximum potential, though I mostly feel that way about all the players we draft. When we brought Chandler in, everyone said that he would be a great mentor to Len and would help him elevate his game. All I have seen is Len lose his role and minutes to Tyson, so seeing Chandler continue to get all the minutes is very frustrating to me.

We are limiting a perfectly healthy Alex Len, who is in his 4th year, for Tyson Chandler. We are last in the west and play terrible defense, so how could playing Len more really make anything worse? If the Suns are really trying to keep his numbers and minutes down, just to try and sign him to a cheaper deal, than they are clearly not learning from past mistakes and have reached a new level of ineptness in my eyes.

[Christine-In-AZ]

Williams play has impressed me though, and I see no reason why Len cannot finish the year as the starter and Williams as the backup. We all know that is never happening though.

Len averaged over 30 minutes per and started nearly every post all-star game last year. He's had over 100 starts in his career. In my book the difference between him playing 18 minutes or starting & getting 30 is trivial in terms of his development, particularly that he got a lot of burn his 2nd and 3rd years.

Truly needing to earn more minutes seems a good long range strategy by the Suns...and it doesn't hurt to keep his overall numbers down with his free agency coming-up.

Even if Tyson doesn't miss a lot of games down the stretch, Len's PT will increase just like it did last year.

Frankly it strikes me odd that you find Len's playing time such a big issue. Yeah, ok, maybe I can see an argument that Chandler's presence is slowing down Len's growth, but he's in a situation that needs no rushing. I don't think Alex is complaining either. Is he? Has he?

I like Alex Len and want to see him get a fair shot at developing and reaching his maximum potential, though I mostly feel that way about all the players we draft. When we brought Chandler in, everyone said that he would be a great mentor to Len and would help him elevate his game. All I have seen is Len lose his role and minutes to Tyson, so seeing Chandler continue to get all the minutes is very frustrating to me.

We are limiting a perfectly healthy Alex Len, who is in his 4th year, for Tyson Chandler. We are last in the west and play terrible defense, so how could playing Len more really make anything worse? If the Suns are really trying to keep his numbers and minutes down, just to try and sign him to a cheaper deal, than they are clearly not learning from past mistakes and have reached a new level of ineptness in my eyes.

Ok.

Still think your fears for Len's Chandler influenced future are unreasonable. Also believe he'll get more minutes in the last 30+ games just as he did last year.

[bwgood77]

Yes but going forward if the Suns are going to be paying him $12M/yr, I'm sure they want him to stay on the court and out of foul trouble. Not much use in paying a guy big bucks to stay on the bench cause of foul trouble.

He probably doesn't need to play major minutes though in small ball era and if we also have Chandler and/or Williams.

True but then you can make the argument that there's no need to pay so much money for a guy who doesn't need to/can't play major minutes.

Sure, but you will need a young big for the future for certain lineups. Tyson doesn't have much time left, Williams is nice when he plays but likely doesn't play much because he's not as good.

So you let him go you still probably end up needing to pay a big in FA so you could roll the dice, but those guys tend to get overpaid so in the end you probably overpay someone worse and older anyway...as anyone any good won't be on the FA market because they will still be on rookie or 2nd contract. So you end up overpaying an old guy which doesn't fit our timeline. I just think it would be dumb to let him walk.

[Mulhollanddrive]

Per 36 career averages:

Plumlee 11-10
O'Quinn 13-13
Williams 16-16
Mahinmi 11-9
Black 11-11
Dedmon 10-12
Hernangomez 15-13
Marnjanovic 20-14
Nurkic 16-11
Pachulia 11-11
McGee 15-10
Zubac 15-10
Davis 11-11
Aldrich 11-12
-----
Len 13-11

[bwgood77]

More important to me though, is the rim protection and opponent fg% at rim. Protecting rim is the biggest thing for a center for me, and he is one of the better ones. And he rebounds well. I think we have plenty of scorers. I think he'd have a better per 36 rebounding # if he didn't play half his career on a team with Chandler as well.

[Mulhollanddrive]

I also quoted his Block and Defensive Rebounding Rate was better than Towns and only behind Gobert, Davis, Embiid, Drummond.

So it clearly depends on what metrics you use:
- points / rebounds are replicable for much cheaper
- blocks / defensive rebounding / rim protection % is ranked 5th for Centers <26 and >700 playing minutes this season.

[GotEm]

Also, I'm not sure we can call him a bust when the rest of his draft class was so bad. If you do a redraft, he still goes top 10.

I'm not so sure about that. That draft is probably one of the worst ever but it still has its stars.

Giannis is now an established superstar and top ten player in the league with HOF and likely multiple MVPs in his future.

Gobert, McCollum, Porter and Adams are all star caliber players.

Oladipo, Schroeder, KCP are is a good starting caliber players.

Hardaway Jr, Roberson, and Olynyk are all pretty decent rotation players.

I'd say Giannis, Gobert, McCollum, Porter, Adams, Schroeder, KCP, Oladipo all surely go ahead of Len in a redraft. And not too difficult imagine a team valuing instant offense choosing Hardaway Jr or a team needing an elite defender choosing Roberson over Len.

I don't think Celtics fans would give away Olynyk for Len either.

I was hoping to be encouraged by Len in the Rockets game since they don't have any elite big men but instead, Len looked very bad. He's gonna have a ton of playing time coming up with Tyson out, I hope he shows something.

I think Len is still very much a project where as many other players from the 2013 draft class have already established themselves one way or the other in the league.

[Water]

What would the Suns fan-base here consider fair value from New Orleans for Len?

[Christine-In-AZ]

Here's an interesting "Len" thread from the time perspective of June 2014 (after Alex's rookie season)

What's your timetable you're giving Alex Len?
http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=1328374#start_here

Just a three page thread, but many takes from current/recent Suns forum contributors

[Qwigglez]

What would the Suns fan-base here consider fair value from New Orleans for Len?

Anthony Davis.

Honestly not really interested in anything the Pelicans have (besides AD).

[LukasBMW]

Here's an interesting "Len" thread from the time perspective of June 2014 (after Alex's rookie season)

What's your timetable you're giving Alex Len?
http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=1328374#start_here

Just a three page thread, but many takes from current/recent Suns forum contributors

Wow! I really look like a jackass in that thread.

Len's issue is that he probably smokes weed. It explains his inconsistent play and inconsistent effort. I'm 100% serious.

[GotEm]

Len's issue is that he probably smokes weed. It explains his inconsistent play and inconsistent effort. I'm 100% serious.

Weed would likely relax him and have him play more consistent instead of playing so scared and recklessly.

I don't know if he does smoke weed but if he does, he's not smoking enough.

[Scutt]

Len's issue is that he probably smokes weed. It explains his inconsistent play and inconsistent effort. I'm 100% serious.

Stereotype much? It could have nothing to due with the inconsistent minutes and role he is given on a severely dysfunctional team? Or that he is just 23?

[OGBAH]

What's his fouls per 36? That's been his problem when he gets extended mins. That's why he's not starting and not getting 15 mill+ as a backup.

[Qwigglez]

Watch on YouTube

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

What I would like to see from Alex -

He spends a lot of time on offense trying to be more physical than his opponent. I think it's time he reorients himself. He needs to focus instead on being the more active, energetic player. He's got the speed and athleticism to beat opponents to spots. And while he may not have the quickness, where big players try to use quickness, they often end up getting called for fouls.

He doesn't need to put himself in danger by catching transition lobs, but bully-ball doesn't work for him. He's not a beefcake. He's long and fast. He needs to start approaching the game differently in order to realize his full potential out there.

Just a thought.

[GotEm]

What's his fouls per 36? That's been his problem when he gets extended mins. That's why he's not starting and not getting 15 mill+ as a backup.

Thing is that he has really low basketball IQ. I don't know if the Suns have the big man coaches that are good enough to correct it.

Robin Lopez used to have this same problem but he fixed it after the Suns traded him to New Orleans.

[GotEm]

What would the Suns fan-base here consider fair value from New Orleans for Len?

DeMarcus Cousins.