2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 3 - Trade season begins

[sunsbg]

We are 1.5 wins away from the 6th place in the West.

Every team losing a Top 10 player in the league will struggle, look at the Nets without KD.

We need Book to compete at the highest level. If he is back soon and ​get a solid position for the playoffs we can win it all.

Stranger things have happened I guess. After not winning as favorite in last two years, being the underdog can help. Teams just need a momentum and injury luck, which is severely lacking this season. At least the bench players are getting some burn. If the main guys are healthy for the playoffs there is always a chance. I may prefer Nuggets in 1st round as both CP3 and Ayton always play them well. NO and MEM healthy are worse matchup IMO.

[BobbieL]

We are 1.5 wins away from the 6th place in the West.

Every team losing a Top 10 player in the league will struggle, look at the Nets without KD.

We need Book to compete at the highest level. If he is back soon and ​get a solid position for the playoffs we can win it all.

Stranger things have happened I guess. After not winning as favorite in last two years, being the underdog can help. Teams just need a momentum and injury luck, which is severely lacking this season. At least the bench players are getting some burn. If the main guys are healthy for the playoffs there is always a chance. I may prefer Nuggets in 1st round as both CP3 and Ayton always play them well. NO and MEM healthy are worse matchup IMO.

thats the way I see it. Get healthy and see what you can do. Anbd yes, I agree about the Nuggets - they don't play defense - that is a big problem

Memphis and NO are much worse matchups

But if the Suns are healthy - they have the experience - just need to get healthy. and if they don't - what can you do

[King4Day]

These are trade ideas on ESPN's trade deadline preview.

Milwaukee:

Trade we would like to see: Crowder to Milwaukee for Pat Connaughton and Jordan Nwora.

Chicago:

Trade we would like to see: Coby White to Phoenix for Cameron Payne and second-round picks in 2023 and 2025. If the Bulls really want to pivot, how about Zach LaVine to New York for a package of draft picks, young players and contracts? Unlikely but as we mentioned above, the Bulls have a decision to either stay the course or look for deals involving their core players.

Indiana:

Trade we would like to see: Dario Saric and cash considerations from Phoenix for a 2028 second-round pick (protected 31-35). The trade would save Phoenix $23 million toward the luxury tax and give the Pacers additional frontcourt depth.

New York:

Trade we would like to see: Cam Reddish, Svi Mykhailiuk, their own 2027 second to the Suns for Jae Crowder.

Houston:

Trade we would like to see: Kenyon Martin Jr. to Phoenix for a 2023 top-14-protected first. If not conveyed, Houston will receive 2023 and 2025 second-round picks from the Suns

San Antonio (and NY)

Trade we would like to see: A three-team trade with San Antonio, New York and Phoenix. The Spurs receive Dario Saric, Evan Fournier, a 2023 top-14-protected first (via Washington) and a 2024 top-14-protected first from Phoenix (will turn into a 2024 and 2025 second-round picks if not conveyed). Phoenix will receive Jakob Poeltl and Cam Reddish. New York will receive Jae Crowder and Josh Okogie.

https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/35441254/2023-nba-trade-deadline-western-conference-deal-predictions

[BobbieL]

These are trade ideas on ESPN's trade deadline preview.

Milwaukee:

Trade we would like to see: Crowder to Milwaukee for Pat Connaughton and Jordan Nwora.

Chicago:

Trade we would like to see: Coby White to Phoenix for Cameron Payne and second-round picks in 2023 and 2025. If the Bulls really want to pivot, how about Zach LaVine to New York for a package of draft picks, young players and contracts? Unlikely but as we mentioned above, the Bulls have a decision to either stay the course or look for deals involving their core players.

Indiana:

Trade we would like to see: Dario Saric and cash considerations from Phoenix for a 2028 second-round pick (protected 31-35). The trade would save Phoenix $23 million toward the luxury tax and give the Pacers additional frontcourt depth.

New York:

Trade we would like to see: Cam Reddish, Svi Mykhailiuk, their own 2027 second to the Suns for Jae Crowder.

Houston:

Trade we would like to see: Kenyon Martin Jr. to Phoenix for a 2023 top-14-protected first. If not conveyed, Houston will receive 2023 and 2025 second-round picks from the Suns

San Antonio (and NY)

Trade we would like to see: A three-team trade with San Antonio, New York and Phoenix. The Spurs receive Dario Saric, Evan Fournier, a 2023 top-14-protected first (via Washington) and a 2024 top-14-protected first from Phoenix (will turn into a 2024 and 2025 second-round picks if not conveyed). Phoenix will receive Jakob Poeltl and Cam Reddish. New York will receive Jae Crowder and Josh Okogie.

https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/35441254/2023-nba-trade-deadline-western-conference-deal-predictions

I do not hate the first one
White for Payne - why not see what he has. We know what Payne has
Don't like the third one - but thatsa Bobby Sarver special right there. In fact, he would probably trade them Crowder since he is a better player -- but if you trade Crowder for talent and save cash and thats the best you can do with Saric - okay
Don't lioke the fourth one for jae - rather do the Bucks trade
Don't want to give up draft picks for Martin - even top 14 protectedn - granted is signed for next year
Don't hate the last one - well the pick - but thats 2024 - but are you trading Ayuton

[Slim Charless]

I would consider trading for DLo. It’s possible he may have his best years of basketball ahead of him (still just 26) and is a better bet to be good moving forward than FVV in my opinion. Obviously there’s the Booker buddy factor so he’d probably want to play here beyond this year. I wouldn’t give up anything of substantial value for him, maybe Cam Johnson or Chris Paul but certainly not Ayton or this years pick.

I've thought about that and think he's a possibility but why trade for him when we can sign him on the off season? He would be a decent addition right now with his scoring and passing. He's making a ton is the problem and it'd be hard to get matching money.

[BobbieL]

I would consider trading for DLo. It’s possible he may have his best years of basketball ahead of him (still just 26) and is a better bet to be good moving forward than FVV in my opinion. Obviously there’s the Booker buddy factor so he’d probably want to play here beyond this year. I wouldn’t give up anything of substantial value for him, maybe Cam Johnson or Chris Paul but certainly not Ayton or this years pick.

I've thought about that and think he's a possibility but why trade for him when we can sign him on the off season? He would be a decent addition right now with his scoring and passing. He's making a ton is the problem and it'd be hard to get matching money.

I think Crowder, Saric and Payne would work - but that would mean taking on $5m of salary so that means a bunch of luxury tax so $15m or something like that. Whats it in for the Twolves to take a bunch of expirings unless they really really wanted Landry Shamet

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

[Ghost of Kleine]

These are trade ideas on ESPN's trade deadline preview.

Milwaukee:

Trade we would like to see: Crowder to Milwaukee for Pat Connaughton and Jordan Nwora.

Chicago:

Trade we would like to see: Coby White to Phoenix for Cameron Payne and second-round picks in 2023 and 2025. If the Bulls really want to pivot, how about Zach LaVine to New York for a package of draft picks, young players and contracts? Unlikely but as we mentioned above, the Bulls have a decision to either stay the course or look for deals involving their core players.

Indiana:

Trade we would like to see: Dario Saric and cash considerations from Phoenix for a 2028 second-round pick (protected 31-35). The trade would save Phoenix $23 million toward the luxury tax and give the Pacers additional frontcourt depth.

New York:

Trade we would like to see: Cam Reddish, Svi Mykhailiuk, their own 2027 second to the Suns for Jae Crowder.

Houston:

Trade we would like to see: Kenyon Martin Jr. to Phoenix for a 2023 top-14-protected first. If not conveyed, Houston will receive 2023 and 2025 second-round picks from the Suns

San Antonio (and NY)

Trade we would like to see: A three-team trade with San Antonio, New York and Phoenix. The Spurs receive Dario Saric, Evan Fournier, a 2023 top-14-protected first (via Washington) and a 2024 top-14-protected first from Phoenix (will turn into a 2024 and 2025 second-round picks if not conveyed). Phoenix will receive Jakob Poeltl and Cam Reddish. New York will receive Jae Crowder and Josh Okogie.

https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/35441254/2023-nba-trade-deadline-western-conference-deal-predictions

Thanks for sharing these man!
It's really crazy to see some of the stuff the nba talking media promotes though.....lol!

In looking at these trades I've come to the conclusion that either ESPN really hates the suns still or simply shouldn't be making trades as they're really stupid and don't think at all about the outcomes or reasoning to validate the trades they're promoting here.

Not one of these trades are remotely reasonable or beneficial for the suns. The suns front office would have to be severely drunk self hating nihilists to entertain these postulations.

[BobbieL]

These are trade ideas on ESPN's trade deadline preview.

Milwaukee:

Trade we would like to see: Crowder to Milwaukee for Pat Connaughton and Jordan Nwora.

Chicago:

Trade we would like to see: Coby White to Phoenix for Cameron Payne and second-round picks in 2023 and 2025. If the Bulls really want to pivot, how about Zach LaVine to New York for a package of draft picks, young players and contracts? Unlikely but as we mentioned above, the Bulls have a decision to either stay the course or look for deals involving their core players.

Indiana:

Trade we would like to see: Dario Saric and cash considerations from Phoenix for a 2028 second-round pick (protected 31-35). The trade would save Phoenix $23 million toward the luxury tax and give the Pacers additional frontcourt depth.

New York:

Trade we would like to see: Cam Reddish, Svi Mykhailiuk, their own 2027 second to the Suns for Jae Crowder.

Houston:

Trade we would like to see: Kenyon Martin Jr. to Phoenix for a 2023 top-14-protected first. If not conveyed, Houston will receive 2023 and 2025 second-round picks from the Suns

San Antonio (and NY)

Trade we would like to see: A three-team trade with San Antonio, New York and Phoenix. The Spurs receive Dario Saric, Evan Fournier, a 2023 top-14-protected first (via Washington) and a 2024 top-14-protected first from Phoenix (will turn into a 2024 and 2025 second-round picks if not conveyed). Phoenix will receive Jakob Poeltl and Cam Reddish. New York will receive Jae Crowder and Josh Okogie.

https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/35441254/2023-nba-trade-deadline-western-conference-deal-predictions

Thanks for sharing these man!
It's really crazy to see some of the stuff the nba talking media promotes though.....lol!

In looking at these trades I've come to the conclusion that either ESPN really hates the suns still or simply shouldn't be making trades as they're really stupid and don't think at all about the outcomes or reasoning to validate the trades they're promoting here.

Not one of these trades are remotely reasonable or beneficial for the suns. The suns front office would have to be severely drunk self hating nihilists to entertain these postulations.

Sarver is going to see the third one and ship a second round pick not take one - to get that deal done.

[Ghost of Kleine]

I would consider trading for DLo. It’s possible he may have his best years of basketball ahead of him (still just 26) and is a better bet to be good moving forward than FVV in my opinion. Obviously there’s the Booker buddy factor so he’d probably want to play here beyond this year. I wouldn’t give up anything of substantial value for him, maybe Cam Johnson or Chris Paul but certainly not Ayton or this years pick.

I've thought about that and think he's a possibility but why trade for him when we can sign him on the off season? He would be a decent addition right now with his scoring and passing. He's making a ton is the problem and it'd be hard to get matching money.

But could we even sign him with being as far over the tax line as we are currently? I ask because everyone keeps pointing that out to me in my trade ideas towards free agency impact when suggesting trading for expirings.

[Ghost of Kleine]

These are trade ideas on ESPN's trade deadline preview.

Milwaukee:

Chicago:

Indiana:

New York:

Houston:

San Antonio (and NY)

https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/35441254/2023-nba-trade-deadline-western-conference-deal-predictions

Thanks for sharing these man!
It's really crazy to see some of the stuff the nba talking media promotes though.....lol!

In looking at these trades I've come to the conclusion that either ESPN really hates the suns still or simply shouldn't be making trades as they're really stupid and don't think at all about the outcomes or reasoning to validate the trades they're promoting here.

Not one of these trades are remotely reasonable or beneficial for the suns. The suns front office would have to be severely drunk self hating nihilists to entertain these postulations.

Sarver is going to see the third one and ship a second round pick not take one - to get that deal done.

Lol! Wouldn't surprise me at all!
Giving up assets just to move a freaking expiring that'd come off the books regardless!!!

[Ghost of Kleine]

It's not bad! But again, I wouldn't do it without additional incentives just off the basis of how much money they're saving alone in the deal. And expanded, they get better value in expiring vets that can mentor their young guys for half a season, but not also gives them even more cap flexibility in the deal.

Give me a Paul/ Saric for Rozier/ Oubre/ McDaniels/ Denver 23' 1st. Then they can pursue either Poeltl or Turner with their cap space for their center needs whilst keeping their lotto pick.

I think if we trade for Rozier, it's gonna take Ayton. Definitely wouldn't want Paul I don't think unless they are getting MASSIVE cap relief because it's not like Paul is an expiring this yar. Even if he doesn't play, he is paid $15 million NEXT year, so he's like a pretty big expiring next year. If they wanted massive cap relief like Crowder, Saric, and that's it....then maybe it makes sense...they just get off his contract.

But they may want something of value back. Paul is obviously negative value whether you pay him $15 million not to play or $30 million to play (of course they wouldn't).

So they wouldn't want Paul but like Crowder/Saric and at least a pick..maybe a 1st and 2nd? Or Ayton. I think if it came down to it, we might do Ayton if we could get. He makes only like $8.5...expiring but could keep.

He is actually decent..his FG% skyrocketed to 65.7% this year and his #s are 11.4/9.8/3.7 so solid rebounder and passer, and nice efficiency..big improvent this year.

A below avg C maybe but only because there are so many great ones..definitely servicable.

Rozier/Plumlee for Ayton is probably better than the other deals above aside from the VanVleet one...maybe better. I still like the Utah one but Rozier/Plumlee is probably two starters...solid ones that added to Book/Bridges/Cam could be good.

We wouldn't be worldbeaters in the west and with the Ayton of the WC player of the week and playoffs we obviously have far more upside but many fans really care about regular season consistency and going balls to the wall every game and that doesn't seem to be him.

I do Ayton for Mcdaniels/Rozier without looking at the numbers. Gotta have some kind of young piece we can potentially secure for the future.

We'd need to at the very least also be getting back Mark Williams for center depth. And also at least the Denver 23' 1st and the Utah 2nd ( a 1st and a 2nd) for the overall value gap. Although upon reflection and in reading various reports, I really don't see them having interest in Ayton as they're already focused in on both Turner and Poetl via free agency at a lesser projected pricetag!

[Saberestar]

Where i can find evidence that the Suns are listening to trade offers for Ayton?

GM James Jones has said this earlier:
"“Deandre is a force on both ends of the floor, who has elevated his game every year and will continue to do so,” said General Manager James Jones in a press release from the team. “DA is so important to what we do and without him we could not have reached our recent levels of success. We are excited to keep Deandre at home in the Valley where he belongs."

Where i can also find evidence that JJ has said Monty Williams is a basketball genius and that the Suns are excited to keep him for a long time at home in the Valley? Last 15 games record 3-12 tells me something else...Great coaches have magic to keep "tank level" rosters along fighting a playoff spot like Will Hardy does.

If someone goes away it will be Monty, not Ayton.

Reality is something else than fantasy.

James Jones offered an extension to Monty Williams and he is under contract for years and years to come. We don't know even the exact number of years, I can’t find it...he probably is under contract at least for the next 5 years.

So yeah, James Jones really like Monty as a HC.

[BobbieL]

Thanks for sharing these man!
It's really crazy to see some of the stuff the nba talking media promotes though.....lol!

In looking at these trades I've come to the conclusion that either ESPN really hates the suns still or simply shouldn't be making trades as they're really stupid and don't think at all about the outcomes or reasoning to validate the trades they're promoting here.

Not one of these trades are remotely reasonable or beneficial for the suns. The suns front office would have to be severely drunk self hating nihilists to entertain these postulations.

Sarver is going to see the third one and ship a second round pick not take one - to get that deal done.

Lol! Wouldn't surprise me at all!
Giving up assets just to move a freaking expiring that'd come off the books regardless!!!

What about this one for Crowder -

Gallo and Pritchard for Crowder. Suns get a PG and Gallo, if he picks up his option, would be on the bench next year -but Pritchard is not playing as much with White Brogdan and Smart ahead of him

[Slim Charless]

I would consider trading for DLo. It’s possible he may have his best years of basketball ahead of him (still just 26) and is a better bet to be good moving forward than FVV in my opinion. Obviously there’s the Booker buddy factor so he’d probably want to play here beyond this year. I wouldn’t give up anything of substantial value for him, maybe Cam Johnson or Chris Paul but certainly not Ayton or this years pick.

I've thought about that and think he's a possibility but why trade for him when we can sign him on the off season? He would be a decent addition right now with his scoring and passing. He's making a ton is the problem and it'd be hard to get matching money.

But could we even sign him with being as far over the tax line as we are currently? I ask because everyone keeps pointing that out to me in my trade ideas towards free agency impact when suggesting trading for expirings.

Maybe. I think he has to take a massive pay cut this summer. I also think the Booker factor and living in AZ as opposed to Minnesota would help him sign for less. He'd be a good 6th man and someone who's young enough to change his career. Maybe cp3 can help him.

[Jesus_H_Macy]

Read on Twitter

It wouldn't surprise me if the players are rolling their eyes at that Monty-ism by now...it doesn't feel like the type of motivational tactic that has a long shelf life

[Puff]

Another thing that bothered me this week was Barkley's comment on Monday. When asked what was wrong with the Suns he said, they do not like each other. Wow. This was such a close knit group heading into the series against Dallas. What happened? That has been the $64 question that remains unanswered. There is a stink somewhere. I expect it is directly related to Crowder. What other reason would he just be told to stay home and away from the team?

It could be Ayton? - he just does not seem serious about his job
It could be Monty - Maybe he is not the connector I think he is
It could be CP3 - He is not known to be Mr friendly
It could be the whole ownership thing

What is it? Barkley convinced me that he knows what is wrong. He never mentioned all the injuries. He repeated that they do not like each other.

[Slim Charless]

Read on Twitter

It wouldn't surprise me if the players are rolling their eyes at that Monty-ism by now...it doesn't feel like the type of motivational tactic that has a long shelf life

Another thing that bothered me this week was Barkley's comment on Monday. When asked what was wrong with the Suns he said, they do not like each other. Wow. This was such a close knit group heading into the series against Dallas. What happened? That has been the $64 question that remains unanswered. There is a stink somewhere. I expect it is directly related to Crowder. What other reason would he just be told to stay home and away from the team?

It could be Ayton? - he just does not seem serious about his job
It could be Monty - Maybe he is not the connector I think he is
It could be CP3 - He is not known to be Mr friendly
It could be the whole ownership thing

What is it? Barkley convinced me that he knows what is wrong. He never mentioned all the injuries. He repeated that they do not like each other.

The problem, is and has always been Monty. It has been mentioned a time or 2 all of his numerous faults but basically he was riding the coattails of 1 of the great PGs and leaders the league has ever seen. We got pantsd last season in the playoffs and his aura was shattered. Now, no healthy CP3 and look what happens?

None of this matters as his Montyness is on pace to give us a very good shot at getting Scoot/Wemby. Even Brandon Miller or Amen would be a great addition to this team.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Read on Twitter

It wouldn't surprise me if the players are rolling their eyes at that Monty-ism by now...it doesn't feel like the type of motivational tactic that has a long shelf life

Another thing that bothered me this week was Barkley's comment on Monday. When asked what was wrong with the Suns he said, they do not like each other. Wow. This was such a close knit group heading into the series against Dallas. What happened? That has been the $64 question that remains unanswered. There is a stink somewhere. I expect it is directly related to Crowder. What other reason would he just be told to stay home and away from the team?

It could be Ayton? - he just does not seem serious about his job
It could be Monty - Maybe he is not the connector I think he is
It could be CP3 - He is not known to be Mr friendly
It could be the whole ownership thing

What is it? Barkley convinced me that he knows what is wrong. He never mentioned all the injuries. He repeated that they do not like each other.

The problem, is and has always been Monty. It has been mentioned a time or 2 all of his numerous faults but basically he was riding the coattails of 1 of the great PGs and leaders the league has ever seen. We got pantsd last season in the playoffs and his aura was shattered. Now, no healthy CP3 and look what happens?

None of this matters as his Montyness is on pace to give us a very good shot at getting Scoot/Wemby. Even Brandon Miller or Amen would be a great addition to this team.

I think Monty's a very good, well-rounded coach. But his whole thing is about consistency. He coaches this team to play the same way every night. He says the same stuff over and over. He's not an innovator. He's stoical.

If it's working, it will work. But if it's not working, it won't work.

Personally I think the Dallas series broke us. The guys came back to camp and saw that we were going to do the same damn thing that got our butts kicked when it mattered and talk the same talk that we'd been hearing the last three seasons. In the end, who is there to blame but the other guys in the locker room?

Windhorst's talk about new hires excites me, because you don't hire a bunch of new front office personnel unless you're planning to make big changes to your roster. Good. We need some turnover. Like the Jazz last year, the air's become stale. Time to get some fresh air in here.

[BobbieL]

It wouldn't surprise me if the players are rolling their eyes at that Monty-ism by now...it doesn't feel like the type of motivational tactic that has a long shelf life

Another thing that bothered me this week was Barkley's comment on Monday. When asked what was wrong with the Suns he said, they do not like each other. Wow. This was such a close knit group heading into the series against Dallas. What happened? That has been the $64 question that remains unanswered. There is a stink somewhere. I expect it is directly related to Crowder. What other reason would he just be told to stay home and away from the team?

It could be Ayton? - he just does not seem serious about his job
It could be Monty - Maybe he is not the connector I think he is
It could be CP3 - He is not known to be Mr friendly
It could be the whole ownership thing

What is it? Barkley convinced me that he knows what is wrong. He never mentioned all the injuries. He repeated that they do not like each other.

The problem, is and has always been Monty. It has been mentioned a time or 2 all of his numerous faults but basically he was riding the coattails of 1 of the great PGs and leaders the league has ever seen. We got pantsd last season in the playoffs and his aura was shattered. Now, no healthy CP3 and look what happens?

None of this matters as his Montyness is on pace to give us a very good shot at getting Scoot/Wemby. Even Brandon Miller or Amen would be a great addition to this team.

I think Monty's a very good, well-rounded coach. But his whole thing is about consistency. He coaches this team to play the same way every night. He says the same stuff over and over. He's not an innovator. He's stoical.

If it's working, it will work. But if it's not working, it won't work.

Personally I think the Dallas series broke us. The guys came back to camp and saw that we were going to do the same damn thing that got our butts kicked when it mattered and talk the same talk that we'd been hearing the last three seasons. In the end, who is there to blame but the other guys in the locker room?

Windhorst's talk about new hires excites me, because you don't hire a bunch of new front office personnel unless you're planning to make big changes to your roster. Good. We need some turnover. Like the Jazz last year, the air's become stale. Time to get some fresh air in here.

'

I am so ready to be rid of the stench of Bobby Sarver

They need to do a culture cleansing so to speak - that doesn't mean Jones or even Monty are not good people - they are top shelf by all acounts. But its good to have some change

Granted - maybe just getting rid of SArver Garvin and anybody associated with sumbeetch is a good start. Move James up to Pres of B'ball Ops