2020 Preseason Speculation - Lineup battles underway

[bwgood77]

I see much of twitter Suns fandom are now coming around on adding Cam.

[Jarlaxle0204]

I do not want to lose Cam. That would be a bad move.

[TeamTragic]

I see much of twitter Suns fandom are now coming around on adding Cam.

How about no Cam and no #10 pick?

[bwgood77]

Anyone listen to that new podcast? If so, any new news? I'm guessing not or I would have seen it on twitter. Seems like what news we do hear gets less and less positive...not that we won't end up with CP3, but what we might give up for him. I did see Flex say if we gave up Cam we'd probably get something back....so maybe one or both of their late picks or something.

It seems not so long ago no one thought the Thunder would be able to move the Chris Paul contract without attaching picks...but then Presti met Jones and Bower.

[TeamTragic]

Anyone listen to that new podcast? If so, any new news? I'm guessing not or I would have seen it on twitter. Seems like what news we do hear gets less and less positive...not that we won't end up with CP3, but what we might give up for him. I did see Flex say if we gave up Cam we'd probably get something back....so maybe one or both of their late picks or something.

It seems not so long ago no one thought the Thunder would be able to move the Chris Paul contract without attaching picks...but then Presti met Jones and Bower.

Flex basically said Cam has an injury history and therefore we would move him before the #10 pick. Then he mentioned Bertrans (FA) and that he prefers Vassell in the draft "based on what he knows".

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

[Kerrsed]

Anyone listen to that new podcast? If so, any new knews? I'm guessing not or I would have seen it on twitter. Seems like what news we do hear gets less and less positive...not that we won't end up with CP3, but what we might give up for him. I did see Flex say if we gave up Cam we'd probably get something back....so maybe one or both of their late picks or something.

It seems not so long ago no one thought the Thunder would be able to move the Chris Paul contract without attaching picks...but then Presti met Jones and Bower.

Flex basically said Cam has an injury history and therefore we would move him before the #10 pick. Then he mentioned Bertrans (FA) and that he prefers Vassell in the draft "based on what he knows".

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Basically this. Mentioned Cam's age (Being older than Booker) along with the fact that the end of his rookie contract he would be 28 years old, his past injury history (2 knee operations), not necessarily that he is one dimensional but that its kinda easy to find another player that can do everything that he can do and this very well can be his ceiling. Says Booker has spoken out in the past that he isnt happy missing the playoffs and gotta make moves to make your franchise player happy. Booker wants CP3. You dont tell Booker, "Sorry, we didnt get CP3 because we wanted to keep a guy who averaged 9 Points Per Game last season". Things like that are how you lose Booker.

Honestly, i hate it but i have to agree with him on a lot of the points. Its the exact reason why Suns Twitter is now coming around to the idea of letting them have Cam. No coincidence they all started changing their minds AFTER the podcast. Mentioned you can grab a guy in the draft like Vassell who is a smaller version of Cam. Mentioned guys like Bertans and Gallo who can do the same things Cam can and maybe more. Said there are a lot of options out there for us, but you dont just walk away because of a guy like Cam Johnson.

[RedIndian]

Trading Cam would be utterly stupid especially with Oubre leaving. One of the best things about the Suns future was having two long, athletic and extremely switchable wings both on rookie contracts. It's the way the league is going in terms of the 3 and 4, and I'd be loathe to lose one of them to add a massively expensive 35 year old PG.

Flex & Co. saying that we can't let a guy who averaged 9 ppg be the stumbling block in a CP3 trade are missing the woods for the trees. Cam averaged 13/6 in the bubble. I think there's a very good chance he's averaging 15/7 as a starter very soon with very solid defense. That sort of player on a cost-controlled rookie deal is EXACTLY what you need around your stars.

We're going to get bent over here.

[TeamTragic]

Trading Cam would be utterly stupid especially with Oubre leaving. One of the best things about the Suns future was having two long, athletic and extremely switchable wings both on rookie contracts. It's the way the league is going in terms of the 3 and 4, and I'd be loathe to lose one of them to add a massively expensive 35 year old PG.

Flex & Co. saying that we can't let a guy who averaged 9 ppg be the stumbling block in a CP3 trade are missing the woods for the trees. Cam averaged 13/6 in the bubble. I think there's a very good chance he's averaging 15/7 as a starter very soon with very solid defense. That sort of player on a cost-controlled rookie deal is EXACTLY what you need around your stars.

We're going to get bent over here.

Then maybe we give them a future pick. I mean why do they want Cam this badly.

[RedIndian]

Flex mentioned that if we include Cam, there may be other players coming back. I'd want one of Bazley or Dort if Cam is going to OKC. I still wouldn't be too happy. Our wing depth would be terrible post this trade.

Just to add, getting Gallo or Bertans doesn't really compensate for losing two excellent young wings.

Gallo is 32 and brutally injury prone. Not to mention that he simply can't defend on the perimeter anymore.

Bertans is a world class shooter, but putrid defensively.

This is subtraction by addition.

[Crives]

I would not trade Cam...

Scary number though,

Oubre + Rubio + Cam + Frank + Jerome = $42.91m

That is enough salary to bring back CP3 and a Gallinari S&T for $12.29m per year.

I am sure OKC would love to get some value back for Gallinari and maybe that is why Cam is being brought up.

[RedIndian]

I'm fine with adding Paul. I think he's a good bridge to get this young group to the playoffs, and instill a winning mentality in them.

But that's the thing, you can't break up the young group to get him. Cam, Saric, Carter were all an integral part of the excellent chemistry we developed last year, and are the sort of cheap, young players we need developing alongside Ayton, Booker and Bridges if we are to become serious contenders post 2022.

If you gut the group just to add a 35 year old PG and an extremely injury prone 32 year old PF, then you're basically screwing up anything you might have in a couple of years.

Push comes to shove, I add the #10 and ask for #25 in return. Alternatively, I offer them a lotto protected 2021 pick.

[bwgood77]

Anyone listen to that new podcast? If so, any new knews? I'm guessing not or I would have seen it on twitter. Seems like what news we do hear gets less and less positive...not that we won't end up with CP3, but what we might give up for him. I did see Flex say if we gave up Cam we'd probably get something back....so maybe one or both of their late picks or something.

It seems not so long ago no one thought the Thunder would be able to move the Chris Paul contract without attaching picks...but then Presti met Jones and Bower.

Flex basically said Cam has an injury history and therefore we would move him before the #10 pick. Then he mentioned Bertrans (FA) and that he prefers Vassell in the draft "based on what he knows".

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Basically this. Mentioned Cam's age (Being older than Booker) along with the fact that the end of his rookie contract he would be 28 years old, his past injury history (2 knee operations), not necessarily that he is one dimensional but that its kinda easy to find another player that can do everything that he can do and this very well can be his ceiling. Says Booker has spoken out in the past that he isnt happy missing the playoffs and gotta make moves to make your franchise player happy. Booker wants CP3. You dont tell Booker, "Sorry, we didnt get CP3 because we wanted to keep a guy who averaged 9 Points Per Game last season". Things like that are how you lose Booker.

Honestly, i hate it but i have to agree with him on a lot of the points. Its the exact reason why Suns Twitter is now coming around to the idea of letting them have Cam. No coincidence they all started changing their minds AFTER the podcast. Mentioned you can grab a guy in the draft like Vassell who is a smaller version of Cam. Mentioned guys like Bertans and Gallo who can do the same things Cam can and maybe more. Said there are a lot of options out there for us, but you dont just walk away because of a guy like Cam Johnson.

I feel like that could keep going. You agree to Cam and then the next thing is "You don't walk away because of the 10th pick in a bad draft" and so on.

[Flying Colors]

I would not trade Cam...

Scary number though,

Oubre + Rubio + Cam + Frank + Jerome = $42.91m

That is enough salary to bring back CP3 and a Gallinari S&T for $12.29m per year.

I am sure OKC would love to get some value back for Gallinari and maybe that is why Cam is being brought up.

Isn’t Gallo a UFA, whats our incentive of doing a S&T, if we could try to sign him outright?

[Crives]

I would not trade Cam...

Scary number though,

Oubre + Rubio + Cam + Frank + Jerome = $42.91m

That is enough salary to bring back CP3 and a Gallinari S&T for $12.29m per year.

I am sure OKC would love to get some value back for Gallinari and maybe that is why Cam is being brought up.

Isn’t Gallo a UFA, whats our incentive of doing a S&T, if we could try to sign him outright?

Trade could be done after we use our cap space in FA.

[Kerrsed]

I would not trade Cam...

Scary number though,

Oubre + Rubio + Cam + Frank + Jerome = $42.91m

That is enough salary to bring back CP3 and a Gallinari S&T for $12.29m per year.

I am sure OKC would love to get some value back for Gallinari and maybe that is why Cam is being brought up.

No, Cam is being brought up because Preti knows that CP3 still holds value to certain teams around the league. You dont just give up a guy like that for nothing, which is what we would be doing by getting them expiring's. They dont need to move him. There was talk that they needed to move him went he was sent to OKC in the Westbrook trade and what did they do? They kept him and helped give him more value. When Nash was old and not doing to well, he still had value to certain teams, and what did we do? Same thing OKC is doing with CP3, let him figure out where he wanted to go and see what we can get. We got a pair of Lakers picks.

From what i understand Gallo is willing to take quite a bit less to be on a contending team. I also believe that CP3 has him convinced that that could be the Suns with him, and him talking less (Like he said he would) would allow us to sign even more pieces to put us over the top. Im saying, if we include Cam we want one of their late 1st round picks and Dort or even Bazley (Who im not really a fan of).

[bwgood77]

Flex mentioned that if we include Cam, there may be other players coming back. I'd want one of Bazley or Dort if Cam is going to OKC. I still wouldn't be too happy. Our wing depth would be terrible post this trade.

Just to add, getting Gallo or Bertans doesn't really compensate for losing two excellent young wings.

Gallo is 32 and brutally injury prone. Not to mention that he simply can't defend on the perimeter anymore.

Bertans is a world class shooter, but putrid defensively.

This is subtraction by addition.

Yeah, I agree. If our starting lineup is CP3, Book, Bridges, Gallo and Ayton, that is strong on paper, but we went with a 4 like that for much of the year (a poor man's Gallo in Saric) and didn't do nearly as well than when we started 2 wings at SF/PF. Boston is a good example of this, and got really good once Brown and Tatum had a couple years to grow with the team. We just had that with Cam and Oubre.

But after that our bench would be weak..Payne, Carter?, Draft pick?, Saric? Not a fan of Bertans really...can Gallo or Bertans chase wings?

We would suddenly be very old with very little depth. As we all know, draft picks can bust too...then what would our bench look like?

[bwgood77]

I would not trade Cam...

Scary number though,

Oubre + Rubio + Cam + Frank + Jerome = $42.91m

That is enough salary to bring back CP3 and a Gallinari S&T for $12.29m per year.

I am sure OKC would love to get some value back for Gallinari and maybe that is why Cam is being brought up.

Gallinari is a FA..he can do what he wants. OKC doesn't need value for him.

[RedIndian]

I would not trade Cam...

Scary number though,

Oubre + Rubio + Cam + Frank + Jerome = $42.91m

That is enough salary to bring back CP3 and a Gallinari S&T for $12.29m per year.

I am sure OKC would love to get some value back for Gallinari and maybe that is why Cam is being brought up.

Isn’t Gallo a UFA, whats our incentive of doing a S&T, if we could try to sign him outright?

Exactly, he's a UFA and we have no obligation to provide any value to OKC.

It just seems that we're now pandering completely to Booker and CAA. Giving a 24 year old with 4 years left on his deal such leverage is dangerous. I get that we're desperate not having had any success for a decade, but we're setting a dangerous precedent.

Constructing a good roster as a GM is finding the perfect balance between asset management and maintaining player relations.

McD focused only on the former, and sucked at the latter. Now it's early days for Jones & Bower, but I'm scared that they're focusing too much on the latter at the cost of the former.

[Kerrsed]

I feel like that could keep going. You agree to Cam and then the next thing is "You don't walk away because of the 10th pick in a bad draft" and so on.

But thats different. You already know its going to take Oubre and Rubio just from a money standpoint. 2 guys that OKC has already said they have no interest in and the reason why we needed to get a 3rd and possibly a 4th team involved. They still arnt getting any kind of asset for CP3. They get capspace a year from now, but they are looking at a rebuild and im sure will be well under the cap anyways, so that doesnt matter much to them. So they ask for Cam or our pick. Its on the FO which one gets the trade done and from the looks of it its Cam that they would rather let go. If they come back and ask for the pick also, that different than walking away because of a 9PPG player or a top 10 draft pick, its walking away because of a 9PPG player AND a top 10 draft pick.

[Slim Charless]

I would not trade Cam...

Scary number though,

Oubre + Rubio + Cam + Frank + Jerome = $42.91m

That is enough salary to bring back CP3 and a Gallinari S&T for $12.29m per year.

I am sure OKC would love to get some value back for Gallinari and maybe that is why Cam is being brought up.

No, Cam is being brought up because Preti knows that CP3 still holds value to certain teams around the league. You dont just give up a guy like that for nothing, which is what we would be doing by getting them expiring's. They dont need to move him. There was talk that they needed to move him went he was sent to OKC in the Westbrook trade and what did they do? They kept him and helped give him more value. When Nash was old and not doing to well, he still had value to certain teams, and what did we do? Same thing OKC is doing with CP3, let him figure out where he wanted to go and see what we can get. We got a pair of Lakers picks.

From what i understand Gallo is willing to take quite a bit less to be on a contending team. I also believe that CP3 has him convinced that that could be the Suns with him, and him talking less (Like he said he would) would allow us to sign even more pieces to put us over the top. Im saying, if we include Cam we want one of their late 1st round picks and Dort or even Bazley (Who im not really a fan of).

If we can get Dort in the deal, then that changes things in regards to Cam. I'd hate to see him go but CP3 and Dort is worth it. I doubt that OKC is gonna give that guy up after the playoff run he just had though.