2020 Preseason Speculation - Lineup battles underway

[Kerrsed]

The fact we have released other guys but still havent released Baynes leads me to believe we are either in talks with someone or are doing what the new cool trend seems to be, wait for word that a team is signing him and then approach them with a S&T offer.

This is such a weird year. Seems like so many players have been reported to be signing with a team, then a day or two later it changes to be a S&T deal. Rules state that if a team signs a player as a FA the team that still holds his rights has the right to match the offer, but cant trade him to the team that signed him as a FA for a year. Teams seem to have found a loophole around that by announcing they made an offer and are GOING TO sign someone, then the OG team steps up for a S&T deal. Lots of that going on lately that you didnt really see in years past. I noticed all the WOJ (And others) tweets all say (Insert Player Name Here) has agreed to a (Insert Contract Details Here) with (Insert Team Name Here). Its no longer saying that they signed. Once its signed the rule kicks into effect. I think its a loophole that If its just agreed to, there is still time to change it to a S&T if teams wish.

[phx#7]

What would you prefer Carter 3/11.5 or Melton 4/28?

I loved melton and HATED that trade but looking at it through that lense makes me pause.

I knew I was going to like Carter when I saw this last summer

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I like Melton but he is still can only contribute on one side of the court. Carter has turned into a knock down spot up shooter has more to contribute right now. Melton's defensive versatility due to his size is a plus and he is younger so he will be viewed as having more upside so I understand the interest in him but even at the same price I'd prefer Carter for at least next season.

[nevetsov]

The fact we have released other guys but still havent released Baynes leads me to believe we are either in talks with someone or are doing what the new cool trend seems to be, wait for word that a team is signing him and then approach them with a S&T offer.

This is such a weird year. Seems like so many players have been reported to be signing with a team, then a day or two later it changes to be a S&T deal. Rules state that if a team signs a player as a FA the team that still holds his rights has the right to match the offer, but cant trade him to the team that signed him as a FA for a year. Teams seem to have found a loophole around that by announcing they made an offer and are GOING TO sign someone, then the OG team steps up for a S&T deal. Lots of that going on lately that you didnt really see in years past. I noticed all the WOJ (And others) tweets all say (Insert Player Name Here) has agreed to a (Insert Contract Details Here) with (Insert Team Name Here). Its no longer saying that they signed. Once its signed the rule kicks into effect. I think its a loophole that If its just agreed to, there is still time to change it to a S&T if teams wish.

RFA and bird rights on an UFA are two different things though.

"Rules state that if a team signs a player as a FA the team that still holds his rights has the right to match the offer, but cant trade him to the team that signed him as a FA for a year" is an RFA rule (Dario, Carter).

S&T's (Baynes) are happening for UFAs where the original team has bird rights.

[bigfoot]

The fact we have released other guys but still havent released Baynes leads me to believe we are either in talks with someone or are doing what the new cool trend seems to be, wait for word that a team is signing him and then approach them with a S&T offer.

This is such a weird year. Seems like so many players have been reported to be signing with a team, then a day or two later it changes to be a S&T deal. Rules state that if a team signs a player as a FA the team that still holds his rights has the right to match the offer, but cant trade him to the team that signed him as a FA for a year. Teams seem to have found a loophole around that by announcing they made an offer and are GOING TO sign someone, then the OG team steps up for a S&T deal. Lots of that going on lately that you didnt really see in years past. I noticed all the WOJ (And others) tweets all say (Insert Player Name Here) has agreed to a (Insert Contract Details Here) with (Insert Team Name Here). Its no longer saying that they signed. Once its signed the rule kicks into effect. I think its a loophole that If its just agreed to, there is still time to change it to a S&T if teams wish.

RFAs cannot sign an offer sheet and then be part of a S&T
UFAs can make a verbal agreement and then a S&T can be worked out afterwards.

The difference is RFAs signed offer sheets today (e.g., Bogi) and all those involved in S&T are UFAs committing verbally and signing in the future when the NBA allows it.

[phx#7]

The fact we have released other guys but still havent released Baynes

Baynes is a FA the others all had contracts that needed a decision. Renouncing his hold literally does nothing for the team so it's not surprising they haven't bothered.

[Saberestar]

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I love it!

[bwgood77]

The fact we have released other guys but still havent released Baynes leads me to believe we are either in talks with someone or are doing what the new cool trend seems to be, wait for word that a team is signing him and then approach them with a S&T offer.

This is such a weird year. Seems like so many players have been reported to be signing with a team, then a day or two later it changes to be a S&T deal. Rules state that if a team signs a player as a FA the team that still holds his rights has the right to match the offer, but cant trade him to the team that signed him as a FA for a year. Teams seem to have found a loophole around that by announcing they made an offer and are GOING TO sign someone, then the OG team steps up for a S&T deal. Lots of that going on lately that you didnt really see in years past. I noticed all the WOJ (And others) tweets all say (Insert Player Name Here) has agreed to a (Insert Contract Details Here) with (Insert Team Name Here). Its no longer saying that they signed. Once its signed the rule kicks into effect. I think its a loophole that If its just agreed to, there is still time to change it to a S&T if teams wish.

The rule you speak of about matching the offer is just for RFAs. A lot of these guys moving are not RFAs. Baynes wouldn't be either. One thing we can do though is ask for it to be a S&T and take back some small non guaranteed deal, cut the guy and maybe have a trade exception for later. Though I don't know if you get an exception if you take any salary back or only if it's if you get a draft pick back.

[spanishninja]

Looks like Clips got Ibaka

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[bigfoot]

The fact we have released other guys but still havent released Baynes leads me to believe we are either in talks with someone or are doing what the new cool trend seems to be, wait for word that a team is signing him and then approach them with a S&T offer.

This is such a weird year. Seems like so many players have been reported to be signing with a team, then a day or two later it changes to be a S&T deal. Rules state that if a team signs a player as a FA the team that still holds his rights has the right to match the offer, but cant trade him to the team that signed him as a FA for a year. Teams seem to have found a loophole around that by announcing they made an offer and are GOING TO sign someone, then the OG team steps up for a S&T deal. Lots of that going on lately that you didnt really see in years past. I noticed all the WOJ (And others) tweets all say (Insert Player Name Here) has agreed to a (Insert Contract Details Here) with (Insert Team Name Here). Its no longer saying that they signed. Once its signed the rule kicks into effect. I think its a loophole that If its just agreed to, there is still time to change it to a S&T if teams wish.

RFAs cannot sign an offer sheet and then be part of a S&T
UFAs can make a verbal agreement and then a S&T can be worked out afterwards.

The difference is RFAs signed offer sheets today (e.g., Bogi) and all those involved in S&T are UFAs committing verbally and signing in the future when the NBA allows it.

I guess I should be more clear

Scenario #1 - RFA gets an offer from another team and signs the offer sheet. His current team can match or let him go. S&T is not available.

Scenario #2 - A team wants an RFA. They contact the current team and see if a S&T is wanted. If yes, the current team offers the contract and trades to the asking team. If no, the asking team gets the player to sign an offer sheet then waits to see if the current team matches. No trade can happen after the offer sheet is signed.

Scenario #3 - A team wants an UFA. They make an offer. The UFA says yes verbally. The deal is not drawn up and signed until the league allows it (typically a week after teams are allowed to negotiate with FA). During that time the outgoing and incoming teams can negotiate a S&T.

[matt131]

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[matt131]

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[Saberestar]

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[Kerrsed]

RFA and bird rights on an UFA are two different things though.

"Rules state that if a team signs a player as a FA the team that still holds his rights has the right to match the offer, but cant trade him to the team that signed him as a FA for a year" is an RFA rule (Dario, Carter).

S&T's (Baynes) are happening for UFAs where the original team has bird rights.

RFAs cannot sign an offer sheet and then be part of a S&T
UFAs can make a verbal agreement and then a S&T can be worked out afterwards.

The difference is RFAs signed offer sheets today (e.g., Bogi) and all those involved in S&T are UFAs committing verbally and signing in the future when the NBA allows it.

Baynes is a FA the others all had contracts that needed a decision. Renouncing his hold literally does nothing for the team so it's not surprising they haven't bothered.

The rule you speak of about matching the offer is just for RFAs. A lot of these guys moving are not RFAs. Baynes wouldn't be either. One thing we can do though is ask for it to be a S&T and take back some small non guaranteed deal, cut the guy and maybe have a trade exception for later. Though I don't know if you get an exception if you take any salary back or only if it's if you get a draft pick back.

Yes yes, got it guys. My bad, Been drinking Jager-bombs since around noon.

[Kerrsed]

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[bigfoot]

RFA and bird rights on an UFA are two different things though.

"Rules state that if a team signs a player as a FA the team that still holds his rights has the right to match the offer, but cant trade him to the team that signed him as a FA for a year" is an RFA rule (Dario, Carter).

S&T's (Baynes) are happening for UFAs where the original team has bird rights.

RFAs cannot sign an offer sheet and then be part of a S&T
UFAs can make a verbal agreement and then a S&T can be worked out afterwards.

The difference is RFAs signed offer sheets today (e.g., Bogi) and all those involved in S&T are UFAs committing verbally and signing in the future when the NBA allows it.

Baynes is a FA the others all had contracts that needed a decision. Renouncing his hold literally does nothing for the team so it's not surprising they haven't bothered.

The rule you speak of about matching the offer is just for RFAs. A lot of these guys moving are not RFAs. Baynes wouldn't be either. One thing we can do though is ask for it to be a S&T and take back some small non guaranteed deal, cut the guy and maybe have a trade exception for later. Though I don't know if you get an exception if you take any salary back or only if it's if you get a draft pick back.

Yes yes, got it guys. My bad, Been drinking Jager-bombs since around noon.

One jagerbomb per wojbomb ... is that a new drinking game?

[Phnxsports]

So for fun, let's say a sign and trade is possible for Baynes. What team is out there that would want him and what do they have to send back that would be valuable to Phoenix? I'm having a hard time finding something.

[Phnxsports]

RFA and bird rights on an UFA are two different things though.

"Rules state that if a team signs a player as a FA the team that still holds his rights has the right to match the offer, but cant trade him to the team that signed him as a FA for a year" is an RFA rule (Dario, Carter).

S&T's (Baynes) are happening for UFAs where the original team has bird rights.

RFAs cannot sign an offer sheet and then be part of a S&T
UFAs can make a verbal agreement and then a S&T can be worked out afterwards.

The difference is RFAs signed offer sheets today (e.g., Bogi) and all those involved in S&T are UFAs committing verbally and signing in the future when the NBA allows it.

Baynes is a FA the others all had contracts that needed a decision. Renouncing his hold literally does nothing for the team so it's not surprising they haven't bothered.

The rule you speak of about matching the offer is just for RFAs. A lot of these guys moving are not RFAs. Baynes wouldn't be either. One thing we can do though is ask for it to be a S&T and take back some small non guaranteed deal, cut the guy and maybe have a trade exception for later. Though I don't know if you get an exception if you take any salary back or only if it's if you get a draft pick back.

Yes yes, got it guys. My bad, Been drinking Jager-bombs since around noon.

One jagerbomb per wojbomb ... is that a new drinking game?

If that was a real game we would all be dead. LOL

[Kerrsed]

RFA and bird rights on an UFA are two different things though.

"Rules state that if a team signs a player as a FA the team that still holds his rights has the right to match the offer, but cant trade him to the team that signed him as a FA for a year" is an RFA rule (Dario, Carter).

S&T's (Baynes) are happening for UFAs where the original team has bird rights.

RFAs cannot sign an offer sheet and then be part of a S&T
UFAs can make a verbal agreement and then a S&T can be worked out afterwards.

The difference is RFAs signed offer sheets today (e.g., Bogi) and all those involved in S&T are UFAs committing verbally and signing in the future when the NBA allows it.

Baynes is a FA the others all had contracts that needed a decision. Renouncing his hold literally does nothing for the team so it's not surprising they haven't bothered.

The rule you speak of about matching the offer is just for RFAs. A lot of these guys moving are not RFAs. Baynes wouldn't be either. One thing we can do though is ask for it to be a S&T and take back some small non guaranteed deal, cut the guy and maybe have a trade exception for later. Though I don't know if you get an exception if you take any salary back or only if it's if you get a draft pick back.

Yes yes, got it guys. My bad, Been drinking Jager-bombs since around noon.

One jagerbomb per wojbomb ... is that a new drinking game?

I havent drank for a while. Was at the store and was already picking up some Rockstar and saw they had some Jager Holiday deal that included a free cup. Said hey, why the hell not. Now, i hate the taste of Jager (Hate Black Licorice), but i LOVE Jagerbombs. Its weird.

[dremill24]

So for fun, let's say a sign and trade is possible for Baynes. What team is out there that would want him and what do they have to send back that would be valuable to Phoenix? I'm having a hard time finding something.

Honestly you’re probably looking at a 2nd round pick and a trade exception in that scenario.

[phx#7]

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Love Mikal, always quick to post support for the team and teammates. Saw he congratulated Melton too.