Suns Offseason Thread 3: Spurned for the Spurs

[RunDogGun]

We can stop with the exaggerations please. Bledsoe is not a turnover machine. If he is, that means that almost every starting point is one as well. Curry had 3.8 per game last year, and 3.1 this season. Bledsoe had 3.3 last year and 3.4 this year.

I'm not sure if people know this, but trying to make a point by using false statements isn't the smartest way to go about making a point. In fact, you usually negate your point.

Trading Bledsoe, Markieff, and a pick for Favors is silly. First, it isn't happening. Second, McD isn't going to lose that much value for a non superstar.

Oh well, let the massive amounts of negativity continue.

[TeamTragic]

We can stop with the exaggerations please. Bledsoe is not a turnover machine. If he is, that means that almost every starting point is one as well. Curry had 3.8 per game last year, and 3.1 this season. Bledsoe had 3.3 last year and 3.4 this year.

I'm not sure if people know this, but trying to make a point by using false statements isn't the smartest way to go about making a point. In fact, you usually negate your point.

Trading Bledsoe, Markieff, and a pick for Favors is silly. First, it isn't happening. Second, McD isn't going to lose that much value for a non superstar.

Oh well, let the massive amounts of negativity continue.

Morris/picks for Favors. However I would trade Bledsoe for Favors straight up.

[rsavaj]

We can stop with the exaggerations please. Bledsoe is not a turnover machine. If he is, that means that almost every starting point is one as well. Curry had 3.8 per game last year, and 3.1 this season. Bledsoe had 3.3 last year and 3.4 this year.

I'm not sure if people know this, but trying to make a point by using false statements isn't the smartest way to go about making a point. In fact, you usually negate your point.

Trading Bledsoe, Markieff, and a pick for Favors is silly. First, it isn't happening. Second, McD isn't going to lose that much value for a non superstar.

Oh well, let the massive amounts of negativity continue.

You can't just look at raw turnovers per game. Bledsoe ranks 42nd amongst qualified point guards in A:TO ratio

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/assists/sort/assistTurnoverRatio/position/point-guards/count/41

To use the guy you're comparing him to, Curry has a 2.49 A:TO ratio, whereas Bledsoe falters at 1.80. Bledsoe needs to improve his decision-making.

[RunDogGun]

We can stop with the exaggerations please. Bledsoe is not a turnover machine. If he is, that means that almost every starting point is one as well. Curry had 3.8 per game last year, and 3.1 this season. Bledsoe had 3.3 last year and 3.4 this year.

I'm not sure if people know this, but trying to make a point by using false statements isn't the smartest way to go about making a point. In fact, you usually negate your point.

Trading Bledsoe, Markieff, and a pick for Favors is silly. First, it isn't happening. Second, McD isn't going to lose that much value for a non superstar.

Oh well, let the massive amounts of negativity continue.

You can't just look at raw turnovers per game. Bledsoe ranks 42nd amongst qualified point guards in A:TO ratio

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/assists/sort/assistTurnoverRatio/position/point-guards/count/41

Why would I use an assist to turnover ratio, when I'm talking about turnovers? Assists would require someone to actually make a basket, or not get the ball and spend some time in an ISO situation, which negates the pass and even if made, doesn't count as an assist.

So again, when talking about turnovers alone, I will use the turnover stat.

[NTB]

Marc J. Spears
‏@SpearsNBAYahoo
Wizards free agent F Kevin Seraphin getting interest from Wizards, Lakers, Suns & possibly Spurs (if they lose out on D. West), source said.

[RunDogGun]

We can stop with the exaggerations please. Bledsoe is not a turnover machine. If he is, that means that almost every starting point is one as well. Curry had 3.8 per game last year, and 3.1 this season. Bledsoe had 3.3 last year and 3.4 this year.

I'm not sure if people know this, but trying to make a point by using false statements isn't the smartest way to go about making a point. In fact, you usually negate your point.

Trading Bledsoe, Markieff, and a pick for Favors is silly. First, it isn't happening. Second, McD isn't going to lose that much value for a non superstar.

Oh well, let the massive amounts of negativity continue.

Morris/picks for Favors. However I would trade Bledsoe for Favors straight up.

Morris and picks would be ideal, but I don't see why Utah would do it, after letting other bigs walk or be traded away, while keeping Favors. They would have to believe that the picks were worth the trade. I don't think they want Bledsoe, or even just by himself, they have a few young guards that are combo types already.

[sunsbum]

Gallanari playing PF for us? lol, OK. At least the favors wet dream is something that would improve our team. I'm going back into hibernation.

[Stix]

Running out of options with O'Quinn to the Knicks. Not that I liked him, he reminds me of a slower Kieff. Still wouldn't mind Jordan Hill but he will most likely command 12-13mil per, and I don't think we do that unless its a 1 + 1. There's another trade looming ahead. I guess Lee does make some sense in that he is another vet and an expiring. Man, the more I look at the Mook trade, the more I don't like it. We are limited on trade assets now, it's either Tucker or Kieff and doubtful you can get fair value in return for them. McD really needs to pull another rabbit out of his hat.

[RunDogGun]

Gallanari playing PF for us? lol, OK. At least the favors wet dream is something that would improve our team. I'm going back into hibernation.

The idea of Galo at the stretch four isn't bad, if Galo wasn't so injury prone and he came off the bench. But that wouldn't be the case if we traded Morris to make the move.

We could always pair him with Tucker (again if we kept Morris, or had a better starting PF) off the bench, where Tucker could switch to the stronger offensive forward.

In the end though, I would have too many flashbacks to starting Turk at the four. Right now Galo gets too much money for how injured he usually is, and for the production he provides.

[AtheJ415]

We can stop with the exaggerations please. Bledsoe is not a turnover machine. If he is, that means that almost every starting point is one as well. Curry had 3.8 per game last year, and 3.1 this season. Bledsoe had 3.3 last year and 3.4 this year.

I'm not sure if people know this, but trying to make a point by using false statements isn't the smartest way to go about making a point. In fact, you usually negate your point.

Trading Bledsoe, Markieff, and a pick for Favors is silly. First, it isn't happening. Second, McD isn't going to lose that much value for a non superstar.

Oh well, let the massive amounts of negativity continue.

You can't just look at raw turnovers per game. Bledsoe ranks 42nd amongst qualified point guards in A:TO ratio

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/assists/sort/assistTurnoverRatio/position/point-guards/count/41

To use the guy you're comparing him to, Curry has a 2.49 A:TO ratio, whereas Bledsoe falters at 1.80. Bledsoe needs to improve his decision-making.

Nah. You really can't. Not if you're investigating whether he is a turnover machine. Turnovers are a stat all unto themselves. If it's assists/to, then you would have to argue that he has to be more efficient with his passing, but clearly the stats show he needs more assists--not necessarily fewer turnovers.

[RunDogGun]

Running out of options with O'Quinn to the Knicks. Not that I liked him, he reminds me of a slower Kieff. Still wouldn't mind Jordan Hill but he will most likely command 12-13mil per, and I don't think we do that unless its a 1 + 1. There's another trade looming ahead. I guess Lee does make some sense in that he is another vet and an expiring. Man, the more I look at the Mook trade, the more I don't like it. We are limited on trade assets now, it's either Tucker or Kieff and doubtful you can get fair value in return for them. McD really needs to pull another rabbit out of his hat.

I like the idea of Lee, but just not at the current cost. I think if we had traded Amare for him a few years back, it would have made sense. Now if we were signing him for two years at lets say $6.5/per, I would be fine with that.

[TeamTragic]

I definitely understand the concern with Bledsoe and his turnovers. He is definitely turnover prone. I have seen him do it many times and it is frustrating to watch. However we should to give him the off-season and see how he pairs with Knight. If it continues I think he will be traded otherwise he has improved his game.

If a deal comes through the wire that is impossible to refuse sell high on him before the season starts. Maybe that knee injury has become a concern.

[Djedefre]

OK, let's assume Favors is untouchable (which i'm not convinced knowing that Jazz have Burke and Exum at their disposal for organisation), what can we actually do then?? Seraphin? Come on. If this team can not add high quality players, that doesn't mean we should sign mediocrities. Max playing time to youngsters and maybe it'll pay off sooner rather than later.

[RunDogGun]

I definitely understand the concern with Bledsoe and his turnovers. He is definitely turnover prone. I have seen him do it many times and it is frustrating to watch. However we should to give him the off-season and see how he pairs with Knight. If it continues I think he will be traded otherwise he has improved his game.

Otherwise if a deal comes through the wire that is impossible to refuse sell high on him before the season starts. Maybe that knee injury has become a concern.

He is just as turnover prone as any point. Plus we didn't really have guys cutting to the basket for him to look like a good passer. Near the end of the season, he seemed to have no trouble making great passes to a cutting Warren. Maybe he expected guys to cut when they didn't, or he just didn't pay close enough attention to how his other players set up. Either way, these are fixable problems. He is no Nash at passing, but who really expected that?

If we have less guys trying to ISO all the time, the passing should get better all around. It will also help if we have more guys cutting to the hoop instead of standing around.

[In Len We Trust]

I really just read a completely serious post that said Eric Bledsoe is not a turnover machine.

Wow.

I think I need to take a break from this forum.

[RunDogGun]

OK, let's assume Favors is untouchable (which i'm not convinced knowing that Jazz have Burke and Exum at their disposal for organisation), what can we actually do then?? Seraphin? Come on. If this team can not add high quality players, that doesn't mean we should sign mediocrities. Max playing time to youngsters and maybe it'll pay off sooner rather than later.

Seraphin on a cheap deal wouldn't be bad at all. I don't see anyone better than Keef in FA. I wouldn't mind West on a short but cheaper deal. Like I said in the Plan B thread, I wouldn't mind a second unit of Warren, West, Len. Good mix of young and old, and West is already a mentor to Warren. Since both West and Len have decent outside shots, it gives room for Warren to cut.

I really hope Booker can step in quickly. After the sixteen minutes I see Bledsoe pairing with Knight, I'd like to see around sixteen minutes of Knight/Goodwin and Bledsoe/Booker. It gives us slashers with shooters.

[RunDogGun]

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/turnovers/sort/avgTurnovers/order/false

[MrMiyagi]

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/turnovers/sort/avgTurnovers/order/false

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/turnovers/sort/assistTurnoverRatio/position/point-guards/order/false

[Saberestar]

Yahoo Sources: Lakers, Lou Williams agree to three-year, $21M free agent deal.

[RunDogGun]

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/turnovers/sort/avgTurnovers/order/false

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/turnovers/sort/assistTurnoverRatio/position/point-guards/order/false

But an assist to turnover ratio should not be used when discussing whether a player is a "turnover machine".