Game 7: Phoenix Suns (3-3) @ Oklahoma City Thunder (3-3)

Revived · Post #341 » by **Revived** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 4:38 am

This should be the Suns rotation

Bledsoe/Price
Knight/Booker
Warren/Weems
Leuer/Tucker
Chandler/Len

Yes, Kieff should be out of the rotation for now until he gets head cleared. I think Tucker can hold his own against most backup PFs in the league. I wouldn't care if Goodwin played instead of Weems either.

Post #342 » by **bwgood77** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 4:41 am

MrMiyagi wrote:
Frank Lee wrote:So you are saying Washington would start Knight over Beal ?

Here... you take a look

http://espn.go.com/nba/depth

I'd probably give Keif the nod over one or two... Knight as well... but Tucker ??? hmmmmm

Point is.... in positions (SG/SF/PF) where there are many real good players, we rank in the bottom ten

I'm saying at the 2 guard spot, I see only 3 players as significantly better: Klay, Harden, Butler and maybe Wiggins. Then there is a wash Beal and Oladipo. Against everyone else I gladly take Knight. And that's not even mentioning some of the point guards who I'd start Knight over.

As for Kieff, if you want to eliminate Paul George, Tobias Harris and Draymond Green because they're SF playing small ball 4 and Cousins/WCS and Okafor/Nerlens are centers, there are Davis, Griffin, Bosh, Love, LMA and Ibaka who are hell yeah, I'll take those guys over Kieff, but then what else is there? Millsap/Favors/Faried/Mirotic do different things, but I wouldn't classify them as better than Kieff. All the rest are worse or rookies that could be big but could be average.

Millsap is easily better than Kieff. Favors also depending on what you need. And those others just provide roles...depends on what you need. Mirotic would be great with our lineup...Faried and Favors not as much.

But I'd trade Markieff for Millsap in a heartbeat.

PackSuns · Post #343 » by **PackSuns** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 4:42 am

SF88 wrote:
PackSuns wrote:FYI. TJ is a beast! My feelings are well documented.

You gotta get Hornacek to start him! It's your job now, take a flight out to Phoenix first thing tomorrow!!

I thought you knew him and told him not to play him. Just judging by your 14k posts. You are a Perfect example for folks on why they shouldn't bash everyone associated with the program.

If you weren't trying to be sarcastically passive aggressive with your post then I take back my statement. Your move.

MrMiyagi · Post #344 » by **MrMiyagi** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 4:43 am

SF88 wrote:This should be the Suns rotation

Bledsoe/Price
Knight/Booker
Warren/Goodwin
Leuer/Kieff
Chandler/Len

Yes, Kieff should be out of the rotation for now until he gets head cleared. I think Tucker can hold his own against most backup PFs in the league. I wouldn't care if Goodwin played instead of Weems either.

I'd try this lineup for a bit. Kieff going against back up bigs will hopefully get him back on track. I'm not going to defend Tucker, he hasn't done well. Mirza should never be on the floor, and neither should Weems at this point. And honestly, I think if that's our lineup, perception of our team changes to young and up and coming as opposed to "treadmill" even though all those players are on our roster regardless...

MrMiyagi · Post #345 » by **MrMiyagi** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 4:44 am

bwgood77 wrote:
MrMiyagi wrote:
Frank Lee wrote:So you are saying Washington would start Knight over Beal ?

Here... you take a look

http://espn.go.com/nba/depth

I'd probably give Keif the nod over one or two... Knight as well... but Tucker ??? hmmmmm

Point is.... in positions (SG/SF/PF) where there are many real good players, we rank in the bottom ten

I'm saying at the 2 guard spot, I see only 3 players as significantly better: Klay, Harden, Butler and maybe Wiggins. Then there is a wash Beal and Oladipo. Against everyone else I gladly take Knight. And that's not even mentioning some of the point guards who I'd start Knight over.

As for Kieff, if you want to eliminate Paul George, Tobias Harris and Draymond Green because they're SF playing small ball 4 and Cousins/WCS and Okafor/Nerlens are centers, there are Davis, Griffin, Bosh, Love, LMA and Ibaka who are hell yeah, I'll take those guys over Kieff, but then what else is there? Millsap/Favors/Faried/Mirotic do different things, but I wouldn't classify them as better than Kieff. All the rest are worse or rookies that could be big but could be average.

Millsap is easily better than Kieff. Favors also depending on what you need. And those others just provide roles...depends on what you need. Mirotic would be great with our lineup...Faried and Favors not as much.

But I'd trade Markieff for Millsap in a heartbeat.

He's 4 years older, and I'll admit is an improvement, but he's not a difference maker.

Post #346 » by **bwgood77** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 4:46 am

MrMiyagi wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
MrMiyagi wrote:I'm saying at the 2 guard spot, I see only 3 players as significantly better: Klay, Harden, Butler and maybe Wiggins. Then there is a wash Beal and Oladipo. Against everyone else I gladly take Knight. And that's not even mentioning some of the point guards who I'd start Knight over.

As for Kieff, if you want to eliminate Paul George, Tobias Harris and Draymond Green because they're SF playing small ball 4 and Cousins/WCS and Okafor/Nerlens are centers, there are Davis, Griffin, Bosh, Love, LMA and Ibaka who are hell yeah, I'll take those guys over Kieff, but then what else is there? Millsap/Favors/Faried/Mirotic do different things, but I wouldn't classify them as better than Kieff. All the rest are worse or rookies that could be big but could be average.

Millsap is easily better than Kieff. Favors also depending on what you need. And those others just provide roles...depends on what you need. Mirotic would be great with our lineup...Faried and Favors not as much.

But I'd trade Markieff for Millsap in a heartbeat.

He's 4 years older, and I'll admit is an improvement, but he's not a difference maker.

Well, if playoffs are the goal, he would be. But it doesn't matter...Atlanta would never trade him for Markieff.

Revived · Post #347 » by **Revived** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 4:47 am

PackSuns wrote:
SF88 wrote:
PackSuns wrote:FYI. TJ is a beast! My feelings are well documented.

You gotta get Hornacek to start him! It's your job now, take a flight out to Phoenix first thing tomorrow!!

I thought you knew him and told him not to play him. Just judging by your 14k posts. You are a Perfect example for folks on why they shouldn't bash everyone associated with the program.

If you weren't trying to be sarcastically passive aggressive with your post then I take back my statement. Your move.

Lol I was being sarcastic but it wasn't a shot at you, it was more so a friendly nudge that yea I agree with you he should start. You took it to a whole another level.

And no I wasn't bashing Warren back then either. I stand by everything I said then which was that he can't shoot and isn't much of a defender. I see plenty others post the same exact thing here as well so it can't just be me and my 140k posts.

MrMiyagi · Post #348 » by **MrMiyagi** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 4:49 am

bwgood77 wrote:
MrMiyagi wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Millsap is easily better than Kieff. Favors also depending on what you need. And those others just provide roles...depends on what you need. Mirotic would be great with our lineup...Faried and Favors not as much.

But I'd trade Markieff for Millsap in a heartbeat.

He's 4 years older, and I'll admit is an improvement, but he's not a difference maker.

Well, if playoffs are the goal, he would be. But it doesn't matter...Atlanta would never trade him for Markieff.

Playoffs are a goal, but I think a solid core for the next 4 years is more important than a one- or two-year run at the post-season. I guess I'm stupid to think that Kieff as our 4 can still get us to the playoffs this season and then, if he continues improving like he has in the past, for the next 3-4 seasons.

Revived · Post #349 » by **Revived** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 4:52 am

Kieff even last year and year before is a one dimensional player.

He's always been bad defensively and rebounding wise. Opposing PGs attack Kieff in the pick and roll because they know he's not gonna help and even if he does, his weak side rim protection isn't altering many shots.

The only time I've ever liked Kieff was when he came off the bench. I've dreaded him ever since he started because his rebounding and defensive shortcomings become more obvious in the starting role.

PackSuns · Post #350 » by **PackSuns** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 4:53 am

SF88 wrote:
PackSuns wrote:
SF88 wrote:You gotta get Hornacek to start him! It's your job now, take a flight out to Phoenix first thing tomorrow!!

I thought you knew him and told him not to play him. Just judging by your 14k posts. You are a Perfect example for folks on why they shouldn't bash everyone associated with the program.

If you weren't trying to be sarcastically passive aggressive with your post then I take back my statement. Your move.

Lol I was being sarcastic but it wasn't a shot at you, it was more so a friendly nudge that yea I agree with you he should start. You took it to a whole another level.

And no I wasn't bashing Warren back then either. I stand by everything I said then which was that he can't shoot and isn't much of a defender. I see plenty others post the same exact thing here as well so it can't just be me and my 140k posts.

My bad. Hahahhahahh. I guess I'm sensitive today. That's why I don't post a lot cause it turns into troll fest 2015. I like you dudes. Thanks for letting me hang around.

PackSuns · Post #351 » by **PackSuns** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 4:56 am

Did Tj get to guard Mcgary today. They used to battle in high school practice.

RunDogGun · Post #352 » by **RunDogGun** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 5:31 am

Glad I missed this. Man this place is drama central.

SunsRback4Good · Post #353 » by **SunsRback4Good** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 5:31 am

Not sure who he guarded, but I noticed McGary was all over the place it felt like 3 McGary's were on the floor.

TeamTragic · Post #354 » by **TeamTragic** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 5:53 am

http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400827985

Coaching doesn't matter right?

RunDogGun · Post #355 » by **RunDogGun** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 5:57 am

MrMiyagi wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
MrMiyagi wrote:He's 4 years older, and I'll admit is an improvement, but he's not a difference maker.

Well, if playoffs are the goal, he would be. But it doesn't matter...Atlanta would never trade him for Markieff.

Playoffs are a goal, but I think a solid core for the next 4 years is more important than a one- or two-year run at the post-season. I guess I'm stupid to think that Kieff as our 4 can still get us to the playoffs this season and then, if he continues improving like he has in the past, for the next 3-4 seasons.

I just don't know about Kieff. It still seems like he is not going balls out, which should be the next step for him. He has proven in some games to be that guy, and he is a whole year of starting under his belt. He should be in his groove. Or he could have peaked, or at least plateauing from the limited games I've watched. Literally to me, he seemed to lack effort for most of each game, making the occasional good play or effort. Which makes me wonder, why he isn't putting that type of effort the whole time he is in the game. If he truly just wants to be traded, he should be busting his arse to make other team's desire his abilities, and trade for him. Honestly, I think he just doesn't care to be in PHX, and allows that disdain to be transparent on the court.

Oh well, enough about Kieff. There are positives to take away, but it's clear that we are having a rough, or slow start to the season. Almost all of the guys came in early this offseason, and really sounded like a good start. But it is still early in the season, and overall, I think we have a solid roster, we just have to exploit the advantages we have.

Honestly, I still like Warren coming off the bench. I'm totally fine with him getting the bulk of the minutes at the three though, for I like PJ starting. He is a tough guy, and can (not always) rough up an opposing starting wing. TJ comes in with the perfect amount of bench energy we need. The problem is our offensive players in the first unit, are not consistent with their shot.

But overall, I'll be patient and give these guys many more games to figure things out. Tons of potential to do something good this season.

I'd still like to see some guard pairing (meaning pairing up Bledsoe with another guard for 16 of his 32, give or take a few minutes, and same for Knight), but I do like Price out there in limited minutes. He has had a few sparks, with decent passes. He also seemed to worked on his threes. Still getting the steals I knew he would. Great vet pickup.

Chandler and Len have really played hard, and in some games, it's paid off. Our guys are just inconsistent right now.

Oh well. Have a good night guys, we live to fight another day.

SunsRback4Good · Post #356 » by **SunsRback4Good** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 6:23 am

GoranTragic wrote:http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400827985

Coaching doesn't matter right?

29/27 for Drummond
40/5/5 Jackson

DirtyDez · Post #357 » by **DirtyDez** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 6:31 am

This is a solid team but as we see year after year being solid gets you nowhere and is more annoying and pointless than being a bad team. It's the same damn conversation we have every season with this franchise being in a constant state of purgatory.

11' - .488
12' - .500
13' - .305
14' - .585
15' - .476
16' - .500

TeamTragic · Post #358 » by **TeamTragic** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 7:11 am

JellyRolling wrote:
GoranTragic wrote:http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400827985

Coaching doesn't matter right?

29/27 for Drummond
40/5/5 Jackson

Jackson > Knight

Who disagrees?

SunsRback4Good · Post #359 » by **SunsRback4Good** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 7:39 am

DirtyDez wrote:This is a solid team but as we see year after year being solid gets you nowhere and is more annoying and pointless than being a bad team. It's the same damn conversation we have every season with this franchise being in a constant state of purgatory.

11' - .488
12' - .500
13' - .305
14' - .585
15' - .476
16' - .500

In the East we make the playoffs 5 outta those 6 years. :lol:

Revived · Post #360 » by **Revived** » Mon Nov 9, 2015 8:00 am

JellyRolling wrote:
DirtyDez wrote:This is a solid team but as we see year after year being solid gets you nowhere and is more annoying and pointless than being a bad team. It's the same damn conversation we have every season with this franchise being in a constant state of purgatory.

11' - .488
12' - .500
13' - .305
14' - .585
15' - .476
16' - .500

In the East we make the playoffs 5 outta those 6 years.

Lol all teams in the Eastern conference are always in playoff contention because of that.