OT - Current Affairs/COVID/Vaccines, etc

[MrMiyagi]

I am still confused about what these NBA players would have liked to see in this Jacob Blake issue.

Can you guys answer what you would have done?

5:11 dispatch gets a call about a domestic issue saying Blake shouldn't be there, and took the complainants keys and is refusing to give them back. Then dispatch tells the officers there is a warrant for this guy stemming from May and to be aware of that.

Once cops arrive they get into a scuffle with Blake, and they fight on the ground, one office tases him and it does not work. Blake then aggressively walks to car and reached down into the floorboard. Get's shot 7 times. (I believe 7 times is the issue I have which is way too many for that situation)

Here is where I stand:

Blake shouldn't have been shot 7 times.
I blame the cops for allowing him to go to his front door and reach down (Never should have got that far)
I blame Blake for going to his front door and reaching down, what did he expect?

It is a bad situation but Why did it escalate? Why didn't they just take him in, why didn't he just listen to them?

He should not have been shot. How hard is that to comprehend? Who should be responsible for de-escalating the scenario, a supposedly well-trained officer of the law or an untrained civilian?

Is it the job of an anesthesiologist to keep a patient knocked out during surgery or should the patient just grit their teeth and not react to a surgeon's scalpel?

[GoodBehavior]

The preaching to the choir aspect of this bugs me. Being NBA fans we chose to closely follow a sport dominated by black men and most of us follow those players without a thought of color. I get that black lives matter even without them throwing it in my face constantly during the bubble experience. I don't know what I am supposed to do differently other than nod my head, vote for Biden and call out anyone who says blue lives or any other lives matter and never under any circumstances point out anything negative about the people who have been shot.

I guess maybe I'm not the fan I thought I was. They can cancel the season. I'm sick of the politics, hypocrisy and virtue signaling bs. They won't take on any empowering women messages any time soon or at least until the train is done.

I don't think that the message is for the casual NBA fan. There's a reason the players want the owners to do more. Nothing in this country happens unless the truly rich (not millionaires, but billionaires) decide something needs to be done. These guys have leverage over some of the wealthiest people in America (and the world) by hitting them in their pocket books. If they can get them to lobby for police reform across the country, they've got a shot to make real change.

NBA owners have been very supportive of BLM. I am not a fan of NBA owners as a general rule, but they're being placed in a ridiculous situation, due to some misguided and poorly informed NBA players. Lebron and co. are asking something that owners cannot really deliver: reform, actual changes. They're targeting the wrong set of people. The entire wealth of owners is not going to change anything in the next month or so. It's pure fantasy.

Woj is reporting that there's optimism among players that the season will continue ... I think after a night of reflection and letting things calm down, I think players realize the limitation of what they can do. And it's back to business.

[Wilber85]

I am still confused about what these NBA players would have liked to see in this Jacob Blake issue.

Can you guys answer what you would have done?

5:11 dispatch gets a call about a domestic issue saying Blake shouldn't be there, and took the complainants keys and is refusing to give them back. Then dispatch tells the officers there is a warrant for this guy stemming from May and to be aware of that.

Once cops arrive they get into a scuffle with Blake, and they fight on the ground, one office tases him and it does not work. Blake then aggressively walks to car and reached down into the floorboard. Get's shot 7 times. (I believe 7 times is the issue I have which is way too many for that situation)

Here is where I stand:

Blake shouldn't have been shot 7 times.
I blame the cops for allowing him to go to his front door and reach down (Never should have got that far)
I blame Blake for going to his front door and reaching down, what did he expect?

It is a bad situation but Why did it escalate? Why didn't they just take him in, why didn't he just listen to them?

He should not have been shot. How hard is that to comprehend? Who should be responsible for de-escalating the scenario, a supposedly well-trained officer of the law or an untrained civilian?

Is it the job of an anesthesiologist to keep a patient knocked out during surgery or should the patient just grit their teeth and not react to a surgeon's scalpel?

So when he reached down in car? If he had a gun, or grabbed his knife, cops should let him shoot first or stab them?

What do you recommend Mr Miyahi? I think one shot would have been explainable but 7 or 8 is excessive

[Wilber85]

I am still confused about what these NBA players would have liked to see in this Jacob Blake issue.

Can you guys answer what you would have done?

5:11 dispatch gets a call about a domestic issue saying Blake shouldn't be there, and took the complainants keys and is refusing to give them back. Then dispatch tells the officers there is a warrant for this guy stemming from May and to be aware of that.

Once cops arrive they get into a scuffle with Blake, and they fight on the ground, one office tases him and it does not work. Blake then aggressively walks to car and reached down into the floorboard. Get's shot 7 times. (I believe 7 times is the issue I have which is way too many for that situation)

Here is where I stand:

Blake shouldn't have been shot 7 times.
I blame the cops for allowing him to go to his front door and reach down (Never should have got that far)
I blame Blake for going to his front door and reaching down, what did he expect?

It is a bad situation but Why did it escalate? Why didn't they just take him in, why didn't he just listen to them?

He should not have been shot. How hard is that to comprehend? Who should be responsible for de-escalating the scenario, a supposedly well-trained officer of the law or an untrained civilian?

Is it the job of an anesthesiologist to keep a patient knocked out during surgery or should the patient just grit their teeth and not react to a surgeon's scalpel?

Your analogies are crap by the way. They did try to de-escalate the situation. He fought (Did you miss that?), he was tased (kept going), aggressively went to door and opened/reached which 99% of people who have guns in cars, have guns in that location.

You are the blind one comparing Apples to Potatoes. Such a horrible horrible comparison

[MrMiyagi]

The preaching to the choir aspect of this bugs me. Being NBA fans we chose to closely follow a sport dominated by black men and most of us follow those players without a thought of color. I get that black lives matter even without them throwing it in my face constantly during the bubble experience. I don't know what I am supposed to do differently other than nod my head, vote for Biden and call out anyone who says blue lives or any other lives matter and never under any circumstances point out anything negative about the people who have been shot.

I guess maybe I'm not the fan I thought I was. They can cancel the season. I'm sick of the politics, hypocrisy and virtue signaling bs. They won't take on any empowering women messages any time soon or at least until the train is done.

I don't think that the message is for the casual NBA fan. There's a reason the players want the owners to do more. Nothing in this country happens unless the truly rich (not millionaires, but billionaires) decide something needs to be done. These guys have leverage over some of the wealthiest people in America (and the world) by hitting them in their pocket books. If they can get them to lobby for police reform across the country, they've got a shot to make real change.

NBA owners have been very supportive of BLM. I am not a fan of NBA owners as a general rule, but they're being placed in a ridiculous situation, due to some misguided and poorly informed NBA players. Lebron and co. are asking something that owners cannot really deliver: reform, actual changes. They're targeting the wrong set of people. The entire wealth of owner is not going to change anything in the next month or so. It's pure fantasy.

Woj is reporting that there's optimism among players that the season will continue ... I think after a night of reflection and letting things calm down, I think players realize the limitation of what they can do. And it's back to business.

Money = free speech in this country, and when you can afford a 2 billion dollar franchise, you've got the means to enact real change in record time.

I agree that they'll probably continue the season, but they could negotiate with the owners for a joint effort to create a super pac like bigfoot suggested and fund candidates locally and nationally who are concerned with police reform.

[MrMiyagi]

I am still confused about what these NBA players would have liked to see in this Jacob Blake issue.

Can you guys answer what you would have done?

5:11 dispatch gets a call about a domestic issue saying Blake shouldn't be there, and took the complainants keys and is refusing to give them back. Then dispatch tells the officers there is a warrant for this guy stemming from May and to be aware of that.

Once cops arrive they get into a scuffle with Blake, and they fight on the ground, one office tases him and it does not work. Blake then aggressively walks to car and reached down into the floorboard. Get's shot 7 times. (I believe 7 times is the issue I have which is way too many for that situation)

Here is where I stand:

Blake shouldn't have been shot 7 times.
I blame the cops for allowing him to go to his front door and reach down (Never should have got that far)
I blame Blake for going to his front door and reaching down, what did he expect?

It is a bad situation but Why did it escalate? Why didn't they just take him in, why didn't he just listen to them?

He should not have been shot. How hard is that to comprehend? Who should be responsible for de-escalating the scenario, a supposedly well-trained officer of the law or an untrained civilian?

Is it the job of an anesthesiologist to keep a patient knocked out during surgery or should the patient just grit their teeth and not react to a surgeon's scalpel?

So when he reached down in car? If he had a gun, or grabbed his knife, cops should let him shoot first or stab them?

What do you recommend Mr Miyahi? I think one shot would have been explainable but 7 or 8 is excessive

He was within arms reach when he shot him 7 times. So he couldn't have grabbed him and physically restrained him? I though you knew how much physical training these officers receive. They should be able to physically apprehend an untrained member of the public, then, right?

So either they are well-trained and chose not to physically restrain him or they are not well trained enough to physically restrain him. Either way is a huge problem.

You are making excuses for one side - the side that should be held to a higher standard and should be trained to handle these situations - while "virtue signaling" that both sides are to blame.

I'm sorry that I don't want to live in a world where a cop can end my life just because of what they think I might be doing.

[bigfoot]

The preaching to the choir aspect of this bugs me. Being NBA fans we chose to closely follow a sport dominated by black men and most of us follow those players without a thought of color. I get that black lives matter even without them throwing it in my face constantly during the bubble experience. I don't know what I am supposed to do differently other than nod my head, vote for Biden and call out anyone who says blue lives or any other lives matter and never under any circumstances point out anything negative about the people who have been shot.

I guess maybe I'm not the fan I thought I was. They can cancel the season. I'm sick of the politics, hypocrisy and virtue signaling bs. They won't take on any empowering women messages any time soon or at least until the train is done.

I don't think that the message is for the casual NBA fan. There's a reason the players want the owners to do more. Nothing in this country happens unless the truly rich (not millionaires, but billionaires) decide something needs to be done. These guys have leverage over some of the wealthiest people in America (and the world) by hitting them in their pocket books. If they can get them to lobby for police reform across the country, they've got a shot to make real change.

NBA owners have been very supportive of BLM. I am not a fan of NBA owners as a general rule, but they're being placed in a ridiculous situation, due to some misguided and poorly informed NBA players. Lebron and co. are asking something that owners cannot really deliver: reform, actual changes. They're targeting the wrong set of people. The entire wealth of owners is not going to change anything in the next month or so. It's pure fantasy.

Woj is reporting that there's optimism among players that the season will continue ... I think after a night of reflection and letting things calm down, I think players realize the limitation of what they can do. And it's back to business.

Sure it won't make a change in one month and I think the players are smart enough to know it won't. But ...what the Koch brothers did was invest their hundreds of millions of dollars in elections to influence state and local governments. Those local politicians then were able to redistrict their states to form advantageous boundaries at the U.S. level. Voting for Biden doesn't solve the police reform issue. Changing the makeup of local and state governments, one-at-time, is what will make the desired reforms. It is a slow, long, deliberate game the Koch brothers have been playing for many, many years.

[GoodBehavior]

I don't think that the message is for the casual NBA fan. There's a reason the players want the owners to do more. Nothing in this country happens unless the truly rich (not millionaires, but billionaires) decide something needs to be done. These guys have leverage over some of the wealthiest people in America (and the world) by hitting them in their pocket books. If they can get them to lobby for police reform across the country, they've got a shot to make real change.

NBA owners have been very supportive of BLM. I am not a fan of NBA owners as a general rule, but they're being placed in a ridiculous situation, due to some misguided and poorly informed NBA players. Lebron and co. are asking something that owners cannot really deliver: reform, actual changes. They're targeting the wrong set of people. The entire wealth of owner is not going to change anything in the next month or so. It's pure fantasy.

Woj is reporting that there's optimism among players that the season will continue ... I think after a night of reflection and letting things calm down, I think players realize the limitation of what they can do. And it's back to business.

Money = free speech in this country, and when you can afford a 2 billion dollar franchise, you've got the means to enact real change in record time.

I agree that they'll probably continue the season, but they could negotiate with the owners for a joint effort to create a super pac like bigfoot suggested and fund candidates locally and nationally who are concerned with police reform.

Most political candidates have police reforms in their agenda, including majority of Republicans. Even Trump is pitching police reform, lol. The SuperPac idea conceptually looks good but is largely impractical, setting aside legal issues with it. The NBA is not a political vehicle. Can it be a medium to get a message across? Sure. But beyond that, there's not much the NBA, players, or owners can do. I think they're wising up to this limitations. Early talks this morning is not about reform, it's about how to restart the playoff ...

[GoodBehavior]

I don't think that the message is for the casual NBA fan. There's a reason the players want the owners to do more. Nothing in this country happens unless the truly rich (not millionaires, but billionaires) decide something needs to be done. These guys have leverage over some of the wealthiest people in America (and the world) by hitting them in their pocket books. If they can get them to lobby for police reform across the country, they've got a shot to make real change.

NBA owners have been very supportive of BLM. I am not a fan of NBA owners as a general rule, but they're being placed in a ridiculous situation, due to some misguided and poorly informed NBA players. Lebron and co. are asking something that owners cannot really deliver: reform, actual changes. They're targeting the wrong set of people. The entire wealth of owners is not going to change anything in the next month or so. It's pure fantasy.

Woj is reporting that there's optimism among players that the season will continue ... I think after a night of reflection and letting things calm down, I think players realize the limitation of what they can do. And it's back to business.

Sure it won't make a change in one month and I think the players are smart enough to know it won't. But ...what the Koch brothers did was invest their hundreds of millions of dollars in elections to influence state and local governments. Those local politicians then were able to redistrict their states to form advantageous boundaries at the U.S. level. Voting for Biden doesn't solve the police reform issue. Changing the makeup of local and state governments, one-at-time, is what will make the desired reforms. It is a slow, long, deliberate game the Koch brothers have been playing for many, many years.

Koch brothers are (allegedly) corrupt with questionable business practices. Do you think that's the right model for the NBA?

[Wilber85]

He should not have been shot. How hard is that to comprehend? Who should be responsible for de-escalating the scenario, a supposedly well-trained officer of the law or an untrained civilian?

Is it the job of an anesthesiologist to keep a patient knocked out during surgery or should the patient just grit their teeth and not react to a surgeon's scalpel?

So when he reached down in car? If he had a gun, or grabbed his knife, cops should let him shoot first or stab them?

What do you recommend Mr Miyahi? I think one shot would have been explainable but 7 or 8 is excessive

He was within arms reach when he shot him 7 times. So he couldn't have grabbed him and physically restrained him? I though you knew how much physical training these officers receive. They should be able to physically apprehend an untrained member of the public, then, right?

So either they are well-trained and chose not to physically restrain him or they are not well trained enough to physically restrain him. Either way is a huge problem.

You are making excuses for one side - the side that should be held to a higher standard and should be trained to handle these situations - while "virtue signaling" that both sides are to blame.

I'm sorry that I don't want to live in a world where a cop can end my life just because of what they think I might be doing.

Mr Miyagi. You are a fool my man. They already tried physical restraint!!! The women POLICE OFFICER used a taser and it didn't work.

Do you know what you are trained to do if all avenues fail? And they go for a weapon?

Like I keep saying , he didn't deserve 8 shots

[MrMiyagi]

NBA owners have been very supportive of BLM. I am not a fan of NBA owners as a general rule, but they're being placed in a ridiculous situation, due to some misguided and poorly informed NBA players. Lebron and co. are asking something that owners cannot really deliver: reform, actual changes. They're targeting the wrong set of people. The entire wealth of owner is not going to change anything in the next month or so. It's pure fantasy.

Woj is reporting that there's optimism among players that the season will continue ... I think after a night of reflection and letting things calm down, I think players realize the limitation of what they can do. And it's back to business.

Money = free speech in this country, and when you can afford a 2 billion dollar franchise, you've got the means to enact real change in record time.

I agree that they'll probably continue the season, but they could negotiate with the owners for a joint effort to create a super pac like bigfoot suggested and fund candidates locally and nationally who are concerned with police reform.

Most political candidates have police reforms in their agenda, including majority of Republicans. Even Trump is pitching police reform, lol. The SuperPac idea conceptually looks good but is largely impractical, setting aside legal issues with it. The NBA is not a political vehicle. Can it be a medium to get a message across? Sure. But beyond that, there's not much the NBA, players, or owners can do. I think they're wising up to this limitations. Early talks this morning is not about reform, it's about how to restart the playoff ...

If you don't think a billion dollar corporation isn't a political vehicle since Citizens United, you're fooling yourself. Just about every billion dollar corporation lobbies the government in some fashion. The players should be looking at making the company they work for is working politically for them.

[nevetsov]

The preaching to the choir aspect of this bugs me. Being NBA fans we chose to closely follow a sport dominated by black men and most of us follow those players without a thought of color. I get that black lives matter even without them throwing it in my face constantly during the bubble experience. I don't know what I am supposed to do differently other than nod my head, vote for Biden and call out anyone who says blue lives or any other lives matter and never under any circumstances point out anything negative about the people who have been shot.

I guess maybe I'm not the fan I thought I was. They can cancel the season. I'm sick of the politics, hypocrisy and virtue signaling bs. They won't take on any empowering women messages any time soon or at least until the train is done.

I don't think that the message is for the casual NBA fan. There's a reason the players want the owners to do more. Nothing in this country happens unless the truly rich (not millionaires, but billionaires) decide something needs to be done. These guys have leverage over some of the wealthiest people in America (and the world) by hitting them in their pocket books. If they can get them to lobby for police reform across the country, they've got a shot to make real change.

NBA owners have been very supportive of BLM. I am not a fan of NBA owners as a general rule, but they're being placed in a ridiculous situation, due to some misguided and poorly informed NBA players. Lebron and co. are asking something that owners cannot really deliver: reform, actual changes. They're targeting the wrong set of people. The entire wealth of owners is not going to change anything in the next month or so. It's pure fantasy.

Woj is reporting that there's optimism among players that the season will continue ... I think after a night of reflection and letting things calm down, I think players realize the limitation of what they can do. And it's back to business.

Couldn't have said it better myself. 100%.

[MrMiyagi]

So when he reached down in car? If he had a gun, or grabbed his knife, cops should let him shoot first or stab them?

What do you recommend Mr Miyahi? I think one shot would have been explainable but 7 or 8 is excessive

He was within arms reach when he shot him 7 times. So he couldn't have grabbed him and physically restrained him? I though you knew how much physical training these officers receive. They should be able to physically apprehend an untrained member of the public, then, right?

So either they are well-trained and chose not to physically restrain him or they are not well trained enough to physically restrain him. Either way is a huge problem.

You are making excuses for one side - the side that should be held to a higher standard and should be trained to handle these situations - while "virtue signaling" that both sides are to blame.

I'm sorry that I don't want to live in a world where a cop can end my life just because of what they think I might be doing.

Mr Miyagi. You are a fool my man. They already tried physical restraint!!! The women POLICE OFFICER used a taser and it didn't work.

Do you know what you are trained to do if all avenues fail? And they go for a weapon?

Like I keep saying , he didn't deserve 8 shots

There were 3 officers there before he walked around to the car. So 3 officers cannot handle 1 civilian?

[GoodBehavior]

Money = free speech in this country, and when you can afford a 2 billion dollar franchise, you've got the means to enact real change in record time.

I agree that they'll probably continue the season, but they could negotiate with the owners for a joint effort to create a super pac like bigfoot suggested and fund candidates locally and nationally who are concerned with police reform.

Most political candidates have police reforms in their agenda, including majority of Republicans. Even Trump is pitching police reform, lol. The SuperPac idea conceptually looks good but is largely impractical, setting aside legal issues with it. The NBA is not a political vehicle. Can it be a medium to get a message across? Sure. But beyond that, there's not much the NBA, players, or owners can do. I think they're wising up to this limitations. Early talks this morning is not about reform, it's about how to restart the playoff ...

If you don't think a billion dollar corporation isn't a political vehicle since Citizens United, you're fooling yourself. Just about every billion dollar corporation lobbies the government in some fashion. The players should be looking at making the company they work for is working politically for them.

That's not how it work at all. Corporation uses SuperPac to influence towards their economic interest (trade, taxes, etc). It's white and black (for the most part). They funnel money towards candidate who will benefit their bottom the line the most. It's an easy equation for them.

A Superfac focusing in on police reform is illogical since every candidate has some police reform on their agenda. They also have other issues that makes it impractical to select one from another. How would the NBA know to fund one candidate from another? Do you go with the candidate who wants to fund better training? or Do you go with his opponent who wants to defund the police? What happens if the candidate is pro-gun while having a better police reform program? What if he doesn't supports same sex marriage? Are we sure all NBA players are okay with a SuperPac funding an anti-abortion candidate just because he's for police reform? etc.

We're wasting our time discussing these topics because at the end of the day, nothing will change.

[MrMiyagi]

Most political candidates have police reforms in their agenda, including majority of Republicans. Even Trump is pitching police reform, lol. The SuperPac idea conceptually looks good but is largely impractical, setting aside legal issues with it. The NBA is not a political vehicle. Can it be a medium to get a message across? Sure. But beyond that, there's not much the NBA, players, or owners can do. I think they're wising up to this limitations. Early talks this morning is not about reform, it's about how to restart the playoff ...

If you don't think a billion dollar corporation isn't a political vehicle since Citizens United, you're fooling yourself. Just about every billion dollar corporation lobbies the government in some fashion. The players should be looking at making the company they work for is working politically for them.

That's not how it work at all. Corporation uses SuperPac to influence towards their economic interest (trade, taxes, etc). It's white and black (for the most part). They funnel money towards candidate who will benefit their bottom the line the most. It's an easy equation for them.

A Superfac focusing in on police reform is illogical since every candidate has some police reform on their agenda. They also have other issues that makes it impractical to select one from another. How would the NBA know to fund one candidate from another? Do you go with the candidate who wants to fund better training? or Do you go with his opponent who wants to defund the police? What happens if the candidate is pro-gun while having a better police reform program? What if he doesn't supports same sex marriage? Are we sure all NBA players are okay with a SuperPac funding an anti-abortion candidate just because he's for police reform? etc.

We're wasting our time discussing these topics because at the end of the day, nothing will change.

People who think nothing can change are the biggest reason why nothing will change.

[Wilber85]

He was within arms reach when he shot him 7 times. So he couldn't have grabbed him and physically restrained him? I though you knew how much physical training these officers receive. They should be able to physically apprehend an untrained member of the public, then, right?

So either they are well-trained and chose not to physically restrain him or they are not well trained enough to physically restrain him. Either way is a huge problem.

You are making excuses for one side - the side that should be held to a higher standard and should be trained to handle these situations - while "virtue signaling" that both sides are to blame.

I'm sorry that I don't want to live in a world where a cop can end my life just because of what they think I might be doing.

Mr Miyagi. You are a fool my man. They already tried physical restraint!!! The women POLICE OFFICER used a taser and it didn't work.

Do you know what you are trained to do if all avenues fail? And they go for a weapon?

Like I keep saying , he didn't deserve 8 shots

There were 3 officers there before he walked around to the car. So 3 officers cannot handle 1 civilian?

2 officers. 3 showed up after fight. So yes, there is a difference in officers through every police department.

I am a Marine, and there are some marines that barely squeek by the training, that I would not want to go to the sandbox with.

[Wilber85]

side note: would love to see the lakers and clippers forfeit! Would be amazing.

I think these players are idiots. They have a big platform right now to use. NBA PLAYOFFS, NBA FINALS.

If they leave, all they have is their social media.

[MrMiyagi]

Mr Miyagi. You are a fool my man. They already tried physical restraint!!! The women POLICE OFFICER used a taser and it didn't work.

Do you know what you are trained to do if all avenues fail? And they go for a weapon?

Like I keep saying , he didn't deserve 8 shots

There were 3 officers there before he walked around to the car. So 3 officers cannot handle 1 civilian?

2 officers. 3 showed up after fight. So yes, there is a difference in officers through every police department.

I am a Marine, and there are some marines that barely squeek by the training, that I would not want to go to the sandbox with.

Wow, you are so close to actually getting it, it's like you're just flat refusing to at this point.

[Wilber85]

There were 3 officers there before he walked around to the car. So 3 officers cannot handle 1 civilian?

2 officers. 3 showed up after fight. So yes, there is a difference in officers through every police department.

I am a Marine, and there are some marines that barely squeek by the training, that I would not want to go to the sandbox with.

Wow, you are so close to actually getting it, it's like you're just flat refusing to at this point.

I get it. There are cops who need more training. That is why I say do not defund them, but fund the training portion.

My ask from my original post was, what would you have done in that situation ?

Answer that?

[Wilber85]

Mr Miyagi.

We are past the point of Blake not deserving to get shot 8 times.

Question is. Why does nobody point out he wouldn't have been shot if he didn't fight or aggressively go to car with guns pointed at you, after a fight, when you just got tased?

What would you have done if you were in his shoes? Please answer that.