2021-22 Season/Offseason Speculation

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Something I wanted to bring up was recently on the Locked on Suns podcast, and they were talking about how the Suns are punting on youth a little bit by forgoing the draft, but I don't necessarily think that's the case. Smith -21, Ayton -23, Booker-24, Bridges -24, Shamet-24, CamJo -25, Payne-27.

That's half the roster, and almost our entire core, that is on the younger side. If we didn't add a draft pick to that group for another year or two, it's not like we'd suddenly find ourselves as an aging team, particularly if Smith can become a rotation player within 2 years. You can argue that it starts to become expensive, but at the same time you're likely moving on from Crowder and Saric within the next 2 years, which is a $20m savings, and then CP3 in the next 2-4 years, which saves up to $30m. So it's not like we are in dire straits with our long term finances either.

We do need to find a PG of the future to take over from CP3 when he retires or begins to break down, but that's really the only glaring weakness in this roster for the foreseeable future. And I have SOME belief that Cam Payne could be a starting guard in this league.

The point being, I think that dealing the pick this year is a bit overblown in terms of us stocking up on young talent. We are full of young talent, and they are getting better all the time. If by his 3rd year, Smith can beat our Dario and Crowder, then we are pretty well set in terms of talent and roster construction, so long as we add a good young PG at some point in the next two seasons.

I think you're right - if we keep Smith. And especially based on last night's play, I really think we should. If he can shoot like that, he'll be on the court. Shot was quick, smooth, perfect. At this point he can't do anything if he's chased off the line, but that's okay. A 6'10" floor stretcher will play.

I hope we keep him.

[Barkley6]

Something I wanted to bring up was recently on the Locked on Suns podcast, and they were talking about how the Suns are punting on youth a little bit by forgoing the draft, but I don't necessarily think that's the case. Smith -21, Ayton -23, Booker-24, Bridges -24, Shamet-24, CamJo -25, Payne-27.

That's half the roster, and almost our entire core, that is on the younger side. If we didn't add a draft pick to that group for another year or two, it's not like we'd suddenly find ourselves as an aging team, particularly if Smith can become a rotation player within 2 years. You can argue that it starts to become expensive, but at the same time you're likely moving on from Crowder and Saric within the next 2 years, which is a $20m savings, and then CP3 in the next 2-4 years, which saves up to $30m. So it's not like we are in dire straits with our long term finances either.

We do need to find a PG of the future to take over from CP3 when he retires or begins to break down, but that's really the only glaring weakness in this roster for the foreseeable future. And I have SOME belief that Cam Payne could be a starting guard in this league.

The point being, I think that dealing the pick this year is a bit overblown in terms of us stocking up on young talent. We are full of young talent, and they are getting better all the time. If by his 3rd year, Smith can beat our Dario and Crowder, then we are pretty well set in terms of talent and roster construction, so long as we add a good young PG at some point in the next two seasons.

I think you're right - if we keep Smith. And especially based on last night's play, I really think we should. If he can shoot like that, he'll be on the court. Shot was quick, smooth, perfect. At this point he can't do anything if he's chased off the line, but that's okay. A 6'10" floor stretcher will play.

I hope we keep him.

Smith's usefulness depends on his role, and his role in this team is going to be: Play smart team defense, crash the boards, space the floor.

Nothing I've seen in summer league tells me he can't do that for 10 minutes a night in the NBA.

I think the issue we have, is during the McD era, we'd see guys struggle mightily in Summer League or at best look incredibly mediocre, and then they'd get 25-30 minutes of game time. Smith does two things very well: hit open shots and rebound. Everything else is pretty raw. But guess what the role of a backup stretch 4 is? If you said "hit open shots and rebound" you're exactly right.

If we are expecting him to be a star, he won't be that. But if we are expecting him to contribute to winning basketball, in a limited role, and limited minutes, he's well suited to do that.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Something I wanted to bring up was recently on the Locked on Suns podcast, and they were talking about how the Suns are punting on youth a little bit by forgoing the draft, but I don't necessarily think that's the case. Smith -21, Ayton -23, Booker-24, Bridges -24, Shamet-24, CamJo -25, Payne-27.

That's half the roster, and almost our entire core, that is on the younger side. If we didn't add a draft pick to that group for another year or two, it's not like we'd suddenly find ourselves as an aging team, particularly if Smith can become a rotation player within 2 years. You can argue that it starts to become expensive, but at the same time you're likely moving on from Crowder and Saric within the next 2 years, which is a $20m savings, and then CP3 in the next 2-4 years, which saves up to $30m. So it's not like we are in dire straits with our long term finances either.

We do need to find a PG of the future to take over from CP3 when he retires or begins to break down, but that's really the only glaring weakness in this roster for the foreseeable future. And I have SOME belief that Cam Payne could be a starting guard in this league.

The point being, I think that dealing the pick this year is a bit overblown in terms of us stocking up on young talent. We are full of young talent, and they are getting better all the time. If by his 3rd year, Smith can beat our Dario and Crowder, then we are pretty well set in terms of talent and roster construction, so long as we add a good young PG at some point in the next two seasons.

I think you're right - if we keep Smith. And especially based on last night's play, I really think we should. If he can shoot like that, he'll be on the court. Shot was quick, smooth, perfect. At this point he can't do anything if he's chased off the line, but that's okay. A 6'10" floor stretcher will play.

I hope we keep him.

Smith's usefulness depends on his role, and his role in this team is going to be: Play smart team defense, crash the boards, space the floor.

Nothing I've seen in summer league tells me he can't do that for 10 minutes a night in the NBA.

I think the issue we have, is during the McD era, we'd see guys struggle mightily in Summer League or at best look incredibly mediocre, and then they'd get 25-30 minutes of game time. Smith does two things very well: hit open shots and rebound. Everything else is pretty raw. But guess what the role of a backup stretch 4 is? If you said "hit open shots and rebound" you're exactly right.

If we are expecting him to be a star, he won't be that. But if we are expecting him to contribute to winning basketball, in a limited role, and limited minutes, he's well suited to do that.

Agree with everything, except for your statement that he won't be a star. He's still very young with a lot of physical development ahead of him. And with that long ball in his bag, that's a very potent weapon in today's game. I have very little doubt he'll be able to maintain a 38% or so efficiency getting open looks on an NBA court. He was damn-near automatic from range. He just hasn't mastered anything inside the arc.

He's got the ability to handle and drive. He had a couple pretty impressive passes last night, too. If he grows a bit and puts it all together, I think he's got a real shot at being something close to a 20-10 guy in his prime. And if he's doing that while stretching the floor, that's a star in today's game. I see some Siakam in him - less shake, but better shooting.

Giving up on him for a "win-now" player at this point would be damn foolish. We need to develop guys like him if this core is going to have a future post-CP3. And most "win-now" types tend to be injury prone, and none of the guys we're talking about are going to be able to stroke like Jalen *already can.* So it's just a bad idea, IMO.

[Frank Lee]

No way we trade our one and only prospect

As long as he keeps Shank on the bench it’s a plus

Still would be nice to have another youngster developing in the G in a two way.

As it is, this is likely our roster moving forward. We have neither players or draft picks we are willing to give up for any substantial improvements. Crowder is our PF, and we’ll just have to cope with his inabilities, which are mostly offset by his other good qualities.

At the very least, we got bigger with McGee and hopefully sporadic minutes from Smith over the Saric/Shank show

[RunDogGun]

No way we trade our one and only prospect

As long as he keeps Shank on the bench it’s a plus

Still would be nice to have another youngster developing in the G in a two way.

As it is, this is likely our roster moving forward. We have neither players or draft picks we are willing to give up for any substantial improvements. Crowder is our PF, and we’ll just have to cope with his inabilities, which are mostly offset by his other good qualities.

At the very least, we got bigger with McGee and hopefully sporadic minutes from Smith over the Saric/Shank show

Dude, how do you get away with ripping Frank in almost every post in almost every thread? You must get warned constantly by the mods here about repeatedly beating a "dead horse". Or maybe that just applies to people they disagree with.

[MrMiyagi]

No way we trade our one and only prospect

As long as he keeps Shank on the bench it’s a plus

Still would be nice to have another youngster developing in the G in a two way.

As it is, this is likely our roster moving forward. We have neither players or draft picks we are willing to give up for any substantial improvements. Crowder is our PF, and we’ll just have to cope with his inabilities, which are mostly offset by his other good qualities.

At the very least, we got bigger with McGee and hopefully sporadic minutes from Smith over the Saric/Shank show

Dude, how do you get away with ripping Frank in almost every post in almost every thread? You must get warned constantly by the mods here about repeatedly beating a "dead horse". Or maybe that just applies to people they disagree with.

Frank posts less frequently than you do, and we all know Kaminsky's flaws. We've not had disappointing moments with Shamet yet, and you're flinging doodoo at our shiny new toy.

You do you.

[RunDogGun]

No way we trade our one and only prospect

As long as he keeps Shank on the bench it’s a plus

Still would be nice to have another youngster developing in the G in a two way.

As it is, this is likely our roster moving forward. We have neither players or draft picks we are willing to give up for any substantial improvements. Crowder is our PF, and we’ll just have to cope with his inabilities, which are mostly offset by his other good qualities.

At the very least, we got bigger with McGee and hopefully sporadic minutes from Smith over the Saric/Shank show

Dude, how do you get away with ripping Frank in almost every post in almost every thread? You must get warned constantly by the mods here about repeatedly beating a "dead horse". Or maybe that just applies to people they disagree with.

Frank posts less frequently than you do, and we all know Kaminsky's flaws. We've not had disappointing moments with Shamet yet, and you're flinging doodoo at our shiny new toy.

You do you.

[matt131]

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[thamadkant]

Out of the 16 playoff teams, the Suns went to the line the least. Since we didn't change much, how do we fix this? Is there a player we could get to change this? And it wasn't because we shot too many threes, on that I think we were 13th.

Can Paul (3.4/gm but best ft% in the league) draw more fouls? Ayton? Booker?

Unfortunately, the only way to address this is through internal development.

CP3 is too old, and his trips to the line will likely decrease even more.

Book gets to the line about 6-7 times a game, which is fine. I don't think he's the sort to average 8-10 trips a game the way Harden, Luka and Trae can. He's physical enough, but his ball-handling isn't at the level of those guys, so he can't quite bait defenders the way those guys can.

Bridges could maybe get to the line a bit more, but again his ball-handling is limited and he rarely takes it to the rim when he's attacking. Prefers pulling up for the midrange, which is fine, because he's quite good at it.

Really, the ones you can hope something from are Ayton, Cam Johnson and Payne. Payne did attack the rim a lot in the playoffs up until his ankle injuries, but it was mostly using the first step to blow past big guys and use an angle to finish. Hopefully, he starts really getting into the teeth of the defense. Would be a big boost if he could average like 3 trips to the line in 20 mins off the bench.

Likewise, for Cam Johnson, he's strong and athletic enough to attack the basket. Just needs to be more comfortable handling the ball and attacking off the dribble. At the moment, it's mostly just attacking closeouts.

The biggest one is Ayton. 2.5 trips a game for such a huge, athletic guy is pitiful. All of it comes from the fact that he simply refuses to attack the basket on his own. And that stems from complete lack of confidence in dribbling the basketball. Ayton finishes great off the pick and roll, but it's the short rolls where his limitations really arise. All I want him working on is attacking the basket with single-dribble drives on those short rolls. He does that consistently, and those 2.5 trips will turn to 5 trips a game very easily. He's simply too big and athletic not to be fouled once he does attack.

Comfort in ball-handling is really the key to getting more trips to the FT line.

What you want Ayton to do is something a player who wants personal stats would do.

What you say could likely be the opposite Monty or even his team mates wants him to do... Because they want Ayton to be ready to finish the play quick and within the flow.... So that means quick moves to the basket wihh out dribbling.

I mean I do that to my team mates. I always tell the big guys to catch and then explode up so defenses don't adjust.

So I just can't see Ayton catching the ball from 15 feet and try to attack the rim with a dribble when Paul and Booker Never really give him the ball that far... They always give him the ball after drawing the defender out so Ayton has a clean look.....

So Ayton shooting 70% from the field has a reason.. Suns are using him as a last second outlet receiver..... Not going to change since that was very effective.

What suns need is Bridges to draw more fouls or other wings.

[Barkley6]

I think you're right - if we keep Smith. And especially based on last night's play, I really think we should. If he can shoot like that, he'll be on the court. Shot was quick, smooth, perfect. At this point he can't do anything if he's chased off the line, but that's okay. A 6'10" floor stretcher will play.

I hope we keep him.

Smith's usefulness depends on his role, and his role in this team is going to be: Play smart team defense, crash the boards, space the floor.

Nothing I've seen in summer league tells me he can't do that for 10 minutes a night in the NBA.

I think the issue we have, is during the McD era, we'd see guys struggle mightily in Summer League or at best look incredibly mediocre, and then they'd get 25-30 minutes of game time. Smith does two things very well: hit open shots and rebound. Everything else is pretty raw. But guess what the role of a backup stretch 4 is? If you said "hit open shots and rebound" you're exactly right.

If we are expecting him to be a star, he won't be that. But if we are expecting him to contribute to winning basketball, in a limited role, and limited minutes, he's well suited to do that.

Agree with everything, except for your statement that he won't be a star. He's still very young with a lot of physical development ahead of him. And with that long ball in his bag, that's a very potent weapon in today's game. I have very little doubt he'll be able to maintain a 38% or so efficiency getting open looks on an NBA court. He was damn-near automatic from range. He just hasn't mastered anything inside the arc.

He's got the ability to handle and drive. He had a couple pretty impressive passes last night, too. If he grows a bit and puts it all together, I think he's got a real shot at being something close to a 20-10 guy in his prime. And if he's doing that while stretching the floor, that's a star in today's game. I see some Siakam in him - less shake, but better shooting.

Giving up on him for a "win-now" player at this point would be damn foolish. We need to develop guys like him if this core is going to have a future post-CP3. And most "win-now" types tend to be injury prone, and none of the guys we're talking about are going to be able to stroke like Jalen *already can.* So it's just a bad idea, IMO.

When I said he won't be a star, I meant this season. Should have been more clear. He definitely has the tools to be very good with his combination of size, athleticism, handle and shooting.

[Barkley6]

Out of the 16 playoff teams, the Suns went to the line the least. Since we didn't change much, how do we fix this? Is there a player we could get to change this? And it wasn't because we shot too many threes, on that I think we were 13th.

Can Paul (3.4/gm but best ft% in the league) draw more fouls? Ayton? Booker?

Unfortunately, the only way to address this is through internal development.

CP3 is too old, and his trips to the line will likely decrease even more.

Book gets to the line about 6-7 times a game, which is fine. I don't think he's the sort to average 8-10 trips a game the way Harden, Luka and Trae can. He's physical enough, but his ball-handling isn't at the level of those guys, so he can't quite bait defenders the way those guys can.

Bridges could maybe get to the line a bit more, but again his ball-handling is limited and he rarely takes it to the rim when he's attacking. Prefers pulling up for the midrange, which is fine, because he's quite good at it.

Really, the ones you can hope something from are Ayton, Cam Johnson and Payne. Payne did attack the rim a lot in the playoffs up until his ankle injuries, but it was mostly using the first step to blow past big guys and use an angle to finish. Hopefully, he starts really getting into the teeth of the defense. Would be a big boost if he could average like 3 trips to the line in 20 mins off the bench.

Likewise, for Cam Johnson, he's strong and athletic enough to attack the basket. Just needs to be more comfortable handling the ball and attacking off the dribble. At the moment, it's mostly just attacking closeouts.

The biggest one is Ayton. 2.5 trips a game for such a huge, athletic guy is pitiful. All of it comes from the fact that he simply refuses to attack the basket on his own. And that stems from complete lack of confidence in dribbling the basketball. Ayton finishes great off the pick and roll, but it's the short rolls where his limitations really arise. All I want him working on is attacking the basket with single-dribble drives on those short rolls. He does that consistently, and those 2.5 trips will turn to 5 trips a game very easily. He's simply too big and athletic not to be fouled once he does attack.

Comfort in ball-handling is really the key to getting more trips to the FT line.

What you want Ayton to do is something a player who wants personal stats would do.

What you say could likely be the opposite Monty or even his team mates wants him to do... Because they want Ayton to be ready to finish the play quick and within the flow.... So that means quick moves to the basket wihh out dribbling.

I mean I do that to my team mates. I always tell the big guys to catch and then explode up so defenses don't adjust.

So I just can't see Ayton catching the ball from 15 feet and try to attack the rim with a dribble when Paul and Booker Never really give him the ball that far... They always give him the ball after drawing the defender out so Ayton has a clean look.....

So Ayton shooting 70% from the field has a reason.. Suns are using him as a last second outlet receiver..... Not going to change since that was very effective.

What suns need is Bridges to draw more fouls or other wings.

I agree with you somewhat. The way we play offensively doesn't feature Ayton, but there are A LOT of times where Ayton catches within 8 feet of the rim and goes up soft because a defender is in the lane, or gives up the ball. Ayton needs to be able to risk a few offensive fouls and go strong to the cup to start earning trips to the line. I don't want Ayton shooting a Saric style floater. I want him finishing through contact. I think having a defensive big like McGee backing him up will help him for two reasons, it means he won't get away with going up soft in practice (like he would against Smith or Saric), and it means if he picks up a couple of offensive fouls, we have someone serviceable to plug in that will still be able to be a decent defensive anchor.

[RunDogGun]

I think we all agree that Ayton gets a fair amount of contact down low, and often gets fouled with no call. I don't want him to force any issues, especially when we don't know who or when the league will enforce the rule of "unnatural" contact.

Plainly, he should be getting to the line more, and Book as well.

After seeing that stat of us taking the least amount of free throws out of all 16 playoff teams, I just don't think it will be any different this year, because I think teams might be even more physical with us. I would, if I was an opposing coach. I would see how much physical contact my team could make while not getting called for it. And judging from our playoff games, that is a lot.

Maybe our fourth guard could draw more calls?

[oddity]

I think it's a combination of Ayton, Bridges, and Cam J stepping up. If Mikal turns into a steady third option for us he can draw a lot of calls via drives to the basket. Cam has a really nice transition game that I want to see more of next season. Ofc Ayton has to branch out his offensive game to more sweet spots on the floor. Hopefully he becomes more comfortable putting the rock on the ground and taking it to the basket in face-up situations, and that will result in more fouls drawn.

[bwgood77]

ATTN KERRSED!!!!

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/263850/Lance-Stephenson-Holding-Private-Workout-For-NBA-Teams

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[spanishninja]

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that would explain the Shamet trade too. Book was playing heavy minutes throughout the playoffs

[RunDogGun]

Ugh, why play someone 30 minutes when you think he is "basically playing on one leg"?

[lilfishi22]

Ugh, why play someone 30 minutes when you think he is "basically playing on one leg"?

It's the Finals. If you can play (even on one leg) you play. We didn't exactly have a solid back up that would allow him to take the time off.

[sunskerr]

Idk how Smith will shake out, but I like his stat lines in summer league. That has to be one of the nicest looking strokes in the league too.

[cberry78]

Idk how Smith will shake out, but I like his stat lines in summer league. That has to be one of the nicest looking strokes in the league too.

Yup, even when he was missing everything in garbage time last year you could tell his stroke was good.

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